Wild Dog Adventure Riding

Riding: Plan, Report and Racing => Racing Section => Topic started by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 09:25:00 am

Title: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 09:25:00 am
Come On!

All you desk jockeys, wannabe racers and, like me, Injured and broke, lets get the firehose going.

F5uckers!


{Mod edit: Changed the title for and easier search in years to come.

Here is the link to the Baja preparation & buildup thread: http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=180904.0 (http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=180904.0)  :deal: }
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 09:37:58 am
My team mates from yore

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mLJqgWb/0/L/IMG_5586-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mLJqgWb/A)

Justin and Rob

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-5BmHW2K/0/L/IMG_5598-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-5BmHW2K/A)

Random shots from Rynet today

No pressure on Joey

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-76QgNq8/0/L/IMG_5606-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-76QgNq8/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Rtbsmsn/0/L/IMG_5593-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Rtbsmsn/A)

Some serious guys

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7q4sR3D/0/L/IMG_5594-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7q4sR3D/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/0/L/IMG_5596-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/A)

Fast Veterinarian - Bonova

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Ptm9q33/0/L/IMG_5602-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Ptm9q33/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WGkXJxN/0/L/IMG_5597-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WGkXJxN/A)











Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Wookie on March 18, 2016, 09:37:58 am
Nothing to add but subscribed
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 09:42:36 am
(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-5JP28g7/0/L/IMG_5595-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-5JP28g7/A)

Is she racing?

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wr9z5hh/0/L/IMG_5599-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wr9z5hh/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-k2fnG3j/0/L/IMG_5604-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-k2fnG3j/A)

She certainly is...

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-nNNLnQg/0/L/IMG_5603-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-nNNLnQg/A)

Competitor Liaison Rynet, Only woman to have finished 2 Amagezas.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-LSG3xWL/0/L/IMG_5605-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-LSG3xWL/A)



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 09:50:46 am
It all gets real once you get your stickers!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-BWJRscZ/0/L/IMG_5609-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-BWJRscZ/A)

Roger Kane Berman, one very quick rider

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-hfwst92/0/L/IMG_5610-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-hfwst92/A)

Bonova

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-QjWGkvQ/0/L/IMG_5608-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-QjWGkvQ/A)



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: bud500 on March 18, 2016, 09:54:56 am
Yes Judie is racing. Got a late sponsorship offer.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Wookie on March 18, 2016, 09:56:55 am
Yes Judie is racing. Got a late sponsorship offer.

Yep riding  for Woema / mefo team  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Vintage_Mania on March 18, 2016, 10:03:32 am
*ingeskryf*
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: DirtRebell on March 18, 2016, 10:08:14 am
Hey waars my homey, Geelkat?

Sterkte aan almal!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 10:24:04 am
Some have already picked up some unplanned expenses

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7B7845m/0/L/IMG_5585-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7B7845m/A)

MaxthePandas old bikes new rider Chris and co

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-JMqccrR/0/L/IMG_5614-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-JMqccrR/A)


No wife, must make do...
(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CfBHdBL/0/L/IMG_5617-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CfBHdBL/A)

Start them young

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-hpP95Pb/0/L/IMG_5619-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-hpP95Pb/A)

The pits

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-9R5CkwD/0/L/IMG_5616-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-9R5CkwD/A)


Donavan and Robert Aka ....? and Darthvader

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7C8bkw9/0/L/IMG_5618-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7C8bkw9/A)

Random scrutineering

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-JKZWzQg/0/L/IMG_5620-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-JKZWzQg/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mp4QvPW/0/L/IMG_5621-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mp4QvPW/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8cBmtrp/0/L/IMG_5623-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8cBmtrp/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CjN3m4S/0/L/IMG_5625-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CjN3m4S/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-zNJ4WWQ/0/L/IMG_5626-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-zNJ4WWQ/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mbCznWn/0/L/IMG_5630-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mbCznWn/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qszT2hm/0/L/IMG_5628-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qszT2hm/A)

Training or last years Amageza still in there?

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-QvbJM5g/0/L/IMG_5627-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-QvbJM5g/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-TZWJV3V/0/L/IMG_5629-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-TZWJV3V/A)




Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 10:36:14 am
Robert aka Darthvader has a rally nickname... Von Faff.

If anything normally takes 10 minutes, Robert can easily make a day of it and lose shit whilst doing it.

Last year on the way to Scrutineering he lost his wallet. He never got it back and had to borrow a credit card. So you can imagine the banter going on on our WhatsApp group when Justin - Jagsding's message popped up this morning...

"Robert has lost his brand new R2k leatherman - was stressing and swearing - we unpacked the whole van only to find it exactly where he left it in his bag.... But there's still 2 days to go!"

Roberts reply -

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-xFSjz2W/0/L/IMG_5633-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-xFSjz2W/A)

More scrutineering

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-vg3txx2/0/L/IMG_5632-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-vg3txx2/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bazinga on March 18, 2016, 10:45:20 am
Subscribe!!!! Shit looks lekker
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 18, 2016, 10:50:20 am
Hahahah Robert ... can just imagine!!

And Joey #1 lekke man!

Thanks for starting the thread Kamanya...
It will be my 1st time sitting behind a desk... watching all the action..  :lamer:

Go Donovan!!  :ricky: :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: zebra - Flying Brick on March 18, 2016, 11:07:34 am
anyone going through to the BAJA, two items needed were left behind accidently...

3 Tubliss innners, and 12 Enviro-mats...

If anyone CAN help, would really appreciate it!
thanks, and enjoy!
CHris & Team

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: EtienneXplore on March 18, 2016, 11:11:46 am
(http://www.jasonkelly.com/wp-content/themes/JK/images/subscribe-button-small.png)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Dwerg on March 18, 2016, 11:15:24 am
Sub. Enjoy the ride everyone. Wish I could be there to bring up the rear  :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 11:18:11 am
Sub - Go Team Verve
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Pistonpete on March 18, 2016, 11:19:29 am
 :)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Pistonpete on March 18, 2016, 11:20:37 am
 :)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 11:30:47 am
Some of team Zama Zama

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-sGwqmLW/0/L/IMG_5635-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-sGwqmLW/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-FD9bqxN/0/L/IMG_5636-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-FD9bqxN/A)

And others

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-GRxrGxk/0/L/IMG_5637-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-GRxrGxk/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-cjDTMpd/0/L/IMG_5638-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-cjDTMpd/A)



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 11:32:11 am
Some pics of the Team Verve Boys.
White Rhino, Grolls and Chris I think. With the Gas Guzzler...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 11:35:32 am
Chris is riding MaxthePanda's old bike that he bought off of him. It's a sorted bike and one that Chris worked on when he came along as backup last year.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 11:40:04 am
Porn

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-bxbxC84/0/L/IMG_5640-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-bxbxC84/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-D8r7jGr/0/L/IMG_5641-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-D8r7jGr/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-dtmLcSF/0/L/IMG_5642-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-dtmLcSF/A)

Passed scrutineering - White numbers above 451cc, Yellow FIM Rally size - under 450

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-9QqpjKz/0/L/IMG_5644-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-9QqpjKz/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-t3rXBwk/0/L/IMG_5646-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-t3rXBwk/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-MKTD4mx/0/L/IMG_5648-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-MKTD4mx/A)

Justin is 13

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-6X7gpQ9/0/L/IMG_5647-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-6X7gpQ9/A)

Gazebo Widows

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mXrhmLC/0/L/IMG_5639-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mXrhmLC/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-nmVQdqZ/0/L/IMG_5643-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-nmVQdqZ/A)



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 11:43:32 am
Toilets.... Luxury!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mxWWCKn/0/L/IMG_5652-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mxWWCKn/A)


The gomma gomma couch

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WDvXJZK/0/L/IMG_5656-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WDvXJZK/A)



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: zetman on March 18, 2016, 11:43:52 am
 :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 18, 2016, 11:55:42 am
F5 F5 F5 F5 F5 while my heart eats crap.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: dookie on March 18, 2016, 11:56:22 am
.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Alsdad on March 18, 2016, 12:05:58 pm
Go Team Verve and The RAD Boys!!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:12:59 pm
Judy - Malibu

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-57zq25j/0/L/IMG_5657-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-57zq25j/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-G5VSSkG/0/L/IMG_5658-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-G5VSSkG/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:20:49 pm
It's gets stranger than fiction....

Kobie can't see so lekker - he's farsighted, life right in front of him is a bit of a blur. So Gideon has this flashing light taped to his bike so he can pick him out. Kobie can't navigate either so he has to stick with Gideon. Gideon for those that don't know is lighting fast, he won one of the tougher stages in 2014. Kobie was a factory KTM rider in his day. Both are national champions. I've ridden a bit with both. They are nuts.

Fastest pensioners in the North...

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZdbSSNt/0/L/IMG_5653-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZdbSSNt/A)

A new beast

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-hrDMRPB/0/L/IMG_5654-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-hrDMRPB/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CDfXx32/0/L/IMG_5649-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CDfXx32/A)

? Stellenbosch Redneck solutions?

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-69232XH/0/L/IMG_5655-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-69232XH/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-cbz478B/0/L/IMG_5650-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-cbz478B/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-gcTCPTG/0/L/IMG_5651-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-gcTCPTG/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:22:55 pm
Empty because there aren't any here... All amateurs making their dreams

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-LMmHC9x/0/L/IMG_5660-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-LMmHC9x/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Sprocketbek on March 18, 2016, 12:24:32 pm
Robert aka Darthvader has a rally nickname... Von Faff.

If anything normally takes 10 minutes, Robert can easily make a day of it and lose shit whilst doing it.

During Amageza 2 he stopped next to the track to fix a puncture, and lost the rear axle nut.
With help from a few of us, it took a good 2 hours to find it.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:27:03 pm
Our own Dakar finisher Kobus Potgieter. He's not slow, but he's not going to be right at the front. He does this for fun. He'll probably get a top 10

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZQG6GXb/0/L/IMG_5671-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZQG6GXb/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-VZfv3H5/0/L/IMG_5661-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-VZfv3H5/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-b4MQ3RG/0/L/IMG_5664-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-b4MQ3RG/A)

Utter Porrrrrrn! And he has two of them!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-NxPSJCL/0/L/IMG_5662-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-NxPSJCL/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-dbFPtwM/0/L/IMG_5663-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-dbFPtwM/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 18, 2016, 12:31:37 pm
Go Chris!!! (and the Pandamobile)  :snorting:

I see all the usual suspects are in tow... organisers and competitors alike. Peter looks like he's spent most of his prep time putting stickers on his bike which will no doubt make it much faster, so he better win. Of course he'll have to beat Kobus, who's a battle hardened Dakar veteran now with a reputation to uphold. And then there's the Subtech boys as usual, Joey only needs one working tyre on his bike, and a special shout out to Von Faff - he's spent all his training time practicing his wheelies, so if he doesn't ride the entire special on both days on one wheel I'm lodging an official complaint.

f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:32:51 pm
Some more elder statesmen

- Kevin Thompson, he's pushing some big numbers and has competed in a few Amageza's

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-BBjKfTb/0/L/IMG_5665-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-BBjKfTb/A).

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3BhHq9M/0/L/IMG_5668-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3BhHq9M/A)

Ardi of Rockfox fame, an utter Gentleman and serious propeller head. A lot of the field will be using his Cap and trip repeaters and roadbooks. He's pushing 60'ish. Him and his son Mike are racing. Last year Ardi managed only 2 days before falling out. An epic effort considering that he had not only all the manufacturing of rally kit to do, but to make things a little more challenging they were also riding prototype self made rally bikes.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-p9Kgh8V/0/L/IMG_5669-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-p9Kgh8V/A)



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Pistonpete on March 18, 2016, 12:33:00 pm
Alex with his chopper

https://www.facebook.com/amageza.rallye/videos/999391660096576/ (https://www.facebook.com/amageza.rallye/videos/999391660096576/)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:38:36 pm
Donavan is very quick, but has been prone to some bad mechanical luck and once a navigation issue. He's flipping competitive he'll be near the top.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tB9bnDM/0/L/IMG_5667-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tB9bnDM/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-kzCd83n/0/L/IMG_5666-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-kzCd83n/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 12:44:30 pm
Pits and setting up.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Sidpitt on March 18, 2016, 12:46:07 pm
I'm in........my office watching and thinking  "What a woes I am!"

Ride safe chaps....Have fun!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 12:48:23 pm
Judy - Malibu.

She's wanted to do this for years!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-57zq25j/0/L/IMG_5657-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-57zq25j/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 12:55:01 pm
Rainer (White Rhino)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 12:57:26 pm
Gary (Grolls)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 12:58:54 pm
Chris
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 18, 2016, 01:00:43 pm
Bikes scrutineered and impounded
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 01:21:43 pm
Part of the Northern Cape Crowd. Chris Opperman, not sure of his forum name

A really really fast guy! He's won a stage or two before.

Last year, on his newish KTM450RR you see here, on stage 4 I think, he did an extra 400k's ontop of a 700k day. He took a wrong turn aided by a fault in the roadbook. Then, when he tried to work it out and chose to push on instead of backtracking, he was too far in to turn back because of fuel issues. 450RR's have massive fuel tanks so he got himself properly lost! Then he had to make a massive detour to get fuel and then head back to the Bivvy in Kang. He came in at about 9pm cold and hungry. He was nearly in tears that evening thinking that he was out of the race because he'd missed so many way points. I said to him before you pack your kit and go, let's go talk to Alex. Alex heard his story and said, "It's a rally, you got lost. Why would you be out? You're here aren't you. All that happens is that you pick up a ton of time penalties. You're still in the race. You won't win but you can still get a finishers medal" Chris nearly kissed him!

The next day on stage 5 he won it but killed his new rear tire in just 250k's of sand with another 400k's of liaison to go. Those factory 450's are as quick as a 690! He made it to the bivvy but had to do 80 the whole way!

He'll probably be in the top 5

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tCPfQ2T/0/L/IMG_5681-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tCPfQ2T/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 01:25:20 pm
A lot more yellow and blue these days...

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8JBntSF/0/L/IMG_5682-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8JBntSF/A)

Not sure who?

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qj5Q4HT/0/L/IMG_5683-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qj5Q4HT/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-f8jpmnP/0/L/IMG_5678-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-f8jpmnP/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 01:31:49 pm
Supporters?

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-b77bCCn/0/L/IMG_5684-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-b77bCCn/A)

Scrutineering

There are multiple stations where everything is checked

Licences - MSA and bike
Bike Road legality and race prepared
Bike has all the required stuff on it
Kit check - ATGATT!
first aid check
medical physical
raidio check
GPS


(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-sJrpZFG/0/L/IMG_5677-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-sJrpZFG/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: dookie on March 18, 2016, 01:40:29 pm
Andrew.
I see some of the race numbers on the Amageza website does not correspond to numbers on the bikes.

Why would that be?

ie. The Red Honda above , no 23, is defined as Geoff Peterson on a 690 KTM on the website.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 01:44:39 pm
Andrew.
I see some of the race numbers on the Amageza website does not correspond to numbers on the bikes.

Why would that be?

ie. The Red Honda above , no 23, is defined as Geoff Peterson on a 690 KTM on the website.

Not sure, but in the past, you could pitch up at the sticker table and choose the one you wanted. For the last Amageza you were assigned a number and you couldn't easily change it as it was also locked to your spot tracker.

Maybe this time it is a first come first served?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Motties on March 18, 2016, 01:45:28 pm
Sub

This is one of my riding mates Kurt Kapeller (Prop on WD) and my other mate Chris Kruger (Speedmetal) is also there on a CRF450X. Chris has done a couple of Amagezas - Kurt is new to navigational racing but a solid rider and I think both will do well.

Good luck guys - I will hold the fort up here  :xxbah:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 01:47:56 pm
Superman!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Fj9z36L/0/L/IMG_5685-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Fj9z36L/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 18, 2016, 01:53:00 pm
Andrew - you there, or you got a very cheeky media feed?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rokie on March 18, 2016, 01:55:08 pm
 :o :o :o
keep it coming - I'm in no mood to work!!!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlomC on March 18, 2016, 02:02:45 pm
:o :o :o
keep it coming - I'm in no mood to work!!!!

Werk...wat de moer is dit?  >:(



Paar pics vanaf Team Woema/MEFO - op die website is dit listed as "WOEMA RACING"
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 18, 2016, 02:02:46 pm
It's gets stranger than fiction....

Kobie can't see so lekker - he's farsighted, life right in front of him is a bit of a blur. So Gideon has this flashing light taped to his bike so he can pick him out. Kobie can't navigate either so he has to stick with Gideon. Gideon for those that don't know is lighting fast, he won one of the tougher stages in 2014. Kobie was a factory KTM rider in his day. Both are national champions. I've ridden a bit with both. They are nuts.

Fastest pensioners in the North...

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZdbSSNt/0/L/IMG_5653-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZdbSSNt/A)


Hahahahaha... my training mates, these's two are as crazy as they come and Gideon recons Kobie is even faster on that new 701 than he was on his old 690.

I've got these two bullets penned as a 1 - 2 in the Lite class if they don't get lost, which is unlikely because GJ tracks like a homing pigeon  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 02:12:19 pm
Andrew - you there, or you got a very cheeky media feed?


Sadly not. Various WhatsApp groups. Out team is being a bit shy keeping us up to date. Maybe they're helping Robert find or fix something?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 18, 2016, 02:28:26 pm
A lot more yellow and blue these days...

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8JBntSF/0/L/IMG_5682-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8JBntSF/A)




Eben Mocke from Upington.  Started racing last year only.  Quick and consistent enough for maybe a top 5 in the lites.  There with his younger boet, massively fast.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 02:28:33 pm
As to who will win it?

Never can tell but there are some finer considerations that are factors;

As this is short a rally, speed will be important but navigation rather than outright speed is going to do it. Everyone makes mistakes. It's not so much the wrong turns but more the navigation infractions for speeding or missing hidden waypoints.

It's very easy to be belting along catching up some dust and miss the 60kph for 800 meters instruction. These penalties can take you from being in the top 10 to 10 more places back.

Being fast doesn't win rally's. Being consistently good at navigating at speed does. Most pretty decent riders would win the stage if they didn't have to navigate and knew the track.

Peter How (Bonova) is probably one of the better ones in this field. He's very quick, fit and has regularly figured out the route more accurately than most. Plus he's won the Amageza before.

Then there's another factor - the course.

If it is technical then the bigger bikes won't have the advantage. The 690 is a fabulous weapon and for the wider open stuff is brilliant. The little bikes do better when it is slower and require less effort. Also, they are a bit safer. When the poo strikes, bigger bikes don't slow or turn as quick.

Sand is another. It's interesting that many very quick guys who don't come from the Western/Northern Cape don't like it at all.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 18, 2016, 02:29:18 pm
Part of the Northern Cape Crowd. Chris Opperman, not sure of his forum name


(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tCPfQ2T/0/L/IMG_5681-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tCPfQ2T/A)

ChrisMann
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 02:33:49 pm
I think another Northern Capie, Willem du Toit

If it is him (I seem to remember him on a 500?), He is massively fast. On a richtersveld stage in 2013 he was 20 minutes ahead of the next fastest okes. The next 7 were only separated by 15 minutes and none of them were slow. How he did that must have been epic to watch! Tough man.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WCw8pR4/0/L/IMG_5686-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WCw8pR4/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 18, 2016, 02:35:39 pm
No, Willem has taken up off-road racing in a bakkie type special vehicle (Century Racing).  Kicking ass there as well.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 02:38:13 pm
Dig the screen!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PJTVfBL/0/L/IMG_5688-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PJTVfBL/A)

Pretty!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Gk6gbKp/0/L/IMG_5687-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Gk6gbKp/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wFTdCsD/0/L/IMG_5691-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wFTdCsD/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wFTdCsD/0/L/IMG_5691-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wFTdCsD/A)

Parc feme

Riders are not allowed to touch the bikes again till the prologue.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3z6sQTd/0/L/IMG_5690-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3z6sQTd/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 02:40:11 pm
No, Willem has taken up off-road racing in a bakkie type special vehicle (Century Racing).  Kicking ass there as well.

Ahh, Ok, I do remember this chap, he's done the Amageza too. He was there in 2015. Can't remember his name though
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rokie on March 18, 2016, 02:40:51 pm
Some serious guys

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/0/L/IMG_5596-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/A)


KTM bike - BMW clothing . . . can't help but like the guy  :3some:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 03:05:14 pm
Some serious guys

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/0/L/IMG_5596-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/A)


KTM bike - BMW clothing . . . can't help but like the guy  :3some:

It's better than that...

That's a factory KTM450RR... and his team mate Peter is on a BMW 450 (BMW badged, albeit with a rotax motor)

Roger is the Dealer Principle of a bike shop. Not only that, it's a BMW Motorad one.

He's kak fast!

http://www.bmwgroup-dealers.co.za/opencms/sites/MOTORRAD/Ryder_Motorrad/The_Team/ (http://www.bmwgroup-dealers.co.za/opencms/sites/MOTORRAD/Ryder_Motorrad/The_Team/)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlomC on March 18, 2016, 03:10:05 pm
Some serious guys

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/0/L/IMG_5596-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pjRsZkN/A)


KTM bike - BMW clothing . . . can't help but like the guy  :3some:

It's better than that...

That's a factory KTM690RR... and

Roger is the Dealer Principle, not only that, it's a BMW Motorad one.

He's kak fast!

http://www.bmwgroup-dealers.co.za/opencms/sites/MOTORRAD/Ryder_Motorrad/The_Team/ (http://www.bmwgroup-dealers.co.za/opencms/sites/MOTORRAD/Ryder_Motorrad/The_Team/)

You mean a 450RR Andrew..?  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 03:11:51 pm
You mean a 450RR Andrew..?

Ha! Yes. Edited!
Title: Re:
Post by: BlomC on March 18, 2016, 04:19:08 pm
Prologue started at 16:00...no pics yet
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ross Riddle on March 18, 2016, 04:20:03 pm
Rogers other team mate is Greg Raaff another Dakar finisher!
Those three together Roger, Peter and Greg are a formidable team, seriously quick all of them!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 18, 2016, 04:25:00 pm
Prologue is only 3.8km's, which rather disappointing, I was expecting it to be around 50km's? Isn't that what was mentioned initially?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SvR on March 18, 2016, 04:39:02 pm
Been on the tracking site. No tracking for the prologue i take it as it is over pretty fast.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: milesd on March 18, 2016, 05:01:47 pm
Sub.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: westfrogger on March 18, 2016, 06:13:55 pm
I'm in.

Any hints about the route?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlomC on March 18, 2016, 06:40:57 pm
Ek weet nie veel nie, maar ek is nou so lus om daar te wees...om reg te maak vir 'n race môre, ek werk sommer aan my eie bike...met 'n wizza 8) ;D

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160318/98f8e80cf0600183f145a855b31172e9.jpg)

Hijack off.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 07:00:58 pm
So they paraded through the sprawling megalopolis of Port Nolloth, the economic hub of, um, ahh, ok so they rode though it.

Then there was the prologue. A 4k sprint on a GPS track. A straight, then some sandy twisty a few corners and back.

There was a 500m aircraft runway straight to start with. What boy with a throttle, a hord of fellow competitors and the entire population of Port Nolloth watching is not going to make like Tarlton raceway dragster?

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-4Bhg7kJ/0/L/IMG_5697-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-4Bhg7kJ/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qkkFt5S/0/L/IMG_5698-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qkkFt5S/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Q3MMPBq/0/L/IMG_5699-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Q3MMPBq/A)

The aforementioned pensioner Gideon broke with tradition and wheelied the entire length of the runway.

 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 07:08:00 pm
They've got their roadbooks.... actually it might be rather called their Road Encyclopaedia! Its only 257k's but will need to be chopped in half at least to fit the roadbook holder.

Alex took some harsh criticism last year for a overly sparse roadbook that had a few critical errors. It looks like what ever they will be riding will be a puzzle of note. It will be interesting to see the highest speed attained. Normally a thick roadbook means tricky navigating and many things to be careful of.

