Wild Dog Adventure Riding

Technical Section => Make / Model Specific Discussions => Suzuki DR & DRZ => Topic started by: Koet on December 04, 2014, 09:02:53 am

Title: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 04, 2014, 09:02:53 am
Morning Dawgs

It started happening again last night.  The little 250 Djebel sputters when revs go medium/high.  It doesn't have a rev counter, so the best description is that in 6th gear, when I reach more than 60km/h it starts sputtering and backfires.  It happened twice before, and that was also just after refueling.  What is weird is that after a couple of kilometers the bike sorts itself out.  Now I wouldn't worry too much about this usually, but this morning it happened again on my way to work - and quite badly.  So bad that at some stage I couldn't even pull away at a traffic light.  I pulled over to the side and the bike died.  I kick-started it and let it idle and blipped the throttle a couple of times.  It sputtered badly but at least I could ride a bit (but only at low revs).  Then roughly 12km into my commute the bike got over itself and for the last 4km it was fine.

Any idea what could be causing this?  I was thinking maybe it's a dirty carb or fuel filter?  Will have to dig a bit this weekend, but I'm quite limited for time.  :'(

Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: lecap on December 04, 2014, 09:42:23 am
Water in fuel. Drain float bowl. Turn tap to RES, fill float bowl and drain again. If problem persists it's something else :D
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 04, 2014, 09:44:53 am
Water in fuel. Drain float bowl. Turn tap to RES, fill float bowl and drain again. If problem persists it's something else :D

En in ingels?  Of afrikaans?  What/where is the float bowl?  And what do I fill it with?  Sorry, very new to this "fix-my-own-bike" thing.  But learning slowly....

Mmmmm, after doing a bit of googling I think it might be out of my knowledge range...  Will maybe have to watch someone do this first to make sure I don't screw it up...
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 04, 2014, 10:08:47 am
Found this post on a forum somewhere:

"...try draining the float bowl. You need a 14 or 17 mm ring spanner to undo the bolt at the base of the carbie float bowl. Turn off the fuel tap and then when it stops flowing out, let a bit more flow though. Then put the bolt back in ( not too tightly) and then try the feul tap again."

Is this what you were referring to?  On the Djebel 250, where will I find the screw/plug to undo to drain the float bowl?
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Eisbein on December 04, 2014, 10:18:17 am
Float bowl at the bottom of the carburetor.

Carburetor is between the airbox and the engine:
 :biggrin:


Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 04, 2014, 10:19:19 am
OK cool, thanx.  I'll go have a look to see if I can find it on my bike...
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: LouisXander on December 04, 2014, 12:04:48 pm
Kyk of carb rubbers mooi vas is tussen airbox en carb en engine en carb
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 05, 2014, 08:49:52 am
Eisbein, is there an easy way to get to that float bowl to open and drain it?  I had a look last night but couldn't see a way to quickly get at the float bowl.

Then, if it is water in that little bowl, is it OK to ride the bike like that even if it splutters?  Will the water just work itself out of the system?

And how on earth does water get in there in the first place?
Title: Re:
Post by: kwassi on December 05, 2014, 09:07:27 am
Lol
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Eisbein on December 05, 2014, 10:30:27 am
Eisbein, is there an easy way to get to that float bowl to open and drain it?  I had a look last night but couldn't see a way to quickly get at the float bowl.

Then, if it is water in that little bowl, is it OK to ride the bike like that even if it splutters?  Will the water just work itself out of the system?

And how on earth does water get in there in the first place?

I don't know on the Djebel, but there should be (at the bottom of the bowl) some form of extruded point with a bolt or screw (can be an sunken or normal screw/bolt).

Similar to the bottom (please note that the red circle is the one I added highlighting the drain - the black line was there from another article on where to adjust).

It may or may not have what looks like a 'bleed nipple' with (or without) an overflow pipe attached to it.
If I remember correctly you don't take that screw/bolt out totally - you just turn it out 'till fuel begin flowing out of the bleed nipple.

Just make sure that you know how the petcock (tap) works. On some bikes you have a 'prime' as well as the normal on/off/reserve setting.

If you drain the float bowl and you don't have a  'prime' to fill it up again it will crank a couple of times before it will start as it have to fill the bowl with fuel again.

The standard disclaimer of 'if you are wondering about these things then it is probably better to take it to someone who has done this before' applies.
:biggrin:



Also - having said all of the above - have you checked out the side stand switch as well ?
Friend of mine had it on his KLR that the bigger vibrations of higher revs caused the side stand switch to become very finicky and cause the same type of symptoms.



Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 05, 2014, 10:44:53 am
Thanx!  I'll go have a look to see if I can find something.  It's definitely not the side stand, as that cuts out the engine properly.  My issue is with sputtering and loss of power, which comes and goes.  Usually the start of my commute (for the last couple of days) is horrible and I can barely get going.  After a while the bike sorts itself out.  Weird.

Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 07, 2014, 11:39:11 am
OK, found the little screw and drained the bowl twice.  Will test it later this afternoon.  Hold thumbs!   8)
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: sidetrack on December 07, 2014, 11:24:17 pm
If the draining the float bowl does not work also try :

Check spark plug and cap
Check all connections are tight at ignition coil
That the stator is not faulty or failing (burnt coils)
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 08, 2014, 07:52:53 am
This morning the little bike started once, idled for literally a second and then died.  No fokol.  Can't get the thing to start AT ALL.  Engine turns over, but nothing happens.

I now also drained the battery trying to get the thing started, so I'll need to charge it again or jump-start it from my car to continue to get it working.  All I did was drain the float bowl.  This is so frustrating!
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Eisbein on December 08, 2014, 08:46:52 am
Did you manage to 'prime' it again ?

(Does your fuel tap have a prime ?)

Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 08, 2014, 09:05:21 am
Got the bike sorted.

It doesn't have a prime on the fuel tap, only RES, OFF and ON.

Basically lots of knee grease (electric starter was useless in this instance).  Stood for almost an hour just kick-starting the thing.  Every now and again it would take and then die quick.  This at least gave me hope to continue trying.  Then just before 8:30 it purred into life.

On the way to work it stuttered once or twice again (not bad) but for the rest of the commute it was back to it's sweet little old self.   :ricky:

Gonna avoid that filling station in the future.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: LouisXander on December 08, 2014, 02:06:48 pm
Koet, daai klink soos stator probleme.

Laat toets jou stator. Dark electrical in Malvern.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 08, 2014, 02:11:18 pm
Hi LouisXander

Die main probleem was verseker water in die carb.  Maar ek dink jy mag dalk reg wees dat my battery nie genoeg laai nie as gevolg van die stator.  Ek sal die ding moet toets, maar dit kan wag tot volgende jaar.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: LouisXander on December 08, 2014, 02:19:25 pm
Aan en af start is gewoonlik stator. Waar in GP is jy?
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 08, 2014, 02:22:11 pm
Di bike start nou darm elke keer - dit was net toe ek die floatbowl gedrain het dat ek vanoggend gesukkel het.

Ek is in Randpark Ridge, soortvan Wes JHB.  As jy kan help om te kyk na die stator ens sal ek waardeer!
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: sidetrack on December 08, 2014, 06:14:42 pm
Check my write up for removing the stator on a DRZ400, see one burnt coil that also cause the bike to miss splutter and cut out randomly.

http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/399740-how-to-remove-the-stator-ignition-cover/ (http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/399740-how-to-remove-the-stator-ignition-cover/)

(http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j220/mordies/DSCF6761.jpg)
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 09, 2014, 07:25:04 am
Nee wat, lyk my daai ding is DOOD!  Moes gisteraand die AA kry om die ding op 'n trok te laai en te kom aflewer by my huis. 

Nou moet ek probeer uitfigure wat om te doen en watse parte om te vervang.  Sal begin by die stator (dankie LouisXander en Sidetrack vir die inligting), maar ek moet eerlik wees ek's bietjie dom as dit by hoërgraad mechanics kom.  Sal die threads lees en dan moet begin soek vir iemant wat die parte vir my kan regmaak of vervang.

Dankie almal vir die hulp!
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: sidetrack on December 09, 2014, 07:46:46 am
n Stator kan rewind word maar jy moet hom obviously eers van die bike af verwyder. Gaan tien teen een n nuwe gasket ook moet kry as die ou een skeur.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 09, 2014, 07:48:39 am
OK, sal jou thread volg en heopelik skeur die gasket nie.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: LouisXander on December 09, 2014, 07:48:58 am
Koet luister nou. Haal die stator af en vat hom Dark electrical toe. Ek is seker dis stator. 011 622 1703.

Ek is seker Startline sal gasket kit he vir die DR. Ozark hardloop selfde motor?
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 09, 2014, 07:50:03 am
Koet luister nou. Haal die stator af en vat hom Dark electrical toe. Ek is seker dis stator. 011 622 1703

Ek's met julle.  Sal die stator die naweek afhaal en hulle dan bel.

Dankie!
Title: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: chopperpilot on December 09, 2014, 12:31:19 pm
Hierdie was op 'n tyd my vrou se fiets. Carb deur myself skoon gemaak, en fiets was ook deur Runner se hande.

Ek sal nie sommer met die stator karring nie. Fokus op brandstof toevoer.

Met die brandstofkraantjie oop, draai die float bowl se drain oop, en kyk of daar konstant brandstof uitloop. As ek reg kan onthou is dit met 'n allen key aan die regterkant van die float bowl.

Ek het 'n DR 650 wat se needle en seat soms vashaak, dan loop die enijin ook nie normaal nie. Edit: Brandstofvlak te laag in float bowl.

Ek het jou thread net vinnig gelees. Sal kyk of ek iets gemis het!



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Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: chopperpilot on December 09, 2014, 12:42:35 pm
Ek sal ook eers die battery laai, en laat toets. Is dit nog dieselfde battery as waarmee jy die fiets van my gekoop het?

Toets ook met 'n multimeter die volts by die battery wanneer die fiets loop. Ten minste 13.5V. Dis om die regulator te toets. Het al een op 'n DR 200 vervang.


