Wild Dog Adventure Riding

Technical Section => Make / Model Specific Discussions => KTM LC8 1050 / 1190 / 1290 => Topic started by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 09:49:22 pm

Title: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 09:49:22 pm
So I took my bike in for a service, they called me this afternoon to tell me my bike's frame is broken near the top mount of my rear shock.

I will go in tomorrow and take pics, they said they will try for a warranty claim...

I am beginning to lose my trust in the bike, I know I weigh more than the average rider and perhaps I ride harder off road than the average person. But FFS it should handle being loaded with luggage and riding two up on dirt.

Will let you guys know whats up when I know. Will post pics ASAP.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Draadwerk on September 01, 2015, 10:09:08 pm
No man, and I was just looking for one on another thread here. Now I have to start thinking again.

Sorry to hear- hope it gets sorted soon...👍🏻
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 10:11:05 pm
No man, and I was just looking for one on another thread here. Now I have to start thinking again.

Sorry to hear- hope it gets sorted soon...👍🏻

Nee man, sover ek weet is myne die enigste ene wat dit al mee gebeur het. Ek weeg 120ish en maak asof ek die dakar ry elke dag op hom.

EK sou die bike nogsteeds recommend, maar miskien is ek op die verkeerde bike vir wat ek verwag.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 10:15:14 pm
@Xchallenge

This may very well be the reason for my bikes headshake...
But if I consider everything including my own ideas about adventure bikes I could have pushed the bike harder than it was built for. Perhaps I was on the wrong bike after all... But still this has seriously shaken my confidence in this bike.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 01, 2015, 10:17:18 pm
Why don't you swop your bike for 2wdrift's warranty claim and new bike?

Sorted!

2wdrift, sorry to hear about your frame, perhaps it's time for a Boxer engine.

I want commission if you two end up swapping!
 :sip:

No man, and I was just looking for one on another thread here. Now I have to start thinking again.

Sorry to hear- hope it gets sorted soon...👍🏻
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 10:20:04 pm
Why don't you swop your bike for 2wdrift's warranty claim and new bike?

Sorted!

2wdrift, sorry to hear about your frame, perhaps it's time for a Boxer engine.

I want commission if you two end up swapping!
 :sip:

No man, and I was just looking for one on another thread here. Now I have to start thinking again.

Sorry to hear- hope it gets sorted soon...👍🏻

I was thinking more along the lines of a SE, something I can push as hard as I want. In the end I will probably break before the SE does.

I cant go back to a GS, they are lovely to ride as a normal human, but the moment the red mist descends I will break it very quickly.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Draadwerk on September 01, 2015, 10:20:52 pm
Why don't you swop your bike for 2wdrift's warranty claim and new bike?

Sorted!

2wdrift, sorry to hear about your frame, perhaps it's time for a Boxer engine.

I want commission if you two end up swapping!
 :sip:

No man, and I was just looking for one on another thread here. Now I have to start thinking again.

Sorry to hear- hope it gets sorted soon...👍🏻
Excellent idea. I'll take your new bike...😃
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 01, 2015, 10:32:52 pm
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 10:48:56 pm
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:

I'm beginning to believe that KTM sold me a bike that isnt suitable for the purpose. Hence I may be able to claim via the consumer protection act.

After the airbox fuckup and suspension issues I have had plus this I dont know if I want the bike back, especially when I bought it to travel through africa. I cant trust it.
Dont get me wrong its one of the best all round bikes on the planet IMHO but its just not the right bike for me.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 01, 2015, 10:51:38 pm
I agree, ask KTM how it's possible that this guy can't even manage to break a frame, but you could?

https://www.youtube.com/v/JWIZfYQhgMc&list=PLo2YKlfZDcNF1j8Pdce5spNDjYEOSraHZ
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 10:53:38 pm
I agree, ask KTM how it's possible that this guy can't even manage to break a frame, but you could?

https://www.youtube.com/v/JWIZfYQhgMc&list=PLo2YKlfZDcNF1j8Pdce5spNDjYEOSraHZ
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:

The guy from Trax said it will need a new frame...
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 01, 2015, 11:10:43 pm
I think Chris Birch probably weighs 75kg, but nonetheless, then KTM should change the 440kg (?) spec that the bike can supposedly carry

2wdrift I'm sure they will fix/replace frame, but if they don't, make sure to ask them what you did wrong - their answer should be enlightening
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 01, 2015, 11:15:54 pm
I think Chris Birch probably weighs 75kg, but nonetheless, then KTM should change the 440kg (?) spec that the bike can supposedly carry

2wdrift I'm sure they will fix/replace frame, but if they don't, make sure to ask them what you did wrong - their answer should be enlightening

Dont worry, I will record the conversation... If they decide to be difficult I shall see a lawyer.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 01, 2015, 11:20:17 pm
If they give you any excuses, you could always just drop in the 3 words they love to use in all their marketing material and see what they say about false advertising:

"READY TO RACE"
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Kletsou on September 01, 2015, 11:29:11 pm
Best bikes when they are not in the workshop🙊😈
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Toffie@2 on September 02, 2015, 06:42:04 am
Sorry to hear about your frame! :o This sucks! It is like you say, your weight should not be enough to crack a frame, even if you ride it like you do!
Lets hope they fix it for you without legal hassles etc!

Good luck!
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Dwerg on September 02, 2015, 06:49:09 am
Hey D!

Sorry om te hoor oor die frame. Net die footpeg sou my klaar maak die ding in trade.

Soos jy ry is daar net 2 bikes wat gaan hou, SE en as ek die ander een noem gan dit klink of ek bias is  :lol8:

And these clips are new bikes probably used for one promo vid and that's the end off it. All good and well and displays ability but if you keep abusing a big bike like that, something is gonna give

Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Ndlovu on September 02, 2015, 07:16:09 am
Ouch! Not nice, for you or someone who has just taken delivery of one. Let's hope it's isolated and that they sort you out without any hassles.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: TheBear on September 02, 2015, 07:25:30 am
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:

I'm beginning to believe that KTM sold me a bike that isnt suitable for the purpose. Hence I may be able to claim via the consumer protection act.

After the airbox fuckup and suspension issues I have had plus this I dont know if I want the bike back, especially when I bought it to travel through africa. I cant trust it.
Dont get me wrong its one of the best all round bikes on the planet IMHO but its just not the right bike for me.

How is this KTM's fault?  Surely a buyer should do his own research before buying?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Dwerg on September 02, 2015, 07:32:24 am
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:

I'm beginning to believe that KTM sold me a bike that isnt suitable for the purpose. Hence I may be able to claim via the consumer protection act.

After the airbox fuckup and suspension issues I have had plus this I dont know if I want the bike back, especially when I bought it to travel through africa. I cant trust it.
Dont get me wrong its one of the best all round bikes on the planet IMHO but its just not the right bike for me.

How is this KTM's fault?  Surely a buyer should do his own research before buying?

Ok easy there tiger. Let's try to keep the discussion technical
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: TheBear on September 02, 2015, 07:37:21 am
How is this KTM's fault?  Surely a buyer should do his own research before buying?

Ok easy there tiger. Let's try to keep the discussion technical

The name is AMZ, not so much tiger.

I am interested in understanding why 2wdrift feels that way, so I asked him.  I am pretty sure he is able to respond and will do so shortly.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: silvrav on September 02, 2015, 08:00:57 am
 :sip:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 08:02:19 am
find out from manic what happened to his frame crack story - I would insist KTM fixes! :deal:

I'm beginning to believe that KTM sold me a bike that isnt suitable for the purpose. Hence I may be able to claim via the consumer protection act.

