Wild Dog Adventure Riding

General => General Bike Related Banter => Topic started by: immigrant on October 21, 2012, 12:33:12 am

Title: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: immigrant on October 21, 2012, 12:33:12 am
i am looking at expanding the collection a bit, and the north american BMW websites are starting to advertise the new R 1200 GS. it seems it is coming in 3 "variants" - touring, dynamic and off road, so  there is quite a difference in options and setups.  It seems you will have a more "specific configuration" in stead of a good all round bike.
It looks they are trying to get rid of the "old" model 1200 gs's and there are good deals at the moment. Will it still hold its re-sale value once the new model hit the street? New must be better, right?
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: TVB on October 21, 2012, 08:02:16 am
Call me what you want...prophet, whatever :peepwall: but the 1200GS (air/oilhead) will never loose it's value in SA
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 21, 2012, 08:42:40 am
Value is determined by supply and demand.

BMW is in a lot of cases 'n fashion accessory and as such a lot of the currant bikes will be dropped in favour of having the New! Lastest! bike.

Supply of the currant model will go up (and there are a LOT). Demand will go down.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: whitedelight on October 21, 2012, 08:56:26 am
I reckon it will depend on how good the new bike is.if it is really good the old ones might lose a little,if kark the old ones might gain a bit of value.
I think the same will happen to KTM.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Ratt on October 21, 2012, 09:16:09 am
Value is determined by supply and demand.

BMW is in a lot of cases 'n fashion accessory and as such a lot of the currant bikes will be dropped in favour of having the New! Lastest! bike.

Supply of the currant model will go up (and there are a LOT). Demand will go down.

Agreed, its a fashion statement / its the show of who's got the most money.

Example: 2009 GSA with the whole catalog af bmw add ons and gps and what what all mostly k@k on.... used for commuting to work, never seen dirt, never did more than 200km on a single day. WTF

Also I must add that some guys actually use the bike as you are suppose to-  respect
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: BennNevis on October 21, 2012, 09:37:23 am
Value lost already. Sold to many to make them a rare find. A pyramid scheme as far as I can tell, last in last out= losses  :deal:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Enzo on October 21, 2012, 09:18:32 pm
look what happened to the 1150, still available at about 45k, the 2004 1200 at about 65k, if the euro is going to stay strong I recon the new bikes will be expensive and if you are in the market for a pre 2010 model for about a 100k you will prolly be safe, no point buying a 2012 now, no matter what the deal, IMHO
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Aprilian on October 21, 2012, 09:37:25 pm
Usual BS about BM fashion accessory- besides high jacking the thread it ignores the facts that the GS is a reliable, comfortable, capable and immensely practical bike with fewer shortcomings than most. Yes it will lose value as all bikes do but will still be sought after by those who cant afford or dont see the value in the new BM.
If youre buying a bike as an investment it had better be an investment in pleasure or youre sure to be disappointed...
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 21, 2012, 09:45:42 pm
Usual BS about BM fashion accessory- besides high jacking the thread it ignores the facts that the GS is a reliable, comfortable, capable and immensely practical bike with fewer shortcomings than most. Yes it will lose value as all bikes do but will still be sought after by those who cant afford or dont see the value in the new BM.


Aprilian nobody said it wasn't reliable, comfortable, capable etc. It is marketed as a Lifestyle / Fasion item so it will obviously attract those buyers as well.

The question was "Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?"

I said Value is determined by supply and demand and gave some examples. How is that a hijack?

You are a little too sensitive about your chosen fashion item brand methinks... The Aprilian doth protest too much. ;) :pot:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Aprilian on October 21, 2012, 10:04:56 pm
[quote author=Ratt link=topic=109407.msg2132984#msg2132984 date

Agreed, its a fashion statement / its the show of who's got the most money.

Example: 2009 GSA with the whole catalog af bmw add ons and gps and what what all mostly k@k on.... used for commuting to work, never seen dirt, never did more than 200km on a single day. WTF

Also I must add that some guys actually use the bike as you are suppose to-  respect
[/quote]

Erm, seems to me fairly biased not to mention ignorant of the fact that the GS is not exclusively supposed to be used in the wild and deepest Africa- it is a very versatile motorcycle and rather than a show of who's got the most money, some might say that it is a show of who has the better understanding of what one wants from a motorcycle. If its comfort, reliability, economy, pillion friendly, on and offroad cruising you desire (or even a commuter if youre doing fair mileage) it remains an excellent choice. I have a number of motorcycles of different makes - none compares to the GS in ease of use and general maintenance.

