Wild Dog Adventure Riding

Technical Section => Make / Model Specific Discussions => KTM LC4 400/610/640 & 690 => Topic started by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:15:56 am

Title: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:15:56 am
Hi, has anyone seen this before? Pipe was fitted from new. The bike has 14000kms on the clock and I don't recall any noteworthy  damage from tumbles. Carbon tip also obviously came off
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: silvrav on September 28, 2015, 10:18:51 am
Looks like stress cracks? maybe to much movement on the pipe allow for to much shaking....
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: boland on September 28, 2015, 10:19:22 am
Have you ever repacked the exhaust?

Had a similar issue with a Wings, the endcap was still perfect but the can itself had a small part missing and the holes was very big. Seems like you need to repack every 4 000 - 5 000 km
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:20:55 am
Have you ever repacked the exhaust?

Had a similar issue with a Wings, the endcap was still perfect but the can itself had a small part missing and the holes was very big. Seems like you need to repack every 4 000 - 5 000 km

I haven't no
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:24:43 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: wolf skaap on September 28, 2015, 10:29:00 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?
It's definitely worth a try.
There's no apparent impact marks on the exhaust which could have lead to this stress fracture:
(http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180591.0;attach=439132;image)

IMO it's this crack that caused the failure of all the other parts.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: boland on September 28, 2015, 10:29:42 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.

Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:34:56 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?
It's definitely worth a try.
There's no apparent impact marks on the exhaust which could have lead to this stress fracture:
IMO it's this crack that caused the failure of all the other parts.

If I had to take a guess, the rivets were slightly loose, causing the end cap to vibrate back and forth enlarging the holes and causing the crack
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: wolf skaap on September 28, 2015, 10:36:34 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.



You might have a point.
It seems to have a heat induced discoloration at this point..
A neglected exhaust definitely runs hotter
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: BLK on September 28, 2015, 10:38:05 am
My own experience with a 690 seems that everything at the back of the bike/tail piece breaks.Its seems there is a high degree of vibration.
The indicators last a couple of KM's then break off.
My touratech carrier broke(cracked).....Touratech replaced it as a goodwill gesture.

I see your exhaust seems to be a similar problem being a high frechency problem.(my 690 was a 2014 model)

Just a thought
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:39:56 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.

Well by the time we took the end piece off, most of the packing had been blown out so it's hard to tell which came first. The rivets were definitely loose and the cap was rattling around before the crack appeared (or before I noticed it at least)
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: boland on September 28, 2015, 10:46:37 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.

Well by the time we took the end piece off, most of the packing had been blown out so it's hard to tell which came first. The rivets were definitely loose and the cap was rattling around before the crack appeared (or before I noticed it at least)

I also noticed that some of the rivets were loose and later on the entire endcap started coming loose. The 690's are notoriously heavy on packing.

Hope you can make a (cheap) plan. I ended up replacing mine with a very good second hand unit.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:49:01 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.

Well by the time we took the end piece off, most of the packing had been blown out so it's hard to tell which came first. The rivets were definitely loose and the cap was rattling around before the crack appeared (or before I noticed it at least)

I also noticed that some of the rivets were loose and later on the entire endcap started coming loose. The 690's are notoriously heavy on packing.

Hope you can make a (cheap) plan. I ended up replacing mine with a very good second hand unit.

Thanks it's beyond repair I'm afraid. I'll see what the distributors have to say and take it from there
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: boland on September 28, 2015, 10:53:32 am
Good luck :thumleft:. The wings is a good product, mine lasted around 42 k kms and I did neglect the packing since taking ownership.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 10:56:28 am
Good luck :thumleft:. The wings is a good product, mine lasted around 42 k kms and I did neglect the packing since taking ownership.

Shot I already decided that Wings would be the replacement, it's just a matter now of who's going to pay for it  >:D

I do still have the unused stock pipe and I'll probably fit that for the time being. Hideous freakin thing though
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: the_BOBNOB on September 28, 2015, 11:01:32 am
OEM exhausts have metal baffles etc - that tend to last the entire life of the bike.