After the airbox fuckup and suspension issues I have had plus this I dont know if I want the bike back, especially when I bought it to travel through africa. I cant trust it.
Dont get me wrong its one of the best all round bikes on the planet IMHO but its just not the right bike for me.

How is this KTM's fault?  Surely a buyer should do his own research before buying?

KTM advertising has pictures of the bike being ridden hard in a desert somewhere, there are pics of the bike being jumped and being drifted around with "luggage" on the bike. I saw those pics and said, yes I ride like that often they advertise the bike using those images so the bike must have been built for that. Thus leading me to believe that the 1190R was built with the purpose of being ridden off the beaten path at speed as shown in those pictures.

After having said that, the airbox issues left me with a very bad taste in my mouth with denials of the problem left right and centre. For a bike obviously designed to be ridden off paved roads or even just in africa this is unacceptable. The suspension is so easily bottomed out that I had decent damage from riding a normal dirt road and hitting a bit of a bump, where my 1200GSA was fine, they did not do a warranty claim. The front rim bent and went flat instantly when I hit a rock the size of a tennis ball at about 60-70km/h, nearly causing a crash while I was riding rather slowly and carefully on a road I ride every day.  

There have been numerous little things that broke while just riding normally on washboard gravel roads, yet this is an adventure bike for the more off road rider.

When I bought the bike I told the salesman what I plan on using the bike for, and how I tend to ride over what terrain. He was adamant that the bike is perfect for what I want to do with it. After this I asked them to fit the unifilter, he once again was adamant that the airbox issues were solved on the 2014 models so he convinced me not to go that route. At 10k km when the bike wouldnt run anymore due to dust bypassing the airfilter and fucking up the motor. They told me it was just a valve clearance issue and when I mentioned I would prefer a new motor for peace of mind I was looked at as though I was crazy.

I cant trust this bike in africa like my original plan was for the bike.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: silvrav on September 02, 2015, 08:26:40 am
eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on September 02, 2015, 08:41:25 am
eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou

I wouldnt let this stop you.


These are forums, and forums tend to be a collection of problems and okes dont post the thousands of brilliant KMs they did, only the 3 shitty ones.


It seems the Unifilter or Rotti setup cures the airbox problems. That's a fix for that, so don't even worry about it.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 08:50:08 am
eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou

Do you weigh more than 110kg? Do you ride hard off road? Do you believe sales people?

If yes to two or more then dont. Otherwise its the most fun bike ever.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 02, 2015, 08:55:05 am
2WD can you perhaps post some pics of the crack/s that would indicate exactly where they are?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 08:58:27 am
I will, I am going to the dealership this morning. Should be there around 11 ish. Will take pics and attempt to post via tapatalk.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: TheBear on September 02, 2015, 09:00:39 am
How is this KTM's fault?  Surely a buyer should do his own research before buying?

KTM advertising has pictures of the bike being ridden hard in a desert somewhere, there are pics of the bike being jumped and being drifted around with "luggage" on the bike. I saw those pics and said, yes I ride like that often they advertise the bike using those images so the bike must have been built for that. Thus leading me to believe that the 1190R was built with the purpose of being ridden off the beaten path at speed as shown in those pictures.

After having said that, the airbox issues left me with a very bad taste in my mouth with denials of the problem left right and centre. For a bike obviously designed to be ridden off paved roads or even just in africa this is unacceptable. The suspension is so easily bottomed out that I had decent damage from riding a normal dirt road and hitting a bit of a bump, where my 1200GSA was fine, they did not do a warranty claim. The front rim bent and went flat instantly when I hit a rock the size of a tennis ball at about 60-70km/h, nearly causing a crash while I was riding rather slowly and carefully on a road I ride every day.  

There have been numerous little things that broke while just riding normally on washboard gravel roads, yet this is an adventure bike for the more off road rider.

When I bought the bike I told the salesman what I plan on using the bike for, and how I tend to ride over what terrain. He was adamant that the bike is perfect for what I want to do with it. After this I asked them to fit the unifilter, he once again was adamant that the airbox issues were solved on the 2014 models so he convinced me not to go that route. At 10k km when the bike wouldnt run anymore due to dust bypassing the airfilter and fucking up the motor. They told me it was just a valve clearance issue and when I mentioned I would prefer a new motor for peace of mind I was looked at as though I was crazy.

I cant trust this bike in africa like my original plan was for the bike.

Thanks.   :thumleft:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: silvrav on September 02, 2015, 09:11:34 am
eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou

I wouldnt let this stop you.


These are forums, and forums tend to be a collection of problems and okes dont post the thousands of brilliant KMs they did, only the 3 shitty ones.


It seems the Unifilter or Rotti setup cures the airbox problems. That's a fix for that, so don't even worry about it.

Who pays for the unifilter/Rotti? Dealer or me?

eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou

Do you weigh more than 110kg? Do you ride hard off road? Do you believe sales people?

If yes to two or more then dont. Otherwise its the most fun bike ever.

113ish.... and no probably wont ride like you but the day i want to i dont want to/have to think twice
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 02, 2015, 09:14:55 am
I will, I am going to the dealership this morning. Should be there around 11 ish. Will take pics and attempt to post via tapatalk.


which dealer? I might drop by.....
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: StuartC on September 02, 2015, 09:18:18 am
There is a reason I buy Jap bikes, reliability, and no this aint a knock on the ready to race crowd my son won national titles on KTM but I seriously find the strongest bikes in just about all respects to be Japanese.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on September 02, 2015, 09:20:18 am
eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou

I wouldnt let this stop you.


These are forums, and forums tend to be a collection of problems and okes dont post the thousands of brilliant KMs they did, only the 3 shitty ones.


It seems the Unifilter or Rotti setup cures the airbox problems. That's a fix for that, so don't even worry about it.

Who pays for the unifilter/Rotti? Dealer or me?

eish, en ek kyk na n 1190....sal maar moet 2 keur dink nou

Do you weigh more than 110kg? Do you ride hard off road? Do you believe sales people?

If yes to two or more then dont. Otherwise its the most fun bike ever.

113ish.... and no probably wont ride like you but the day i want to i dont want to/have to think twice


I think sometimes we need to remember that it isn't a dirtbike.   It's a touring bike that can be taken onto dirt when the need arises but it's still a 230kg 150hp giant.


If you are buying a  new bike I'm sure you could negotiate a Unifilter in the deal. I paid for mine because I felt the peace of mind was worth the R1000 cost. I ight still add the new 2015 airbox bits as well.
Title: Re:
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 11:47:04 am
Its at Trax KTM.



Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 11:48:28 am
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/02/6de3193ae8a6cd520bcdc8c46d4f56d3.jpg)

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 11:49:12 am
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/02/a797f698f99bbe34d5508ce77ab5caa2.jpg)

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re:
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 12:08:36 pm
@silvrav

I probably did about 40% of my riding on dirt, and considering it has about 24k km on the clock its a fair bit of riding hard on dirt that I did. As far as I know its the first bike this happened on (excluding manic's one but he is manic so...)
and looking at the crack I think it was a bad weld from the factory on my specific bike.

It was the most epic bike I have ever owned.  

Jammer oom manic, moenie raas met my nie...