I'm going to say that the winning time will be about 3 and half hours. Average Joe will take 5 hours.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3L5JSSg/0/L/IMG_5700-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3L5JSSg/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZZV9cDN/0/L/IMG_5702-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZZV9cDN/A)

That's one mother of a roadbook!
(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Zx23CPw/0/L/IMG_5701-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Zx23CPw/A)


 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 18, 2016, 07:35:42 pm
sub :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 18, 2016, 07:39:45 pm
So who won the day for a bit of glory??
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SvR on March 18, 2016, 08:10:00 pm
So who won the day for a bit of glory??

 :peepwall:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 08:24:00 pm
For those who have not done a rally, this is the finest video showing how much thinking goes into trying to chase that roll of paper.

Lyndon has achieved a top 10 on a stage in the 2014 Dakar. As a privateer it's outstanding.

His video shows just how much goes on mentally, emotionally and physically trying to decipher and deal with the roadbook and the track.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQiqxbKxCR4&feature=em-subs_digest (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQiqxbKxCR4&feature=em-subs_digest)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 18, 2016, 08:36:20 pm
As to the prologue, The results are not out yet.

But, wining it, if you are keen on doing well overall is not tactically a good idea.

Opening the stage, unless you are a master navigator is hard. It ups the pressure of having to be right. When you are in the front, there is that voice that reminds you that you are the rabbit... you fuck up once and the dogs behind will catch you.

Starting between 6th and 10th is quite an advantage; all your navigation is constantly being confirmed by the tracks ahead. The mindset is of the hunter - "I know what I am doing and I am just checking to see where my prey is making mistakes"

It takes supreme confidence to ride at the front.

Having said that, a downside of being behind is dust.

Dust is super dangerous and very tiring to ride in. When the guy ahead is only marginally slower, it takes quite some luck to find the right moments to pin the throttle to get close enough to make a pass. Most times, it's a bit of a lottery. Many guys have a personal rule about dust - never pass in it. (wait until the wind is right to pass) this means that many guys will ride for hours waiting patiently for a pass.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Sprocketbek on March 18, 2016, 08:46:01 pm
I'm going to formally request BB to pray that there isn't a fog issue tomorrow morning.

We have hectic fog tonight on the lower West Coast  :(

We all know what that means to a stage........... :'(

So BB, if you are in Lima, do your best to beam it into the time line from West to East ............
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 18, 2016, 09:44:49 pm
Yep, fog is always a big risk so close to the coast, if there is hopefully it will burn off quickly.


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Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 18, 2016, 09:50:04 pm
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160318/44e4dfe25f87ccaae2bf3d4bf0321b6d.jpg)

GJ and Greg having some fun on the runway.


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Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rokie on March 18, 2016, 09:55:52 pm
 :sip:

Thanks for the updates. Looking forward to tomorrow.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 19, 2016, 07:44:03 am
Update from Team Verve and Starting positions.
Rainer had a problem with his GPS yesterday and is leading the field today. Quite nervous. Chris is 5th and Gary 38th after getting wire around his back wheel yesterday. All excited and nervous.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Hondsekierie on March 19, 2016, 08:29:11 am
Chris Ogden leading and seems Peter How moving extremely slow - really hope he's OK - awesome person and racer

Rainer (White Rhino) doing excellent at the moment :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Hondsekierie on March 19, 2016, 09:02:18 am
Kobus Potgieter doing the Superman move and taking a huge shortcut  :lol8:

That will move him at least 10 x positions upwards
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 09:19:17 am
Kobie, of blind pensioner fame has already lost Gideon and taken the scenic route. This is with about 60 bikes ahead of him making tracks. He must be riding by Braille!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wHDKKq5/0/L/Kobie-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wHDKKq5/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 09:20:59 am
Pity, Ardi and son Mike have both got broken bikes. Mike seems to be on the way to Alexander Bay. I would presume he has a fuel tank issue? Bikes still going but he's short coursing.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 09:30:17 am
Chris who was part of our support crew is flying. He's amongst the front 3

Race face this morning

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pGFDHrV/0/L/IMG_5713-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-pGFDHrV/A)

Comrade von Faff

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBdsSXM/0/L/IMG_5715-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBdsSXM/A)

Justin

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8nXsdmD/0/L/IMG_5714-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8nXsdmD/A)

Start line

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-h42RmWK/0/L/IMG_5728-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-h42RmWK/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-gFdvHNZ/0/L/IMG_5717-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-gFdvHNZ/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-j6Sf9ZQ/0/L/IMG_5719-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-j6Sf9ZQ/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-bzxtDXs/0/L/IMG_5726-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-bzxtDXs/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WG24ZvC/0/L/IMG_5718-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WG24ZvC/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WNjjt8t/0/L/IMG_5727-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WNjjt8t/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 09:48:33 am
Oops! That's going to sting later.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-4cXNpzS/0/L/Werner-L.png) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-4cXNpzS/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 19, 2016, 09:53:50 am
Eish ja!!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 10:02:01 am
Mark on a 450 bike must have followed him. I'll say it'll cost him an hour or more penalty.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-b9sDHZ9/0/L/Mark%20K-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-b9sDHZ9/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 19, 2016, 10:02:15 am
Go Chris! Seems my bike was a lot faster than I was 😀
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 10:14:26 am
Stephen Milburn who is up the pointy end doesn't feature on the entrants list? But no 27 is Brian Bontekoning and he's blitzig!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 10:19:30 am
GG might get lucky. But knowing StephenD who will be keeping score is pretty sharp!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qktxpVf/0/L/GG-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qktxpVf/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 10:25:28 am
I know the feeling...

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CkL3SNV/0/L/dean-L.png) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CkL3SNV/A)

Both side by sides have made navigation errors.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 10:40:15 am
Hope nothing serious, Greg Raaff, Peter How and Joey Evans have all stopped in the same place 137k's in. A marshal looks close too.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 11:09:38 am
Peter has pushed or someone has pushed his SOS. Medic on the way. 3 others have stopped. Bugger!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 11:10:25 am
Kobus is flying!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: DirtRebell on March 19, 2016, 11:20:13 am
Kobus is flying!

Geelkat?

How's he doing?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 19, 2016, 11:33:12 am
Kobus is flying!

Geelkat?

How's he doing?

Was tracking him... he was standing still for a while ... see his tracker is in Alexander baai now... refuelling

And Donovan is like a rocket!!!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 11:35:35 am
Anybody know how to make the tracker go full screen?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 19, 2016, 11:36:53 am
Peter has pushed or someone has pushed his SOS. Medic on the way. 3 others have stopped. Bugger!

oh no!!! man i hope all is ok!!!  :o ??? :-\
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 19, 2016, 11:39:14 am
Anybody know how to make the tracker go full screen?

nope - also been trying to get it full screen! :lamer:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: DirtRebell on March 19, 2016, 11:49:25 am
Kobus is flying!

Geelkat?

How's he doing?

Was tracking him... he was standing still for a while ... see his tracker is in Alexander baai now... refuelling

And Donovan is like a rocket!!!!

Cool

Just got the tracker loaded.
Geelkat likes to sweep :biggrin:

I see a full screen button but has no effect. ???

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 11:59:20 am
To get to full screen...

Once you've clicked on an individual and his screen comes up, click on the blue Westcoast Stage 1 bit.

It then comes up with the whole field, the fullscreen function then works

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CkL3SNV/0/L/dean-L.png) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CkL3SNV/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 12:07:58 pm
I think Brian came in before Roger but he made a navigation mistake a few k's from the end so he'll get penalised. If Roger didn't make any mistakes I'd say he's won the stage.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 19, 2016, 12:12:44 pm
I see a few guys took a wrong turn.... man that happens so easy!!
hope the guys at the back figures it out :P
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 12:14:31 pm
Roger, then Brian, then Gavin

Brian will get a penalty though.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-S7SMsZ8/0/L/IMG_5735-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-S7SMsZ8/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Dustman on March 19, 2016, 12:21:38 pm
Anyone know what happened to Judy?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 12:39:55 pm
Ardi's bike killed itself on the Prolog, suspected bigend. Mikes bike wouldn't start yesterday for the prolog, fuel issues. Started today, but 8k's in died again. They will try fix it this evening and ride tomorrow.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 12:42:35 pm
Anyone know what happened to Judy?

She missed the cutoff by 10 minutes.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 12:45:29 pm
(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Zvjr63n/0/L/IMG_5737-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Zvjr63n/A)

That's rally, the roaring crowds of adoring fans at the finish... not.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZjhSW93/0/L/IMG_5736-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-ZjhSW93/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 01:40:43 pm
Faff had a fall 200k in. Sore back.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-L4tFdgk/0/L/IMG_5742-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-L4tFdgk/A)

Peter had a fall at a triple caution.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-JL2HJWt/0/L/IMG_5738-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-JL2HJWt/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tkFZCDG/0/L/IMG_5739-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-tkFZCDG/A)

Niklaus, most of that bikes bits have been fabricated by him. He's not slow either.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-x5fvb4F/0/L/IMG_5741-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-x5fvb4F/A)

Many have finished, still quite a few out there.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8853j8F/0/L/IMG_5740-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-8853j8F/A)

 
Title: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 19, 2016, 03:11:10 pm
By my reckoning that looks like Gavin Morton won it - or where did Eben start? Of course they'll have to open tomorrow.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 19, 2016, 04:00:39 pm
Anyone know what happened to Judy?

She missed the cutoff by 10 minutes.
sorry to hear
Rally 101
rather take a shortcut or cut and run and take the penalties.
as long as you are in the bivouac in time to get some decent rest and organizers do not have any hassles getting you back to camp, they will most probably  allow you to race the next day again.

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Hondsekierie on March 19, 2016, 04:24:41 pm
Anyone know what happened to Judy?

She missed the cutoff by 10 minutes.
sorry to hear
Rally 101
rather take a shortcut or cut and run and take the penalties.
as long as you are in the bivouac in time to get some decent rest and organizers do not have any hassles getting you back to camp, they will most probably  allow you to race the next day again.



Trust you to find the "cut and run" Eddie  :lol8:

Very unfortunate that she didn't make the cut.  We saw her coming past us some 15km Alexander Bay and was wondering what had happened.  The marshal told us that she apparently stopped a few times, takes small breaks and simply got caught out by the time :-\
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 19, 2016, 04:33:25 pm
Everyone off the course.
Last guys

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-vXcrSWH/0/L/IMG_5747-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-vXcrSWH/A)

Kevin made it! (at 60 nog al!) Great Effort!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBTbKJW/0/L/IMG_5745-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBTbKJW/A)

Long day for this side by side, did a lot of sight seeing

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CfjBnWb/0/L/IMG_5743-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CfjBnWb/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Hp6DTrz/0/L/IMG_5746-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Hp6DTrz/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Dustman on March 19, 2016, 04:49:25 pm
Well done all the boys and girls the riders, marshalls and medics.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ross Riddle on March 19, 2016, 05:24:05 pm
Peter How had a big off today! Apparently went to pass a sbs and the sbs driffed wide and Pete slammed anchors and went down hard. Was unconscious for a long time. Greg, Joey and Toti stopped to assist.
Pete is okay but v sore and groggy and unfortunately that is his race done.
Glad you okay mate👍🏻 will have to make it up at Amageza 2016!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: 1ougat on March 19, 2016, 05:58:07 pm
 :sip:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 19, 2016, 06:03:24 pm
Anyone know what happened to Judy?

She missed the cutoff by 10 minutes.
sorry to hear
Rally 101
rather take a shortcut or cut and run and take the penalties.
as long as you are in the bivouac in time to get some decent rest and organizers do not have any hassles getting you back to camp, they will most probably  allow you to race the next day again.



Trust you to find the "cut and run" Eddie  :lol8:

Very unfortunate that she didn't make the cut.  We saw her coming past us some 15km Alexander Bay and was wondering what had happened.  The marshal told us that she apparently stopped a few times, takes small breaks and simply got caught out by the time :-\
that is a pitty
If Kevin comes in late, it was hard
I battle to ride with him in technical stuff

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Hondsekierie on March 19, 2016, 06:25:22 pm
I think there's gonna be some penalties dished out for some shortcut takers  ;) 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 19, 2016, 08:13:01 pm
On elapsed time, 4 Upington riders in the top 12.  Its the water...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 19, 2016, 08:20:12 pm
Andrew & all: Thanks for this thread and all the updates, please keep them coming. :thumleft:

I'm sorry for being able to contribute much, but Knopkop I will see what I can do arrange for good weather ;D

This thread has been stickied.


From vleisbook, Peter How:

I had quite a big fall today. Massive thanks to Greg, Toti and Joey for staying with me for ages. I'm out of the race. Ankel and thumb are sore but the bigest thing is that I was concussed for quite long and ut now feels like mike tyson us beetibg my brain....

Glad you are okay, get well soon bud!

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 19, 2016, 08:48:16 pm
On elapsed time, 4 Upington riders in the top 12.  Its the water...

Where the results?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rokie on March 19, 2016, 10:19:38 pm
I also never tracked the race (single parent this weekend - wife on work travels)
Sorry to have missed it. Thanks for keeping this thread going!!!!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 19, 2016, 10:20:18 pm
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160319/ceb0e59eba9b94de3cafbed808b828be.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 19, 2016, 10:21:29 pm
That front oke must be insanely fast to ride 39min out of GJ


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 20, 2016, 12:21:31 am
Buff, maybe he stopped to help his blind friend ;D
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: GJ on March 20, 2016, 05:45:29 am
Jip,het hom gehelp tot op 11de plek
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 20, 2016, 05:59:18 am
Where  can we see full results
Important real bikers at the back of the field where you will find all my riding buddies
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 20, 2016, 09:33:54 am
The Team Verve guys all finished yesterday with Chris doing really well and Gary having a big fall in the dust after starting at the back due to barbed wire getting caught in his  rear wheel in the prologue. I understand Rainer (WR) waited for him at the fuel stop and they finished the stage riding together. Gary (Grolls) was going to pull out this morning due to an extremely stiff nick and knee pain etc from his fall yesterday. He however changed his mind at the last minute and is out there. From the tracking it looks like him and White Rhino are riding together and progressing well. Chris is flying and was near the front. Good luck guys and go well today! Bring it home!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 20, 2016, 10:16:27 am
In the Richtersveld today. Looks quite slow and technical in places.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 11:02:43 am
The route crosses itself. It looks like Gavin and Eben Mocke, Peter Brinkworth and Gideon Joubert missed the right and took the loop anti-clockwise. They've met the field in a technical bit thankfully.

That's really dangerous. Looks like no-one had a head on.
 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 20, 2016, 11:09:15 am
Will be interesting to see if there is a way on the GPS track to see which way you need to enter a loop.  Maybe it was said in the briefing?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 11:24:04 am
Roger was leading but also missed the turn rode on for a few k's and then turned around.

There was a marshal there when they got there.

Just speculation but when there are marshals they normally don't help at all. Maybe this one pointed them the wrong way before the mistake was corrected?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 11:25:11 am
54 Kobus has pushed his SOS button.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Scrat on March 20, 2016, 11:39:14 am
54 Kobus has pushed his SOS button.

Oh no!! hope all is ok!!  :-[ :-\
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 20, 2016, 12:01:00 pm
It looks like Rainer 59 (White Rhino) is standing still. I hope he is okay. Anyone know what's happening?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 12:01:18 pm
Rynete the Start and Finish Marshal

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wc5KNCF/0/L/IMG_5752-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-wc5KNCF/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-cpCgtF2/0/L/IMG_5751-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-cpCgtF2/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 12:03:06 pm
Kobus and Mike yesterday

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-XScjcBw/0/L/IMG_5757-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-XScjcBw/A)

What a headache looks like

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-dQjnmWB/0/L/IMG_5754-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-dQjnmWB/A)

Mike had fuel issues yesterday

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-TnkHq5m/0/L/IMG_5755-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-TnkHq5m/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-LWnsMDm/0/L/IMG_5759-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-LWnsMDm/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 12:10:25 pm
The route

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-BKHvf42/0/L/IMG_5749-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-BKHvf42/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mNQXZ5z/0/L/IMG_5750-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-mNQXZ5z/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 12:12:19 pm
Justin out, bike broke. Kobus out crash, leg not good

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3hCdfbQ/0/L/IMG_5770-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3hCdfbQ/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3M6Wpqd/0/L/IMG_5768-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-3M6Wpqd/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-f6qg6RX/0/L/IMG_5771-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-f6qg6RX/A)

He should have carried on on Kobus' bike instead of stuffing his face

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-gBrMxND/0/L/IMG_5769-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-gBrMxND/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Andre v S on March 20, 2016, 12:49:50 pm
And? Any fresh news?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 20, 2016, 01:02:25 pm
Apparently Rainer ( WR )  59 is out with bike problems.  Bike stopped.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 01:16:24 pm
Justin's throttle cable snapped. Ironically he took the spare he used have routed alongside it off a little while ago. "I mean how often does a throttle cable snap?" The Gods don't take kindly to having their beards pulled.

The lost Mocke brothers

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7XjxG8p/0/L/IMG_5774-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7XjxG8p/A)

The quick boys at the finish

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-rNPVXfP/0/L/IMG_5775-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-rNPVXfP/A)

Gideon just needs to learn to read a GPS. HE was in the rally lite brigade and rode part of the route backwards.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-jLCZJPZ/0/L/IMG_5777-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-jLCZJPZ/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-4gDxLgD/0/L/IMG_5778-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-4gDxLgD/A)

Donovan

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7qmrbrt/0/L/IMG_5779-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-7qmrbrt/A)

Postmortem

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qJ7KFwn/0/L/IMG_5780-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-qJ7KFwn/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-nLLjTFp/0/L/IMG_5781-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-nLLjTFp/A)

Careful Dad, you don't know how impressionable youngsters can be

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-5gPVvbx/0/L/IMG_5772-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-5gPVvbx/A)

Weskus Klong

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-zTtwCZZ/0/XL/IMG_5776-XL.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-zTtwCZZ/A)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bundu on March 20, 2016, 01:25:10 pm
does anybody know how Dave Griffin is doing? Think he's rider no. 2
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 01:48:15 pm
does anybody know how Dave Griffin is doing? Think he's rider no. 2

There is no tracker for No2

I suspect his tracker was on the blink. There is a tracker named RM3 that shows on the track as having gone around the whole course with the other riders and was through the finish line 40 minutes ago and is now back in the bivvy. It may very well have been him.

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bundu on March 20, 2016, 02:07:27 pm
let's hope it's him - thanks Andrew  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Hondsekierie on March 20, 2016, 02:09:01 pm
Dave was No 2 but got DQ'd yesterday after suffering technical problems on the first stage some km before Alexander Bay.  His crew apparently assisted him close to the actual track and was disqualified.  Electrical short circuit of some sorts.

Very bad news as Dave really wanted to at least have a chance at racing on the last day but I guess rules are rules

Cannot believe the 4 x fast guys going clockwise into the mountain stage.  Can only imagine the eyeball sizes when the two groups met each other on those tight jeep tracks high up in the mountain :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bundu on March 20, 2016, 02:13:14 pm
faaarkit! thanks HSK  :'( :'(  but yeah, rules are rules
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 02:24:56 pm
Cannot believe the 4 x fast guys going clockwise into the mountain stage.  Can only imagine the eyeball sizes when the two groups met each other on those tight jeep tracks high up in the mountain :ricky:

Spoke to Chris, he was leading when he met them. He thought for sure he was right as the roabook was making sense. The problem was the rally lite guys just followed the GPS and it would then be routing them to the closest waypoint albeit going now backwards.

Chris said meeting them head on wasn't an issue as it was really slow and technical for most of that section.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kawaki on March 20, 2016, 02:44:31 pm
Go Chris!!! (and the Pandamobile)  :snorting:

I see all the usual suspects are in tow... organisers and competitors alike. Peter looks like he's spent most of his prep time putting stickers on his bike which will no doubt make it much faster, so he better win. Of course he'll have to beat Kobus, who's a battle hardened Dakar veteran now with a reputation to uphold. And then there's the Subtech boys as usual, Joey only needs one working tyre on his bike, and a special shout out to Von Faff - he's spent all his training time practicing his wheelies, so if he doesn't ride the entire special on both days on one wheel I'm lodging an official complaint.

f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5!
:3some:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 03:48:26 pm
Can someone tell me how to embed youtube videos!

Some interviews

Chris at the finish line

Editor's note:
https://youtu.be/xj0r78SagpU (https://youtu.be/xj0r78SagpU)
cupy the url which looks like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xj0r78SagpU&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xj0r78SagpU&feature=youtu.be)
Edit it to look like this
{flash=800,600}https://www.youtube.com/v/xj0r78SagpU/{/flash} just replace the brackets with square brackets
https://www.youtube.com/v/xj0r78SagpU/

Justin on his misfortune

https://www.youtube.com/v/UKitCDKdSxg

Robert arriving at the bivvy

https://www.youtube.com/v/Q3NWYCbA1qI
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 04:23:02 pm
Roberts photo's from the route

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-N9MVHpM/0/L/IMG_5790-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-N9MVHpM/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-KLvrTtC/0/L/IMG_5793-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-KLvrTtC/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-bfbtcPJ/0/L/IMG_5787-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-bfbtcPJ/A)

The mighty 525

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WP98L9M/0/L/IMG_5789-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-WP98L9M/A)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bundu on March 20, 2016, 04:26:42 pm
Can someone tell me how to embed youtube videos!

Some interviews

Chris at the finish line

https://youtu.be/xj0r78SagpU (https://youtu.be/xj0r78SagpU)

Justin on his misfortune

https://youtu.be/UKitCDKdSxg (https://youtu.be/UKitCDKdSxg)

Robert arriving at the bivvy

https://youtu.be/Q3NWYCbA1qI (https://youtu.be/Q3NWYCbA1qI)

Just copy the youtube link into the provided area on this link http://mynameiswes.co.za/tools/youtube/ (http://mynameiswes.co.za/tools/youtube/)  then press CONVERT and copy the result into your post
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Mooch on March 20, 2016, 04:49:22 pm
Gary / Grolls almost in !  :ricky: :ricky: :hello2: :headbang: :blob5:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 20, 2016, 04:49:45 pm
Thanks for the really fantastic updates guys. What a lot of drama! Loving it.

Seems quite a few guys are maybe riding a little too fast and crashing? Hope no one got too badly hurt. That road book looks extremely detailed, with tulips just a couple of hundred meters apart...makes for slower riding especially if you are not used to riding to a road book, but I'm guessing the it was a lot more precise. :thumleft:

I guess the vid's came from Justin. Bummed about your mechanical.

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 20, 2016, 05:29:34 pm
Results out yet?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 20, 2016, 05:43:10 pm
Hoping Buff can get them for us again. :deal:

I tried through official lines and got absolutely nowhere....I dont think they realize how important it is to get the provisional results out for the those following. :(
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 20, 2016, 05:43:22 pm
Results not out yet.

What an absolute fun event!!!!

Prologue, had a blast  :biggrin:
Stage 1, navigation awesome, made two small mistakes combined less than 1km extra.  Waited for Mike did not know he did not start.  Lost 40 odd minutes that way, dumb mistake from me.
Missed second cutoff because of that.
Stage 2, had a great start at the back, caught a few guys, then on the big dune at the top I accidetally stepped on gear lever and went down a gear with throttle pinned.  Flipped bike which then attacked me, injured both knees, left just quite sore but OK, right fucking painfull probably ligament will have it checked out tomorrow.  Rally tower and roadbook holder ISM as well.

Have a few photos will post when back tomorrow.

Almost beer time...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on March 20, 2016, 05:58:41 pm
Sorry about the off Geel Kat.

Kan nie wag vir pics nie. Klink awesome.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 20, 2016, 06:31:39 pm
Seems there's issues regarding the 4 Lite riders going the wrong way so results delayed. GJ obviously very disappointed, he was having a jol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 20, 2016, 06:32:19 pm
Sorry to hear about the bad luck Kobus, hope it's nothing too serious.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: boland on March 20, 2016, 06:41:35 pm
The fact that there was a loop (it seems) must have made it difficult for the lite guys. Would be diffucult to determine which way to head i would presume.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 20, 2016, 07:21:26 pm
Results not out yet.

What an absolute fun event!!!!