After market exhaust use packing that needs to be repacked every xxxxx km, I just repacked my Dakar's Van Der Linde exhaust this weekend.

My first packing only lasted about 20 000km my last packing lasted about 30 000km and was still in pretty good shape when I replaced it - it is important to pack it correctly, then it lasts otherwise it gets destroyed quickly.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Bill the Bong on September 28, 2015, 12:06:12 pm
My Wings did almost the same.  Extreme heat due to packing blowing out after last year's Amag.  I cut it shorter just short of the holes.  Cut inner perforated pipe same amount.  Repack and go. Difference is my end cap did not break, just the titanium skin.

Running at full taps took the packing out in 3 stages. This year I used an FMF.   Sounds kak, fitted extremely poorly, but survived with the packing intact. 
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: ChrisL - DUSTRIDERS on September 28, 2015, 12:09:16 pm
My Wings did the same.  Extreme heat due to packing blowing out after last year's Amag.  Cut it shorter just short of the holes.  Cut inner perforated pipe same amount.  Repack and go.

Running at full taps took the packing out in 3 stages.
Dis goeie raad Dwerg, spaar jou die prys van n nuwe pyp. :deal:
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 12:13:01 pm
My Wings did the same.  Extreme heat due to packing blowing out after last year's Amag.  Cut it shorter just short of the holes.  Cut inner perforated pipe same amount.  Repack and go.

Running at full taps took the packing out in 3 stages.
Dis goeie raad Dwerg, spaar jou die prys van n nuwe pyp. :deal:

Die ou wat ons gehelp het het die kraak probeer weld en die eerste keer wat ek hom start toe blaas daar 'n gat so groot soos 'n 5 rand in die end cap. Het daai oplossing oorweeg maar die end cap is ongelukig Mike Tango
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: ChrisL - DUSTRIDERS on September 28, 2015, 12:25:08 pm
End cap behoort jy nuut te kry by die agente.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 12:35:20 pm
End cap behoort jy nuut te kry by die agente.

Dankie ek het vir hulle 'n email gestuur vroeer vanoggend so ek sal maar wag om te hoor wat my opsies is
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 01:24:44 pm
Agents have replied, very friendly and helpful. They'll be sending my mails and photo's to the factory and will get back to me
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: 1190 on September 28, 2015, 01:39:43 pm
Mate of mine 1290's akra also cracked (near the header) and was replaced by the agent
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Richard Smit on September 28, 2015, 03:06:44 pm
Are 100% sure that that is a genuine Akra end-cap?
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 28, 2015, 03:21:36 pm
Are 100% sure that that is a genuine Akra end-cap?


Yes. Fitted from new by ktm. Lost the carbon tip on the trip
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on September 29, 2015, 06:54:47 am
Warranty claim submitted. Now awaiting feedback
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on October 02, 2015, 06:45:21 am
Unfortunatly your warranty claim has been refused as the warranty period on KTM Powerparts is 6 Months and is therefore expired.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on October 02, 2015, 06:51:13 am
Th best they can do is offer me a new end cap at a discounted price. End cap and carbon tip will come to almost half the price of a new wings pipe
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Noneking on October 02, 2015, 07:02:02 am
6 maande? 😩😩Het meer verwag van hulle......
Title: Re: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: the_BOBNOB on October 02, 2015, 07:03:35 am
Unfortunatly your warranty claim has been refused as the warranty period on KTM Powerparts is 6 Months and is therefore expired.
And what prevents it from happening again?
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on October 02, 2015, 07:14:07 am
6 maande? 😩😩Het meer verwag van hulle......

Ja self. Vir starters verwag die pyp sal langer hou as 'n jaar

Unfortunatly your warranty claim has been refused as the warranty period on KTM Powerparts is 6 Months and is therefore expired.
And what prevents it from happening again?