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re:
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 12:21:11 pm
Oh yeah I almost forgot. KTM is sending a new frame free of charge. It should be here next friday and then its a good three days to rebuild the bike onto another frame.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Toffie@2 on September 02, 2015, 12:44:19 pm
Glad to hear it 2WD! I hope you have many happy miles to come!! :thumleft:
Title: Re:
Post by: OFFROAD FANATICS on September 02, 2015, 12:56:47 pm
Oh yeah I almost forgot. KTM is sending a new frame free of charge. It should be here next friday and then its a good three days to rebuild the bike onto another frame.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

It simply is the right thing to do. Hope you have many more enjoyable kms on this bike!!!
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 02, 2015, 01:04:11 pm
thanks for the feedback 2wdrift  :thumleft:

oompie manic dropped his bike from a trailer and killed a buck with his, so........ ::)

I was sure KTM would sort the frame for you (if not, I would have helped you cause loads of kak)

If you are still concerned about your motor, you could always do a leakdown test, even if you had to pay for that yourself, it should show if the air filter caused any damage, but if the bike goes as well as it did in the beginning, I wouldn't worry too much
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 02, 2015, 01:05:31 pm
Nice one dude.

You should've asked for a new Airbox while youre at it, plus a new engine, and perhaps a new shock.

Milk it!

ha ha
Title: Re:
Post by: 2wdrift on September 02, 2015, 01:14:58 pm
Yeah the bike is still under warranty so no way in hell would I have paid.

I love the bike but after nearly two year on it I think I want to move on. The 950SE is calling... That and a DL650 will have me sorted for bikes.

I would recommend one to anyone who asks but I think I am a bit over the sooperbike on dirt.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re:
Post by: silvrav on September 02, 2015, 01:15:32 pm
Oh yeah I almost forgot. KTM is sending a new frame free of charge. It should be here next friday and then its a good three days to rebuild the bike onto another frame.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

It simply is the right thing to do. Hope you have many more enjoyable kms on this bike!!!

good news! faith restored!

Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: StuartC on September 02, 2015, 02:15:21 pm
Goof for them as thats bad manufacture
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on September 02, 2015, 02:15:44 pm
Definitely looks like a dodgy weld.


At least it's getting sorted.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Toors on September 25, 2015, 10:08:47 am
Good news. But don't forget the unifilter and the Hilton Hayward suspension and the excell rims and ..... if you want to go into Africa.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Rough Rider on September 25, 2015, 10:19:47 am
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/02/a797f698f99bbe34d5508ce77ab5caa2.jpg)

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

It has cracked in the HAZ of the weld, which is the weakest part, but should still not happen with proper QC.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 25, 2015, 12:29:02 pm
Good news. But don't forget the unifilter and the Hilton Hayward suspension and the excell rims and ..... if you want to go into Africa.

I'm selling. So there shall be no further upgrades or repairs on this bike from me. I'm tired of KTM's refusal to acknowledge that there are faults on the bikes and them giving me a hard time on the warranty work like with the suspension. Why buy a new bike if the warranty is useless.

Getting a 950SE and a touring bike.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 25, 2015, 12:37:09 pm
Please can we perhaps chat about swopping seats before you sell?
I really like the PowerParts seats, and would appreciate it if you would consider.

Sorry to hear you are giving up on the 1190 'brand" but at least you're staying with team orange...

Good news. But don't forget the unifilter and the Hilton Hayward suspension and the excell rims and ..... if you want to go into Africa.

I'm selling. So there shall be no further upgrades or repairs on this bike from me. I'm tired of KTM's refusal to acknowledge that there are faults on the bikes and them giving me a hard time on the warranty work like with the suspension. Why buy a new bike if the warranty is useless.

Getting a 950SE and a touring bike.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 25, 2015, 12:45:52 pm
Please can we perhaps chat about swopping seats before you sell?
I really like the PowerParts seats, and would appreciate it if you would consider.

Sorry to hear you are giving up on the 1190 'brand" but at least you're staying with team orange...

Good news. But don't forget the unifilter and the Hilton Hayward suspension and the excell rims and ..... if you want to go into Africa.

I'm selling. So there shall be no further upgrades or repairs on this bike from me. I'm tired of KTM's refusal to acknowledge that there are faults on the bikes and them giving me a hard time on the warranty work like with the suspension. Why buy a new bike if the warranty is useless.

Getting a 950SE and a touring bike.

I will have to hear what the dealership would give me for mine with the heated seats vs standard. Plus you need the switches installed on your bike for the seats as well.

Dont get me wrong I love the bike, but I cant trust my specific one. And for me that means no trips into africa, or rides in remote areas, as was the original plan that I actually bought the bike for.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 25, 2015, 12:48:23 pm
Thanks dude do that, but seriously, I couldn't care less about the heated seats, KTM 1190's bake my balls enough not to need them.
I want them for the comfort and the image...

Please can we perhaps chat about swopping seats before you sell?
I really like the PowerParts seats, and would appreciate it if you would consider.

Sorry to hear you are giving up on the 1190 'brand" but at least you're staying with team orange...

Good news. But don't forget the unifilter and the Hilton Hayward suspension and the excell rims and ..... if you want to go into Africa.

I'm selling. So there shall be no further upgrades or repairs on this bike from me. I'm tired of KTM's refusal to acknowledge that there are faults on the bikes and them giving me a hard time on the warranty work like with the suspension. Why buy a new bike if the warranty is useless.

Getting a 950SE and a touring bike.

I will have to hear what the dealership would give me for mine with the heated seats vs standard. Plus you need the switches installed on your bike for the seats as well.

Dont get me wrong I love the bike, but I cant trust my specific one. And for me that means no trips into africa, or rides in remote areas, as was the original plan that I actually bought the bike for.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 25, 2015, 12:52:28 pm
Thanks dude do that, but seriously, I couldn't care less about the heated seats, KTM 1190's bake my balls enough not to need them.
I want them for the comfort and the image...

Please can we perhaps chat about swopping seats before you sell?
I really like the PowerParts seats, and would appreciate it if you would consider.

Sorry to hear you are giving up on the 1190 'brand" but at least you're staying with team orange...

Good news. But don't forget the unifilter and the Hilton Hayward suspension and the excell rims and ..... if you want to go into Africa.

I'm selling. So there shall be no further upgrades or repairs on this bike from me. I'm tired of KTM's refusal to acknowledge that there are faults on the bikes and them giving me a hard time on the warranty work like with the suspension. Why buy a new bike if the warranty is useless.

Getting a 950SE and a touring bike.

I will have to hear what the dealership would give me for mine with the heated seats vs standard. Plus you need the switches installed on your bike for the seats as well.

Dont get me wrong I love the bike, but I cant trust my specific one. And for me that means no trips into africa, or rides in remote areas, as was the original plan that I actually bought the bike for.

Hahaha I will ask the guys. It should be finished by tomorrow so I will probably go there and hear what they would offer on monday.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 25, 2015, 01:49:28 pm
Thanks bud. Good luck with the sale!
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 12:11:58 pm
Ok so the saga continues, I went to trax today to go and have a look at my bike.

They showed me that there was another spot on the frame that was broken at the bottom, and on my new frame it has been strengthened on both of these spots. I love that it was strengthened.

I then walked over to my motor in the new frame and checked the throttle valves (forget the other name now) and find them nice and dusty. So my motor has been ingesting dust with KTM's brilliant DNA filter that they gave me.

Now I am not sure what to do. Sue them, CPA and get a new bike, keep my bike with its reinforced frame and ask for a new motor. Or CPA get new bike and sell it for more than I can sell mine now.

But under no circumstances do I want a 1190 out of warranty.

Xchallenge you said you had the contact details for KTMSA? I would like to have a chat to the KTM sa boss about my specific case. 
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 28, 2015, 12:19:39 pm
Ok so the saga continues, I went to trax today to go and have a look at my bike.

They showed me that there was another spot on the frame that was broken at the bottom, and on my new frame it has been strengthened on both of these spots. I love that it was strengthened.

I then walked over to my motor in the new frame and checked the throttle valves (forget the other name now) and find them nice and dusty. So my motor has been ingesting dust with KTM's brilliant DNA filter that they gave me.