Prologue, had a blast  :biggrin:
Stage 1, navigation awesome, made two small mistakes combined less than 1km extra.  Waited for Mike did not know he did not start.  Lost 40 odd minutes that way, dumb mistake from me.
Missed second cutoff because of that.
Stage 2, had a great start at the back, caught a few guys, then on the big dune at the top I accidetally stepped on gear lever and went down a gear with throttle pinned.  Flipped bike which then attacked me, injured both knees, left just quite sore but OK, right fucking painfull probably ligament will have it checked out tomorrow.  Rally tower and roadbook holder ISM as well.

Have a few photos will post when back tomorrow.

Almost beer time...

Well done on making it! Thanks for the update GK. :thumleft:

Hope the kneemonia is not a ligament.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kawaki on March 20, 2016, 08:16:37 pm
Results not out yet.

What an absolute fun event!!!!

Prologue, had a blast  :biggrin:
Stage 1, navigation awesome, made two small mistakes combined less than 1km extra.  Waited for Mike did not know he did not start.  Lost 40 odd minutes that way, dumb mistake from me.
Missed second cutoff because of that.
Stage 2, had a great start at the back, caught a few guys, then on the big dune at the top I accidetally stepped on gear lever and went down a gear with throttle pinned.  Flipped bike which then attacked me, injured both knees, left just quite sore but OK, right fucking painfull probably ligament will have it checked out tomorrow.  Rally tower and roadbook holder ISM as well.

Have a few photos will post when back tomorrow.

Almost beer time...
:'( hoop als is ok..
Title: Re:
Post by: GG on March 20, 2016, 08:44:38 pm
Baja routes were amazing but what a mess of the rest!  8.20 and no results no prize giving. Cold miserable tent not even a drink! Alex a stickler for the rules and time but not when it applies to him!  Every briefing late!  Suspect like 2014 late event and we'll post your medal!

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk
Title: Re:
Post by: Kamanya on March 20, 2016, 11:41:10 pm
Baja routes were amazing but what a mess of the rest!  8.20 and no results no prize giving. Cold miserable tent not even a drink! Alex a stickler for the rules and time but not when it applies to him!  Every briefing late!  Suspect like 2014 late event and we'll post your medal!

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

What are you on about?

The prize giving started with a slide show at 8.30? That's only 30 minutes after the published time was to have been in the program.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Andre v S on March 20, 2016, 11:46:23 pm
And the winner is?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SvR on March 21, 2016, 07:38:31 am
 :peepwall:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on March 21, 2016, 07:42:55 am
And the winner is?


Net so nuuskierig, en soek fotos.

Weet darem van een man wat klaar gemaak het.  Well done Jan!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 21, 2016, 07:43:36 am
For those who have not done a rally, this is the finest video showing how much thinking goes into trying to chase that roll of paper.

Lyndon has achieved a top 10 on a stage in the 2014 Dakar. As a privateer it's outstanding.

His video shows just how much goes on mentally, emotionally and physically trying to decipher and deal with the roadbook and the track.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQiqxbKxCR4&feature=em-subs_digest (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQiqxbKxCR4&feature=em-subs_digest)

And while we are waiting, to get you in the mood for the Amageza, check out what the top guys look like in the same dunes. This is Pal Anders, chasing Laia Sanz, Mark Coma and a few others....

https://www.youtube.com/v/sJT3VUHU2NA
Amazing how smooth they are.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: EtienneXplore on March 21, 2016, 08:03:40 am
Neil,
Do you know what is the story with Pal Anders? He seem to have vanished off the face of the earth, he was one of may favorite riders, and he is so incredibly fast and his interviews with the press are hilarious! He just always seems like such a fun and positive guy. Maybe he ran out of money and is struggling to find sponsorship, if this is the case, it is really sad as he is such a talented rider!!



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 21, 2016, 08:15:23 am
I'm still haven't seen the final results either but I know the 4 that took the loop in the wrong direction got slapped with a 30m time penalty. GJ is obviously disappointed but reckons it's a lot better than a disqualification  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 21, 2016, 08:20:34 am
They're up here: http://www.amageza.com/#!blank-1/odxej (http://www.amageza.com/#!blank-1/odxej)

(https://static.wixstatic.com/media/d7abc3_8d64c63a195d425c8977694d61276da0.jpg/v1/crop/x_68,y_75,w_988,h_675/fill/w_979,h_670,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/d7abc3_8d64c63a195d425c8977694d61276da0.jpg)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 21, 2016, 08:27:39 am
Out of interest - were they running the guys on the GPS tracks and the guys on the roadbooks on the same tracks at the same time?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: DirtRebell on March 21, 2016, 08:37:43 am
Results not out yet.

What an absolute fun event!!!!

Prologue, had a blast  :biggrin:
Stage 1, navigation awesome, made two small mistakes combined less than 1km extra.  Waited for Mike did not know he did not start.  Lost 40 odd minutes that way, dumb mistake from me.
Missed second cutoff because of that.
Stage 2, had a great start at the back, caught a few guys, then on the big dune at the top I accidetally stepped on gear lever and went down a gear with throttle pinned.  Flipped bike which then attacked me, injured both knees, left just quite sore but OK, right fucking painfull probably ligament will have it checked out tomorrow.  Rally tower and roadbook holder ISM as well.

Have a few photos will post when back tomorrow.

Almost beer time...

Jammer om te hoor van jou teëspoed, maar bly jy is ok.
Hoop nie dis te ernstig nie?

Well done dat jy sover gekom het :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Andre v S on March 21, 2016, 10:07:42 am
Out of interest - were they running the guys on the GPS tracks and the guys on the roadbooks on the same tracks at the same time?

Yes
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: sidetrack on March 21, 2016, 12:02:03 pm
Neil,
Do you know what is the story with Pal Anders? He seem to have vanished off the face of the earth, he was one of may favorite riders, and he is so incredibly fast and his interviews with the press are hilarious! He just always seems like such a fun and positive guy. Maybe he ran out of money and is struggling to find sponsorship, if this is the case, it is really sad as he is such a talented rider!!




He races the old Dakar route on the Africa Eco Race I think
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 21, 2016, 01:09:49 pm
They're up here: http://www.amageza.com/#!blank-1/odxej (http://www.amageza.com/#!blank-1/odxej)

(https://static.wixstatic.com/media/d7abc3_8d64c63a195d425c8977694d61276da0.jpg/v1/crop/x_68,y_75,w_988,h_675/fill/w_979,h_670,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/d7abc3_8d64c63a195d425c8977694d61276da0.jpg)

So what do you think of the format of the results? Penalties are broken down by each category, so you can see how many tulips were missed and what penalty resulted from that, how many times you didn't stop, speeding penalties etc etc.
I see the negative penalties (which are either time given back for helping at an accident, or after a protest) are not displaying correctly, but they are being summed correctly.
Is this better than previous events?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Andre v S on March 21, 2016, 01:48:57 pm
They're up here: http://www.amageza.com/#!blank-1/odxej (http://www.amageza.com/#!blank-1/odxej)

(https://static.wixstatic.com/media/d7abc3_8d64c63a195d425c8977694d61276da0.jpg/v1/crop/x_68,y_75,w_988,h_675/fill/w_979,h_670,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/d7abc3_8d64c63a195d425c8977694d61276da0.jpg)

So what do you think of the format of the results? Penalties are broken down by each category, so you can see how many tulips were missed and what penalty resulted from that, how many times you didn't stop, speeding penalties etc etc.
I see the negative penalties (which are either time given back for helping at an accident, or after a protest) are not displaying correctly, but they are being summed correctly.
Is this better than previous events?

Much better, the problem is that I can't read the figures. Do you have a higher quality link? Furthermore, it would be nice to see the bikes they were riding and possibly the team.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Cracker on March 21, 2016, 05:10:58 pm
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 21, 2016, 05:21:44 pm
Steve, its great :thumleft:

One, no two suggestions: A bit bigger would be nice (but that just a copy paste thing), and on the provisionals you posted on saturday, including the day's ranking would be fantastic.

Knopkop. Pal Anders is still around - he won the Africa Eco race (the old Dakar route) in January, but did not appear in the Dakar because he was unable to raise the sponsorship.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 21, 2016, 05:26:18 pm
So what do you think of the format of the results? Penalties are broken down by each category, so you can see how many tulips were missed and what penalty resulted from that, how many times you didn't stop, speeding penalties etc etc.
I see the negative penalties (which are either time given back for helping at an accident, or after a protest) are not displaying correctly, but they are being summed correctly.
Is this better than previous events?

Yeah, but the low res jpeg is silly - put it in downloadable PDF or excel, like all other races.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 21, 2016, 05:48:50 pm
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............
No 35
not bad for and old toppie :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 21, 2016, 05:52:22 pm
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............
No 35
not bad for and old toppie :ricky:
Did Kevin have some admin on route, He should have finished much higher up in the standings
41 looks like he was babysitting someone or had huge admin
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Gavin on March 22, 2016, 09:07:00 am
I found a KTM bike key on the street in Port Nolloth , it has a Woema keyring Im sure from a 690 . owner can contact me on 083 225 7251
Cheers
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kevin_ZA on March 22, 2016, 10:05:03 am
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............
No 35
not bad for and old toppie :ricky:
Did Kevin have some admin on route, He should have finished much higher up in the standings
41 looks like he was babysitting someone or had huge admin
Hi Eddie…no admin issue. Merely ran out of talent. Absolutely awesome riding – very little liason and for me the SS was “in you face” riding. No chance to relax. The mountain loop was incredible – so glad I did it but the one steep incline with plenty loose rocks was hectic. No problem if one maintained momentum and got up first time.  For me,  running out of talent,  resulted in  60 minutes which should have been 5 minutes and all my energy was sapped. Something like that big dune we did on Amageza 2014 – luckily I got up that one first time.. Oh we had a dune that was even higher than the one in 2014 !!
Still it was incredible and in my opinion was more technical than any Amageza SS stage I finished. Unfortunately this Baja also gave me a bit of a reality check. Doubt I will do any more. Thanks  Alexander and the Amageza/Baja crew. You held a fantastic event. IMO a big improvement.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 22, 2016, 10:28:42 am
Jammer om te hoor van jou teëspoed, maar bly jy is ok.
Hoop nie dis te ernstig nie?

Regter MCL na moer, niks wat 'n paar weke se rus en TransAct nie sal regmaak nie  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: bud500 on March 22, 2016, 10:31:28 am
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............
No 35
not bad for and old toppie :ricky:
Did Kevin have some admin on route, He should have finished much higher up in the standings
41 looks like he was babysitting someone or had huge admin
Hi Eddie…no admin issue. Merely ran out of talent. Absolutely awesome riding – very little liason and for me the SS was “in you face” riding. No chance to relax. The mountain loop was incredible – so glad I did it but the one steep incline with plenty loose rocks was hectic. No problem if one maintained momentum and got up first time.  For me,  running out of talent,  resulted in  60 minutes which should have been 5 minutes and all my energy was sapped. Something like that big dune we did on Amageza 2014 – luckily I got up that one first time.. Oh we had a dune that was even higher than the one in 2014 !!
Still it was incredible and in my opinion was more technical than any Amageza SS stage I finished. Unfortunately this Baja also gave me a bit of a reality check. Doubt I will do any more. Thanks  Alexander and the Amageza/Baja crew. You held a fantastic event. IMO a big improvement.


Well done Uncle Kev!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: weskus on March 22, 2016, 10:38:59 am
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............
No 35
not bad for and old toppie :ricky:
Did Kevin have some admin on route, He should have finished much higher up in the standings
41 looks like he was babysitting someone or had huge admin
Well done Kevin.. :thumleft:
Hi Eddie…no admin issue. Merely ran out of talent. Absolutely awesome riding – very little liason and for me the SS was “in you face” riding. No chance to relax. The mountain loop was incredible – so glad I did it but the one steep incline with plenty loose rocks was hectic. No problem if one maintained momentum and got up first time.  For me,  running out of talent,  resulted in  60 minutes which should have been 5 minutes and all my energy was sapped. Something like that big dune we did on Amageza 2014 – luckily I got up that one first time.. Oh we had a dune that was even higher than the one in 2014 !!
Still it was incredible and in my opinion was more technical than any Amageza SS stage I finished. Unfortunately this Baja also gave me a bit of a reality check. Doubt I will do any more. Thanks  Alexander and the Amageza/Baja crew. You held a fantastic event. IMO a big improvement.

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Beemer Mike on March 22, 2016, 10:39:17 am
I dont see Judy Hardy on the results. Anyone know how she did?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: bud500 on March 22, 2016, 10:49:40 am
I dont see Judy Hardy on the results. Anyone know how she did?

Time barred on day 1 I believe.
It was covered here in earlier posts.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 22, 2016, 12:31:29 pm
Hey Steve where can we see the stage 2 results?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 22, 2016, 12:39:44 pm
I want to see video!

Come on, I saw a bunch with gopro's.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Alsdad on March 22, 2016, 12:42:07 pm
 :sip:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rokie on March 22, 2016, 01:39:35 pm
I am no rally rider (yet), but I am feeling particularly deprived. As a keyboard racer I am totally keen to get more stories and info (and pics and video!!)

I guess some of the okes are still recovering and the footage will emerge in due course . . .
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on March 22, 2016, 01:45:04 pm
I am no rally rider (yet), but I am feeling particularly deprived. As a keyboard racer I am totally keen to get more stories and info (and pics and video!!)

I guess some of the okes are still recovering and the footage will emerge in due course . . .

I agree 100%.  Also a keyboard racer for now.

This is all I could get this far.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 22, 2016, 01:45:19 pm
Hey Steve where can we see the stage 2 results?

You want results for just Day2, not the overall after Day2?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 22, 2016, 01:49:13 pm
Hey Steve where can we see the stage 2 results?

You want results for just Day2, not the overall after Day2?

YES the stage results, please
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 22, 2016, 01:49:41 pm
This is all I could get this far.

This could have been nasty, rider went down and the other rider went over his bike (fortunately missing the rider).

I was behind them but luckily had enough space to stop.

Both riders were OK but the one bike had its seat and tail-pack ripped off (this was all the damage I could see).

Once I saw both were OK, one rider continued and the other retired I carried on right up to the dune where I mistook my 450 for a gyrocopter...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on March 22, 2016, 01:53:44 pm
First rider down was one of our fellow dogs - he can decide whether to elaborate.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: weskus on March 22, 2016, 02:00:10 pm
 :eek7:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: JustBendIt on March 22, 2016, 04:55:02 pm
Looking at these pics brings back many memories from the past few days - both good and bad - I suffer from hectic post rally blues - feels like nothing else really matters - even a bad day on the bike is better than a good day in the real world.

I must compliment Alex and team on 2 fantastic routes and a very detailed roadbook - in Amageza 2015 he got a lot of stuff wrong and took a lot of flack for crucial missing info on the roadbooks - in this race he went the extra mile and included a massive amount of detail - if your navigation was good and your instruments were accurate then you could maintain a good pace and make good time.

My throttle cable snapped 27 km into Stage 2. Robert and I tried to fix it but to no avail. He carried on and I pressed the recovery button on my tracker. I was very impressed to be recovered just over 90 minutes later by Sean Kriel and his helper - I really expected to be sitting there the whole day.

The bivouac side of thing still needs work though - I can never understand why it is so difficult to be able to provide adequate sanitary toilets and washing facilities - this was really disappointing after these issues were brought up post Amageza 2015.

I am bummed that I did not complete the race and return home with a finisher's medal but I am really glad that I entered and rode as much as I could. I can only blame myself for poor preparation and not checking the cable beforehand - and not having a spare cable with me - I am usually over prepared for any eventualities.

Lastly big thanks to my riding partner and rally buddy Robert Adams aka Darthvader - he drives me absolutely fucking mad with his constant faffing and over analysing everything but we ride well together and look out for one another - during 5000 km of Amageza 2015 we were never more than a bike length apart. Robert starts the stage hard and sets the pace and I usually take over about halfway and bring us home. Thanks Bobby Von Faff  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 22, 2016, 05:37:51 pm
Hey gus, talk about having the blues. Miss the sand already. Has anyone got some footage of the mountain section on go pro would be keen to show family at home what devils breath looks like.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: seankriel on March 22, 2016, 06:04:07 pm
WHAT A BAJA!!!!

I woke up this morning and wanted to start the guys off on another Special!! I'm having marshal withdrawals here..

Thanks to all the hardcore riders and their teams for making WC Baja a great event and for those preparing for Amageza 2016, goooooood luck with your training! You will need it!!

I will fly till the next adventure.....

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 22, 2016, 06:13:51 pm
First rider down was one of our fellow dogs

And a very nice guy.

After riding alone for a large portion of the 1st stage I hooked up with him and another KTM 690 rider and we stuck together to the DSP and from there back to Port Nolloth.
As much as I like riding solo, riding together during something like this really helps during those moments one doubts yourself  :thumleft:

We started the second stage at the back of the field and the plan was to ride together - sadly it did not work out that way.

Next year we will be back, stronger, faster, wiser - and a bit older  :biggrin:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 22, 2016, 09:42:17 pm
Hey gus, talk about having the blues. Miss the sand already. Has anyone got some footage of the mountain section on go pro would be keen to show family at home what devils breath looks like.

I have some nice footage still trying to load to youtube think I must rather stick to riding my bike....will hopefully get there & share. also some sand & dune footage.....
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 22, 2016, 09:46:48 pm
Out of interest - were they running the guys on the GPS tracks and the guys on the roadbooks on the same tracks at the same time?

Yes

Havent read the whole tread yet but NO - only sections were the same for the two groups.

The roadbook was MOERSE BUSY. 200 od km and 400 odd tulips.  NO WAY you can do that with a GPS.

Adie

 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Grolls on March 22, 2016, 09:59:48 pm
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read believe  :imaposer: the results with these ancient eyes ..............

12th in class - 35th overall
or 3rd last and 7th last  :imaposer:

Not bad for an old toppie Eddie  :ricky: :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 22, 2016, 10:12:07 pm
Would be nice to see where Grolls finished - maybe it's coz I can hardly read the results with these ancient eyes ..............

12th in class - 35th overall
or 3rd last and 7th last  :imaposer:

Not bad for an old toppie Eddie  :ricky: :ricky:
very impressed
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Crossed-up on March 22, 2016, 10:46:51 pm
In case it's owner reads this - I've got a rain suit in a zipped bag that a rider dropped. I'd be happy to return it.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 22, 2016, 11:36:18 pm
Just an update on team ROCKFOX.

Adie
My KTM started the scruteneering day with a motor that sounded more like a Yamaha than a KTM.  Prolog day it was much more noticable but not too bad.  

Pic 1: I had a nice drag with the old cow against a new fuel injected KTM at the start. Maybe the term 'Klapped that motor came to mind'

Pic 2: Back at 'Park Ferm'  one of the riders ask me if I have enough oil.  The exhaust was wetter than a dipstick. :-\  Best option was not to race and save the motor. We just looked at this.

Mike
The WR (the same one that Ruan ahd so many issues with at 2015 Amageza) decided to play a trick with us. It refused to start for the Prolog.  Mike had an hour to find the problem as he was out of Park Ferm.  He checked all fuel lines, carburettor, spark plug etc. Could not get it solved properly.  When I came back from Prolog we jump the battery for a quick charge and all seems to be OK. Went to bed just past midnight.

Pic 3: a few km's out of town to Day 1 start the bike died. A few minutes later i started again but only traveled about 800m.  This looked like fuel starvation.  He phoned me to pick him up with the trailer as he already checked all possible fuel related causes.
At this stage he considered 'Gooi die Pantie in' and call it the day. After we informed the marshalls about his DNS we drove through to Alexandria bay to see how Kobus (Geel Kat) managed the roadbook on his own.

Pic 4: Back at the 'Boeviak' we again checked everything fuel related and stripped the carb.  The clever people showed us how to check the float level as this was the most likely cause of fuel starvation.  Could not find anything wrong. We checked the sparkplug again.  This time it was properly wet.  Replace with a new one and the bike starts but died again (a few times)  Another Yamaha mechanic came over just as the bike ran again but with a severe misfire this time.  He jerked the wires at the plug to the coil and the bike ran smooth. WTF, you touch the wire and the bike dies, touch it again and the bike ran smooth.  Further inspection showed the connector was heavily corroded and a lot of 'oil and soot' on the terminals.  Maybe someone sprayed some cleaner in  ??? .  We cleaned everything, bent the sockets a bit closed, it started and ran like a Japanese watch.

Pic 5: With much anticipation the roadbook was marked up and we went to bed early.

Pic 6: Mike started about 4th from the back at 8:06.  At the DSP he passed about 15 riders (came in 41st) Refueled, had a snack and was on his way again.  He took a longish break and about 3 riders started started before him if I'm not mistaken.  He arrived at 9:38 (1 hour 32 minutes) and left at 9:55. He was back at the DSP from the mountain loop at 12:44. (2 hours and 50 min.) this time I think he only passed about 3 to 4 riders.

Pic 7: In the mountain.

We packed up and headed back to Port Nolloth.
Leg 3 took him 1 hour and 44 minutes. (finished at 2:44pm)

Summary: Distance 237km, Total time: 6h 38min. Standing time about 25 minutes
               Moving time 6h 13min with an average of 38kph.

Pic 8: Waiting for the results - I would rather Braai and Drink.

Pic 9: Dit is wat mens doen as jy verveeld is. The headless soccer team.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 23, 2016, 12:03:04 am
Rockfox nav eq.

Me thinks we got it right this time. 

The base Trip-CAP unit worked flawless either as CAP repeater or tripmeter.  All user feedback was positive.

I will try to reduce the size of the manual for upload to show some of the advance features of the unit while still retaining the simplicity of the user inerface.


The rockfox roadbook holder could take the WHOLE day 2 roll (all 407 waypoints) without a problem.  It could wind both directions without any issue.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Grolls on March 23, 2016, 04:20:53 am
Here is a short vid of me at the start
Just as I am getting into my rythm, superman flies past proving I am way out of my league ;)

(please can someone embed this - I have forgotten how)

https://www.youtube.com/v/yTZtg1KGGhg
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 23, 2016, 07:25:11 am
Rockfox nav eq.

Me thinks we got it right this time. 

The base Trip-CAP unit worked flawless either as CAP repeater or tripmeter.  All user feedback was positive.

The rockfox roadbook holder could take the WHOLE day 2 roll (all 407 waypoints) without a problem.  It could wind both directions without any issue.

I can second this, the Trip and CAP worked flawlessly.

The roadbook was also perfect but mine had one issue on day 2...

When I flipped my bike the navigation tower was first to hit the deck and the roadbook holder screen and internals could not bear the full weight of the WR450 and stopped working  :peepwall:

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2086_zpspqxzbftp.jpg)

Thanks Rockfox, the kit worked perfectly and the user interface is very easy to understand.  For a first time navigation rider like me it certainly helped.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Airtime on March 23, 2016, 07:58:17 am
I agree with Justin the road book was good and the organizing ok (army style hurry up and wait) but the ablution facilities really sucked and after a hard day in the saddle one would like to have a nice hot shower and a decent c**p so please can they sort this out.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 23, 2016, 08:31:13 am
Baja 2016 : What a great event  :thumleft:, was marvellous being part of it .  :ricky:

 Thanks Alex for creating this event that keeps getting better and better each year . Loved being part of the back-up team, and had so much fun despite it being hard work. Respect for the photographers who work so hard and I was lucky to be sharing digs with them  . They sat till late at night editing and posting photos , Fanus , Lie-Ann and Shari .  :thumleft: Not to leave anyone out ,but thinking of Andy and Lofty who did the extreme recovery on the mountain of an injured rider coming back back near midnight on the last night . Andy tell us of your hairy ride !

Very proud of all the riders, finishers or not . It takes a huge effort to just pitch up and stand at the start line. Well done to all the riders who did well .  :ricky: Especially proud of Kevin , Grolls and White Rainer  :thumleft:

I get Goosebumps , thinking of everyone's story and please riders share some more stories , we want to hear .

Ash , talking to you nr 17 ,  nr 22  and White Rhino , why so quiet ?
Robert , where are you ? We want to hear . Everyone has their own story .