Buying something else would prevent that
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: the_BOBNOB on October 02, 2015, 08:31:42 am
do not count out the locally made pipes

van der linde
scorch
etc

my van der linde i bought 2nd hand on gumtree and i have doen 90 000km (not sure how much the previous owner did) and not a days problems - every weld, every joint still 100%  :thumleft:
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Titanic on October 02, 2015, 09:02:08 am
Talking about local. If that was my pipe I would have taken it to Stealth performance pipes. They do amazing work at very competitive prices.
They might be able to manufacture a new end cap and fix/modify the pipe.
http://www.stealthpipes.co.za (http://www.stealthpipes.co.za)



Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on October 02, 2015, 09:36:12 am
From the distributor:

With the next system you purchase ensure you re-pack the silencer often this is one of the biggest contributing factors to the rivets and end caps coming loose. What happens is once the exhaust wool is burnt away the damping it offers is no longer there and this then starts adding more vibration which will loosen anything.


Spoke to the OEM DEPT Akrapovic KTM at the Factory and they recommend the packing is changed at a minimum of every 6000km for average use. The Dakar bikes get changed for every stage to ensure no failures may occur which can cost them overall positions. Many things on bikes today require periodical checking to ensure they last...
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Takashi on October 02, 2015, 09:43:06 am
From the distributor:

With the next system you purchase ensure you re-pack the silencer often this is one of the biggest contributing factors to the rivets and end caps coming loose. What happens is once the exhaust wool is burnt away the damping it offers is no longer there and this then starts adding more vibration which will loosen anything.


Spoke to the OEM DEPT Akrapovic KTM at the Factory and they recommend the packing is changed at a minimum of every 6000km for average use. The Dakar bikes get changed for every stage to ensure no failures may occur which can cost them overall positions. Many things on bikes today require periodical checking to ensure they last...


Did KTM tell you when they fitted the bike that the packing should be changed every 6000kms?

If not make it their problem.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: the_BOBNOB on October 02, 2015, 09:50:54 am
Did KTM tell you when they fitted the bike that the packing should be changed every 6000kms?

If not make it their problem.

Do you actually live in South Africa ???

In South Africa it is never a dealers problem - the dealer is just the man between you and the factory <period>
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Noneking on October 02, 2015, 10:13:21 am
From the distributor:

With the next system you purchase ensure you re-pack the silencer often this is one of the biggest contributing factors to the rivets and end caps coming loose. What happens is once the exhaust wool is burnt away the damping it offers is no longer there and this then starts adding more vibration which will loosen anything.


Spoke to the OEM DEPT Akrapovic KTM at the Factory and they recommend the packing is changed at a minimum of every 6000km for average use. The Dakar bikes get changed for every stage to ensure no failures may occur which can cost them overall positions. Many things on bikes today require periodical checking to ensure they last...


Does that apply to all their products? Should I be doing the packing on my 2 1200's??
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on October 02, 2015, 10:18:27 am
No idea. The Akra on my 800 was still fine when I sold it with 90 000km on thhe clock
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Bundu on October 02, 2015, 02:40:35 pm
on the Wings they say as soon as any discolouring on the silincer is noticed, it should be repacked - mine has probably done about 10k km now and still seems fine
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: WP on October 06, 2015, 07:00:01 am
Talking about local. If that was my pipe I would have taken it to Stealth performance pipes. They do amazing work at very competitive prices.
They might be able to manufacture a new end cap and fix/modify the pipe.
http://www.stealthpipes.

 (http://www.stealthpipes.co.za)

Completely agree, take it to Stealth in Montana and hear what they say.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: BiG DoM on October 06, 2015, 07:14:04 am
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.



You might have a point.
It seems to have a heat induced discoloration at this point..
A neglected exhaust definitely runs hotter


Doubt agents will warranty - clearly well used. Typical vibration stress fracture and denegration. Carbon end caps are available but get the Vaseline out (even on evilBay they are $$$). The discolouration is normal for titanium. I would suggest either sourcing a trashed can for harvesting the tailpiece - a very tricky weld on TiT thin and on a bend but you may find a wunderkind who can do it. Then trim 10-15mm off can (may need to also shorten the perforated through pipe the same) and re-drill and re-rivitt with SS rivitts after a repack. I am sure Scortch or one of the other local zorst guys would do it for you.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Noneking on October 06, 2015, 01:36:20 pm
Would there be any point in trying to contact the distributors or would that be a waste of time?