Now I am not sure what to do. Sue them, CPA and get a new bike, keep my bike with its reinforced frame and ask for a new motor. Or CPA get new bike and sell it for more than I can sell mine now.

But under no circumstances do I want a 1190 out of warranty.

Xchallenge you said you had the contact details for KTMSA? I would like to have a chat to the KTM sa boss about my specific case. 

NAIL them! KTM should wake fuck up! :deal:

I wonder if the fiches indicate a different part number?

Has your bike still got the 'old' airbox?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 12:22:36 pm
Ok so the saga continues, I went to trax today to go and have a look at my bike.

They showed me that there was another spot on the frame that was broken at the bottom, and on my new frame it has been strengthened on both of these spots. I love that it was strengthened.

I then walked over to my motor in the new frame and checked the throttle valves (forget the other name now) and find them nice and dusty. So my motor has been ingesting dust with KTM's brilliant DNA filter that they gave me.

Now I am not sure what to do. Sue them, CPA and get a new bike, keep my bike with its reinforced frame and ask for a new motor. Or CPA get new bike and sell it for more than I can sell mine now.

But under no circumstances do I want a 1190 out of warranty.

Xchallenge you said you had the contact details for KTMSA? I would like to have a chat to the KTM sa boss about my specific case. 

NAIL them! KTM should wake fuck up! :deal:

I wonder if the fiches indicate a different part number?

Has your bike still got the 'old' airbox?

Old airbox and DNA as recommended by KTM themselves.

They engraved my old VIN numbers and the works onto the new frame.
I would love having a 1190 with a special custom frame, but not if the motor is fuct.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 12:25:34 pm
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/dd66a298b18f189150422470c7102c84.jpg)

(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/e664800eff016944f2301ddd151e7675.jpg)

(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/80af8c3ab18f00e246b18b60c797e4c9.jpg)

(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/f03cdb020bf97aaec13cd3fdb29c8080.jpg)

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 28, 2015, 12:27:48 pm
where did your frame break? I assume it was on the main and not the sub-frame?

had a quick look, but it seems the R has same main frame from 13 to 15, except if they have all been updated

Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 12:45:38 pm
Looking at the image you posted it seems they have all been updated. And in that case my bike is not some special build, uhh I should have checked with the mechanics before I got exited about a reinforced frame.  ::)

This should mean two things, they have had other issues in the same areas on the frames. And I dont have to feel bad about getting a special frame and then taking them on.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 28, 2015, 01:45:22 pm
what did the mechanics say about the dust in the throttle bodies?
maybe ask them if they can do a leak-down test
Title: Re:
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 02:03:07 pm
They just gave me a knowing look, other than that they didnt say or do anything.

I am not in the mood for tests and crap. New bike or new motor, or a nice big public lawsuit.

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Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Manic on September 28, 2015, 11:24:04 pm
I know of 2x1190R bikes here in PE that got new fames.


Secondly, and I'm not trying to kak on anyones head, but how many times did we talk about the DNA filter story and said IT DOES NOT CURE THE DUST PROBLEM.

But still, everybody fits them, or trusts KTM when they fit them for you......

The dust thing is not new to KTM Headoffice. I run the Unifilter, so on my 15 000km service when they opened the airbox it was CLEAN inside. The guy told me, if there is dust, they check the shimming, if its clean like mine, they dont check it.

So even the Meccies are aware of the dust story. Here in PE at least 4 engines have been swopped, and thats the ones I know about, there can be even more.

Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 11:33:41 pm
I know of 2x1190R bikes here in PE that got new fames.


Secondly, and I'm not trying to kak on anyones head, but how many times did we talk about the DNA filter story and said IT DOES NOT CURE THE DUST PROBLEM.

But still, everybody fits them, or trusts KTM when they fit them for you......

The dust thing is not new to KTM Headoffice. I run the Unifilter, so on my 15 000km service when they opened the airbox it was CLEAN inside. The guy told me, if there is dust, they check the shimming, if its clean like mine, they dont check it.

So even the Meccies are aware of the dust story. Here in PE at least 4 engines have been swopped, and thats the ones I know about, there can be even more.



Yes I was never really sure about the DNA, but I thought if there was a issue I can take them on. If I ask for a unifilter and the damage from earlier causes kak they can say its my filter or my fitment of said filter. Right now any and all of the blame falls right on them, in a court case my side will not be full of holes...
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Manic on September 28, 2015, 11:45:36 pm
Everyone thinks like you do, saying bike has a Warranty and and and.

Just remember, KTM dont HAVE to give you a new engine, or a new bike.

If they decide to let the appy in the workshop repair with new parts, you will have to take it.

There is three R's in the Consumer Act.

Repair
Replace
Refund.

It is up to KTM to decide which R they will use, and if you dont like it,then you can take them on and hope for the best.

I did my Unifilter in the beginning, think it had something like 2000km on the clock or something, reason being, I dont want a 15mnth old bike, with a reconditioned engine in it eventually.
I paid for the Uni myself, and dont regret it one day  :thumleft:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 28, 2015, 11:49:28 pm
Everyone thinks like you do, saying bike has a Warranty and and and.

Just remember, KTM dont HAVE to give you a new engine, or a new bike.

If they decide to let the appy in the workshop repair with new parts, you will have to take it.

There is three R's in the Consumer Act.

Repair
Replace
Refund.

It is up to KTM to decide which R they will use, and if you dont like it,then you can take them on and hope for the best.

I did my Unifilter in the beginning, think it had something like 2000km on the clock or something, reason being, I dont want a 15mnth old bike, with a reconditioned engine in it eventually.
I paid for the Uni myself, and dont regret it one day  :thumleft:

True
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: BatmanGS on September 29, 2015, 03:30:37 am
Hi guys about the damage Dust causes.

Please watch this you Tube movie "Operation Hour Glass" that was reasleased by Cummins back in the Day
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E2QKklzvBY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E2QKklzvBY)

Its about the damage that Dust causes to engines and how much is needed to cause damage to an engine, these are old technolgie engines, so you deciede with the modern fine tolerences in modern engines this problem would be increased.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: MaxThePanda on September 29, 2015, 06:28:20 am
People ride these bikes in dusty offroad conditions. SURELY the only approach is an oiled foam filter, like a dirt/rally bike?
Title: Re: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: the_BOBNOB on September 29, 2015, 06:35:44 am
People ride these bikes in dusty offroad conditions. SURELY the only approach is an oiled foam filter, like a dirt/rally bike?
Paper filters are better than oiled foam filters <period>
Title: Re: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Manic on September 29, 2015, 07:38:53 am
People ride these bikes in dusty offroad conditions. SURELY the only approach is an oiled foam filter, like a dirt/rally bike?
Paper filters are better than oiled foam filters <period>

Not in the 1190 scenario, you will blow that engine before 10 000km if you run the paper filter. Talking about dusty conditions.
Title: Re: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: ktmmer on September 29, 2015, 07:45:08 am
People ride these bikes in dusty offroad conditions. SURELY the only approach is an oiled foam filter, like a dirt/rally bike?
Paper filters are better than oiled foam filters <period>

Not in the 1190 scenario, you will blow that engine before 10 000km if you run the paper filter. Talking about dusty conditions.

and you pay how much for these bikes  :pot: :pot:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Manic on September 29, 2015, 07:47:37 am
Netso ja, so you pay R180 000 for the bike, but refuse to pay R1000 extra so it can last. Instead you hold onto your R1000 for fuel, then blow the engine.

The ONLY problem with engine is the airbox, so sort it and you have a machine for life!

I think that R1000 is worth it  :thumleft:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: ktmmer on September 29, 2015, 07:51:09 am
I fully agree with your logic.