Thanks Justin for sharing and Grolls for the Video.

Criticisms noted and will be incorporated into planning for next time I am sure . Alex was still in transit and will be back today  . He always takes negatives and turns them into positives and improves year by year  .  :thumleft:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 23, 2016, 08:37:42 am
Summary of my Baja experience...

After marshalling at the 2015 Amageza I decided I want more than that.
Was very happy when Alexander announced the Baja which would allow a noob the experience on a smaller scale.

So, Friday the 18th arrived and a very nervous cat registered and went through scrutiny at 07:30, having to sit around and fiddle endlessly while waiting for the prologue...

Prologue - a 3.8km run going across the salt pan, then around a low dune in a sandy tweespoor, back across the pan through a bit of mud to the finish.
Did well enough there (a number of the top guys held back, wheelie'd across the pan and so forth) a great show for the locals who came to watch  :thumleft:
This set the starting order for stage 1 (in categories)

Stage 1 - Started well enough, about 25km in I decided to wait for Mike (the idea was that we would ride together).  I waited for 40 - 45 minutes before I decided to carry on - rookie mistake on my side, I should only have waited the differential in starting time  :lamer:  
Had a blast for the first 90km to the fuel stop outside Alexander Bay.  During this time I also hooked up with two other riders (who caught up with me on one of my two navigation errors) both on KTM 690's.
We just made the first cutoff and after refuel we carried on with the second leg to the DSP.  Too many stops to rest (and pick up bikes from time to time) we missed the second cutoff and were not allowed to continue on the last leg of the stage.  We had to return to bivouac on public roads.
Navigation was good, I made two minor errors which did not cost me more that a kilometer in total.
Lesson learnt, if you want to ride together make sure the other rider has at least started - it turned out he only made it half way from bivouac to the start before he had mechanical problems and could not start.

Stage 2 - On the back of stage 1 I started 3rd last.  One of the previous day's riding partners did not start, the other rider (also a WD) was there and we decided to ride together again. He took the lead.  Very soon into the stage (I guess about a km or so) he went down in the sand and another rider went over his bike.  They were both lucky to walk away unharmed but his seat was ripped off and he decided to retire.  I was now right at the back of the field and had to get going.  Riding was great, I enjoyed myself and even passed a few riders.

30km into the stage was what Alexander referred to as a "big ass dune" in the briefing - as a matter of interest from what I can see the track up the dune is close to 300m in length with about a 60m climb (excluding the run-up)

A few riders were at the bottom, one was down about halfway up the dune and one was on his way back down for a second attempt.
As soon as the way was clear I took off on the run-up to the dune.  The only way to get this one done was to pin it and hold on.
About 5 or 10 m from the top I accidentally stepped on the gear lever going down one gear.  That, combined with a pinned throttle and sudden traction resulted in a spectacular backflip for rider and bike.
I went down hard and when I tried to get up I felt both my knees were very sore (and yes, I wore knee braces - without them things would probably have been much worse)
I also realised it would be very difficult for sweep and recovery to recover me at the top of the dune, so I walked my bike down the dune, a process which took me about 40 minutes, resting and feeling sorry for myself every few meters  :3some:.  Once down I pressed the SOS on my SPOT tracker and settled down with my radio and water to wait for recovery, feeling rather sorry for myself.
About an hour later recovery was on the radio, they were 5km out.  They then picked up Justin with mechanical problems about 3km from my position before they recovered me.

And that was the end of my first Baja, lots learnt, a bit disappointed with my result but happy that I was there, and I will be back.

The view from the top of the dune (notice the small spec of dust where the path seems to stop, that is another rider on yet another attempt)
The green horizontal ridge in the middle of the photo is about half way up.

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2081_zpsixuwunky.jpg)


Zoomed to the max of my camera.

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2082_zps4smd4ydb.jpg)


Nasty landing after a backflip.

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2084_zps39wdjkla.jpg)


The result (bike, not rider) - broken roadbook, screen and internals damaged, navigation tower top bracket cracked.

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2086_zpspqxzbftp.jpg)


The other rider on his attempt (after this he went down to try again and made it up)

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2089_zps4bwmbb6x.jpg)

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2090_zpsl4lbdskg.jpg)


Not this time bud...

(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s677/Garfield_Kola/Amageza/West%20Coast%20Baja%202016/Resized_IMG_2091_zpswvffij6i.jpg)

Having had a number of knee injuries before it felt like torn MCL, had it checked out yesterday and indeed, MCL, but it will heal up soon enough.

Next year I will do a few things different.  I am very happy with my navigation and gear, also happy with my riding at the moment but all of those can also only get better.

Thanks to Alexander and the marshal team for an awesome event.

Overall it was great - punctuality is not a strong point and the shower/toilet facilities were just pathetic really (I assume these were provided by the locals, it was really not acceptable when you get back from the ride filthy and tired).

All of these can easily be fixed  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 23, 2016, 10:48:10 am
My opinion on the results :

Each day's stage results should be posted as provisional results. 
The overall classification should be for the rally class seperate from the lite class.  it is 2 completely different races and according to Alex even different tracks. 

So you should have:
Rally class
     open
     restricted
     overall

Light class
     open
     restricted
     overall

Nothing else makes sense!

Majority of riders actually race for the result not the adventure, so without proper results this event is worthless.

I cannot find stage 2 results and even on previous Amageza events one should be able to still see the different stage results. Lots of people don't finish Amageza due to different reasons at least if there are stage results they have something to show.  These are also important results for sponsorships etc.

I had an average first day result after having to scroll my roadbook manually one handed riding in the sand not so nice and getting lost costing me 40mins.  The 2nd stage I pushed quite hard & improved my overall result quite a bit but now I don't have anything to show for my effort......would like to know my stage result.

I will send them an email in this respect.  Was just wondering if anybody is sharing my sentiments on this....
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 23, 2016, 12:30:14 pm
please guys if anyone has anymore video footage let us know
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: FrancoisTz on March 23, 2016, 12:50:39 pm
Great job GK, proud of you.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Airtime on March 23, 2016, 01:58:44 pm
ditto Martin I feel exactly the same as you I think they need to sort out the results more timeously and more detailed.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: MaxThePanda on March 23, 2016, 05:28:07 pm
Looking at these pics brings back many memories from the past few days - both good and bad - I suffer from hectic post rally blues - feels like nothing else really matters - even a bad day on the bike is better than a good day in the real world.

I must compliment Alex and team on 2 fantastic routes and a very detailed roadbook - in Amageza 2015 he got a lot of stuff wrong and took a lot of flack for crucial missing info on the roadbooks - in this race he went the extra mile and included a massive amount of detail - if your navigation was good and your instruments were accurate then you could maintain a good pace and make good time.

My throttle cable snapped 27 km into Stage 2. Robert and I tried to fix it but to no avail. He carried on and I pressed the recovery button on my tracker. I was very impressed to be recovered just over 90 minutes later by Sean Kriel and his helper - I really expected to be sitting there the whole day.

The bivouac side of thing still needs work though - I can never understand why it is so difficult to be able to provide adequate sanitary toilets and washing facilities - this was really disappointing after these issues were brought up post Amageza 2015.

I am bummed that I did not complete the race and return home with a finisher's medal but I am really glad that I entered and rode as much as I could. I can only blame myself for poor preparation and not checking the cable beforehand - and not having a spare cable with me - I am usually over prepared for any eventualities.

Lastly big thanks to my riding partner and rally buddy Robert Adams aka Darthvader - he drives me absolutely fucking mad with his constant faffing and over analysing everything but we ride well together and look out for one another - during 5000 km of Amageza 2015 we were never more than a bike length apart. Robert starts the stage hard and sets the pace and I usually take over about halfway and bring us home. Thanks Bobby Von Faff  :thumleft:

Nice writeup Justin! Seriously missed riding with you guys... felt very miff not being part of it. All the more so watching my bike racing so brilliantly without me... Nice work Chris!!  :3some:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: rubiblue on March 23, 2016, 05:42:00 pm
What a great experience, first rally I have been riding in, joined Team525 as a spanner boy and pitch bitch - was also a bag of fun, but proper hard work.

Managed to pick up MaxthePanda's machine, as he was getting out of the Rallye vibe. Team Verve was incorporated (Rainer aka White Rhino, Gary aka Grolls, and myself aka RubiBlue) teamed up together with the view of doing the amageza, and using the Baja as a learning curve to getting there. I ride quite a bit, so am relatively fit, and we managed to do 3 road books test (all the same route, but had to do it a few times in order to complete Mark's Magaliesburg road book), mostly due to issues arising and learning various things about navigation, etc. (1 blown engine, a new gearbox, engine sucking sand, punctures, siezing rear brakes and the likes - we learnt quickly). At the last minute to manage to source some crew men, thankfully, they made it a pleasure for us as riders. Hugh and Sean joined the epic journey.

Lots of nerves on the Friday, from waking up early, we were the first to be registered and scrutineered. We sailed through, we had a lot more mental doubt than was actually needed, during that process, was pleasantly chilled and went very smoothly. Our motto of "failure to prepare is preparing to fail", paid off very well.
We were quite happy we went through early, as there seemed to be a building backlog behind us, and we had plenty of time to setup our pits and camp site for the rest of the day. At 3.30 we frantically got dressed and prepped for the prologue. Again, I think I was far to nervous than necessary, it was a blast. Originally i said I was gonna take it easy and get into the flow the following day, but when the marshall's hand dropped, so did my 450 KTM's clutch. From there on in the bike was pinned, about a 1.5 km dash down the runway, over the hill on a sandy twisty road, leading into a sharp right. I noticed someone had fallen, think it the was Bontekoning and I immediately slowed in an expectation to be having to give assistance.

I noticed he stood up and was picking his bike up, all good then. 2 seconds later, my racing partner was shouting and I was rear ended. Thankfully I didn't go down, but I saw Chris behind me did go down, but he was immediately picking his bike up. I dumped the clutch and went as fast as i could all the way to the finish line. Just before the pans again the bike got a little away from me, and i noticed a cameraman was strategically placed, I was hoping he caught it, he did, its a wicked picture - https://www.facebook.com/amageza.rallye/photos/a.999764700059272.1073741911.189117647790652/999771760058566/?type=3&theater (https://www.facebook.com/amageza.rallye/photos/a.999764700059272.1073741911.189117647790652/999771760058566/?type=3&theater)

Heart was racing, spoke to fellow riders for a bit and then we were paraded back through the town into parc ferme. A while later we collected our bikes, fueled them, did a few small changes, got our road books and started marking them, so much confusion with them that we ended getting to bed quite late. tomorrow would be a long day we thought.

Alarm went off at 5.10am, uggh, still dark and very cold outside. We got dressed, placed bikes back into parc ferme, had some chow, did final prep, and then we were being lead towards the start point in convoy. On arrival, most had a quick toilet break, and what felt like a few seconds I was on the starting line, started 5th I think (prologue must have gone well), all alone, and the marshall shouted "GO". Fuck ok, and I was off and rallying! Caught 2 guys I think, one of them was Rainer as he had to lead the way, must have been daunting for him. Things were going well, and I was riding very smoothly, came across Peter and Roger, seemed they had gotten a little lost, saw the first GPS waypoint (we were given 6 or 7 for the day), and then rode behind them for a while, they opened a small gap, but I maintained my comfort zone, and was able to see their dust trail at all times. Was suddenly in Alexander Bay and both Roger and peter seemed to be with their crews, mine were at the next DSP. I took my warm top off, and thought I would ventured forth and open the road for as long as I could. Its very daunting opening the road, even more so being only 90km into my first rally. Why not learn the hard way? I rode a little slower than usual, making sure I was on the correct roads, got  lost a little and eventually found my way, still no-one in sight. Continued on some unbelievable terrain, Cudo's to Alex + Team for prepping such amazing routes for us. Top 10 rides of my life. Just before the DSP, Roger and someone else caught me, think it was Peter, and we rode the rest of the way together. I need to refuel with a few litres and fuel the body a little, they continued on. As i left the DSP, my road books un bundled so I spent a few minutes sorting it out, and 2 or 3 guys caught me, Donovan being one of them. we rode the rest of the way together, swapping positions as each person over shot, was great to ride with them, Superman was with us as well as one of the Lite guys.

Was feeling fresh after the ride, and all the others riders began filtering into the bivvy over the next few hours. Had a warm shower, first in a while and chilled the rest of the afternoon. Same process was to be repeated, refueled, make small changes to bike, mark road book, have dinner, riders briefing, back to bikes to load road books, bed. 5.10am, wake up.

Was even colder on than the Saturday morning and our crew left earlier than us, as Alex said the first guys would be coming through the dual DSP after an hour of riding, was a little longer than that, but was happy there were there when I got in. Again, tremendous riding, mostly sandy twee spoor. I felt sorry for the less fit riders, because in reality this was quite easy going, but i know from experience, lack of fitness can make these roads a mutha fucka. Glad I spent 2 months getting into reasonable shape before hand. At kilo 31, there was a big dune, I recall Alex saying it was hectic, but thought he said around kilo 40. Regardless we were in a small fast group (Roger, Brian, Mark, and 2 others I think), I was at the rear and when I got it I could see nothing but dust. There is only one way up a dune, and that's fast/hard/aggresively. Followed my theory, and went straight up, following the thick dust, saw one or 2 riders stuck on the way up, smashed through several bushes but got to the top without much hassle. We made it to the first DSP without much time elapsing, got my goggles cleaned by the crew, and noticed most raced off, didn't really mind, was tired of the dust. Before coming into the pits I noticed just after the DSP there was a right turn off the main drag, but most were heading flatout down the main road. Eventually left and followed their lead, bad mistake, but after a short while i hooked up with another rider and we turned back (Mark raaff and someone else I think). We headed down the right road and the 2 of them sped ahead, I slowed to get a dust gap going. Then I noticed they overshot a turn, I was now confused, but followed the road book from the earlier "Dont follow" lesson.

So I was leading once again, scary shit. The next 80/90 odd kilos was flipping amazing, a lot more technical riding, riverbeds, ups/downs, sharps inclines and descents - very rocky indeed.  Alex was flying overhead, the road books was making complete sense, and I got a warm fuzzy feeling that I was making up some great time on the top boys - either that or he was telling me I was properly lost  :imaposer:.

I knew they would come, but took my time and read the book and kept the pace up without taking any "stupid" risks. The route was fantastic, and I was taking the time to look at the surroundings. Then I shat myself. I noticed 2 bikes coming towards me, oh crap, i have fucked up properly. But how could the book have made so much sense to me. We pulled over and had a quick chat, told them they were wrong and I was right (was the 2 brothers Eben and Gavin - they were on the GPS category), but purely being optimistic and hoping inside that all was good with my navigation. We parted and then I came across 2 more riders (Gideon on the 701 and someone else), Gideon said the road ahead of me was shit. I agreed with them, but purely cos he was going up some of that crap and I was going down, I didn't think Alex would have made us come up that way on these bigger bikes, was pretty knarly. The affirmed my thinking that i was right.

On a long tough descent Roger caught me, and I noticed Brian was a kilo or 2 back, I let Roger go, but maintained a dust gap and a view of him most of the time. Eventually Brian passed me on the flats back to DSP2, again just maintained a dust gap and continued to follow the road book.

At DSP2, the others left in a hurry, but I stayed and relaxed (the 4 other wrong way GPS boys then came into the DSP, and also raced off). We refueled, I ate some food, cleaned goggles and refitted the 2nd part of my road book. Again there is no words to thank our crew, superb work. I think I hung around for a little too long, and decided to go before anymore came into the DSP. I wanted to spend the next 70 kilos working on my nav skills without any dust. Was a super stretch back to the finish line, kept my speed up nicely, worked methodically through the book, and just confirmed my decisions with visible bike tracks every now and again. Before i knew the rally was over. WHAT, all done?

Spoke briefly to Roger and Brian and the Mocke brothers, Rynet did a quick interview. Then did the liaison section back to Port Nolloth. On passing the only real pub, we went in for a "COKE" and some more small talk. Then back to bivvy.

Was super chuffed with myself, I never expected to be riding with some of these "known" names. But I rode on my comfort line and gained a wealth of navigation experience. Loved every second of it. Fellow team Verve members had a tougher day (Rainer bike packed up and he only got back to bivvy around 8.30PM) and Gary missioned through Day 1 injuries (he was not going to start day 2, but some arm bending put him on his bike) to complete day 2 in style - super proud of them both - thanks for the pre training rides and the many beers to get here. A big thanks to our support guys, made it so much easier and made the adventure that much more rewarding by sharing time with them. Alex and crew, great event, a few small changes for next time, but a great life changing experience nonetheless.

Was purely wanting a finish the Baja, and possibly be placed decently (like top 30 or so) and finish with energy to spare. I managed to do this, and was very surprised when Alex called me up for 2nd in Restricted Rally class and 3rd overall. This might change with final timing changes and objections etc, nut for now I am enjoying the vibe.

The bug has bitten....to the amageza in Nov.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 23, 2016, 06:11:46 pm

Was purely wanting a finish the Baja, and possibly be placed decently (like top 30 or so) and finish with energy to spare. I managed to do this, and was very surprised when Alex called me up for 2nd in Restricted Rally class and 3rd overall.

The bug has bitten....to the amageza in Nov.

Awesome write and awesome ride  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on March 23, 2016, 06:33:02 pm
Awesome rubiblue, and what a picture!  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 23, 2016, 06:38:21 pm
Awesome rubiblue, and what a picture!  :thumleft:

True, and only looked at the picture now, all I can add is  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Grolls on March 23, 2016, 07:16:36 pm
Rubiblue , team Verve's secret weapon
What a pleasure to have done all the pre race training and learning with you and the White  Rhino
You are a true champion
Very proud to be a team mate of yours
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: rubiblue on March 23, 2016, 07:19:13 pm
Rubiblue , team Verve's secret weapon
What a pleasure to have done all the pre race training and learning with you and the White  Rhino
You are a true champion
Very proud to be a team mate of yours

Likewise my friend. You taught me about guts and determination. Grolls rode most of day 2 with a broken rib. Champion extreme.
Title: Re:
Post by: Rynet on March 23, 2016, 07:22:53 pm
Baja routes were amazing but what a mess of the rest!  8.20 and no results no prize giving. Cold miserable tent not even a drink! Alex a stickler for the rules and time but not when it applies to him!  Every briefing late!  Suspect like 2014 late event and we'll post your medal!

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk


GG . I can’ t speak for the event or for Alex , but on a personal note the Oakpic photographers and I were very disheartened to see your same comment as above on the Amageza facebook page at 11 pm on Sunday of the final night when everyone else was already sleeping and we were sleeping off site and couldn’t phone anyone . We felt all of us had worked so hard the whole weekend to support the riders , Alex especially , and to get a comment saying “ what a mess of the rest “ was neither accurate nor fair .
 
Oakpics’ slide show started as you drove out the gates which was about 8.20 pm and the actual prize giving started at about 8.30 pm  . 
I phoned Gideon at 8.16 pm to tell him the outcome of riding the route the wrong way and he can verify the time .
 
Alex spent most of every day of the event flying and only came back late as he was dealing with riders who were still riding quite late and also had an injured rider stuck on the mountain . Alex despatched Andy who rode with the extreme recovery rider , Loftie (Scrat’s brother ) . They had to recover the injured rider on that hectic mountain pass , they also rode the route the wrong way like Gideon and Co. did , apparently an admirable feat and only arriving back at bivvy near midnight .
 
Gideon, the two Mocke brothers and Peter Brinkworth had ridden the mountain loop the wrong way . Roger Kane Berman apparently made the same mistake when he left the last fuel stop, but he had a roadbook and realised his error and turned back after 15 km . However , the Rally lite GPS system apparently doesn’t show you if you are riding the loop in the wrong direction . The way points are apparently not visible or too small to see.  Being the front runners, there also would have been no tracks to help them. The Rally Lite system was supposed to make it easier for the Rally Lite guys and instead it appears to have made it more difficult, on the Loop at least.
 
A decision had to made about the 4 guys before prize giving as it would affect the final results.   The issue had to be considered seriously as a disqualification would ruin a rider’s chance to ride Amageza later in the year .  At the same time there had to be a fairly strict penalty for carrying on riding in the wrong direction once it was known they were going against the race route.  ( although it was taken in consideration that there wasn’t any way for them to know this when they started the loop anti-clockwise. Also once they met the front runners and realised their mistake, they would have been influenced by fuel issues too) . There was quite a bit of discussion as there is no precedent for this as the Rally lite system is a new system. After much debate the decision was made to give the 4 riders a 30 minute penalty each.
 
By this stage Steve was at the airport flying to Manchester and he was calculating the final results while the airhostess threatened to leave without him .
 
All very stressful, but it was successfully done and the prize giving was great and I am sorry you missed it as you had at least three finishers in your group , yourself and Johan Jansen van Rensburg as well as Gavin Morten, who came first in the Open Rally which is a big achievement and I think 4th overall   :thumleft:

When the Oakpics team showed their two slide shows you could hear a penny drop in the tent . Every person , riders ,crew and local helpers , were staring with rapt attention at the beautiful slide show . Oakpics managed to capture the essence of the rally , the landscape and the spirit of the riders and of course the riding and sliding and wheelies and the Gideon stunts .   The riders were of top quality and it was awesome to see them riding and for us to be part of this amazing event .  The prize giving was quite emotional for all of us , the riders really earned their medals and made us proud . 

The riders had lots of compliments for the spectacular routes, the road book and the racing part .  Yes I am sure Alex will take note of communicating more often and effectively to the riders after the daily riding  , as he always takes note of criticisms and comments and improves on Amageza ( and will do so with Baja ) year after year . 

I am proud of being part of this amazing team and I think this was the best event so far . May it grow to become even better.   :ricky:
 
 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 23, 2016, 07:27:05 pm
Rubiblue , team Verve's secret weapon
What a pleasure to have done all the pre race training and learning with you and the White  Rhino
You are a true champion
Very proud to be a team mate of yours

Likewise my friend. You taught me about guts and determination. Grolls rode most of day 2 with a broken rib. Champion extreme.

Awesome both of you ,and White Rhino too.  :thumleft:

Rubiblue I remember how excited you were last year to just be able to be back-up for the 525 Team and here you come out and surprise everyone ,very well done . Love your story and yea you rode a near perfect race .   :ricky:
Your photo is pretty spectacular .  :drif:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: AlexRG on March 23, 2016, 09:33:58 pm
Hi guys,

Thanks to Alex Nel and the whole crew... I had a blast! A superb event! I give it 11 on a scale of 1 to 10.

The road book was super and the terrain even better!!!

I made lot's of small GoPro vids including the monster dune, Superman passing and falling, and the mountain section, also one having an "off" myself on a double (!!) caution :-) ... just need to find time to edit and post it.

Well done to each and every entrant for actually moving into action to enter and race. Don't dream it, do it...

Wish we had another one like this, i.e. x2 Baja's per year and then the Amageza.

Cheers!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 23, 2016, 09:57:20 pm
Hey guys it's Ash rider no 17. So this is my story of the Baja... but first a massive thanks to Alex and all of his team for such an awesome event. Kevin and I loved every moment (except the mountain part- Alex was not bullshitting us when he scared the life out of us at Rider's Briefing on Saturday night). I would also like to thank all the sponsors that bought advertising space on my bike by donating money to DARG (animal rescue group in Hout Bay); we raised a massive R64000 in total. Incredible!

So I drove up on Thursday to get there early but my van's turbo overheated and I had to drive the whole way for almost 9 hours in donkey mode. Final pulled into Port Nolloth around 8:30 pm to a very welcoming group of riders enjoying themselves at a local Bar/restaurant. I met up with Kevin, my riding partner, and we settled in at the unit we rented for the weekend.

Friday morning up early for scrutineering  at 9am and my nerves where shot. Got there at 8:30am to be told we had to be in full kit, so rushed off and got ready.
TT that afternoon and again the nerves where finished, Kevin kept reminding me take it easy on the TT you have nothing to gain but everything to lose. Well that only remained in my head for about a second before Shaun dropped his hands at the start line and race mode kicked in, and I think I was still sideways in 3rd gear as I opened the throttle to infinity and beyond riding it like I just stole it. Over shot turn one and landed up in the bush and got barbed wire wrapped in the rear wheel; that was TT over for me- I was the last bike back in.