Bottom line - for a good while still it will be great choice and popular for many good reasons.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 21, 2012, 10:15:33 pm

Bottom line - for a good while still it will be great choice and popular for many good reasons.


That is true.

But will it lose value now that it's the older model? ;)
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Aprilian on October 21, 2012, 10:38:03 pm
In answer to thread title:
In my opinion the resale value of the 1200 GS has not been great for at least 3 years. Reasons include large number available, general financial climate and other factors incl bad press wrt pinging, KTM fashionability and other factors. I am sure that having a new engine will contribute to this depreciation.

However, I do think that there is a core of riders who will prefer the simpler, air cooled engine for at least a few years, which I think might offset this accelleration in depreciation to an extent. Time will tell!
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: 1ougat on October 21, 2012, 11:30:48 pm
Yes and when the 300Kg "Adventure" eventually arrives .... the old Adventure will suddenly seems very light in comparison .... :pot:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: TVB on October 22, 2012, 06:47:58 am
I think the real question and also hope from a number of riders is rather if this oilheads will now become available at bargain prices.....as we like bargains in SA. Its almost li scavangers sometimes waiting for the beast to fall so that they can feast....lol I do not think it will loos its money to that extend, it still is and always was a gr8 living legend. Yes I don't have one but I am not blind to identify value products. A bit honest hey?
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Adventurer on October 22, 2012, 07:27:54 am
Supply will always decide, because there are so many GS's on the road, and for sale, one can often just look around for what suits him the best, it's not like if one comes up it gets snapped up straight away.....
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: krister on October 22, 2012, 07:36:33 am
BMW holds its value well.  Just look at the 1150 and 1100 - not to speak of the old airheads (R80GS etc.)...
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 22, 2012, 07:44:34 am
The 1150 will hold value. Those were the best GS's IMO. And there are few pristine examples left. It's like hen's teeth. Supply & demand...

The 1200 on the other hand, there are examples on this very forum that does not sell.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: krister on October 22, 2012, 07:48:39 am
Time will tell, of course.  I think the reason many 1200s don't sell is because the seller wants too much.  Also, there is a point where selling price becomes very relative...
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Vintage_Mania on October 22, 2012, 08:07:46 am
Die 1150 word baie gesog op die oomblik, en het 'n sterk gevolg in SA. Ek sien dat die eerste 1200's al vir dieselfde pryse (en in sekere gevalle selfs minder) as die 1150's verkoop.

Ek dink die ander probleem vir 1200 eienaars is net die verskriklike hoeveelhede wat verkoop is.Gaan kyk net op Bumtree, daar is honderde te koop op 'n permanente basis. Het ook gehoor dat die GS die grootste verkooper in SA is. Of was.

Die GS80's is BAIE gesog, en daar was nie verskriklik baie  van hulle verkoop nie. So gesog dat daar baie "scramblers" gebou word van ander modelle om die vraag op te maak.

Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Ratt on October 22, 2012, 08:20:29 am
Die 1150 word baie gesog op die oomblik, en het 'n sterk gevolg in SA. Ek sien dat die eerste 1200's al vir dieselfde pryse (en in sekere gevalle selfs minder) as die 1150's verkoop.

Ek dink die ander probleem vir 1200 eienaars is net die verskriklike hoeveelhede wat verkoop is.Gaan kyk net op Bumtree, daar is honderde te koop op 'n permanente basis. Het ook gehoor dat die GS die grootste verkooper in SA is. Of was.

Die GS80's is BAIE gesog, en daar was nie verskriklik baie  van hulle verkoop nie. So gesog dat daar baie "scramblers" gebou word van ander modelle om die vraag op te maak.


:laughing4:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 22, 2012, 08:38:38 am
Die 1150 word baie gesog op die oomblik, en het 'n sterk gevolg in SA. Ek sien dat die eerste 1200's al vir dieselfde pryse (en in sekere gevalle selfs minder) as die 1150's verkoop.

Ek dink die ander probleem vir 1200 eienaars is net die verskriklike hoeveelhede wat verkoop is.Gaan kyk net op Bumtree, daar is honderde te koop op 'n permanente basis. Het ook gehoor dat die GS die grootste verkooper in SA is. Of was.