I just cannot believe you pay that much money for something with a latent defect.

Not even a cheap Chinese pit bike has a leaking air filter.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on September 29, 2015, 07:54:33 am
Perhaps what 2wdrift needs is one of these KTM Zimmer frames! Ha ha.

Title: Re: Re: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: the_BOBNOB on September 29, 2015, 09:09:47 am
People ride these bikes in dusty offroad conditions. SURELY the only approach is an oiled foam filter, like a dirt/rally bike?
Paper filters are better than oiled foam filters <period>

Not in the 1190 scenario, you will blow that engine before 10 000km if you run the paper filter. Talking about dusty conditions.
But that is the filter not sealing against the airbox.

But paper element filters better than oiled foam (when the air passes through the filter) :D
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 09:14:02 am
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/29/116b8c0a7f6fbedbe46729ddc307753b.jpg)

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Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: MaxThePanda on September 29, 2015, 10:07:02 am
Out of interest, what exactly is the problem on these? The airbox has cracks or leaking seals or something and lets dust in? Or the filter doesn't seal against the airbox and lets dust in? Or the dust goes straight through the filter? Got to be one of the three...

When I bought my X-Challenge some years ago (paper filter) it had dust in the inlet. Briefly switched to K&N filter (same system as DNA, right?) but that was rubbish for offroad. Got a Unifilter (oiled foam) and that was the last of my problems. Oiled foam filters work well, but you've got to treat them like a dirt bike - clean and re-oil often. And grease the flange. It's not a "fit and forget between services" item.

Now only ride dirt bikes and I'm used to changing filters every or every second ride.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Rough Rider on September 29, 2015, 10:09:49 am
The key to the foam filter is to clean them often and keep them oiled.

On my SE I use a Rottweiler foam filter together with filter skins. I change the filter skins during the overnight stops and remove, clean and re-oil the foam filter after every dusty ride.

On the SE the Rottweiler system is very good because you can access the filter without removing the fuel tank blaa de blaa....
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Draadwerk on September 29, 2015, 10:11:51 am
Netso ja, so you pay R180 000 for the bike, but refuse to pay R1000 extra so it can last. Instead you hold onto your R1000 for fuel, then blow the engine.

The ONLY problem with engine is the airbox, so sort it and you have a machine for life!

I think that R1000 is worth it  :thumleft:
Well, if I pay that much for a bike, am I unreasonable in expecting that the airbox should function 100% at all times? Isn't this the same as saying - buy the bike, but before you ride it sort the airbox otherwise your engine will not last, and the bike is not fit for purpose without it.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Rough Rider on September 29, 2015, 10:15:07 am
Netso ja, so you pay R180 000 for the bike, but refuse to pay R1000 extra so it can last. Instead you hold onto your R1000 for fuel, then blow the engine.

The ONLY problem with engine is the airbox, so sort it and you have a machine for life!

I think that R1000 is worth it  :thumleft:
Well, if I pay that much for a bike, am I unreasonable in expecting that the airbox should function 100% at all times? Isn't this the same as saying - buy the bike, but before you ride it sort the airbox otherwise your engine will not last, and the bike is not fit for purpose without it.

The problem is that these bikes are not really designed for our African conditions, where we have endless dirt roads. As owners we need to appreciate this and make sure the air filter is doing its job and not allowing the dust in.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on September 29, 2015, 10:17:47 am
Out of interest, what exactly is the problem on these? The airbox has cracks or leaking seals or something and lets dust in? Or the filter doesn't seal against the airbox and lets dust in? Or the dust goes straight through the filter? Got to be one of the three...

When I bought my X-Challenge some years ago (paper filter) it had dust in the inlet. Briefly switched to K&N filter (same system as DNA, right?) but that was rubbish for offroad. Got a Unifilter (oiled foam) and that was the last of my problems. Oiled foam filters work well, but you've got to treat them like a dirt bike - clean and re-oil often. And grease the flange. It's not a "fit and forget between services" item.

Now only ride dirt bikes and I'm used to changing filters every or every second ride.

a combination of two problems exists on some bikes:
filter not seating properly against airbox walls
airbox lid not sealing properly
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Draadwerk on September 29, 2015, 10:22:10 am
Netso ja, so you pay R180 000 for the bike, but refuse to pay R1000 extra so it can last. Instead you hold onto your R1000 for fuel, then blow the engine.

The ONLY problem with engine is the airbox, so sort it and you have a machine for life!

I think that R1000 is worth it  :thumleft:
Well, if I pay that much for a bike, am I unreasonable in expecting that the airbox should function 100% at all times? Isn't this the same as saying - buy the bike, but before you ride it sort the airbox otherwise your engine will not last, and the bike is not fit for purpose without it.

The problem is that these bikes are not really designed for our African conditions, where we have endless dirt roads. As owners we need to appreciate this and make sure the air filter is doing its job and not allowing the dust in.
Nonsense - they bring these bikes to Africa - why not see to it that they are fit for our conditions? They should at least adapt the bike before you buy it, not so?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Rough Rider on September 29, 2015, 10:29:55 am
Netso ja, so you pay R180 000 for the bike, but refuse to pay R1000 extra so it can last. Instead you hold onto your R1000 for fuel, then blow the engine.

The ONLY problem with engine is the airbox, so sort it and you have a machine for life!

I think that R1000 is worth it  :thumleft:
Well, if I pay that much for a bike, am I unreasonable in expecting that the airbox should function 100% at all times? Isn't this the same as saying - buy the bike, but before you ride it sort the airbox otherwise your engine will not last, and the bike is not fit for purpose without it.



The problem is that these bikes are not really designed for our African conditions, where we have endless dirt roads. As owners we need to appreciate this and make sure the air filter is doing its job and not allowing the dust in.
Nonsense - they bring these bikes to Africa - why not see to it that they are fit for our conditions? They should at least adapt the bike before you buy it, not so?

I agree they should; but at the end of day it is your asset and therefore your responsibility. 

For example; a 10,000 km service interval is very different on a bike ridden only on the highway when compared to a bike spending 80% of it's time on dirt roads. At the end of the day the manufacturers can only give recommendations on service intervals based on averages, if your bike falls outside the average you need to do more regular maintenance. Air filters and oil are top of the list when it comes to regular maintenance.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 11:04:39 am
The problem is not that the bikes werent designed for africa. The problem is they had a retard design the airbox, they have the same issues in europe with dust ingestion. Even if the guys never ride them on dirt there is still dust bypassing the filter farking up the motor.

The frame seems to be a common problem as well.

I mean FFS why build a awesome bike and then weaken it at certain key points thus making it useless for anything other than a weekend trip to the cafe in your neighborhood?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Rough Rider on September 29, 2015, 11:10:46 am
The problem is not that the bikes werent designed for africa. The problem is they had a retard design the airbox, they have the same issues in europe with dust ingestion. Even if the guys never ride them on dirt there is still dust bypassing the filter farking up the motor.

The frame seems to be a common problem as well.

I mean FFS why build a awesome bike and then weaken it at certain key points thus making it useless for anything other than a weekend trip to the cafe in your neighborhood?

I am guessing here, because I don't know what the airbox design is, but I think it all about airflow, to get optimal power and still beat the emissions regulations.

As for the frame they learn to strengthen certain areas by trial and error in the field so to say. It costs a lot of money to test a frame to fatigue destruction.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 11:14:55 am
The problem is not that the bikes werent designed for africa. The problem is they had a retard design the airbox, they have the same issues in europe with dust ingestion. Even if the guys never ride them on dirt there is still dust bypassing the filter farking up the motor.

The frame seems to be a common problem as well.