Day 1. I can't remember most of day 1 due to the scarred memories of Devil's Breath on day 2., but my road-book jammed at 38km so I rode blind for the first 38 km following tracks until I was 38km into it, when I could finally use my road-book! I finally caught up to Kevin later on in the ride; just as well because my road-book jammed at 200km again. It was awesome: my first rally and using navigation. Loved it!
Got back and my mind was ready for day 2, until Alex told us what lay ahead on day 2's mountain section and Kevin and I decided that night not to do it.

Day 2. Well a good night's rest, a fresh kit, new goggles and race face on. Finished stage 1 and decided to take on Devil's Breath. Refueled the bikes and as we were about to leave for the mountain in high spirits, Alex stopped us and said he highly suggested we do not do the mountain and he thought we should rather retire while we were ahead.  To get us out of there would not be easy and even if we made it, we would not make it back by 4pm to do stage 3 and would get time-barred anyway. O man, the disappointment hit the ground so hard I was sure I saw dust around where we were standing. I said to Kevin 'let's rather leave it and go back home with awesome memories and a great ride under our belts'. But Kevin had a certain look in his eye, the sort of look a gunslinger gets just before he draws his revolver. He was not thinking what I was thinking. Alex then added ''it's up to you''. Well' needless to say' we both knew where this was going and as quick as a flash we jumped on the bikes and took off like we just robbed a bank, heading for the feared DEVILS BREATH.

Long story short we crapped ourselves in the mountain and I have never been so worried in my life before. But rock after rock Kevin and I managed to push each other through it and got back to refuel again at 3pm, one hour before time-bar. We got horribly lost again but finally got back and finished the race.

I appreciate my medal so much and will always have awesome memories of the 2016 BAJA. It was a pleasure to ride with you Kevin and well done! Your passion is addictive!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: AlexRG on March 23, 2016, 10:07:49 pm


Some roadbook homework for Stage 2 from the comfort of the sunny rental beachouse.

Some photos of the stunning Richtersveld rocks after the mountain section.



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 24, 2016, 12:12:08 am
Hey guys it's Ash rider no 17. So this is my story of the Baja... but first a massive thanks to Alex and all of his team for such an awesome event. Kevin and I loved every moment (except the mountain part- Alex was not bullshitting us when he scared the life out of us at Rider's Briefing on Saturday night). I would also like to thank all the sponsors that bought advertising space on my bike by donating money to DARG (animal rescue group in Hout Bay); we raised a massive R64000 in total. Incredible!

So I drove up on Thursday to get there early but my van's turbo overheated and I had to drive the whole way for almost 9 hours in donkey mode. Final pulled into Port Nolloth around 8:30 pm to a very welcoming group of riders enjoying themselves at a local Bar/restaurant. I met up with Kevin, my riding partner, and we settled in at the unit we rented for the weekend.

Friday morning up early for scrutineering  at 9am and my nerves where shot. Got there at 8:30am to be told we had to be in full kit, so rushed off and got ready.
TT that afternoon and again the nerves where finished, Kevin kept reminding me take it easy on the TT you have nothing to gain but everything to lose. Well that only remained in my head for about a second before Shaun dropped his hands at the start line and race mode kicked in, and I think I was still sideways in 3rd gear as I opened the throttle to infinity and beyond riding it like I just stole it. Over shot turn one and landed up in the bush and got barbed wire wrapped in the rear wheel; that was TT over for me- I was the last bike back in.

Day 1. I can't remember most of day 1 due to the scarred memories of Devil's Breath on day 2., but my road-book jammed at 38km so I rode blind for the first 38 km following tracks until I was 38km into it, when I could finally use my road-book! I finally caught up to Kevin later on in the ride; just as well because my road-book jammed at 200km again. It was awesome: my first rally and using navigation. Loved it!
Got back and my mind was ready for day 2, until Alex told us what lay ahead on day 2's mountain section and Kevin and I decided that night not to do it.

Day 2. Well a good night's rest, a fresh kit, new goggles and race face on. Finished stage 1 and decided to take on Devil's Breath. Refueled the bikes and as we were about to leave for the mountain in high spirits, Alex stopped us and said he highly suggested we do not do the mountain and he thought we should rather retire while we were ahead.  To get us out of there would not be easy and even if we made it, we would not make it back by 4pm to do stage 3 and would get time-barred anyway. O man, the disappointment hit the ground so hard I was sure I saw dust around where we were standing. I said to Kevin 'let's rather leave it and go back home with awesome memories and a great ride under our belts'. But Kevin had a certain look in his eye, the sort of look a gunslinger gets just before he draws his revolver. He was not thinking what I was thinking. Alex then added ''it's up to you''. Well' needless to say' we both knew where this was going and as quick as a flash we jumped on the bikes and took off like we just robbed a bank, heading for the feared DEVILS BREATH.

Long story short we crapped ourselves in the mountain and I have never been so worried in my life before. But rock after rock Kevin and I managed to push each other through it and got back to refuel again at 3pm, one hour before time-bar. We got horribly lost again but finally got back and finished the race.

I appreciate my medal so much and will always have awesome memories of the 2016 BAJA. It was a pleasure to ride with you Kevin and well done! Your passion is addictive!

That's why rally is addictive, it's you the bike and the course. That there are others on it, only makes it more fun!

I was stuck behind my computer following your little dot and cheering when you finally got moving again after the rocks but groaning when so close to home you guys took a huge left for a for while when you should have gone right!

Well flipping done!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 24, 2016, 12:14:58 am
rubiblue & Ash, well done  - fantastic reports guys! :thumleft:

Rubiblue - Big respect to you for doing so well on your first rally. Those guys are super fast.  :salut:

Rynett - Thanks for you comments and perspective, was good to read.

From what I have seen and heard the road book was excellent. Busy too, but that is normal on a technical route. The Sardegna Rally is very similar and also has long RB´s.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 24, 2016, 01:27:38 am
I have posted a video of Devil's Breath here (hope it works - technically handicapped!)


https://youtu.be/KDLa7ctPaec

enjoy & excuse the byklanke it's all in racing....I think
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Grolls on March 24, 2016, 01:37:06 am
an idea of the Friday Prologue ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emdohHCeNB4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emdohHCeNB4)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 24, 2016, 02:16:38 am
I have posted a video of Devil's Breath here (hope it works - technically handicapped!)

https://www.youtube.com/v/KDLa7ctPaec&feature=youtu.be

enjoy & excuse the byklanke it's all in racing....I think


an idea of the Friday Prologue ...

https://www.youtube.com/v/emdohHCeNB4

Bliskem, those were lekker to watch! :thumleft: Thanks guys. I hope there is more coming. Grolls, you need longer vids :deal:

luckyloo, you were positively flying through those rocks! A couple of sphincter knuiping moments :eek:  :biggrin:  :ricky:

I have to ask, why were you shouting FO? Flies or bees maybe?


Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 24, 2016, 07:31:47 am
Hahaha BB my wonderful ADD mind keeps loosing focus I find it wondering off badly so I have to keep  reminding it nicely to please keep focus but there's unfortunately not enough time to have this full conversation with it while riding 😂😂😡, hence just a short reminder about the talk we had before the race. ......makes sence?? 😆
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 24, 2016, 07:53:19 am
Hahaha BB my wonderful ADD mind keeps loosing focus I find it wondering off badly so I have to keep  reminding it nicely to please keep focus but there's unfortunately not enough time to have this full conversation with it while riding 😂😂😡, hence just a short reminder about the talk we had before the race. ......makes sence?? 😆

Ha ha, that's funny!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Malibu on March 24, 2016, 08:04:13 am
For those that asked, here is the link to my RR

http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190049.0 (http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190049.0)

:)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: White Rhino on March 25, 2016, 11:18:04 am
Hi guys, Nice to see the support from the forum.

This event was AWESOME!!!!!

I can't compare this event as it's my first. It was a properly organised and well executed event. The little things can be swallowed without too much discomfort. Well one to Alex and the rest of the organisers and helpers.

Thanks Rynette for giving us such awesome encouragement - you rock!

I got to meet Andy (Andy660) one of the soldiers during my recovery - thanks Andy great war stories that helped while the hours away.

My bike started misbehaving in the Mountain section stuttering and cutting out forcing me to call it. I did manage to do close on three quarters of the distance and I was in good physical condition so making it to the end was a reality.

My story will be posted shortly!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: JohannesKotze on March 25, 2016, 10:03:59 pm
Hi luckyloo, you passed me first in your first vid, then you pased Nilkaus letzeller and then Kobus potgieter. I remember when you passed me I thought geez this guy is comfortable in the rocks. After we met up in the tent and we had a chat.

Us Upington boytjies are much happier in sand.

This was my first event as well and I did send Alex and Marie-Louise an e-mail to thank them for all the effort. I think what they do might be one of the most thankless jobs out there, and I do think it is important to show thanks and give credit where it is due. I know for a fact I will not be able to pull such an event off.

This was a graet event and I will be back next year. I learned a lot and got horribly lost on stage 1. I believe Geoff Patterson and I lost almost 40 minutes.

I will try and post my vids when I get the chance.

Cheers

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: lj111 on March 26, 2016, 07:21:06 pm

Was purely wanting a finish the Baja, and possibly be placed decently (like top 30 or so) and finish with energy to spare. I managed to do this, and was very surprised when Alex called me up for 2nd in Restricted Rally class and 3rd overall.

The bug has bitten....to the amageza in Nov.

Awesome write and awesome ride  :thumleft:

Yes WELL done Chris :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:

Must have been a lot more fun than being stuck with me in a Land Rover through Amageza :lol8:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: rubiblue on March 26, 2016, 07:39:30 pm

Was purely wanting a finish the Baja, and possibly be placed decently (like top 30 or so) and finish with energy to spare. I managed to do this, and was very surprised when Alex called me up for 2nd in Restricted Rally class and 3rd overall.

The bug has bitten....to the amageza in Nov.

Awesome write and awesome ride  :thumleft:

Yes WELL done Chris :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:

Must have been a lot more fun than being stuck with me in a Land Rover through Amageza :lol8:



Tough call bud. That was a pretty good week. Even though we worked like crazy.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 27, 2016, 12:00:24 pm
Loving all the updates and videos, thanks guys  .  :ricky:

Here is another mountain Video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_wS1-ncqcY&ebc=ANyPxKrnZmrT61Mmoz949aZDG9CVX30ldnrXfybyK1KEyPYyP5ZoAXO31MaqiwtlZmCSa1xv956JlI8_tNgUMRBS6c1rChIlYg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_wS1-ncqcY&ebc=ANyPxKrnZmrT61Mmoz949aZDG9CVX30ldnrXfybyK1KEyPYyP5ZoAXO31MaqiwtlZmCSa1xv956JlI8_tNgUMRBS6c1rChIlYg)


Luckyloo thanks for your video , it was great to see the riding the mountain paths , and makes me lus to ride . And hahaha its so cool to hear you talking to yourself , FOKus ,  :imaposer: thanks for sharing .  :thumleft:

Grolls thanks for your video , I see it features the para-medic that was in our group that ended up helping Sean and I with the starts , she was sweet and so eager to send the guys off .   :biggrin:

Where is Bonovo? I want to hear from him , give us an update on your healing please .  I'm very impressed with his team mates who stood by him and over him for three hours till help arrived and then thy still rode and did really well , Gregg Raaf , Toti Einarson and Joey Evans stayed with him .

Such team spirit and loyalty from his team mates . Some pics from facebook about the aftermath and one nice one of Peter riding on the Pan.  :thumleft:

Come on guys please post more comments and videos . :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 27, 2016, 07:16:35 pm
Another undedited video of Stage 2 first part upto before the dune.  Directly into the sun at first, couple of navigation mistakes, some nice speed towards the end.  Sorry if it's a bit long.....I will post my rolling down the dune at a later stage.  Which App is best for editing these videos?  Enjoy!!

https://youtu.be/kDWzqy_mmhI
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 27, 2016, 10:36:15 pm
Another undedited video of Stage 2 first part upto before the dune.  Directly into the sun at first, couple of navigation mistakes, some nice speed towards the end.  Sorry if it's a bit long.....I will post my rolling down the dune at a later stage.  Which App is best for editing these videos?  Enjoy!!

https://youtu.be/kDWzqy_mmhI

Very nice, I prefer the longer videos to be honest. :thumleft:

Flip, maat jy kan ry! :ricky: Talk about an attacking style of riding.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 28, 2016, 09:38:04 am
So as always we do a few things differently on each rallye, trying to improve things. This time not so much different, but I would like to hear opinions about:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: JustBendIt on March 28, 2016, 10:01:38 am
So as always we do a few things differently on each rallye, trying to improve things. This time not so much different, but I would like to hear opinions about:

  • Did it help that we loaded the safety waypoints onto your GPSs for you, rather than print them and have you load them manually  ???
  • Did the handing out of GPSs in the morning work out OK, or was it a huge schlep ???
  • Did not using printed timecards make a big difference ???

YES yes yes to all - I noticed a huge improvement in the timing and the "race organisation"

Well done to this dept  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 28, 2016, 10:28:49 am
I saw in one of the videos there was no countdown at the SS start? Was this just a bad observation or ?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 28, 2016, 10:37:42 am
Steve the loading of the waypoints made that part easier but the known waypoints weren't indicated on the roadbooks so you couldn't scroll down the roadbook to see at which tulip the next WP was you had to search the waypoint name on gps to see which is the next available WP.  With only getting the gps in the morning there was no time to put this manually on the roadbook. So I would prefer still having WP indicated on the RB.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 28, 2016, 11:05:40 am
So as always we do a few things differently on each rallye, trying to improve things. This time not so much different, but I would like to hear opinions about:

  • Did it help that we loaded the safety waypoints onto your GPSs for you, rather than print them and have you load them manually  ???
  • Did the handing out of GPSs in the morning work out OK, or was it a huge schlep ???
  • Did not using printed timecards make a big difference ???

Yes.

Yes, No.

Yes, makes life easier.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Crossed-up on March 28, 2016, 11:23:48 am
Many of the pics from the Baja show a plethora of bike tracks criss-crossing the veld. This is what I was afraid would happen and in spite of asking you nicely it seems that many riders really didn't care. I'm sure that these same riders would never do this in ordinary life, but somehow being part of a Rally gives them licence.

Rallying will have to face up to the new eco-realities. We cannot gooi at will all over the countryside.  So I'd really like to see a drastic tightening up of the track log examination. One where the competitor's track-log is overlaid on the "ideal" track, and penalties are applied for deviations beyond a certain tolerance. This should be for the whole track and not just the waypoints. Existing tracks off the correct track could be included so that wrong turnings only incur their own time penalty. There must be some mathematical way of doing this so that it's the same for everyone, and is never subjective.

If there is to be a future for rallying, and this applies to them all, they are going to have to find ways to minimise the impact on the environment. The global eco-lobby gains strength and us hooligans need to fit in or fuck off.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 28, 2016, 12:00:51 pm
Many of the pics from the Baja show a plethora of bike tracks criss-crossing the veld. This is what I was afraid would happen and in spite of asking you nicely it seems that many riders really didn't care. I'm sure that these same riders would never do this in ordinary life, but somehow being part of a Rally gives them licence.

Rallying will have to face up to the new eco-realities. We cannot gooi at will all over the countryside.  So I'd really like to see a drastic tightening up of the track log examination. One where the competitor's track-log is overlaid on the "ideal" track, and penalties are applied for deviations beyond a certain tolerance. This should be for the whole track and not just the waypoints. Existing tracks off the correct track could be included so that wrong turnings only incur their own time penalty. There must be some mathematical way of doing this so that it's the same for everyone, and is never subjective.

If there is to be a future for rallying, and this applies to them all, they are going to have to find ways to minimise the impact on the environment. The global eco-lobby gains strength and us hooligans need to fit in or fuck off.
I agree 100%. these arid regions are super sensitive and take more than a lifetime to recover.
It will not take too long for the environmentalists to have us banned from these regions if we are not going to be more careful.
The worst of all is that we bring the proof  back and post it on U Tube :xxbah:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 28, 2016, 02:27:09 pm
Many of the pics from the Baja show a plethora of bike tracks criss-crossing the veld. This is what I was afraid would happen and in spite of asking you nicely it seems that many riders really didn't care. I'm sure that these same riders would never do this in ordinary life, but somehow being part of a Rally gives them licence.

Rallying will have to face up to the new eco-realities. We cannot gooi at will all over the countryside.  So I'd really like to see a drastic tightening up of the track log examination. One where the competitor's track-log is overlaid on the "ideal" track, and penalties are applied for deviations beyond a certain tolerance. This should be for the whole track and not just the waypoints. Existing tracks off the correct track could be included so that wrong turnings only incur their own time penalty. There must be some mathematical way of doing this so that it's the same for everyone, and is never subjective.

If there is to be a future for rallying, and this applies to them all, they are going to have to find ways to minimise the impact on the environment. The global eco-lobby gains strength and us hooligans need to fit in or fuck off.
I agree 100%. these arid regions are super sensitive and take more than a lifetime to recover.
It will not take too long for the environmentalists to have us banned from these regions if we are not going to be more careful.
The worst of all is that we bring the proof  back and post it on U Tube :xxbah:




Whilst I agree to some extent, I would like to propose doing this a bit more scientifically. Taking a photo of places like that big dune soon after the guys went up it, asking some enviro students to measure the damage and then going back in 6 months and again a year later to assess just how quickly the environment forgets we were even there.

Of course there are some places like the lichen beds in Namibia that carry their scars for centuries, but I have personally seen places in the Richetersveld where even after making a meal of some tracks, it was hard to see we'd even been there a few months later.

Anecdotal and alarmist "proof" does more damage to our reputation and can never be countered. Enviro groups are going to have a go no matter what. Rally is by its very nature not very green. Having some proper data to refute the more rabid opinions of those who want to shut the sport no matter what we do. Just the mere fact that we are scientifically measuring our impact would be a huge positive for the sport. But, even if we only used sun/wind replenished batteries with high floatation soft tires and speed limits of under 40kph, they'd still be up in arms.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 28, 2016, 03:11:42 pm
Another undedited video of Stage 2 first part upto before the dune.  Directly into the sun at first, couple of navigation mistakes, some nice speed towards the end.  Sorry if it's a bit long.....I will post my rolling down the dune at a later stage.  Which App is best for editing these videos?  Enjoy!!

https://youtu.be/kDWzqy_mmhI

Windows Movie Maker works quite well.

You were making less mistakes than others and you had some pace. That's not easy to do.

How many gears on your bike? I was wanting another gear at times!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rolling Stone on March 28, 2016, 03:41:02 pm
Many of the pics from the Baja show a plethora of bike tracks criss-crossing the veld. This is what I was afraid would happen and in spite of asking you nicely it seems that many riders really didn't care. I'm sure that these same riders would never do this in ordinary life, but somehow being part of a Rally gives them licence.

Rallying will have to face up to the new eco-realities. We cannot gooi at will all over the countryside.  So I'd really like to see a drastic tightening up of the track log examination. One where the competitor's track-log is overlaid on the "ideal" track, and penalties are applied for deviations beyond a certain tolerance. This should be for the whole track and not just the waypoints. Existing tracks off the correct track could be included so that wrong turnings only incur their own time penalty. There must be some mathematical way of doing this so that it's the same for everyone, and is never subjective.

If there is to be a future for rallying, and this applies to them all, they are going to have to find ways to minimise the impact on the environment. The global eco-lobby gains strength and us hooligans need to fit in or fuck off.
I agree 100%. these arid regions are super sensitive and take more than a lifetime to recover.
It will not take too long for the environmentalists to have us banned from these regions if we are not going to be more careful.
The worst of all is that we bring the proof  back and post it on U Tube :xxbah:




Whilst I agree to some extent, I would like to propose doing this a bit more scientifically. Taking a photo of places like that big dune soon after the guys went up it, asking some enviro students to measure the damage and then going back in 6 months and again a year later to assess just how quickly the environment forgets we were even there.

Of course there are some places like the lichen beds in Namibia that carry their scars for centuries, but I have personally seen places in the Richetersveld where even after making a meal of some tracks, it was hard to see we'd even been there a few months later.

Anecdotal and alarmist "proof" does more damage to our reputation and can never be countered. Enviro groups are going to have a go no matter what. Rally is by its very nature not very green. Having some proper data to refute the more rabid opinions of those who want to shut the sport no matter what we do. Just the mere fact that we are scientifically measuring our impact would be a huge positive for the sport. But, even if we only used sun/wind replenished batteries with high floatation soft tires and speed limits of under 40kph, they'd still be up in arms.
very good idea Andrew.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 28, 2016, 04:32:52 pm
Steve the loading of the waypoints made that part easier but the known waypoints weren't indicated on the roadbooks so you couldn't scroll down the roadbook to see at which tulip the next WP was you had to search the waypoint name on gps to see which is the next available WP.  With only getting the gps in the morning there was no time to put this manually on the roadbook. So I would prefer still having WP indicated on the RB.

???
The tulip number and the waypoint number on the GPS were the same, and each tulip for which you had a GPS waypoint was indicated with a WPE.
At least that was the plan, did I get it wrong?!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Crossed-up on March 28, 2016, 05:28:04 pm
Many of the pics from the Baja show a plethora of bike tracks criss-crossing the veld. This is what I was afraid would happen and in spite of asking you nicely it seems that many riders really didn't care. I'm sure that these same riders would never do this in ordinary life, but somehow being part of a Rally gives them licence.

Rallying will have to face up to the new eco-realities. We cannot gooi at will all over the countryside.  So I'd really like to see a drastic tightening up of the track log examination. One where the competitor's track-log is overlaid on the "ideal" track, and penalties are applied for deviations beyond a certain tolerance. This should be for the whole track and not just the waypoints. Existing tracks off the correct track could be included so that wrong turnings only incur their own time penalty. There must be some mathematical way of doing this so that it's the same for everyone, and is never subjective.

If there is to be a future for rallying, and this applies to them all, they are going to have to find ways to minimise the impact on the environment. The global eco-lobby gains strength and us hooligans need to fit in or fuck off.
I agree 100%. these arid regions are super sensitive and take more than a lifetime to recover.
It will not take too long for the environmentalists to have us banned from these regions if we are not going to be more careful.
The worst of all is that we bring the proof  back and post it on U Tube :xxbah:




Whilst I agree to some extent, I would like to propose doing this a bit more scientifically. Taking a photo of places like that big dune soon after the guys went up it, asking some enviro students to measure the damage and then going back in 6 months and again a year later to assess just how quickly the environment forgets we were even there.

Of course there are some places like the lichen beds in Namibia that carry their scars for centuries, but I have personally seen places in the Richetersveld where even after making a meal of some tracks, it was hard to see we'd even been there a few months later.

Anecdotal and alarmist "proof" does more damage to our reputation and can never be countered. Enviro groups are going to have a go no matter what. Rally is by its very nature not very green. Having some proper data to refute the more rabid opinions of those who want to shut the sport no matter what we do. Just the mere fact that we are scientifically measuring our impact would be a huge positive for the sport. But, even if we only used sun/wind replenished batteries with high floatation soft tires and speed limits of under 40kph, they'd still be up in arms.

And I agree with you, Andrew. We both know that the eco-fascists run an emotion-based campaign. Regrettably, science has little to do with it.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 28, 2016, 06:27:06 pm
One where the competitor's track-log is overlaid on the "ideal" track, and penalties are applied for deviations beyond a certain tolerance. This should be for the whole track and not just the waypoints. Existing tracks off the correct track could be included so that wrong turnings only incur their own time penalty. There must be some mathematical way of doing this so that it's the same for everyone, and is never subjective.

Hmm, penalties for riding off-piste when the route is not off-piste?
It would be interesting to code, but not impossible.
We could call it Crossed Up Piste Off penalties.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: seankriel on March 29, 2016, 07:57:54 am
I saw in one of the videos there was no countdown at the SS start? Was this just a bad observation or ?