Die GS80's is BAIE gesog, en daar was nie verskriklik baie  van hulle verkoop nie. So gesog dat daar baie "scramblers" gebou word van ander modelle om die vraag op te maak.


Die ander ding is dat baie (meeste?) "first time buyers" GS'e gekoop het. Ons stokperdjie het gegroei en nuwe toetreders het BMW GS'e gekoop oor BMW die beste bemarkings masjien het - feit. Die GS is 'n goeie bike, maar soos mens groei in die stokperdjie kom jy agter van watse tipe riding jy hou en in baie gevalle is die 2de bike iets anders, iets kleiner en ligter (weereens, daar is voorbeelde daarvan op hierdie einste forum).

Dit is in my mening juis die afgelope groei in Adventure riding (en gepaardgaande sales), die huidige duik in die ekonomie en die feit dat 'n persentasie 2de kopers juis nie weer 'n GS1200 wil koop nie, gekombineer met die feit dat daar nou 'n nuwe model is wat nuwe kopers gaan trek, als maak dat die supply hoog is en bly (of op die kort termyn nog hor gaan raak?) terwyl die demand sak en nou gaan bly sak.

Selfs die nuwe 1200's op die vloer se pryse het al gesak (hulle noem dit nou 'n "special") so hoe op aarde kan 'n 2de handse fiets se prys onaangeraak bly?

Value is determined by supply and demand.

Ek dink 4 jaar van nou as al die 1000'e huidige 1200's begin oud raak, jy hierdie fietse gaan begin op tel vir 'n appel en 'n ui. Op die up side behoort 2de handse parte en accesories vrylik beskikbaar te wees.

Die 1150 aan die ander kant het Legend tax, nes die Africa Twin.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Vintage_Mania on October 22, 2012, 08:57:32 am
Ek stem saam met jou TR.

Hier is my search op Bumtree. 139 advertensies!!

En net vir vergelyking het ek ook GS80 gesoek - 'n hele 3 advertensies.

KLR650 - 53 ads
KTM 990 - 38 ads
Tiger - 18 ads

Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Garfield on October 22, 2012, 09:06:40 am
I still believe the current (old) model is a very nice and useful, if somewhat heavy fashion accessory and am looking forward to many more km's on mine.

Of course the current (old) model will lose value, simple economics really, 1000's sold + new model being launched soon.

No way would I buy the current model new today if I was in the market for one, I would wait a few months.

It seems a lot of aftermarket stuff on the current model will not fit the new water cooled model.

That, together with lots of owners who will just have to have the latest model will result in awesome farkled, low mileage second hand deals soon.

Great for the second hand buyer with cash in hand  :thumleft:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Stofdonkie on October 22, 2012, 09:10:42 am
Ek dink gravel travel se Hey-day-modegier het gekom en gegaan.

Enigste plek waar jy nou 'n groot bike verkoop is op inruiling ... terwyl dit hou.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Pullaway on October 22, 2012, 09:37:17 am
Trailrider, as jy reg is kan dit dalk beteken al ons Kawasaki ouens kan nou ewe skielik n BMW bekostig(hopelik die onderhoud ook), en dit sal die vraag weer so n bietjie opstoot.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 22, 2012, 09:50:39 am
Trailrider, as jy reg is kan dit dalk beteken al ons Kawasaki ouens kan nou ewe skielik n BMW bekostig(hopelik die onderhoud ook), en dit sal die vraag weer so n bietjie opstoot.

Yup. Die pryse sal net sak tot waar dit die vraag ontmoet en daar settle.

Maar daai prys sal laer wees as nou, wat die antwoord is op die thread se vraag.




I still believe the current (old) model is a very nice and useful, if somewhat heavy fashion accessory and am looking forward to many more km's on mine.