I mean FFS why build a awesome bike and then weaken it at certain key points thus making it useless for anything other than a weekend trip to the cafe in your neighborhood?

I am guessing here, because I don't know what the airbox design is, but I think it all about airflow, to get optimal power and still beat the emissions regulations.

As for the frame they learn to strengthen certain areas by trial and error in the field so to say. It costs a lot of money to test a frame to fatigue destruction.

No the airbox doesnt seal propperly so the air doesnt go through the filter, they fucked this one up good and proper.
Being taken to court when someone gets badly injured from a frame breaking wont cost more than decent testing?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: THROTTLE JOCKEY on September 29, 2015, 11:21:35 am
GET A OIL SAMPLE TEST DONE NOW!!!!!

I am embarrassed to admit that I owned a propella bike once upon a time and the air filter sucked into the air box, after a year of fighting they replaced the engine, complete! One of the main reasons I had a leg to stand on was that the oil had silca (sand) and a small amount of water in it. I had insisted on a oil test as the agents insisted that I accept that the bike is ok and warrantee will sort out any problems in the future. The dust can only get into the oil by going past the rings proving that excessive wear had taken place. The water pump seal had been damaged (I am told) by the dust in the oil causing water to contaminate. 9 months of fighting I got my bike back.

The oil contaminate test is often used in heavy machinery to establish wear.

The report you get from the test will give you either peace of mind (if clean) or proof for a claim. If they supply a new engine you basically will have a new bike.

Good Luck.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: ROMMEL HOND on September 29, 2015, 11:31:42 am
Just buy a GS :pot:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 11:44:20 am
GET A OIL SAMPLE TEST DONE NOW!!!!!

I am embarrassed to admit that I owned a propella bike once upon a time and the air filter sucked into the air box, after a year of fighting they replaced the engine, complete! One of the main reasons I had a leg to stand on was that the oil had silca (sand) and a small amount of water in it. I had insisted on a oil test as the agents insisted that I accept that the bike is ok and warrantee will sort out any problems in the future. The dust can only get into the oil by going past the rings proving that excessive wear had taken place. The water pump seal had been damaged (I am told) by the dust in the oil causing water to contaminate. 9 months of fighting I got my bike back.

The oil contaminate test is often used in heavy machinery to establish wear.

The report you get from the test will give you either peace of mind (if clean) or proof for a claim. If they supply a new engine you basically will have a new bike.

Good Luck.

I am not interested in tests or repairs, I am selling and I dont want another 1190. They can keep it, it a wonderfull bike let down by pathetic customer service and rubbish design on certain crucial points. 
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 11:49:57 am
Just buy a GS :pot:

Currently using my friends 2012 GSA to commute and so forth, the same model as I owned in 2013. On the tar its very nice to ride, it really is one of the best long distance bikes I have ever felt.

Riding sedately(ish) on our dirt road I sometimes bottom it out even set up with max preload and hard settings. And you can sort of point it in a direction but your not really in control of your line, especially in the sand. Or at least I have this feeling with the GS. I took a 2015GSA for a test ride the other day, on tar once again it was impressively comfortable, but the moment I got on the dirt I could feel the suspension was way too soft and the chassis had a lot more flex that the 1190. It feels really unhappy on dirt IMHO.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: ktmmer on September 29, 2015, 12:55:48 pm
How did they stamp the vin number? If  by hand, a future police clearance might become a challenge .
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Dux on September 29, 2015, 01:07:46 pm
How did they stamp the vin number? If  by hand, a future police clearance might become a challenge .

If KTM replace a frame or engine they supply one with the original number punched in at the factory to prevent any licensing issues .
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 01:51:23 pm
How did they stamp the vin number? If  by hand, a future police clearance might become a challenge .

If KTM replace a frame or engine they supply one with the original number punched in at the factory to prevent any licensing issues .

Jip
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on September 29, 2015, 02:00:17 pm
Well I'm definitely going to get the new airbox bits and retrofit just in case.  There are 2 new parts in the 2015 airbox compared to the '13 and '14 ones and it seems them + unifilter work pretty well.



Guys have even had trouble with the Rottweiler setup it seems. Rott is now making a deflector in front of their airbox so the air doesnt go straight into it like before.  It seems KTM designed the intake track from the front too well, and the airbox not well enough hahaha
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: TornadoF5 on September 29, 2015, 02:04:37 pm
....and now might be the time to speak with Charl aka Charliepappa he is wanting to sell his SE!!
His number is 082-897-4333
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on September 29, 2015, 02:10:50 pm
....and now might be the time to speak with Charl aka Charliepappa he is wanting to sell his SE!!
His number is 082-897-4333

I have my eye on one already, but thanks I will keep the number.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 02, 2015, 06:26:00 pm
I went to trax ktm today as my bike is finished.

It all looks good and right and everyone was friendly until I asked what they did about my airfilter leaking, the mechanic gave me a funny look and said that they cant do anything about that.

I then asked them if they would like to buy my bike as I am actually quite disappointed in the bike overall. They basically said not yet and they could look at it in a month.

I am not impressed, have since cooled down and now I would like to ask advice on how to proceed. I would like to know if someone here has experience with the consumer protection act as the bike is not suitable for the purpose it is advertised for.

I am pretty close to never wanting anything to do with any KTM product or anything orange ever again.

Any advice please. And I will probably go and pick the bike up tomorrow, on a trailer.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on October 02, 2015, 06:35:40 pm
maybe first a letter to KTM SA and KTM Austria?

Doubt if you can lodge a complaint without having exhausted all official avenues......

Maybe contact this guy and ask his advice as well? He helped me getting wiring diagrams for the 1290 before the service manual was available
BRIAN TODD
CUSTOMER SERVICE
KTM MOTORCYCLES SA (PTY) LTD
Unit 4, 251 Aintree Ave
Northriding Commercial Park
North Riding, 2194
South Africa
P: +27 (0) 11 462 7796
F: +27 (0) 11 462 7182
Fax mail 086 218 0361
brian@ktmsa.co.za
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on October 02, 2015, 06:36:15 pm
How much mileage and when did you get it?
Title: Re:
Post by: 2wdrift on October 02, 2015, 06:45:14 pm
Thanks bundu.

I got it in 09/01/2014 and it has around 25k km on.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Draadwerk on October 02, 2015, 08:02:45 pm
Send the KTM to me tomorrow, and I will get the money to pay you for it from RAD. How's that sound? 😀😉
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 02, 2015, 09:43:46 pm
Send the KTM to me tomorrow, and I will get the money to pay you for it from RAD. How's that sound? 😀😉

If only I could trust you forum people it would have been halfway there by now...  :deal:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 03, 2015, 08:12:41 am
I have sent an email to Brian and will report back to you guys how KTM handles this situation.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on October 03, 2015, 10:15:39 am
I think it's too late for a CPA return. Usually I think there's a 6 month "implied warranty" but I'm not sure about on a new bike.  Good luck man.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 03, 2015, 10:21:37 am
I think it's too late for a CPA return. Usually I think there's a 6 month "implied warranty" but I'm not sure about on a new bike.  Good luck man.
I'll start doing research.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on October 03, 2015, 10:39:36 am
I think it's too late for a CPA return. Usually I think there's a 6 month "implied warranty" but I'm not sure about on a new bike.  Good luck man.