Nope Bluebull, I did not do a finger countdown, your observation is right. I had the usual start time list for all riders and with the bikes arriving from bivouac in a motorcade, the start line up was in start time/number order.(Renette was assisting with line up before the riders entered SS stamping zone). This gave me a minute to release each batch after calling them to the start position; checking goggles/GPS/roadbook/bike/neckbrace/tracker/spirit/wishing well and my usual smile away before letting them go. I had 01:17 to dispatch 68 riders on day 1.... any further delays meant some might be stuck after dark and we wanted to avoid that at all cost.
Any rider that missed his spot - I wrote down his actual time on the list. On day one there was only one such case.

With longer uncontrolled liaisons, riders are suppose to know their start time and be ready 2 minutes before entering SS stamping zone. The actual start times are on the stamp card. We trailed this without the stamp cards as VERY few rider actually look at this card and only 5% takes out the card and hand it to the start marshal which then has to fill in check that all good and then count them off.

I think for the BAJA the start list vs stamp card worked perfect - but for the Amageza later in the year the stamp card will be better! Normally Start times are 2 minutes apart vs one minute on the Baja.

I hope this answered your question??


Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 29, 2016, 08:02:06 am
my 2 cents, when kevin and i made our way back to the end of the race on day 2 we were the last guys back and the wind had picked up i was surprised to see how quickly the wind covered the tracks in the sand and at one stage you could not tell that anyone had been there. then again we got so f£$king lost maybe no one had been there hahaha
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 29, 2016, 09:35:56 am
Interesting, two riders say that manual timecards are a schlep and not having them was an improvement, and one marshall saying that having them has advantages.

We have used manual timing cards twice. the first time we printed them on normal paper, and that was a flop. They were just too flimsy.
Second time around we printed them on 3"x 5" index cards, and that worked better.

The advantage of the cards is that it is a manual backup to the GPS logs. In Baja, we relied on the marshalls writing down SSStart and SSSend times, and sending them to me. It worked perfectly, and I was able to score riders whose GPSs had failed.
 
The real advantage of the manual timing cards is that they are a perfect record of whether a rider has arrived at the bivvy, what their status is (DNF/WD etc), and by implication whether or not they are still out there and need recovering. At Amageza we were anal about getting the timecards back to me at the end of each day, and it worked brilliantly.
They are a huge schlep to print, and a pain to fill in, but I think we may well have them at Amageza again.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 29, 2016, 10:01:27 am
The way the Baja was started and controlled with the "convoy" start and cutoff times worked well and timecards were redundant in my opinion.

In the Amageza where long liaisons can result in riders not arriving at SS start in perfect marching order for various reasons and the days are much longer with riders possible out there all night timecards make sense.

The only time they are a schlep is when you start and end the special and you do not have a convenient place to store the card with easy access.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: seankriel on March 29, 2016, 12:25:50 pm
Interesting, two riders say that manual timecards are a schlep and not having them was an improvement, and one marshall saying that having them has advantages.

We have used manual timing cards twice. the first time we printed them on normal paper, and that was a flop. They were just too flimsy.
Second time around we printed them on 3"x 5" index cards, and that worked better.

The advantage of the cards is that it is a manual backup to the GPS logs. In Baja, we relied on the marshalls writing down SSStart and SSSend times, and sending them to me. It worked perfectly, and I was able to score riders whose GPSs had failed.
 
The real advantage of the manual timing cards is that they are a perfect record of whether a rider has arrived at the bivvy, what their status is (DNF/WD etc), and by implication whether or not they are still out there and need recovering. At Amageza we were anal about getting the timecards back to me at the end of each day, and it worked brilliantly.
They are a huge schlep to print, and a pain to fill in, but I think we may well have them at Amageza again.
The way the Baja was started and controlled with the "convoy" start and cutoff times worked well and timecards were redundant in my opinion.

In the Amageza where long liaisons can result in riders not arriving at SS start in perfect marching order for various reasons and the days are much longer with riders possible out there all night timecards make sense.

The only time they are a schlep is when you start and end the special and you do not have a convenient place to store the card with easy access.

Thanks Steve - Thanks Geelkat - this made me think.....

How about using something similar to the RaceTec tag?? I know it's another cost..... but!!! These things are super! If we have a screener at Start; somewhere on the route; at the end as well as the bivouac.... on the person - then we can always know, when tracker has failed if the rider started, got to the middle point, got to the end and got to the bivouac....??

What do you think?? This will give time of point always!! Steve?

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 29, 2016, 12:28:53 pm
Thanks Steve - Thanks Geelkat - this made me think.....

How about using something similar to the RaceTec tag?? I know it's another cost..... but!!! These things are super! If we have a screener at Start; somewhere on the route; at the end as well as the bivouac.... on the person - then we can always know, when tracker has failed if the rider started, got to the middle point, got to the end and got to the bivouac....??

What do you think?? This will give time of point always!! Steve?



 :thumleft: and I do not think the additional cost will be excessive in the bigger scheme of things.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 29, 2016, 12:31:00 pm
???
The tulip number and the waypoint number on the GPS were the same, and each tulip for which you had a GPS waypoint was indicated with a WPE.
At least that was the plan, did I get it wrong?!

Never needed the WP's but did spot check and from what I can see the tulip numbers are part of the waypoint numbers.

One part which could be a touch confusing is the fact that we shared part of the routes and also crossed but it would still have been possible to get home safely in an emergency.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: EtienneXplore on March 29, 2016, 01:52:06 pm
Maybe I am talking nonsense here, but won't a simple hand held bar-code scanner work? You just stick a little bar-code sticker on the rider and the bike and scan them, this will record a number of data points....

 ???

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: seankriel on March 29, 2016, 02:40:23 pm
Maybe I am talking nonsense here, but won't a simple hand held bar-code scanner work? You just stick a little bar-code sticker on the rider and the bike and scan them, this will record a number of data points....

 ???



KnopKop, I was thinking of that as well.... more to the label on the person/helmet.... I don't really care for the bike so much as for the rider (a bike can get home without rider and that means we would not go look for him) lol ....  I know after 15 hours or more in the field no rider wants to hand in a little paper he can hardly take out of his pocket - plus the delay etc.... a scanner or so would work much better.... just having 5 scan points to scan throughout a day could become a bit tricky.... most important would be leaving bivouac, SS Start, SS end, enter new Bivouac... one at cross roads? maybe - I was thinking more of a remote system than a manual one? Just in case someone like me would forget to scan.... lol....  uploading to Steve could also be done in a few seconds..... anyone have a idea?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: EtienneXplore on March 29, 2016, 02:58:09 pm
Maybe I am talking nonsense here, but won't a simple hand held bar-code scanner work? You just stick a little bar-code sticker on the rider and the bike and scan them, this will record a number of data points....

 ???



KnopKop, I was thinking of that as well.... more to the label on the person/helmet.... I don't really care for the bike so much as for the rider (a bike can get home without rider and that means we would not go look for him) lol ....  I know after 15 hours or more in the field no rider wants to hand in a little paper he can hardly take out of his pocket - plus the delay etc.... a scanner or so would work much better.... just having 5 scan points to scan throughout a day could become a bit tricky.... most important would be leaving bivouac, SS Start, SS end, enter new Bivouac... one at cross roads? maybe - I was thinking more of a remote system than a manual one? Just in case someone like me would forget to scan.... lol....  uploading to Steve could also be done in a few seconds..... anyone have a idea?

Surely someone can develop a small app where you (the marshal) can scan the rider with a smartphone, and this data can then be immediately uploaded to a central database kind of thing where the guys at HQ can access the info in real time. Yes I know that data connectivity may well be a problem, but these things can work via sms as well, we used a similar technology here in Zambia to sell mobile airtime, all that is needed is a cellphone signal to basically send an sms, no data connection is needed. We used the bar-code scanning with a cellphone extensively in Qatar, also in the scratch card distribution industry, it was used to track machines and keep up to date on what is happening in 1000's of retailers scatted all over the place. Sorry, a little off topic here, but I am sure this type of thing exists out there somewhere.



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: seankriel on March 29, 2016, 03:08:17 pm
Maybe I am talking nonsense here, but won't a simple hand held bar-code scanner work? You just stick a little bar-code sticker on the rider and the bike and scan them, this will record a number of data points....

 ???



KnopKop, I was thinking of that as well.... more to the label on the person/helmet.... I don't really care for the bike so much as for the rider (a bike can get home without rider and that means we would not go look for him) lol ....  I know after 15 hours or more in the field no rider wants to hand in a little paper he can hardly take out of his pocket - plus the delay etc.... a scanner or so would work much better.... just having 5 scan points to scan throughout a day could become a bit tricky.... most important would be leaving bivouac, SS Start, SS end, enter new Bivouac... one at cross roads? maybe - I was thinking more of a remote system than a manual one? Just in case someone like me would forget to scan.... lol....  uploading to Steve could also be done in a few seconds..... anyone have a idea?

Surely someone can develop a small app where you (the marshal) can scan the rider with a smartphone, and this data can then be immediately uploaded to a central database kind of thing where the guys at HQ can access the info in real time. Yes I know that data connectivity may well be a problem, but these things can work via sms as well, we used a similar technology here in Zambia to sell mobile airtime, all that is needed is a cellphone signal to basically send an sms, no data connection is needed. We used the bar-code scanning with a cellphone extensively in Qatar, also in the scratch card distribution industry, it was used to track machines and keep up to date on what is happening in 1000's of retailers scatted all over the place. Sorry, a little off topic here, but I am sure this type of thing exists out there somewhere.






See - NOW you talking..... lol!! Thanks!! I will investigate...... STEVE STEVE kom in!! What ya think???
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 29, 2016, 03:12:13 pm
KnopKop, I was thinking of that as well.... more to the label on the person/helmet.... I don't really care for the bike so much as for the rider (a bike can get home without rider and that means we would not go look for him) lol ....  I know after 15 hours or more in the field no rider wants to hand in a little paper he can hardly take out of his pocket - plus the delay etc.... a scanner or so would work much better.... just having 5 scan points to scan throughout a day could become a bit tricky.... most important would be leaving bivouac, SS Start, SS end, enter new Bivouac... one at cross roads? maybe - I was thinking more of a remote system than a manual one? Just in case someone like me would forget to scan.... lol....  uploading to Steve could also be done in a few seconds..... anyone have a idea?

Uploading to Steve, that's funny.
I think we may be onto something here.
http://www.specialstage.com/forums/showthread.php?37553-Active-RFID-Control-Timing-System (http://www.specialstage.com/forums/showthread.php?37553-Active-RFID-Control-Timing-System) discusses something very similar, but at $1000 per checkpoint that is eina.

A major factor is the lack of connectivity. The millibits-per-minute speeds that we get have bitten us many, many times, so any solution would have to be buffered, with Upload-to-Steve happening when connectivity is restored.

I think Dakar used RFID tags that look like wristbands?
Interesting.......
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 29, 2016, 03:16:44 pm
The size of the uploads should be very small, it should be possible to transfer via satellite phone if need be where there is no mobile phone signal.

Either RFID or a simple barcode can work, you need rider number and date/time stamp, very little data.

$1000.00 per checkpoint seems expensive, it should be possible to do something cheaper.

What about using SPOT?

Every rider has one, it uses satellite and can send messages...

I used mine at times to let my wife know I am still sort of OK, even if it was not always technically true...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 29, 2016, 04:22:33 pm
Ok, I'll drop a bit of info about what's happening at the Rockfox lab.

History:
We were looking at safety items for rally's right from our early involvement.  This (safety) is actually a problem for all rally's except Dakar due to resources.  Dakar use Unik-2 and Sentinel to cover most (all) bases.  Other rallies use standard GSM (temp Cell towers in Europe) or the newly developed Rally Comp. Let us ignore Dakar for a moment.  All other rally orgs battle with two basic controls during a rally. 1) rider feedback for scoring and 2) safety.  Rally Comp, Etrex 10 and Spot address the rider scoring requirement.  The safety is currently not as high on the list.  :pot:  I strongly believe in the 'golden hour' for recovery.  All over the world this is a challenge.

Today:
Based on rider feedback (and simple economics) we need to look at safer rallying.  I watched quite a few video's, even simple things like overtaking can be dangerous.  If 4 wheeler's are included the risk is even bigger. (It is not really feasible to let each type run on its own route)

Future:
We started a project where a small unit (similar to the Sentinel) could be mounted on every vehicle.  Unlike Dakar the feeling is that even bikes must have a 'PTP' (Push To Pass) button to warn the Twats.  The final unit will have a 100m radio for overtake warning, an accelerometer with 'distress siren' to warn all riders in a 100m radius that the road might be obstructed. A second button can be pressed by 'FPOS' (First Person On Scene) as warning to other riders.  the final update will include a Satellite modem to send info to Race Org.  The FPOS/SOS/Recover options are already available on the Spot but will be a bit more powerful and versatile. The final component will be satellite modem to transmit info (one way) to the org.

Just thinking  :laughing4:
To include a 'racecard' option where a tablet 'talk' to the bike at the checkpoint will be just a few lines of code.  This list of 'actual' riders can then be sent via the satellite modem to the Org as well as the next checkpoint.  

Now, we are looking for a name for this creation. Guard, GuardIt, Pro-Tect
Ok, me thinks we will go with 'Pro-Tect'

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 29, 2016, 05:33:34 pm
Ok this all sound wonderful but you lost me somewhere i feel like am back in the desert haha
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 29, 2016, 05:49:46 pm
Now, we are looking for a name for this creation. Guard, GuardIt, Pro-Tect
Ok, me thinks we will go with 'Pro-Tect'

Adie

Guardian Angel?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: zebra - Flying Brick on March 29, 2016, 06:01:27 pm
Maybe I am talking nonsense here, but won't a simple hand held bar-code scanner work? You just stick a little bar-code sticker on the rider and the bike and scan them, this will record a number of data points....
 ???
I raced Surf-Ski's for 10 years, semi-competitively, and we were bar-code scanned in at GROUP starts, and then scanned in at the INDIVIDUAL finish...

It worked VERY well, basic results (there were very few 'penalties' in surf-skiing - since it took 30 minutes to reach a turn-bouy - we made f@cking sure we went AROUND it...!) wer ethen more-or-less immediately available, in our case we got a waterproof sticker to attach to the boat, and another one to the paddle, it really worked very well.

Just my 5c.

It was also used in multiple-point racing, such as the Cape Point CHallenge, where half-way around the Point you had to beach, run around a pole, compulsory 5 minute safety stop, etc, and we were scanned IN to the beach, and then OUT of the beach, etc...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: gser on March 29, 2016, 06:26:45 pm
It's good to hear a lot of positive comments !
We thoroughly enjoyed the race ! although it was from a marshaling viewpoint.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 29, 2016, 07:56:05 pm
Hi Guys you must read the lekker Baja RR by GG on his Blog called THE g-Spot .

He has a RR under Ride Reports but it is much more enjoyable reading it on his Blog :

http://www.ggalcock.co.za/2016/the-race-of-halfmensbome-malmokkies-malmense/ (http://www.ggalcock.co.za/2016/the-race-of-halfmensbome-malmokkies-malmense/)


http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190185.0 (http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190185.0) ( but rather read the Blog )

GG I love this part , it makes me feel like riding !~ :ricky:

"Vertical climbs test our climbing ability and worse on the other side dizzying descents consisting of loose marbles of stone wash away our front tyres. Gavin flies over his handlebars, smashing his peak, he remembers suddenly as he shakes his head to clear it that he should film this. The video is like a rocky vertigo inducing extreme game.  I crash twice once bending my rear brake so I can’t reach it, the same one I need so desperately to control my slipping sliding fall down the cliff face Alex has chosen as a track.   Never has such beauty and such harshness combined to test my endurance.  I stop, take pictures, the raw savage beauty is breath-taking, it fills my senses, it surrounds me in 360 degree splendour, I savour it fearing though the next corner, the next climb, the rocks trying to rip me and my KTM to shreds"

He has some good photos too, like the one below of the mountain trail.  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 29, 2016, 08:01:25 pm
......
What about using SPOT?

Every rider has one, it uses satellite and can send messages...

I used mine at times to let my wife know I am still sort of OK, even if it was not always technically true...



 :imaposer: 
hehe that made me laugh GK , your wife was the last to know about your tumble even though she was at the event , you are such a gentleman.  
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 29, 2016, 08:17:38 pm
......
What about using SPOT?

Every rider has one, it uses satellite and can send messages...

I used mine at times to let my wife know I am still sort of OK, even if it was not always technically true...



 :imaposer: 
hehe that made me laugh GK , your wife was the last to know about your tumble even though she was at the event , you are such a gentleman.  

 :imaposer: you joke but is is also important.

There is no point in informing people who will only worry but can do nothing at the time.

in order of importance of notification:
- Recovery crew
- Medics (if not part of the recovery crew)
- Curios people who want to know about "events" but do not really care all that much
- People who care but can do nothing to solve the problem at the time, in most cases family

Please read some of this tongue in cheek and some seriously ;)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 29, 2016, 08:31:53 pm
GG awesome words bud gave me goosies, makes me want to do it again.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 29, 2016, 08:35:07 pm
......
What about using SPOT?

Every rider has one, it uses satellite and can send messages...

I used mine at times to let my wife know I am still sort of OK, even if it was not always technically true...



 :imaposer: 
hehe that made me laugh GK , your wife was the last to know about your tumble even though she was at the event , you are such a gentleman.  

 :imaposer: you joke but is is also important.

There is no point in informing people who will only worry but can do nothing at the time.

in order of importance of notification:
- Recovery crew
- Medics (if not part of the recovery crew)
- Curios people who want to know about "events" but do not really care all that much
- People who care but can do nothing to solve the problem at the time, in most cases family

Please read some of this tongue in cheek and some seriously ;)

Yes . Agreed. I laughed because it is so true . My mom still to this day doesn't know about some of my accidents . :biggrin:

But yes it is tricky .  That is the part I like least about marshalling, the time lapse between a SOS and finding the rider .
I still shudder when I think of 2013 , the delay in finding the guys, at least now with the trackers we know where the riders are when the SOS goes off , but yes good to keep it under wraps till we know what the real situation is .  :thumleft:


 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on March 29, 2016, 08:38:52 pm
I keep forgetting to post this. thanks again for an awesome event and allowing us to help others
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 29, 2016, 08:39:45 pm
I keep forgetting to post this. thanks again for an awesome event and allowing us to help others

Awesome Ash  :thumleft:

What is your target to raise for Amageza?

 :pot:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 29, 2016, 09:31:46 pm
There are some really good ideas in this thread, many of them linked to one another :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:

Sean: Thanks you answered my question very well. I asked because as a rider I am never prepared to leave, and the 30 seconds 20s 10s and 5,4,3,2,1 helped me a lot to get into my groove.  ::)  I suppose its no biggie really, but I will tell you that if you get pro international riders in, they will all too soon be whining about the 15-45 s differences by not counting down to the applicable minute/half minute. Imagine the race comes down to a minute or two difference between the front runners after 6-7 stages? Would it be fair or unfair on riders if the times on the cards are not accurate? If you look at Dakar footage you will see that especially for the front 30 guys there is quite flurry at the finish as the officials get the right times on the cards for groups of riders coming in. The way they do this is use a laser beam which clocks the times which are then written into the cards of the guys coming in the order of their arrival. At the start,  I think you and Rynette must have been like a well oiled machine after little while so would not think it be too difficult for her to write the times with you knowing it is at the top of that minute that you send the next group away? This should not delay anything really. Maybe I beating a dead horse but thought I would put it out there for consideration.  BTW it is so awesome to see your spirit and comradeship at the start.  :thumleft: The guys might not have said anything to you but they would have really appreciated your kind words and friendly pats on the shoulders. Actually this goes for most of the officials.

Steve: AFAIK the Dakar and many other rallies still use manual time cards because they can be written on and are an excellent record...especially when there is a rider protest or an issue when the electronic systems go down. We all know that the iritrack is dubious at best and this is the worlds biggest rally! The wristbands with electronics were used for bivouac access to stop guys like me were faking wristbands in 2012 and sneaking into Dakar bivoaucs as VIP's when we actually weren't allowed to! ;D The little chips they use in extreme enduros like Ertzberg and Romaniacs are great but all they do is clock a rider number through, and not for timing purposes. Sometimes these "clockers" fail too - ask Graham Jarvis! ;D

I would suggest you stick with the manual time cards rather than readers etc, because they are fail-safe like paper road books, if you lose yours, its a 2 hour penalty, and if the guys dont stop at a PC like a major road crossing (where they must stop and be stamped to show they have stopped) they can be nailed and the proof is (not) there stamped on the card, easy to see...no black box and easy to manage by the PCO. Or if a rider has an altercation with an official or does something dangerous say at the ASS (these things hopefully wont happen on the Amageza, but they do happen from time to time elsewhere!) , the official can easily make a remark or correction on any card for when the rider arrives at the bivvy. I say keep it manual and empower your officials going Amageza in the sun... :peepwall:


Crossed up:
I also noticed the guys riding off course in the pics and agree to a point, but to be fair most of the pics of the tracks everywhere seemed to be  at that big dune (I think)? The idea of tightening the tracking will slow down the rally tremendously which -to me- would be counterproductive to the idea of racing. I am fully behind Andrew's comments as well BTW. Perhaps a happy medium can be made, because the biggest issues are normally at forks, where guys cross the shortcut through the bush. This could be reduced by having a 10m diameter bubble off the centerline provided it does not apply in areas where there are pans or other HP sections. Better still would be to include a note in the Road books in zones of environmentally sensitive areas are where guys going off the track in those areas could be heavily penalized against a smaller bubble.  This has been used by the ASO on their rallies in the past in selected sensitive areas, some parks etc. Also what happens on the HP (off piste) sections? This would surely not be practical as I might ride a different part of the same riverbed with no impact on the environment to speak of. Hopefully there will be lots of HP in the Amageza (Alexander plse take note :deal).  

Adie/organizers: I must say Adie your contribution to this sport in RSA is totally awesome - thank you! :notworthy:
One small issue with the use of an automatic proximity alarm: Every time anyone is near to anyone else you would have the damn alarm going off. Not great when you are riding in a group. I would suggest there be an option for a rider to warn a guy manually in front by pushing a button if he really needs to. The dangers associated with passing cannot be replaced by something like this, but it would help when a side-by-side needs to pass or be passed for example. (Having said that I saw in some of the video footage that those guys were fantastic in pulling over when they heard a bike behind them).

Then there is the case of a bike being down behind a dune or something out of sight, the rider has the option to manually activate/deactivate a 100m "chime" bubble if he is worried about someone running over him.  Maybe have two different sounds for each case. Having raced with cars and trucks in the past, I can tell you its a very shit thing to have your sentinel alarm go off and think there is a 10t monster bearing down on you, risk your neck riding into the bushes to get out of the way, only to find its not a truck but some guy in the track ahead of you. The vice versa case is even worse.

But consider the safety aspect if, knowing you have taken the wrong track and are back tracking the course to find the right track, you can activate the signal, warning the next guy coming along from riding head on into you at race pace. This I think would be a brilliant feature that could save lives. It would also save the environment, because if I realize I am wrong and have to back track, there is no way I will be riding in the track for fear of someone like Andrew or Peter (if i were so lucky to be in front of them  :P ) coming along at race pace, not at all expecting anyone to be coming back into the opposite direction. We saw this happen on the Baja a couple of times when a couple of guys went the wrong way into the loop...thank goodness it was in a technical section. In this case I would always take the penalty rather than have a head on, but with a "safety bubble" around me I would be more confident to correct my error by back tracking on the course.

Geel Kat: The spot is a great tool but sometimes they fail too. Must admit it would be great to be able to text a word or two anyway to followers, family, supporters and organization; I just don't think they should replace the manual time card advantages discussed above.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 29, 2016, 11:15:36 pm
Wise words, as usual.
I didn't know the Dakar RFID wristbands were for bivvy access. I may have a business idea regarding the cloning and selling of wristbands......  >:D
In the meantime, I will get printing on the Amageza 2016 manual timecards. As you say, paper doesn't fail, for roadbooks, timecards and, hopefully, toilets.  :pottytrain5:

Watch the Baja website tomorrow   :lamer:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 29, 2016, 11:34:16 pm
:thumleft: Steve re toilets: you should have seen the riders on the Dakar. Get to the DSS early. Ride 1km into the desert past the crowds at race pace.. Yank down pants really fast and take a tactical dump. Baby swipe, baby oil and baby powder, pants up lets go, before the photographers get there!

