Wild Dog Adventure Riding

General => About South Africa... => eTolls - The Resistance => Topic started by: Spectral on April 06, 2014, 09:38:41 pm

Title: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Spectral on April 06, 2014, 09:38:41 pm
Hi everyone! I got a KLR 650 (My first bike!!!) this week. I was looking at the position of the number plate and it looks like rear fender comes down quite far over the number plate.

It got me thinking. Does anyone know if the cameras can pick up the number plate?
I looked at the plate from a 45 degree angle whilst standing directly behind the bike, but 2 of the letters were obscured. Even if I stood over to the side, one of the letters always seems to be obscured. Not sure which angles the etoll cameras take pictures from.

I'd really like to skip out on the etolls, but I don't want to block my number plate or do anything illegal that can get me in trouble if the cops pull me over.
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Flatout on April 06, 2014, 09:50:40 pm
My brother got a speed fine in the post with three of his six numbers knocked off by stones. So looks like they can run it through their programs and still identify you if they can identify the model and colour of your bike. He was on one of the older maroon klr's.  :o
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Kneeslider on April 06, 2014, 10:49:05 pm
From TVB's post on another thread.

Quote
Jip, en die n@aiers het my ook geroer. Ek werk vir ER24 en is 'subcontracted' aan SANRAL om as 'first responder motorbike medic' te werk op die snelweg. Ons was aangese om te registreer want die publiek gaan na ons kyk en en en....so ek het maar n tag gekry vir my KLR en gaan daagliks deur 1 gantry. Sondag gaan ek n draai in Brits maak en haal pos uit, wat sal ek vind? n hoop SANRAL rekening van die violation centre - ek is n violator. So Maandag stap ek hier in, gaan sien toe n dame om my te help in die violation centre. Sy kyk toe op die stelsel. 'Yes sir you are registered and the transactions is going through', but it is not taking any money out of you pre paid account because you are a violator - you are hiding you number plate and the computer program pics up your tag, but cant confirm the transaction for your numberplate is hidden'

So wys ek haar op die fotos dat my nommerplaat nie 'hidden' is nie, maar dat n 2010 klr n lang agter bumper het wat die bokant van die nommerplaat toemaak. Net die middelste letter. Nou 'label' die rekenaar program my as n violator en die mense kry dit dan in die 'manual' afdeling en zoom in, sien wie ek is en stuur n rekening. Hulle kan dit nie aftrek van my pre paid account en die siteem laat dit nie toe nie! So as ek dit wil oplos moet ek die nommerplaat skuif of my moderskerm afsny! Hulle sisteem kan my nie akkomodeer nie. Ek het n 'complaint' gelog en hul het laat weet dis onder 'review'....maar n week later (en ek werk hier) kan hul my steeds nie help nie. As dit nie was vir die ongereelde road block by popgieter straat waar die highway in pta inloop nie het ek die tag weggegooi en die plaat afgehaal.....dit maak mens moerig
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Dirty Boy on April 07, 2014, 08:09:36 am
My brother got a speed fine in the post with three of his six numbers knocked off by stones. So looks like they can run it through their programs and still identify you if they can identify the model and colour of your bike. He was on one of the older maroon klr's.  :o

Thats something we dont see much of in the same paragraph  :biggrin:  :thumleft:
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Spectral on April 07, 2014, 08:51:47 pm
@Flatout: Could the speeding fine be possible because they have less photos to go through? I'm wondering if they have a way of going through the thousands of cars' and bikes' photos that get taken by these gantries.

@Kneeslider: My KLR has exactly the same thing. I am just wondering if they can still pick up who I am if I do not have an etag (As in TVB's case). One letter will almost always be invisible from above. I'll be very happy if I can legally stop these bastards from billing me!
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Beebop on April 15, 2014, 10:01:15 am
Can someone explain to me why they need a camera at the back of an e-tolls van ?
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Mr Zog on April 15, 2014, 10:20:15 am
dunno

but that reg number should be cloned a few times...  :peepwall:  :ricky:
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Sláinte Mhaith on April 15, 2014, 10:29:27 am
I am just wondering if they can still pick up who I am if I do not have an etag (As in TVB's case). One letter will almost always be invisible from above. I'll be very happy if I can legally stop these bastards from billing me!

My logic tells me yes, they probably can, but a couple of things need to fall in place for it to happen.
My interpretation: It won't happen automatic and the system needs to flag the plate for manual review. Maybe they can use footage of more than one camera to get the full plate number. If that is not the case they can probably run all the variable for the missing numbers and see if any are registered to a KLR. But with 2 number obscured they might get more than one bike.

Don't register, use the road and let us know if you get an invoice in the post.  ???
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Dirty Boy on April 15, 2014, 10:38:32 am
Can someone explain to me why they need a camera at the back of an e-tolls van ?