I'm not so sure - his argument is the bike has never been "fit-for-purpose"
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 03, 2015, 10:47:26 am
But now that I have cooled down and no longer want to have a long painfull fight I would rather sort this out with KTM. If all else fails I can brand my bike and park it next to a few KTM dealerships...
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Draadwerk on October 03, 2015, 10:52:14 am
Trust your fellow wilddogs man 😁👍
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on October 03, 2015, 11:23:47 am
But now that I have cooled down and no longer want to have a long painfull fight I would rather sort this out with KTM. If all else fails I can brand my bike and park it next to a few KTM dealerships...

handled correctly, I'm sure you will come right  :thumleft:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 03, 2015, 01:38:50 pm
I had a quick chat to the head mechanic at trax and he said he would try and help me and perhaps try and organise something with head office at well. I really appreciated that. And my problem doesnt really lie with the mechanics or dealerships its with KTM's refusal to take responsibility for their fuckups.

But my point still stands that I have a motor full of dirt and a warranty that expires in january.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 05, 2015, 11:33:03 am
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on October 05, 2015, 11:37:16 am
Sounds like a fair deal to me, but I would ask them to make special note on their system that even if your motor had to die after your extended warranty ends, that they honour the fact and acknowledge that the engine problem as as a result of their faulty airbag in the first 2 years, and not through any fault of your own.

Not saying anything will happen, but should it later down the line, at least Brian's acknowledgement is on record for your sake should another customer service representative eventually take over from him during this time.

Well done.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on October 05, 2015, 12:35:58 pm
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.

that's good to hear!  :thumleft:

I would make sure I have a recording of the conversation or something on paper  :deal:

now ride that fucking thing!  ;) :biggrin:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 05, 2015, 12:39:56 pm
It was all done via email. So I have record of it.  :thumleft:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Fudge on October 05, 2015, 12:43:41 pm
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.
:thumleft:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Toffie@2 on October 05, 2015, 01:56:17 pm
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.

that's good to hear!  :thumleft:

I would make sure I have a recording of the conversation or something on paper  :deal:

now ride that fucking thing!  ;) :biggrin:

Great news! Glad for you 2wdrift :biggrin:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Manic on October 05, 2015, 09:59:50 pm
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.

Why would cleaning the airfilter yourself void the Warranty?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on October 05, 2015, 11:48:33 pm
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.

Why would cleaning the airfilter yourself void the Warranty?

I think he was perhaps just overly cautious and concerned that him fiddling with the problematic area, would result in KTM coming up with shit arguments
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: 2wdrift on October 06, 2015, 01:40:54 am
I contacted Brian at KTM (thanks bundu) he said I would get another year of warranty if anything goes wrong with the engine. I think this is a good compromise.

I asked if I can clean the filter myself and not void the warranty and he agreed. I asked about the unifilter and he said it would not void the warranty but they believe the DNA is good enough. I will ask Trax to do a leakdown test and have them fit the 2015 airbox. I will ask Trax to also show me how to clean the filter just for the warranty's sake.

I have another year on the bike at least so I am pretty happy with the outcome. I was expecting no real help or solution from them so I was pleasantly surprised.

Why would cleaning the airfilter yourself void the Warranty?

I think he was perhaps just overly cautious and concerned that him fiddling with the problematic area, would result in KTM coming up with shit arguments

Yes, I have had dealings with a certain car manufacturer where they claimed the incorrect fitting of certain parts. Even after I asked them if they would come to malawi to fix the car them selves. So I am just being cautious and not taking any chances.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: fudgypup on May 15, 2019, 06:36:47 pm
My buddy's 1190 frame cracked last week.  Did a search and then found this YouTube vid of a similar incident.

https://youtu.be/fRh9PdvEbfk
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: hiltonph on May 16, 2019, 03:45:06 pm
My buddy's 1190 frame cracked last week.  Did a search and then found this YouTube vid of a similar incident.

https://youtu.be/fRh9PdvEbfk

Well now he can trash that bike and it will never break again... well at least not where he fixed it :imaposer: :imaposer: :imaposer:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Roadhawg on May 16, 2019, 03:53:36 pm
My buddy's 1190 frame cracked last week.  Did a search and then found this YouTube vid of a similar incident.

https://youtu.be/fRh9PdvEbfk

Some would say that bike seems excessively loaded....especially for that sort of terrain.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on May 16, 2019, 04:01:28 pm
My buddy's 1190 frame cracked last week.  Did a search and then found this YouTube vid of a similar incident.

https://youtu.be/fRh9PdvEbfk

Some would say that bike seems excessively loaded....especially for that sort of terrain.

was my 1st thought as well
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on May 16, 2019, 04:21:31 pm
All you need is a Tent, Sleeping bag, T-shirts, Shorts, Toothbrush, Duct Tape, Cable-ties, Tools, and maybe a Toilet roll...
Geez, what was he carrying in there, his whole bedroom cupboard? Ha ha
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: katana on May 16, 2019, 06:02:00 pm
All you need is a Tent, Sleeping bag, T-shirts, Shorts black bag, Toothbrush, Duct Tape, Cable-ties, Tools, and maybe a Toilet roll...
Geez, what was he carrying in there, his whole bedroom cupboard? Ha ha
Fixed, the good old days.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Xchallenge on May 16, 2019, 06:09:53 pm
Okay you win.
But can we agree on a toilet roll at least?

Ha ha

All you need is a Tent, Sleeping bag, T-shirts, Shorts black bag, Toothbrush, Duct Tape, Cable-ties, Tools, and maybe a Toilet roll...
Geez, what was he carrying in there, his whole bedroom cupboard? Ha ha
Fixed, the good old days.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 16, 2019, 07:04:02 pm
I watched the video. That is piss easy terrain. True, a red route for the BMW riders clubs, but a green route for real bikes and bikers. Quite a few trip pictures in the ride reports were put up lately of real terrain. Have a look there and compare.  Only in the video the bike was not designed for that terrain. I put the fault solely on the bike. Maybe a flawed model and not representative of the general production output.

Picture below was taken next to the Fish river canyon, both bikes already a bit off-loaded. From there it was the road to Walvis. Those here that have had the privilege of having ridden that road will know. But, those two bikes were still built with real metal and not composite shite or materials skimmed to the bone in order to save 5kg off the overall weight.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: m0lt3n on May 20, 2019, 11:31:51 am
I always wonder if apples are compared to apples when I see pics like those above.

Quick example, put those big bulky indicators on my 1190 and it wont last a week. (just the previous trip already a CRF250L riding with me lost an indicator, same terrain same speed as myself)
Its simply not the same, my average speed on gravel over a corrugated crappy gravel road is the top speed of those old bonies. We put considerably more strain on the newer faster machines.I look at those panniers on the black/red bike, they wouldn't last and then the (plastic?) topbox on the white GS, loaded that frame will crack. And this from experience, I did bend the topbox bracket on my GS that the box hang at almost 45 degrees. And then I also had to reweld my frame on that GS as well. I don't see the frame of an 1150 being stronger.

And I know I am abusing my 1190 more than I did the GS.

Its simply not apples with apples, the bikes are faster and therefore you hit the road faster, bumps harder, the strain everywhere is more.

Granted, the headunit mounts suck, but something always has to go first
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 03:22:27 pm
Don’t know what your top speed is, but we klapped those BMs an easy 130km/h for large stretches on that road.  Going into the dry river dips at top speed and flying out at the other side. Going airborne for the first metre or so. Thumping them down on the other side. At times the GS was ahead of me and did I so wish I could take pictures of that bike being airborne. Quite a sight. Then smashing them into sand banks where you took a wrong spoor and not a chance you can brake at that speed (at most speeds on those roads) so you close the petrol, gear down and head for the thickest, best sand bank and “crash” the bike into it. Switch the engine off. Take a smoke break and wiggle the bike out. And start it all over again.