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Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on December 09, 2014, 01:01:51 pm
Hi Henk

Ek het al al die goed gedoen en getoets soos in jou posts.  Ek het ook al die spark plug gecheck.  Selfs as ek die fiets op jumper leads het wil hy nog steeds nie vat nie.  Wel, hy vat en luier vir 'n ruk en dan stop hy.  Soms met 'n lekker harde backfire.

Die battery is so klein rukkie terug vervang, dink 3 maande gelede.  Maar selfs met die nuwe battery moes ek elke nou en dan die battery op charge sit, want die bike het nie regtig die battery gelaai nie (lyk dit my).  Dit als, plus die manne se kennis asook al die carb en float bowl goed wat ek klaar gedoen het oortuig my wel dat dit die stator is.

Ek sal heel waarskynlik die fiets na iemant toe vat eerder as om dit self te probeer uitsorteer.  Ek het mense al gekontak maar wag nog op kwotasies.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: chopperpilot on December 11, 2014, 09:16:28 am
Die enigste elektriese kennis en ervaring het ek reeds met jou gedeel.

Die enigste ander moontlikheid wat ek nie genoem het nie, is wanneer die o-ring by die needle en seat lek. Dan is die float level te hoog, en loop die enjin nie reg nie.

Ek dink nie dis van toepassing hier nie.

Maak egter die airbox oop en kyk of die spons lugfilter nie dalk nat van brandstof is nie.

Die fiets het altyd maklik gevat. Selfs beter met die kick start as elektries.

Ek het 'n spaar DR 200 SE stator, wat ek saam 'n DR 200 gekry het. Geen idee of dit kan werk nie. Is volgende Dinsdag tuis, dan kan ek mates neem.


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Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on February 04, 2015, 03:50:47 pm
OK, so 'n vinnige update op die situasie:

Die fiets sit nou al 3 weke by Offroad Cycles in Pretoria.  Conrad is kort van die ding in die vuur gooi want hy kry net nie die fout nie.  So ek sal maar net moet geduldig wag dat die Suzuki engele neer daal aarde toe en nuwe lewe in die fietsie in blaas.

Baie frustrerend, want ek geniet daai fiets baie!

Maar nou ja, dis hoe dit nou is.
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: chopperpilot on February 04, 2015, 08:30:50 pm
Sterkte Koet! Vertrou die engele sal hul ding doen!


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Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on February 23, 2015, 02:38:48 pm
Raait, sy leef weer!

Was toe glo die stator coil. Het haar nou weer terug op die pad vir so 'n week en ek is baie gelukkig en weer van voor af verlief.   8)

Nou vir 'n "small bike trip"!
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: sidetrack on February 23, 2015, 03:39:14 pm
Raait, sy leef weer!

Was toe glo die stator coil. Het haar nou weer terug op die pad vir so 'n week en ek is baie gelukkig en weer van voor af verlief.   8)

Nou vir 'n "small bike trip"!
Jou mos gesę  :biggrin:
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on February 23, 2015, 03:41:02 pm
Raait, sy leef weer!

Was toe glo die stator coil. Het haar nou weer terug op die pad vir so 'n week en ek is baie gelukkig en weer van voor af verlief.   8)

Nou vir 'n "small bike trip"!
Jou mos gesę  :biggrin:

 :biggrin:
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: chopperpilot on February 23, 2015, 08:38:35 pm
Raait, sy leef weer!

Was toe glo die stator coil. Het haar nou weer terug op die pad vir so 'n week en ek is baie gelukkig en weer van voor af verlief.   8)

Nou vir 'n "small bike trip"!
Bly om te hoor!

Haar gesien toe ek nou die dag by Runner die beursie leeg gemaak het.

Sy is nog pragtig! Geniet haar!


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Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: Koet on February 28, 2015, 01:25:56 pm
Dankie Henk.  Ja ek geniet gaar vreeslik!  Ek gaan die week probeer om die agter shock te lig.  Die bike voel bietjie laag vir my en ek wil haar begin off-road ry.  Sal dan begin kyk na al die mods wat die ouens op ADVRider aanbeveel.  My plan is om haar so op te bou dat sy soos nuut is - 'n nuwe verf job ens is ook in haar toekoms.   :biggrin:

Kan jy dalk laat weet watse mods klaar op die bike gedoen is (as jy kan onthou)?  Sal my baie help om my lys o pte stel.

 :thumleft:
Title: Re: Djebel 250 sputtering on higher revs
Post by: chopperpilot on February 28, 2015, 01:56:00 pm
Kyk aan die onderkant van die agter skokbreker. Indien die bout deur die boonste opening is, sit dit deur die onderste opening. Ek is seker jy kan die agterveer se pre-load ook stywer stel. Dalk die damping ook stel. Ons het die fiets gekoop van 'n vroue ryer. Sitplek spons was gesny. Jy kan dit weer opbou.

Meganies het ek net die cannister laat oopmaak, en Conrad het die jetting gedoen. Ek het destyds 'n nuwe lugfilter gekoop. Conrad het die shims ook nagegaan. Die carburator was ook skoongemaak, en nuwe o-ring by die needle en seat ingesit. Het gelek.

Dis dit!

Geniet die Djebel!


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