Thats a brave man thats willing to drive that truck. Could get himself stoned.
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: mox on April 15, 2014, 10:46:57 am
Can someone explain to me why they need a camera at the back of an e-tolls van ?


http://citizen.co.za/77915/e-toll-camera-trucks-out-to-get-you/ (http://citizen.co.za/77915/e-toll-camera-trucks-out-to-get-you/)
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: duke996 on April 15, 2014, 10:50:29 am
I ride a 2010 KLR 650 every day on these e-toll roads going to see clients in different locations.

I have not received a single e-toll invoice but I did get one speeding fine in Roodepoort a few months ago :lol8:.

Looked like the camera was taking pics from the ground up
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: mox on April 15, 2014, 10:53:09 am
I get e-tolls from the fugly all the time so the gantries pick my 2005 one up.
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Sláinte Mhaith on April 15, 2014, 12:28:55 pm
Can someone explain to me why they need a camera at the back of an e-tolls van ?


http://citizen.co.za/77915/e-toll-camera-trucks-out-to-get-you/ (http://citizen.co.za/77915/e-toll-camera-trucks-out-to-get-you/)

An old article and also not done very well. What is an 'outstanding summons'. Don't think something like that exists.
You get summonsed to appear in court. Nothing they can do to you until that day you appear in court. ???
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: GRIM on April 15, 2014, 03:49:04 pm
I got an account for a trip a while ago even though somehow some absent minded autoeletrician had stuck insulation tape over 3 of the numbers of my bakkies numberplate...  ::)

Nothing gets through the thick rubber "e-tag" mat that hangs down over my numberplate, but I did almost get arrested for it right outside my sons matric farewell dance...
Title: Re:
Post by: Spectral on April 17, 2014, 12:30:00 pm
I'm going to ride on the highway when bike is registered to my name, see if I get any bills. My number plate seems to be mounted loosely, so if might flap a bit in the wind, I'll see what happens.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: dieseldawie on April 17, 2014, 01:22:24 pm
Hi everyone! I got a KLR 650 (My first bike!!!) this week. I was looking at the position of the number plate and it looks like rear fender comes down quite far over the number plate.

It got me thinking. Does anyone know if the cameras can pick up the number plate?
I looked at the plate from a 45 degree angle whilst standing directly behind the bike, but 2 of the letters were obscured. Even if I stood over to the side, one of the letters always seems to be obscured. Not sure which angles the etoll cameras take pictures from.

I'd really like to skip out on the etolls, but I don't want to block my number plate or do anything illegal that can get me in trouble if the cops pull me over.

Yes
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: TVB on April 17, 2014, 02:11:16 pm
@Flatout: Could the speeding fine be possible because they have less photos to go through? I'm wondering if they have a way of going through the thousands of cars' and bikes' photos that get taken by these gantries.

@Kneeslider: My KLR has exactly the same thing. I am just wondering if they can still pick up who I am if I do not have an etag (As in TVB's case). One letter will almost always be invisible from above. I'll be very happy if I can legally stop these bastards from billing me!


Sorry guys I don't ha time to read now through all the posts but let me tell you what I know:

There are 2000+ people working (day and night 24/7) on the photos and they do have more than enough time to go manually through all of them and quite fast. Like if you went through a gantry someone will already process the photo (if you don't have a tag-not registered) anything from 20min to an hour. This is manually done. The computers filters all the non registrations out immediately and also all the 'faulty' ones like with the KLR's. The computer cannot read the KLR's plate because of the bumper, so it is done manually and logged as a violation. I was asked to make my plate visible but I told tm it is factory standard. They don't have an answer to me other than 'pay up'. They c clearly read the KLR plate manually though - very clearly. The only way of not being identified is: ride without a plate or with very small one (like some guys put on their superbikes) Really very small. However the fine if they pull you over is more for an illegal plate than no plate at all. They do not read licence discs on the system (cameras), only number plates. The KLR is big headache for them but I was to they are working on it. Unfortunately that does not mean that one can get away with it. The legal department (the guys who will start the legal prosecutions) is also now open - I think the first phase of heated 'arguments and court cases' will soon start. Just keep in mind; I can only comment on what I have get to know by what I have seen here with my own eyes and heard in person. I do not work for SANRAL - I work for ER24as a biker medic - contracted to attend to accidents on the SANRAL Highways. So please don't call me 'names' here again.
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: dieseldawie on April 17, 2014, 07:21:40 pm
Sorry before I moved my number plate on my new bike, the cameras had no trouble picking up the plate in its original position. When Armageddon comes and Zombies rule the world, the KLR may be the only bike still running, but at the moment you are not gonna avoid etolls.

LMAO
Title: Re: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Spectral on April 17, 2014, 09:34:26 pm
@TVB, thanks for the info! It's quite ridiculous how much effort is spent to take our money!