 I make my comparisons on what I see. I have ridden those roads multiple times over many years - same roads, my bike still the same, but no other bikes, anyway none of these super adventure bikes. Only the usual small Chinese local bikes. Watching this video I know now why I did not see any of these advanced, heavy duty super ADV bikes. The video says it all. Show me your pictures on those roads with these elite adventure bikes and I shall reconsider. I believe what I see. The strain that I have put on that bike over 20 years, no new bike will survive. Keep dreaming. The proof is always in the pudding.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: m0lt3n on May 20, 2019, 04:11:42 pm
Don’t know what your top speed is, but we klapped those BMs an easy 130km/h for large stretches on that road.  Going into the dry river dips at top speed and flying out at the other side. Going airborne for the first metre or so. Thumping them down on the other side. At times the GS was ahead of me and did I so wish I could take pictures of that bike being airborne. Quite a sight. Then smashing them into sand banks where you took a wrong spoor and not a chance you can brake at that speed (at most speeds on those roads) so you close the petrol, gear down and head for the thickest, best sand bank and “crash” the bike into it. Switch the engine off. Take a smoke break and wiggle the bike out. And start it all over again.

 I make my comparisons on what I see. I have ridden those roads multiple times over many years - same roads, my bike still the same, but no other bikes, anyway none of these super adventure bikes. Only the usual small Chinese local bikes. Watching this video I know now why I did not see any of these advanced, heavy duty super ADV bikes. The video says it all. Show me your pictures on those roads with these elite adventure bikes and I shall reconsider. I believe what I see. The strain that I have put on that bike over 20 years, no new bike will survive. Keep dreaming. The proof is always in the pudding.


What video?
Are you asking me for pics proofing my adv bike can do rough terrain?



Composites? I don't know of any adv bike making use of composites? I have welded two GS frames (rear frame failed and front has also failed on adv) and my KTM frame, nothing fancy
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 04:17:49 pm
If you do not know what video, then why did you chip in?
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: m0lt3n on May 20, 2019, 04:56:28 pm
Apologies. I thought you were referring to a video with some actual difficult terrain.
No I agree, that terrain in that vid isn't that tough.

Why not rather show me one more instance where the 1190 frame broke at that spot? That random vid is the only case I know of and I follow a lot of 1190 pages.

But you missed my point, I am saying that the old bikes do not take the same kind of shots as current generation bikes as they were simply to slow. Maybe one hard impact but then it takes 5km to get back up to speed while the current Gen bikes are already taking shots again in that 5km.
130 on gravel isn't fast

But this all is a moot point, pointless discussion. The extend any bike will be exposed to abuse is determined by the rider's willingness to accept damage to his bike. How deep his pockets are.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: Bundu on May 20, 2019, 06:41:10 pm
Don’t know what your top speed is, but we klapped those BMs an easy 130km/h for large stretches on that road.  Going into the dry river dips at top speed and flying out at the other side. Going airborne for the first metre or so. Thumping them down on the other side. At times the GS was ahead of me and did I so wish I could take pictures of that bike being airborne. Quite a sight. Then smashing them into sand banks where you took a wrong spoor and not a chance you can brake at that speed (at most speeds on those roads) so you close the petrol, gear down and head for the thickest, best sand bank and “crash” the bike into it. Switch the engine off. Take a smoke break and wiggle the bike out. And start it all over again.

 I make my comparisons on what I see. I have ridden those roads multiple times over many years - same roads, my bike still the same, but no other bikes, anyway none of these super adventure bikes. Only the usual small Chinese local bikes. Watching this video I know now why I did not see any of these advanced, heavy duty super ADV bikes. The video says it all. Show me your pictures on those roads with these elite adventure bikes and I shall reconsider. I believe what I see. The strain that I have put on that bike over 20 years, no new bike will survive. Keep dreaming. The proof is always in the pudding.

 :eek7: :eek7: ;)

seems like they don't make bikes or men, like they used to................. but life carries on and people still have fun on 'super' adventure bikes :sip:
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: m0lt3n on May 20, 2019, 09:36:45 pm
Yeah... Just thinking what else I can put my bikes through... It's done old mill drift, road to hell, it's done 2500km tar in 32hrs and 1600km gravel in 23hrs. I have driven 400km to GS trophy try outs and back after the event, done a Losper technical Lesotho ride and I did not trailer there or back like the others. Kom se pad, prins Alfred baviaans and antoniesbergpas and back in heavy rain (and back) in one day.

Yes, the proof is in the pudding. They can do everything the old bikes could and TONS more.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 10:39:59 pm
I suppose it comes down to priorities. For me the priority is to get to my destination safely without troubles along the way, meaning I place reliability at the top.  E.g. electric windows and air conditioning in a motor vehicle do not impress me. I grew up without it and can still cope without it.  I prefer to be in charge of what I am riding, Modern vehicles (bikes and cars) mostly take that ability away. A computer and electronics mostly run the vehicles. I know of a lot of people who prefer that. I have a handheld air pressure tester with which I test the pressure of my tires. That is the way they like it and that is the way I like it. In the process I sacrifice certain things, like better fuel efficiency, better braking ability (compared to some modern bikes), faster acceleration, weight, etc.

The dry weight of the R60/6 is given as 210kg, that of the R80/7 as 215kg and that of the KTM 1190 Adventure R as 217kg. The maximum power as 40hp at 6400rpm, 55hp at 7000rpm and 147.5hp at 9500 respectively. So comparing the R60/6 (pictured above) to the KTM1190 you have 3.5 times the power output for about the same weight. The KTM wins that competition hands free. That, amongst other things, is related to my remark above as to bikes being skimmed to the bone and composite materials being used. Double the engine capacity, 3.5 times the power output and only 7kg heavier.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 10:41:41 pm

130 on gravel isn't fast


True, I thought often about what speeds can actually be achieved on some of those roads. Just keep in mind that I at all times used road tires, not knobblies. That does affect the bike’s handling on those roads.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 11:01:12 pm
These pictures were taken in the Khomas hochland. Locals in Swakop looked at my bike and very informatively said I won’t make it to Windhoek. At one stage the pass I was on was too steep for the road tires of the bike. The rear wheel kept spinning on the same spot – lots of loose sand and pebbles and stones. So I took off a lot of baggage, drove the bike another 300m (it could then with stuff having been off-loaded) stopped and carried the stuff to there, loaded the bike again and drove on to Windhoek.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 11:02:27 pm
Riding around in Lesotho.

Coming down some pass called Sani.

Kindly note the lack of ultra advanced, road specific tires.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 20, 2019, 11:06:18 pm
Try this with a KTM.

(oops, I forgot, there wasn’t a bike called KTM back then. sorry. KTM missed out on that fabulous era of unlimited raw materials)
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: m0lt3n on May 21, 2019, 04:52:29 am
I don't know anymore.
Putting down a photo of Sani as an example of rough terrain?
I have a Harley as well, and would be willing to do Sani with it.

Reliability? I have only once had to leave my bike due to mechanical failure, in Namibia once when my final drive went on GS. One failure in a lot of extreme adventure biking on these elite bikes and I wouldn't call it elite.

Right now I would get on my 1190 and take it to Kairo if I had the money and time. With my heated grips and tyre pressure sensors and all. There is no way the older bikes are more reliable and they were most definitely not abused more. In fact, I am actually now planning a 2500km in 36hr dustybutt ride, yap, gravel only.


Its fine to believe in the old things. To prefer using them. It's fine to have a history with them and it's fine not to replace them. But to shoot down modern vehicles is not fine. To believe that technology have not gone ahead or progressed in the last 30 years... Is just not true
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: eberhard on May 21, 2019, 08:34:26 am
Change is inevitable. Progress not necessarily.
Title: Re: 1190R Broken Frame
Post by: m0lt3n on May 21, 2019, 09:15:12 am
Change is inevitable. Progress not necessarily.

I take it I have been trolled.