There is even a photo of Cyril Despres in the Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon position on the internet waves somewhere. :laughing7:

Also on liaisons. We used to chase competitors and ride with them. So you're riding along, following the competitors on a liaison in the middle of nowhere. As you go past some big boulders moved by the construction you almost lose it as the guy in front of you ducks off towards them...You start to follow and then you realize "Oh, shit"..I mean "Oh he's taking a shit"

:imaposer:

Unless you are one of the 1st guys in the bivouac, the Dakar toilets were totally MANK. :puke:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 29, 2016, 11:56:28 pm
There are some really good ideas in this thread, many of them linked to one another :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:

Adie/organizers: I must say Adie your contribution to this sport in RSA is totally awesome - thank you! :notworthy:
One small issue with the use of an automatic proximity alarm: Every time anyone is near to anyone else you would have the damn alarm going off.

Hi BB
No, the basic functionality is along the same lines as the Sentinel. At this stage we are gathering info on functionality etc. etc.

1. Press button to indicate intention to pass. Alarm on competitors within a pre-determined range vehicle will go off.  As far as I remember sentinel is 200m.  There are still a lot of detail to sort out like must the alarm be stopped or sound for a few seconds.  The Sentinel 'blare' at 100dB.  As the unit is not directional even riders behind will get the signal.  We did a few tests and think the radius could be down to 60meters but st that distance the dust from a Twat or SbyS could already be blinding/dangerous.  Also, just looking at stats the PtP button might not be that much of a distraction as it will (should) only be used for 'safer passing'.   Will there be racers that will misuse the system to gain an advantage (momentarily unsettle) on a rider in front (just to get out of the dust) ?. I think so, but there are nothing one can do about that minority.  The safety of the majority is the aim.  Also, looking at an average of 70 riders in the event, how many times will the PtP button be pressed before the spread of fast to slow is 'normalized'. At the start of the stage it will be hectic as the riders start in 2x2min groups.  After 20 odd km everything settle and overtaking is much less but this is where the concentration is lower (tired) and accidents happens more frequently.

2. The acceleromiter will kick in at a predetermined G. (I am still looking for someone to test fall  :laughing4: so we can get some reference.  The 'accident' alarm will sound different form the overtake one.  This option could also be manually activated if stuck on the 'other side' of the dune. Seen quite a few of those accidents in Dakar over the years.

A lot of detail still need to be sorted like duration of alarm, warning radius etc etc.  We plan a micro 'stick on' button for the bikes to make the PtP more accessible and less restrictive to use.

3. The satellite modem. This part is probably the most expensive (and tricky) part of the unit.  We will basically use the same GPS and Modem as in the Spot tracker as it already gone through ICASA registration.  The cost per SMS is unfortunately much higher than the Spot. (don't ask me why) so it will not be feasible to replace the Spot.  Messages to Ops etc will thus be emergency only and we do not see it as a replacement of the Spot for tracking.  It will just be possible to select a more specific message from a list.

4. We do not propose replacing the paper Time cards (I am a firm believer in 'paperwork')  It just came apparent that the system can log the rider passing a (manned) CP and pass that info to Org for better control.  Currently (again) a person must use a paper to record the riders, this is then manually correlated against the starting grid.  Due to lack of GSM signal the next CP must wait semi blind as they do not know 'who what where'.  Due to the 'loop' layout of WC Baja the Org could fly the route without to much issues and 'kyk na die laat lammers'.  This is gonna be a totally different issue if the route is not/less loopy.  Again it is more of a safety issue than control.

Lastly, at this stage this project is not 'underwritten' by the Amageza Org.  It is just something that is very close to my heart and with the Dakar qualifier status, 4 wheelers etc quite a few things will have to be considered.  (That also inspired the Rally Comp etc etc.)

******* MODS, MAYBE THIS MUST BECOME A NEW STICKY THREAD UNDER RACING *****

Kamanya, sorry for the hijack.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Malibu on March 30, 2016, 08:13:33 am
Marks pics...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Malibu on March 30, 2016, 08:20:14 am
nog...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Malibu on March 30, 2016, 08:23:21 am
more...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Malibu on March 30, 2016, 08:25:09 am
and...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 30, 2016, 09:29:54 am
2. The acceleromiter will kick in at a predetermined G. (I am still looking for someone to test fall  :laughing4: so we can get some reference.  The 'accident' alarm will sound different form the overtake one.  This option could also be manually activated if stuck on the 'other side' of the dune. Seen quite a few of those accidents in Dakar over the years.


The newest helmet cams measure all sorts of biometric data. A recent video I saw of a motorcross guy just going around a track pegged the max G @ 12.9. That's without crashing. I don't know if the sensor is bike mounted, body or helmet mounted.

https://www.google.co.za/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwiTiJCU8OfLAhVE7RQKHbLjBBQQtwIINTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DnycHV-fWOvk&usg=AFQjCNGesPvaRPm4ePHA8SQ4KMTdu49ieA&sig2=Nwuc_WBRFj7w6ab0fZoPtA (https://www.google.co.za/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwiTiJCU8OfLAhVE7RQKHbLjBBQQtwIINTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DnycHV-fWOvk&usg=AFQjCNGesPvaRPm4ePHA8SQ4KMTdu49ieA&sig2=Nwuc_WBRFj7w6ab0fZoPtA)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: bonova on March 30, 2016, 09:54:34 am
2. The acceleromiter will kick in at a predetermined G. (I am still looking for someone to test fall  :laughing4: so we can get some reference.  The 'accident' alarm will sound different form the overtake one.  This option could also be manually activated if stuck on the 'other side' of the dune. Seen quite a few of those accidents in Dakar over the years.


The newest helmet cams measure all sorts of biometric data. A recent video I saw of a motorcross guy just going around a track pegged the max G @ 12.9. That's without crashing. I don't know if the sensor is bike mounted, body or helmet mounted.

https://www.google.co.za/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwiTiJCU8OfLAhVE7RQKHbLjBBQQtwIINTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DnycHV-fWOvk&usg=AFQjCNGesPvaRPm4ePHA8SQ4KMTdu49ieA&sig2=Nwuc_WBRFj7w6ab0fZoPtA (https://www.google.co.za/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwiTiJCU8OfLAhVE7RQKHbLjBBQQtwIINTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DnycHV-fWOvk&usg=AFQjCNGesPvaRPm4ePHA8SQ4KMTdu49ieA&sig2=Nwuc_WBRFj7w6ab0fZoPtA)

I had a TomTom Helmet cam on when I crashed. It should have had the accelerometer on.... Evidently there is some good footage but I haven't seen it yet. Once it gets to me i'll look into that ;)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 30, 2016, 12:07:55 pm
I had a TomTom Helmet cam on when I crashed. It should have had the accelerometer on.... Evidently there is some good footage but I haven't seen it yet. Once it gets to me i'll look into that ;)

...and post it up for us too.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: JustBendIt on March 30, 2016, 12:16:48 pm
Bonova - shouldn't it be called a "deceleromoter" in your case ?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 30, 2016, 12:32:53 pm
Final results have been posted, in high res detail, per category, per day as requested.
Not much changed, but a few people with GPS issues should be happier now.

http://www.amageza.com/# (http://www.amageza.com/#)!blank-1/odxej
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 30, 2016, 12:47:33 pm
Final results have been posted, in high res detail, per category, per day as requested.
Not much changed, but a few people with GPS issues should be happier now.

http://www.amageza.com/# (http://www.amageza.com/#)!blank-1/odxej

I've always thought that speeding penalties should be a hefty part of the navigation and rightly so - It's a tough thing to do to have the discipline not to speed and to sit right on the edge for any length of time. But I am curious as to why a stop penalty is 10 minutes and 2 speeding is only 33 seconds as in G Mortons case? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Gavin on March 30, 2016, 01:52:49 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: bud500 on March 30, 2016, 02:00:37 pm
can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

That can't be right.  ???
Not a race in the world where that would stand.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 30, 2016, 02:38:16 pm
can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

That can't be right.  ???
Not a race in the world where that would stand.

I can not comment on anything other than they were in the 'Lite' GPS class and apparently that can happen.  They only did the Mountain loop in reverse.  The interesting thing is that they actually did it in the more technical direction I was told.

A
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 30, 2016, 02:43:57 pm
I've always thought that speeding penalties should be a hefty part of the navigation and rightly so - It's a tough thing to do to have the discipline not to speed and to sit right on the edge for any length of time. But I am curious as to why a stop penalty is 10 minutes and 2 speeding is only 33 seconds as in G Mortons case? Shouldn't it be the other way around?

Fair enough.
The algorithm for penalising speeding was new for this event. We compute the time saved by speeding, multiply that by a factor, and apply the result as a penalty. The reasoning behind that a rider entering a speeding zone too fast, but immediately slowing down, would be penalised a small time, whereas a rider that stayed at high speed through the zone would be penalised more heavily.
We ran lots and lots and lots of test data through the system to check the algorithm, and it works. I was suprised how small the resultant penalties were.
The count is then the number of transgressions, but each transgression can result in a penalty as low as a few seconds.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 30, 2016, 02:48:21 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Each of those (four) riders was penalised 30 minutes.
They were all lite riders, so it would have been pretty difficult to see which was the right way when the track split. However, they continued after they found out they were wrong, hense the penalty.
It cost one of them a free Amageza entry.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Gavin on March 30, 2016, 03:11:57 pm
Be it as it may , I think it will cost Amageza a few  entries too .
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Buff on March 30, 2016, 03:14:45 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Each of those (four) riders was penalised 30 minutes.
They were all lite riders, so it would have been pretty difficult to see which was the right way when the track split. However, they continued after they found out they were wrong, hense the penalty.
It cost one of them a free Amageza entry.

Said rider could also have been a total twatwaffle about the issue because it wasn't only his/their fault but instead he's still singing the races praises and recons it's one of the best routes ever. I think it says a lot about his character.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 30, 2016, 03:42:27 pm
Be it as it may , I think it will cost Amageza a few  entries too .

I doubt that as Amageza do not have a 'Lite- GPS only' class, only roadbooks.

BUT, I must say those three (?) musketeers 'was hoogs de moer in' at the DSP. Me thinks you could light a match just holding it close to the helmet. >:D

Again, the general feeling (and appreciation) for the effort to include the Lite class was positive. 

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: GJ on March 30, 2016, 04:03:16 pm
 :biggrin:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: AlexRG on March 30, 2016, 06:45:18 pm
Final results have been posted, in high res detail, per category, per day as requested.
Not much changed, but a few people with GPS issues should be happier now.

http://www.amageza.com/# (http://www.amageza.com/#)!blank-1/odxej

Hi Steve,

Should the quads and side x side not be separate? We did not compete against them.

There's at least two quads in the Restricted Rallye class that should not be mingled with the bikes, and a side x side in the Open Rallye class?

The 200 and 300 race numbers. They can be in the overall results but not mingled with the bike specific results.

Alex
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 30, 2016, 07:28:42 pm
There are some sensitive guys here, hey? ;D

can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

That can't be right.  ???
Not a race in the world where that would stand.

Actually stranger things have happened in the Dakar where a lot more is at stake - like the $100k needed to get there in the first place. The ORGA made a decision, where they admit they were partly responsible in that no one considered some guys would see the wrong WP first. Its not a democracy. Thats what you signed in the indemnity.

I do think that maybe the speeding penalties were a bit light. Nothing worse than having some guy come past you in a speed control zone and get away with a small penalty while you lose precious time strictly observing the DZ´s.

Wel,ek gaan nou 2keer dink voor ek amageza ry >:(

Ag kom moenie word die moer in nie chjom  :3some: I need my two riding partners at the Amageza. :deal:

You were not DQ'd which is what I thought was going to happen. I'm betting if you had ridden with with road book (like you should have), I'm sure you would have gone the right way?

:peepwall:


Anyway, I think if anything these kind of issues is what makes rally raid harder than a typical offroad. There is always the unknown knowns to put a spanner in the works ;D
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: markdiver on March 30, 2016, 07:39:51 pm
I've always thought that speeding penalties should be a hefty part of the navigation and rightly so - It's a tough thing to do to have the discipline not to speed and to sit right on the edge for any length of time. But I am curious as to why a stop penalty is 10 minutes and 2 speeding is only 33 seconds as in G Mortons case? Shouldn't it be the other way around?

Fair enough.
The algorithm for penalising speeding was new for this event. We compute the time saved by speeding, multiply that by a factor, and apply the result as a penalty. The reasoning behind that a rider entering a speeding zone too fast, but immediately slowing down, would be penalised a small time, whereas a rider that stayed at high speed through the zone would be penalised more heavily.
We ran lots and lots and lots of test data through the system to check the algorithm, and it works. I was suprised how small the resultant penalties were.
The count is then the number of transgressions, but each transgression can result in a penalty as low as a few seconds.

I can't agree with this Steve my bud, in my opinion a speed zone starts at an allocated point and should carry a hefty penalty if contravened.  My reason for saying this is for 2 reasons.
1.  On any rally in the world, including Dakar, my point above, this is how it is, why do we want to change that?
2.  Secondly is what I have personal experience on in Amageza 2015.  Whilst racing for position, it took me at least 2 hours before I was able to pass a fellow competitor (he shall remain anonymous), due to dust and also as we were within each others same range of speed ability.  When however I did get past him, I only opened up a gap of about 100m (he was now eating my dust  ;D) when I came across a speed zone.  I diligently slowed down, but anonymous behind me did not, and so passed me again in the speed zone, and stayed just 50m ahead of me, which was if i can remember about 1.2km long.  When I excited the speed zone, I had to eat his dust again for a further hour, and this time was not able to pass due to dusty circumstances until we reached a road section again.
For me, having a 3sec penalty allotted to that person does not do justice. This type of rallying is what this is all about, you follow a RB and all rules, and if don't you get penalized you know you may be making up some places, and that's what keeps it interesting, keeping yourself disciplined, focused and at the same time racing.  
I guess the next question could also be raised, what is deemed to slow down immediately?  50m, 100m, 200m??  Some speed zones are only a couple hundred metres long.
If you really wanted or needed to catch/overtake someone ahead of you, then my tactic would now be to race hard into the speed zones and then only brake hard.  I can assure you this will make a difference.   IMHO of course.  
You time keepers have a tough enough job, why not just keep it simple and how it always has been?  Just saying buddy.   :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 30, 2016, 07:47:39 pm
That's my point as well.

But aside from that Mark, did the guy in front know you were trying to get past? Because the rule of rally is you let someone behind you go through. I have not read the rules but not doing so is considered unsporting in many other rallies and comes with a heavy penalty if someone makes a complaint.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Crossed-up on March 30, 2016, 08:19:09 pm
Speed zones are there for a reason - usually safety or not to upset the locals or both. Considering the danger to the rider, the public, its property and the future of rallying in general, the penalties should be heavy.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: markdiver on March 30, 2016, 08:19:17 pm
That's my point as well.

But aside from that Mark, did the guy in front know you were trying to get past? Because the rule of rally is you let someone behind you go through. I have not read the rules but not doing so is considered unsporting in many other rallies and comes with a heavy penalty if someone makes a complaint.

Actually I am not entirely with this rule to be honest.  If you racing someone, and in my case we were racing each other, he should not have to give way to me.  You know how it goes even with regular riding buddies, one day you faster than your mate and the next he is faster than you.  A sentinel system on the bike to warn for heavy motor car or truck coming through is a good thing, but for another biker I am not so sure, keeping in mind that if he started behind you, there was a reason for it, either he is generally slower, or he was penalized the previous day.  So in that case, let him have to work hard to get past you.  I am not in favour of having to look over my shoulder for faster bikes.  I ride my line as best and steady as I can, and it is on you to get by me.  Of course there is plenty of times you know who could be there, or you have seen them coming from below the hill, then of course I am letting them through as soon as and as safely as I can.  
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rokie on March 30, 2016, 09:06:50 pm
Loving this thread! Thanks all for the participation and info.
I'm keyboarding this Baja as long as the Dakar . . .  :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 30, 2016, 09:22:01 pm
Steve I am totally with Mark D on this.

A set penalty against a penalty that can be tactically manipulated creates a completly different mindset to speed zones.

It swings the balance in favour of really fast guys who are navigationally not as strong as quick guy who are great at navigation.

Rally is about navigation primarily, otherwise it swings towards enduro.

I get that braking 200m later into a zone attracts your algorithm and that yes, it is not as serious as riding for a few k's into a zone at full speed. But being awake to the roadbook is a massive part of rally and should favour those who can read it.

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: SteveD on March 30, 2016, 09:55:42 pm
Difficult to please everyone, yes, but I never expected it to be this difficult.

We have been bitched at in multiple Amagezas for being too harsh on speeding, and for nailing everybody that goes over the limit regardless for how long they are over the limit. The algorithm was simple, but bliksem people moaned. Points that were raised include that we do not have a system to warn riders of impeding speeding penalties, like they have in Dakar.
So we tried a different algorithm, one that takes away the time advantage gained by speeding, plus some. It follows FIM pretty much exactly regarding slow down zones, speed up zones (there are four different combinations to consider) but differs only in how it computes the magnitude of the penalty. It took a lot of work to implement, and even longer to test.

Riders don't like it.
Fair enough, but I would then ask that you propose an alternate solution/algorithm. I am not saying this in a bitchy "Well see if you can do it better" way, it is a genuine request that you propose something that you consider fair.

The SRs for Baja were as they were, and we can't change them retrospectively, but let's improve before the next event.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 30, 2016, 10:35:59 pm
No neutralised time for stage 2?  I specifically asked at riders briefing as we knew day 1 was only neutralised in Alexander bay not at DSP. THe answer from Alex was that day 2 the DSP was a neutralised zone. So I lost an hour to people whom I passed on the route. This wasn't stated in provisional results then I would've appealed. Sorry for bitching but this doesn't seem right?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 30, 2016, 10:44:48 pm
Steve, I think the problem is that you're just too nice ;D

I reckon you need to get hard-assed, like Etienne Lavigne hard-assed. Maybe even learn and start speaking only in French. Start wearing white shirts and simply dictate. Then we will see the whining really crank up a notch. :laughing7: But it would probably make the Amageza more popular. You know what they say, there is not such thing as bad publicity!

I have not looked at an Amageza roadbook recently, but surely the the speed control zones look something like this?

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/Hino_Team_Sugawara_road_book_2013_Tokyo_Motor_Show.jpg)

Surely this is enough?

IOW between 117.33 and 118.08 if your gps shows over 50kmhr, you will be penalized for speeding. So as a rider you need to make sure you have slowed down to 50 at least 50-100m before 117.33 to ensure the gps does not leave a high speed crumb in the DZ.

I dont know how your algorithm works exactly but it should approximate the penalties in the Dakar:

For 1-20km/hr over any limit you get 30" per minute you spend over the limit plus €100 fine
For 21-40km/hr over any limit you get 1' per minute you spend over the limit €200 fine
For 41km/hr+ over any limit you get 5' per minute you spend over the limit €500 fine

Fines being due at the end of the day in cash :eek: Failure to pay means you are not allowed to start the next day.

How does one get around the minutes using GPS crumbs? I don't know but it cant be that hard to work out the average speed of each rider through a zone, surely? Then take the average speed from the crumbs in the zone and work out the time they should have been in the DZ multiplied by the above penalties.

Oh, and maybe change the fine to Rand amounts ;)

There will always be the bitches and moaners and guys threatening to go race somewhere else.  
Good for them - they will be missing out, that's all.

Anyway that's racing: You take the good with the bad. We need to learn to suck it up. I'll default to whatever the organization decides.

Pissies will never be heroes. :paw:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 30, 2016, 11:07:27 pm
No neutralised time for stage 2?  I specifically asked at riders briefing as we knew day 1 was only neutralised in Alexander bay not at DSP. THe answer from Alex was that day 2 the DSP was a neutralised zone. So I lost an hour to people whom I passed on the route. This wasn't stated in provisional results then I would've appealed. Sorry for bitching but this doesn't seem right?

NO, Alexander specifically said at the briefing the DSP 'is your own race time'.  I was also unsure and asked him specifically before our rider arrived at the DSP.  Mike lost about 15 min and 3 to 4 places over and above refueling before the loop and about 10 minutes on return.  At the end of the day it would made no diff in his final position as he was more than that behind the nearest competitor.   

To be honest I think most 450's only needed to refuel once at the DSP if I looked at the level in the tanks when they arrived.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Kamanya on March 30, 2016, 11:15:21 pm
Steve, I think the problem is that you're just too nice ;D ......
 but it should approximate the penalties in the Dakar:

For 1-20km/hr over any limit you get 30" per minute you spend over the limit plus €100 fine
For 21-40km/hr over any limit you get 1' per minute you spend over the limit €200 fine
For 41km/hr+ over any limit you get 5' per minute you spend over the limit €500 fine


Oh, and maybe change the fine to Rand amounts ;)


maybe not the rand fines but certainly the time penalties.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: GraZer on March 31, 2016, 06:08:22 am
There is constant reference to the speeding algorithm that is used to calculate time penalties. Publishing the details of the algorithm would help in better understanding how it works.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Dwerg on March 31, 2016, 06:57:50 am
Ah the joys of racing..... Two days riding followed by two weeks of bitching
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Cracker on March 31, 2016, 07:40:45 am
Difficult to please everyone, yes, but I never expected it to be this difficult.

We have been bitched at in multiple Amagezas for being too harsh on speeding, and for nailing everybody that goes over the limit regardless for how long they are over the limit. The algorithm was simple, but bliksem people moaned. Points that were raised include that we do not have a system to warn riders of impeding speeding penalties, like they have in Dakar.
So we tried a different algorithm, one that takes away the time advantage gained by speeding, plus some. It follows FIM pretty much exactly regarding slow down zones, speed up zones (there are four different combinations to consider) but differs only in how it computes the magnitude of the penalty. It took a lot of work to implement, and even longer to test.

Riders don't like it.
Fair enough, but I would then ask that you propose an alternate solution/algorithm. I am not saying this in a bitchy "Well see if you can do it better" way, it is a genuine request that you propose something that you consider fair.

The SRs for Baja were as they were, and we can't change them retrospectively, but let's improve before the next event.

So you say your algorithm follows FIM regarding slow down zones - that's fine then, don't touch it.

Just multiply the resultant penalty by a decent factor to give you a bigger/harsher penalty - or am I missing something here
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 31, 2016, 08:06:53 am
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on March 31, 2016, 08:16:57 am
Steve, I think the problem is that you're just too nice ;D

I reckon you need to get hard-assed, like Etienne Lavigne hard-assed. Maybe even learn and start speaking only in French. Start wearing white shirts and simply dictate. Then we will see the whining really crank up a notch. :laughing7: But it would probably make the Amageza more popular. You know what they say, there is not such thing as bad publicity!


......

Oh, and maybe change the fine to Rand amounts ;)

There will always be the bitches and moaners and guys threatening to go race somewhere else.  
Good for them - they will be missing out, that's all.

Anyway that's racing: You take the good with the bad. We need to learn to suck it up. I'll default to whatever the organization decides.

Pissies will never be heroes. :paw:

Regarding your comments about making the race control tougher and that the riders are bitches and moaners, well that gets my back up. These guys were the ones who paid their dues , they were the ones who put in the hard work to build up their bikes and to practice , and they took of work and pitched up at the start line and more importantly rode the event . They have every right to debate here .

 More often than not it is simply a matter of not enough information haven been given . Amageza is also still in it's infancy and growing so there is still lots to improve . Alex does listen to input and criticisms and Amageza does improve every year .

I thought the input here on this thread was most creative and interesting from riders and tech boffins , all of it valuable . It is a great way to improve on timing and results and create other technical assistance , brilliant !

 As for the riders moaning , it is a good barometer to see what they issues were and in some cases their complaints are real, in some cases it was simply not having the information or a misunderstanding  .