I'm going to go through a gantry to see if they bill me all the same, just for curiosity sake!

PS: The bastards comment was aimed at the people in at the people in charge of SANRAL, not at you ;)



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Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: TVB on April 18, 2014, 08:46:45 am
Sorry before I moved my number plate on my new bike, the cameras had no trouble picking up the plate in its original position. When Armageddon comes and Zombies rule the world, the KLR may be the only bike still running, but at the moment you are not gonna avoid etolls.

LMAO

Let me just explain to some who haven't read this before:
The system works in 3 settings
1: photo from the front
2: read tag
3: photo from the back

The computer then makes a virtual image of the vehicle and verify through the system that it is actually the said registered 'bike or car/truck'. The number plates are then also through automatic program being read and verified that it match the tag. A KLR numberplat is slightly obstruckted in the middle and computer can not make this automatic verification. It is channeld to the violation centre where the billing then gets done manually, and then they (operator) decide weather you are at fault or not and bill accordingly. All new shape klr's have this problem if you make use of a legal plate.

I now avoid this one gantry and use an alyternative route till they have sorted the issue. There must be a solution other to cut a OEM mudguard.....

I have heard that they will start with highway patroll cars (there are 2 which I alreaddy know of and is this ford model that looks like a frontier) that will start patrolling and stopping especially bikes without number plates. There are stopper groups at some offramps, and video surveilience. Please don't try to run when the do pull you over. They will use cops that will only work on SANRAL roads. This is all I know and able to share. At this stage registration is not compulsary if you use the road, but paying for the 'service' is compulsary. The complicated part: it now is law and all oposed court cases have unfortunately failed.
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Mr Zog on April 18, 2014, 09:42:14 am
Sorry before I moved my number plate on my new bike, the cameras had no trouble picking up the plate in its original position. When Armageddon comes and Zombies rule the world, the KLR may be the only bike still running, but at the moment you are not gonna avoid etolls.

LMAO

Let me just explain to some who haven't read this before:
The system works in 3 settings
1: photo from the front
2: read tag
3: photo from the back

The computer then makes a virtual image of the vehicle and verify through the system that it is actually the said registered 'bike or car/truck'. The number plates are then also through automatic program being read and verified that it match the tag. A KLR numberplat is slightly obstruckted in the middle and computer can not make this automatic verification. It is channeld to the violation centre where the billing then gets done manually, and then they (operator) decide weather you are at fault or not and bill accordingly. All new shape klr's have this problem if you make use of a legal plate.

I now avoid this one gantry and use an alyternative route till they have sorted the issue. There must be a solution other to cut a OEM mudguard.....

I have heard that they will start with highway patroll cars (there are 2 which I alreaddy know of and is this ford model that looks like a frontier) that will start patrolling and stopping especially bikes without number plates. There are stopper groups at some offramps, and video surveilience. Please don't try to run when the do pull you over. They will use cops that will only work on SANRAL roads. This is all I know and able to share. At this stage registration is not compulsary if you use the road, but paying for the 'service' is compulsary. The complicated part: it now is law and all oposed court cases have unfortunately failed.

And therein lies the big issue...

So if Sanral can get dedicated cops, why cant other businesses/communities/groups etc. also get them?

As far as I am concerned, this is an abuse of power, its the govt just trying even harder to steal my money. Just means that I will continue even harder to not pay them.
(ps. not directed at you Tom, but at Scamral, but thanks for the info...)
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: TVB on April 18, 2014, 01:19:31 pm
Agree, it just doesn't seem right. If they were at least serve the people and by that I mean help to safe guard the rodas: assist with scene safety at accidents and stationary vehicles or even pull over vehicles which seem to be overloaded or noot roadworthy. Apparently that was the main reason right in the beginning for getting dedicated traffic cops. Let's wait and see, keep an eye on the situasion but if the start harassing the people with regards to payments I'm sure some political parties like the DA and other will make a stand. This fight agains E toll is far from over, in fact, I think it is only going to really start now (soon) as they begin to prossecute not paying users
Title: Re: Can the cameras read a KLR's number plate?
Post by: Bundu on April 18, 2014, 01:47:13 pm
Agree, it just doesn't seem right. If they were at least serve the people and by that I mean help to safe guard the rodas: assist with scene safety at accidents and stationary vehicles or even pull over vehicles which seem to be overloaded or noot roadworthy. Apparently that was the main reason right in the beginning for getting dedicated traffic cops. Let's wait and see, keep an eye on the situasion but if the start harassing the people with regards to payments I'm sure some political parties like the DA and other will make a stand. This fight agains E toll is far from over, in fact, I think it is only going to really start now (soon) as they begin to prossecute not paying users
:thumleft:

makes me angry to think they are using OUR money AGAINST us - there is a lot of anger in many people using these roads, I just hope enough of us stick together to make the laws around this issue unworkable....