It couldn't hurt to contact them. I suspect the damage was caused due to the packing being moeg, but I'm definitely not an expert.



You might have a point.
It seems to have a heat induced discoloration at this point..
A neglected exhaust definitely runs hotter


Doubt agents will warranty - clearly well used. Typical vibration stress fracture and denegration. Carbon end caps are available but get the Vaseline out (even on evilBay they are $$$). The discolouration is normal for titanium. I would suggest either sourcing a trashed can for harvesting the tailpiece - a very tricky weld on TiT thin and on a bend but you may find a wunderkind who can do it. Then trim 10-15mm off each can (may need to also shorten the perforated through pipe the same) and re-drill and re-rivitt with SS rivitts after a repack. I am sure Scortch or one of the other local zorst guys would do it for you.

Not what you would expect from "premium brand " slip-on after 13000km.
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: boland on October 07, 2015, 10:20:48 am
From the distributor:

With the next system you purchase ensure you re-pack the silencer often this is one of the biggest contributing factors to the rivets and end caps coming loose. What happens is once the exhaust wool is burnt away the damping it offers is no longer there and this then starts adding more vibration which will loosen anything.


Spoke to the OEM DEPT Akrapovic KTM at the Factory and they recommend the packing is changed at a minimum of every 6000km for average use. The Dakar bikes get changed for every stage to ensure no failures may occur which can cost them overall positions. Many things on bikes today require periodical checking to ensure they last...


Does that apply to all their products? Should I be doing the packing on my 2 1200's??

The big singles are very heavy on packing. 2 cyl + much less so. Or thats how I understand it
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dux on October 08, 2015, 08:04:40 am
The end cap can be repaired , a mate of mine does laser welding , awesome work , pm me if you are interested
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Xpat on October 12, 2015, 10:53:05 pm
Dwerg, have you got the Wings yet? I have ordered one and if everything goes well I want to install it on Saturday.

If you've got it, did you do the 15 minutes idle procedure after the install? Ta
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on October 13, 2015, 06:29:34 am
Dwerg, have you got the Wings yet? I have ordered one and if everything goes well I want to install it on Saturday.

If you've got it, did you do the 15 minutes idle procedure after the install? Ta

Haven't had time to get to the bike yet. A bit busy at work at the moment. I am going to install the stock pipe for the time being
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on December 08, 2015, 09:32:08 am
Dwerg, have you got the Wings yet? I have ordered one and if everything goes well I want to install it on Saturday.

If you've got it, did you do the 15 minutes idle procedure after the install? Ta

Haven't had time to get to the bike yet. A bit busy at work at the moment. I am going to install the stock pipe for the time being

Ended up installing the stock pipe. Just started the bike and rode to work without any idle procedure and it ran fine. Intake noise is now louder than the pipe but it sounds quite nice actually
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on December 08, 2015, 09:34:10 am
Oh and I now have the Acra and baffle lying around if anyone has use for it. End cap is totally stuffed by now
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dirt Junkie on December 08, 2015, 09:39:34 am
Oh and I now have the Acra and baffle lying around if anyone has use for it. End cap is totally stuffed by now
why don't you have a new stainless steel cap made just shorten the slipon a bit before fitting it
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: Dwerg on December 08, 2015, 11:55:06 am
Oh and I now have the Acra and baffle lying around if anyone has use for it. End cap is totally stuffed by now
why don't you have a new stainless steel cap made just shorten the slipon a bit before fitting it

I once traded in a car because the window winder broke. This pipe is dead to me
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: zetman on December 09, 2015, 11:18:25 pm
Dips asb sal jou pm stuur
Title: Re: Akrapovic damage - 690
Post by: bud500 on December 10, 2015, 09:15:39 am

The big singles are very heavy on packing. 2 cyl + much less so. Or thats how I understand it
There must be some truth in this. Have done 60 000km on my Wings with zero issues. I am not aware that I should do packing at any stage.