I very much doubt you bought yours for the fasion value! :D
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: fred400 on October 22, 2012, 10:09:47 am
Immagine all the good comming out of the 1200's taking a serious dive in value after the arrival of the new model. Now that sounds rediculous comming from a 2006 GS1200 owner, or does it...  Well, simply because I have no intention of selling mine for a good few years, after already owning it for 6 years. It is not an investment, it is a consumer artcile... I actually use mine everyday for what it was intentented (IMHO), and I really enjoy the thing, specially after fitting numerous farkles and conversions to make it the way I want it.  Now at the end of my current bikes life it potentially can become the parts bin for that almost "new", immaculate, low km's Oil/Air head  :pot: bargain boaught from a poser who is willing to loose the dosh on the old one, while making BMW, the bank and insurance companies wealthy with his new one.  Minor transplant surgery of the farkles, and we have a good as new consumer artcle for the next cycle.  O yes, and with so many 1200's around the doner could well turn out to be an "economical" helpful doner to more 1200's out there for a miner charge...In any event you could even consider giving it away as it has saved you so much in interest, depreciation and insurance that it has already paid for itself.  

p.s IMHO if you are an adventure rider that actually enjoy the more technical stuff (to a limit), the 1200 is not the way to go, not because it cannot, but simply becuase it could make an enjoyable ride into to a potential endurance exercise.  I say, if you can, and if you cannot, strive to have a mid class (600-650 single) for those trips, and push the limit.  My 650 XC takes care of that (after some serious farkles and alterations again...)      
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Stofdonkie on October 22, 2012, 10:14:06 am
... for a miner charge...  

 ???

Last time we had a miner charge it ended in tears.   :biggrin:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: fred400 on October 22, 2012, 10:18:25 am
Magtig, my Sub B juffrou, Ms. Beer,  draai in haar graf om....lyk my die liniaal oor die vingers was nie hard genoeg om my spelwerk uit te sorteer nie...
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: ChrisL - DUSTRIDERS on October 22, 2012, 10:19:09 am
Look back to 2004 when the 1200s came out.

Did the 1150 take a big dive in price although lots of 1200s were sold? No it did not.

And do not bring up Legend Tax. It's only in the last couple of years that people are clinging to their 1150s.............................
...
...
some even sold theirs :'(
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Trailrider on October 22, 2012, 10:40:56 am
ChrisL I was thinking of you this whole thread. You never should have sold that 1150. I still can't get used to seeing you on the 1200.
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: ChrisL - DUSTRIDERS on October 22, 2012, 04:01:32 pm
ChrisL I was thinking of you this whole thread. You never should have sold that 1150. I still can't get used to seeing you on the 1200.
I had to go lighter and that was the only reason I sold it. Yes the 1200 is lighter. Or I had to stick to only
gravelhighways, maar ek is te nuuskierig en neuk altyd in plekke in waar die kraaie nog my o gaan uitpik na
n val soos my vrou s!!! :biggrin: :eek7:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: BlingKing on October 22, 2012, 06:01:45 pm
The 1200GS will take a bit of a dip in its resale value, but will quickly recover as the new buyers who cannot afford the water bus start snapping up the airheads.
The same pattern happened with the 1150's and has been mentioned with those, there are the guys (and gals) who won't trade for the new LC, simple.
There was a comparison earlier as to the amount of GS's and Adventures for sale on Plumtree, that is no reflection of its re-sale value squire, there are simply that many for sale because it has been the best selling bike over 500cc for the last 6 years, so yup there are bound to be more on the market.
The GS and GSA have typically held a better re-sale value against than all their peers and competitors, that is a fact bourne out of its trade and retail figures from the M&M. That exercise has been done twice a year since forever by independant assayers, for the benefit of the Manufacturers, Insurance companies and whoever else gives a dogs turd. Personally it means hogwash to me, because I always take a bath on my bikes, simply because I put too much farkle on them - but then again, it is my showroom and it needs BLING!

Where this whole concept of re-sale value came from in the first place lawdy knows, you don't buy any machine for re-sale value, you buy it to use and enjoy!
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: Brakenjan on October 22, 2012, 06:45:46 pm
... for a miner charge...  

 ???

Last time we had a miner charge it ended in tears.   :biggrin:

 :laughing4:   :lol8:
Title: Re: Will the "old" 1200GS lose its value?
Post by: TVB on October 22, 2012, 07:57:11 pm
I agree with Bling King. The oilhead will never loose its popularity and many guys will want to go with aircooled motors of the beaten track where there is less that can go wrong, no radiator, waterpipes and waterpump etc. I would prefer the outgoing model still as a cross continental tool.while workin in Africa I have seen so many Europeans coming throug from Holland, sweden, belgian (I have actually met them and had conversations while doing demining) and the prefered the aircooled simplicity of the beemer. I would feel more comfortable on one of these than on my Triumph Explorer cross continetal tour (did not buy the Truimph for that though)

This bike is alredy iconic, its some riders who pised some anti Boxer men off