I enjoy this thread , and all the input .   :thumleft: Please don't squash the potential for creativity and growth .
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on March 31, 2016, 09:08:06 am
If nobody "moans and bitches" or like I would much rather put it "provide input as well as question and debate" no event will ever grow in the right way - Like Rynet I find it rather silly and counter productive to lash out at people who question things.

Telling the competitors to "grow a pair" actually goes both ways ;)

Having said that...

The guys who went the wrong way:
This was dealt with at the event within the rules of the event, with opportunity for other competitors to lodge complaints.

The speeding issue:
This (in my mind) should be really simple (not the math, the principle) in that no competitor should be able to benefit by speeding in controlled zones in any way, from the very first few meters to the very last meters (GPS accuracy taken into consideration).
In addition to that anyone who speeds in controlled zones should be penalised for increased danger.

This to me means that, should two guys ride exactly the same pace in the race areas but one speeds in the controlled zones in any way, the rider who was speeding should end up behind the rider who did not once penalties are calculated.

The introduction of a fine on top of this is something I do not agree with, I am a stingy bastard  :biggrin:

To repeat, the organisation and competitors jointly make an event like this, without one or the other there will be no event.
Collaboration is key to the growth of an event like this, even though it often leads to rather robust discussions.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Airtime on March 31, 2016, 11:16:05 am
Adie I think Martin is right as I also recall Alex saying that the DSP on day 2 was a neutral zone I also lost time due to this as I split my road book in 3 and wasted time. :xxbah:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: markdiver on March 31, 2016, 11:45:47 am
I agree with you also Rynet, all points made are valid, no matter what, as it is a good barometer for what is being talked about in the pits and the general feeling.
For me the following is important and with some of my reasons.

1.   Speeding in any marked or controlled zone, should carry a significant penalty & possibly a fine. The fine is debatable here as you do not want to start losing riders who incur a couple grands fines, this is not going to be proactive or good for Amageza in the long run, considering our (SA) economic situation and affordability to SA competitors.  
2.   BUT, I still maintain there must a significant penalty to deter those who think that they can speed through these zones.   A 3sec penalty is not a penalty at all IMHO.  There should be a minimum amount for even the shortest and slowest contravention.  
3.   If you download the 2015 Dakar Regs and see pages 30-33 under section 23P Traffic-Speed, this is how it should be IMHO.
4.   This also aligns the Amageza with Dakar’s rules and since Amageza has this affiliation to Dakar with the “Dakar Challenge”, then why not afford the riders the chance to learn something during this race of what it will be like when and if they get to the Dakar.
5.   Again I should say, this is what this format of racing is all about.  I as a middle of the pack rider has the chance to gain significant placings in the race order if I am disciplined in all aspects, from speeding, arriving on time for my allotted start, looking after my bike, adhering to parc ferme rules, ensuring that I have all required equipment on my bike, etc.  This format of racing has never been about flat out speed, there are GOC’s and local enduro’s for that.  
6.   As important I think for Amageza, is the local impact.  If those of you who took part in the Namaqua 2015 rally will remember, that the beginning of the downfall in that race, was when those front runners were speeding through a controlled speed zone, passed the farmers house, some apparently even on the back wheel, which then spelt the end of that race.  The gate was immediately closed by the farmer and the race for that day was over.  And you all know how that turned out at the end and how pissed off the local community were.
 
YOU SPEED, YOU PAY THE PENALTY  ;D :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: BlueBull2007 on March 31, 2016, 12:30:59 pm
I enjoy this thread , and all the input .   :thumleft: Please don't squash the potential for creativity and growth .

:thumleft:

....Again I should say, this is what this format of racing is all about.[/b][/i]  I as a middle of the pack rider has the chance to gain significant placings in the race order if I am disciplined in all aspects, from speeding, arriving on time for my allotted start, looking after my bike, adhering to parc ferme rules, ensuring that I have all required equipment on my bike, etc.  This format of racing has never been about flat out speed, there are GOC’s and local enduro’s for that. 

As important I think for Amageza, is the local impact. ....


Spot on Mark!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on March 31, 2016, 12:45:04 pm
Adie I think Martin is right as I also recall Alex saying that the DSP on day 2 was a neutral zone I also lost time due to this as I split my road book in 3 and wasted time. :xxbah:

You should have used a Rockfox holder.  It could take the WHOLE 400 tulip roadbook one shot and the drives managed the extra load without an issue.  :pot:

I know the way Alex did talk about 'Wasting daylight' or some other 'bantering' and that was why I asked again at the DSP.

PROPOSAL for the ORG.
Add a comment at the DSP tulip to indicate if it is NEUTRALized.  This will address all issues in the future.

A
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Striggs on March 31, 2016, 07:56:19 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .

My 10c worth....

these guys DID NOT pull over and get off the track as mentioned above.  That's from 3 of us that did the loop the correct way....there is also a video that has been uploaded elsewhere on this forum(not by me) that also clearly shows no effort to move aside.. Go find it and judge for yourself...  Law of averages dictate whether the route was accurately marked/plotted or not, how come the majority did not make this obvious error?

To say that the gps track didn't indicate the direction of travel is bollocks. When I stopped at the DSP, I saw that the routes shared a common road, so I did the obvious and logical thing...stop, zoomed in and checked the numbering of the waypoints, yes they were CLEARLY numbered, i.e. 93 94 95 etc.  so I followed the obvious, correct and safe route.  Why would I go from point 93 to 284 and proceed backwards to 283, 282 etc.  If, and only if, some serious mishap had happened, i.e. A head on collision, then all of this debate would become a more serious issue and we would not be bantering on about 30 mins here and there. We can go on about whether it was more difficult or not, the point is that they did a 90km section of the route incorrectly.  I don't believe that the 10 minute penalty is designed for a 90km error, but rather a minor deviation.  To suggest that the guys doing the route the wrong way around are the losers is ludicrous?  They simply did not follow the route. The essence of rally riding in my opinion is the ability to go fast and safe while navigating ACCURATELY. So would your argument be that if the route was easier the other way around they should get a bigger penalty?  What about the rest of the riders who suddenly felt the anxiety of potentially coming across more competitors racing in the wrong direction, thus slowing down to potentially avoid a life threatening situation? Shouldn't we be given some time to compensate for easing off?

I have had my fair share of protests and decision making being an organizer and MSA Steward/COC in the past, it is a thankless task.  My money would have been on disqualification. I think Alex took the soft decision. If it was me having gone the wrong way, I would have expected nothing less than a disqualification.  First rule of Motorsport is safety of ALL competitors and spectators.  Bottom line is that it was downright dangerous, caused by an error of navigation, NOT the organizers fault.

My overall experience of the event was great, I would do it again in a flash.... The privilege of riding in that area is priceless... But next time I see somebody going in wrong direction, I will make damn sure that my protest money is ready....
Apologies, that 10c turned into 50c...
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Striggs on March 31, 2016, 08:13:19 pm
https://youtu.be/KDLa7ctPaec

Watch at 2:10... Shows just how easily something can go wrong... No attempt to get off the track as 2 bikes approach....
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Prop on March 31, 2016, 08:42:58 pm
Adie I think Martin is right as I also recall Alex saying that the DSP on day 2 was a neutral zone I also lost time due to this as I split my road book in 3 and wasted time. :xxbah:

I agree,  my interpretation was that it was a neutral zone,  Alex referred to it as "CH" (if I remember correctly, not entirely sure what that meant in rallye terms).

Well in my case that made a difference between 2 nd and 3 rd in the restricted lite.

Overall great event,  well done to all who made it happen.

One observation from the lite class,  you couldn't see the caution symbols and speed points ( think i got the 2 nd most violations on speeding), but the most scary was almost riding through a triple caution at fiull taps, I'm generally an over cautious rider,  but the terrain leading up to that caution was just awesome,  and there was nothing in the terrain that would fore warn you that there was a2 meter wide eroded donga, half a meter deep.  Somehow managed to save it...
it was about 200k'sinto day 2, one of the road book chaps mentioned that there was a fish hook symbol,  meaning you had to divert  the caution.
If the GPS symbols can be fixed,  I think  there will be allot more lite riders,  which in turn will mean more amageza riders in the future.

Thanks again to all those that made it possible.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Bill the Bong on March 31, 2016, 08:46:18 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .

My 10c worth....

these guys DID NOT pull over and get off the track as mentioned above.  That's from 3 of us that did the loop the correct way....there is also a video that has been uploaded elsewhere on this forum(not by me) that also clearly shows no effort to move aside.. Go find it and judge for yourself...  Law of averages dictate whether the route was accurately marked/plotted or not, how come the majority did not make this obvious error?

To say that the gps track didn't indicate the direction of travel is bollocks. When I stopped at the DSP, I saw that the routes shared a common road, so I did the obvious and logical thing...stop, zoomed in and checked the numbering of the waypoints, yes they were CLEARLY numbered, i.e. 93 94 95 etc.  so I followed the obvious, correct and safe route.  Why would I go from point 93 to 284 and proceed backwards to 283, 282 etc.  If, and only if, some serious mishap had happened, i.e. A head on collision, then all of this debate would become a more serious issue and we would not be bantering on about 30 mins here and there. We can go on about whether it was more difficult or not, the point is that they did a 90km section of the route incorrectly.  I don't believe that the 10 minute penalty is designed for a 90km error, but rather a minor deviation.  To suggest that the guys doing the route the wrong way around are the losers is ludicrous?  They simply did not follow the route. The essence of rally riding in my opinion is the ability to go fast and safe while navigating ACCURATELY. So would your argument be that if the route was easier the other way around they should get a bigger penalty?  What about the rest of the riders who suddenly felt the anxiety of potentially coming across more competitors racing in the wrong direction, thus slowing down to potentially avoid a life threatening situation? Shouldn't we be given some time to compensate for easing off?

I have had my fair share of protests and decision making being an organizer and MSA Steward/COC in the past, it is a thankless task.  My money would have been on disqualification. I think Alex took the soft decision. If it was me having gone the wrong way, I would have expected nothing less than a disqualification.  First rule of Motorsport is safety of ALL competitors and spectators.  Bottom line is that it was downright dangerous, caused by an error of navigation, NOT the organizers fault.

My overall experience of the event was great, I would do it again in a flash.... The privilege of riding in that area is priceless... But next time I see somebody going in wrong direction, I will make damn sure that my protest money is ready....
Apologies, that 10c turned into 50c...


Rallying is not really a sterile sport.  It is also not for everybody.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Striggs on March 31, 2016, 09:15:15 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .

My 10c worth....

these guys DID NOT pull over and get off the track as mentioned above.  That's from 3 of us that did the loop the correct way....there is also a video that has been uploaded elsewhere on this forum(not by me) that also clearly shows no effort to move aside.. Go find it and judge for yourself...  Law of averages dictate whether the route was accurately marked/plotted or not, how come the majority did not make this obvious error?

To say that the gps track didn't indicate the direction of travel is bollocks. When I stopped at the DSP, I saw that the routes shared a common road, so I did the obvious and logical thing...stop, zoomed in and checked the numbering of the waypoints, yes they were CLEARLY numbered, i.e. 93 94 95 etc.  so I followed the obvious, correct and safe route.  Why would I go from point 93 to 284 and proceed backwards to 283, 282 etc.  If, and only if, some serious mishap had happened, i.e. A head on collision, then all of this debate would become a more serious issue and we would not be bantering on about 30 mins here and there. We can go on about whether it was more difficult or not, the point is that they did a 90km section of the route incorrectly.  I don't believe that the 10 minute penalty is designed for a 90km error, but rather a minor deviation.  To suggest that the guys doing the route the wrong way around are the losers is ludicrous?  They simply did not follow the route. The essence of rally riding in my opinion is the ability to go fast and safe while navigating ACCURATELY. So would your argument be that if the route was easier the other way around they should get a bigger penalty?  What about the rest of the riders who suddenly felt the anxiety of potentially coming across more competitors racing in the wrong direction, thus slowing down to potentially avoid a life threatening situation? Shouldn't we be given some time to compensate for easing off?

I have had my fair share of protests and decision making being an organizer and MSA Steward/COC in the past, it is a thankless task.  My money would have been on disqualification. I think Alex took the soft decision. If it was me having gone the wrong way, I would have expected nothing less than a disqualification.  First rule of Motorsport is safety of ALL competitors and spectators.  Bottom line is that it was downright dangerous, caused by an error of navigation, NOT the organizers fault.

My overall experience of the event was great, I would do it again in a flash.... The privilege of riding in that area is priceless... But next time I see somebody going in wrong direction, I will make damn sure that my protest money is ready....
Apologies, that 10c turned into 50c...


Rallying is not really a sterile sport.  It is also not for everybody.

 :lol8: sterile...  :imaposer: who's suggesting it should be? you have missed my point completely. I was also there to compete, knowing, considering and experiencing all the non sterile events that occur from start to finish.  It's a risky and tough sport and if you think I was there site seeing, you are wrong, I had the next best time after Gavin(excellent rider) on day 2. You are right, it isn't for everybody, but we should all be heading in the same direction at least, literally and figuratively..  :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: luckyloo on March 31, 2016, 10:55:41 pm
Adie I think Martin is right as I also recall Alex saying that the DSP on day 2 was a neutral zone I also lost time due to this as I split my road book in 3 and wasted time. :xxbah:



I agree,  my interpretation was that it was a neutral zone,  Alex referred to it as "CH" (if I remember correctly, not entirely sure what that meant in rallye terms).

Well in my case that made a difference between 2 nd and 3 rd in the restricted lite.

Overall great event,  well done to all who made it happen.

One observation from the lite class,  you couldn't see the caution symbols and speed points ( think i got the 2 nd most violations on speeding), but the most scary was almost riding through a triple caution at fiull taps, I'm generally an over cautious rider,  but the terrain leading up to that caution was just awesome,  and there was nothing in the terrain that would fore warn you that there was a2 meter wide eroded donga, half a meter deep.  Somehow managed to save it...
it was about 200k'sinto day 2, one of the road book chaps mentioned that there was a fish hook symbol,  meaning you had to divert  the caution.
If the GPS symbols can be fixed,  I think  there will be allot more lite riders,  which in turn will mean more amageza riders in the future.

Thanks again to all those that made it possible.

It's a no brainer.  I asked at riders briefing if it was neutralised I.o.w. no timed zone for day 2 because day 1 this was only not timed for lite classes.  The answer from Alex was its not timed but keep in mind if you waste too much time in DSP you can still be time barred.  It is also obvious because the day's stage was more than the specified fuel range for rally classes so they had to provide a fuel zone. This is the reason why myself and some others sent their teams out on that shirty road because it was a service point.    This influences everybody's results so according to me there is not a fair result on this event. Furthermore I feel that by not having had access to stage 2 results prior to final results being posted, there wasn't  a fair chance to protest the results.   My 2c not happy. ..
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on April 01, 2016, 10:09:30 am
Adie I think Martin is right as I also recall Alex saying that the DSP on day 2 was a neutral zone I also lost time due to this as I split my road book in 3 and wasted time. :xxbah:



I agree,  my interpretation was that it was a neutral zone,  Alex referred to it as "CH" (if I remember correctly, not entirely sure what that meant in rallye terms).

Well in my case that made a difference between 2 nd and 3 rd in the restricted lite.

Overall great event,  well done to all who made it happen.

One observation from the lite class,  you couldn't see the caution symbols and speed points ( think i got the 2 nd most violations on speeding), but the most scary was almost riding through a triple caution at fiull taps, I'm generally an over cautious rider,  but the terrain leading up to that caution was just awesome,  and there was nothing in the terrain that would fore warn you that there was a2 meter wide eroded donga, half a meter deep.  Somehow managed to save it...
it was about 200k'sinto day 2, one of the road book chaps mentioned that there was a fish hook symbol,  meaning you had to divert  the caution.
If the GPS symbols can be fixed,  I think  there will be allot more lite riders,  which in turn will mean more amageza riders in the future.

Thanks again to all those that made it possible.

It's a no brainer.  I asked at riders briefing if it was neutralised I.o.w. no timed zone for day 2 because day 1 this was only not timed for lite classes.  The answer from Alex was its not timed but keep in mind if you waste too much time in DSP you can still be time barred.  It is also obvious because the day's stage was more than the specified fuel range for rally classes so they had to provide a fuel zone. This is the reason why myself and some others sent their teams out on that shirty road because it was a service point.    This influences everybody's results so according to me there is not a fair result on this event. Furthermore I feel that by not having had access to stage 2 results prior to final results being posted, there wasn't  a fair chance to protest the results.   My 2c not happy. ..

Yes it does seem that whether the fuel stop on day 2 was neutralised or not , caught a few people out , so it does seem to have been not as clear as it could be.

The results was already mentioned on this thread as having been an issue, and should be sorted by Amageza time.

The Baja was a test run for Amageza , a testing-the-waters, a fun-run , yes for the riders the results were important , but Amageza is the big event . Everything learnt at Baja will be taken into consideration by Alex and where possible and reasonable , will be improved .

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on April 01, 2016, 10:19:42 am
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .

My 10c worth....

these guys DID NOT pull over and get off the track as mentioned above.  That's from 3 of us that did the loop the correct way....there is also a video that has been uploaded elsewhere on this forum(not by me) that also clearly shows no effort to move aside.. Go find it and judge for yourself...  Law of averages dictate whether the route was accurately marked/plotted or not, how come the majority did not make this obvious error?

To say that the gps track didn't indicate the direction of travel is bollocks. When I stopped at the DSP, I saw that the routes shared a common road, so I did the obvious and logical thing...stop, zoomed in and checked the numbering of the waypoints, yes they were CLEARLY numbered, i.e. 93 94 95 etc.  so I followed the obvious, correct and safe route.  Why would I go from point 93 to 284 and proceed backwards to 283, 282 etc.  If, and only if, some serious mishap had happened, i.e. A head on collision, then all of this debate would become a more serious issue and we would not be bantering on about 30 mins here and there. We can go on about whether it was more difficult or not, the point is that they did a 90km section of the route incorrectly.  I don't believe that the 10 minute penalty is designed for a 90km error, but rather a minor deviation.  To suggest that the guys doing the route the wrong way around are the losers is ludicrous?  They simply did not follow the route. The essence of rally riding in my opinion is the ability to go fast and safe while navigating ACCURATELY. So would your argument be that if the route was easier the other way around they should get a bigger penalty?  What about the rest of the riders who suddenly felt the anxiety of potentially coming across more competitors racing in the wrong direction, thus slowing down to potentially avoid a life threatening situation? Shouldn't we be given some time to compensate for easing off?

I have had my fair share of protests and decision making being an organizer and MSA Steward/COC in the past, it is a thankless task.  My money would have been on disqualification. I think Alex took the soft decision. If it was me having gone the wrong way, I would have expected nothing less than a disqualification.  First rule of Motorsport is safety of ALL competitors and spectators.  Bottom line is that it was downright dangerous, caused by an error of navigation, NOT the organizers fault.

My overall experience of the event was great, I would do it again in a flash.... The privilege of riding in that area is priceless... But next time I see somebody going in wrong direction, I will make damn sure that my protest money is ready....
Apologies, that 10c turned into 50c...

Thank you for your input Striggs. I have no idea who you are , can you please ID yourself? If not here , then with a pm please , thanks !

I sat in the meeting with Alex and John and three of the riders and I had spoken to the 4th rider Gideon before he had to leave as well as after the meeting by telephone , so we had information that others did not have .

Some points –mine – not the organisation’s  ,I cannot speak for Alex or Amageza / Baja , this is in my personal capacity .

The Law of averages. I do not think that is relevant  . The 4 riders were the front runners . There were no tracks whatsoever to show them the way.  Roger Kane –Berman- an experienced rider and navigator , he went on to win the race- also made the same error as these 4 and he and rode for 15km in the wrong way before his Road Book showed him wrong . He told this to me in person.  That shows that it was an easy mistake to make at the time of entering the loop.  The lite guys did not have a Road book so once on the route they would simply follow the lines on the GPS . They would not , like Roger , come across anything on a Road book to indicate that they were wrong, until they met the first riders.  When they met the first riders they did not know who was wrong ,and by the time they saw more guys fuel would have been a problem if they turned around.

You say that you were an organiser and MSA Steward/COC in the past  . You are therefore experienced with Rallies and navigation and you cleverly found out how to use the Rally lite system to it’s full potential . Well done . But , the Rally lite system was not designed for someone experienced like you. It was designed for the first time Rally entrant to help them to ride the route easily , to not worry about navigation, but to focus on the ride.  For those purposes, it clearly did not work.

From what you say you found it necessary at that point to double check . Thank you, you are therefore confirming that there was a potential for error which adds weight to the 4 rider’s argument that it was an easy mistake to make.  You have also given valuable information on how to make the Rally Lite system more user friendly next year, if Alex uses it again .  :thumleft:

The Baja was a test run for the Amageza to see what issues will come up and could be dealt with .

Edit : Alex just told me the Rally Lite system was a failure and would not be used again .

For the riders further down the field ,  if you were going the right route , so were the riders with you or who followed you or your tracks or other people’s tracks .

Safety and Penalty given  :  I don’t know who the rider was on that video , if that was at the start of the loop then it surely couldn’t have been these 4 riders ? Maybe Roger coming back?

It is one transgression , one continuous transgression not a lot of little ones.  Yes 30 minutes is fairly lenient from your point , it could have been an hour ,but all factors were taken into consideration such as that the Rally lite system did not work to make things easier as it was supposed to .  For that reason disqualification was unnecessary and would have been too harsh.

Yes of course riding the route the wrong way is a security risk but in reality no one did get hurt , it was a very technical section and for most of it the riders were riding slowly, reducing the risk.

No real emotional harm would have befallen the other riders except the few minutes of overtaking and mostly the wrong way 4 made way. The real pain would have been the wrong way 4 as they would have had the pain of riding the rest of the route knowing it was wrong and not knowing the outcome . Their qualification into Amageza would have been affected and their placings .

I understand your frustration as you clearly did the right thing. It is difficult to please everybody and find a middle way .



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kamanya on April 01, 2016, 11:52:18 am
I’ve had some thoughts on the temperature in this thread and the slight "off piste" direction it has taken. I think its good overall though.

A part of the underlying tension around all this is fairness.

Racers will suffer incredible hardships and deadly risks, so long as it is the same for all. Even for people who have no hope of getting a top 10, so long as the “rules” were applied to all, then it is alright. Where there is perceived unfairness, this is very hard to reconcile.

Because rally is such a complex event, it sets up a more subtle and complex competition too. I know from personal experience that so long as I stayed within the rules but as close to the edge as I could come, I could still proudly claim my medal.

It does set me up for some challenge though, when I overstepped the rules and was penalised, I would feel in some instances that this was fair, but in others not. For those that I didn’t feel were fair or overly harsh, I was mightily aggrieved.


As a person on the marshalling side of the Rally, it creates too, a difficult dynamic. They will want to be above reproach and completely true to the integrity of the event and it’s rules. However, there is always interpretation and of course having to deal with the personal drama in high stress moments, little info or time and trying conditions and no reward. And very few get to see that in action or appreciate that little contest of its own.

It is then understandable that these two sides of the race will have dynamic. Both sides acutely aware of fairness and trying their utmost best.

Racing brings out the best and worst in people. They will come up to levels they themselves never thought possible, but at the same time in this test, sometimes behave in ways that they would later regret or worse, not have any qualms about.

A post-mortem done in a high atmosphere of wanting to improve the brand and experience is helpful. Of course people will have vastly differing thoughts and opinions, some even divisive and conflicting. As you know, it is very easy to get into defending something that was done in the right spirit but seen wrong in the eye of others.

I like this quote:

“Opinion is really the lowest form of human knowledge. It requires no accountability, no understanding. The highest form of knowledge… is empathy, for it requires us to suspend our egos and live in another’s world. It requires profound purpose larger than the self-kind of understanding.”
 ― Bill Bullard

I can’t say that I always live up to it.

Long live Rally!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 01, 2016, 11:59:35 am
Great Post Andrew, and something that I could learn from :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: melvman on April 01, 2016, 12:14:56 pm
Everyone off the course.
Last guys

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-vXcrSWH/0/L/IMG_5747-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-vXcrSWH/A)

Kevin made it! (at 60 nog al!) Great Effort!

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBTbKJW/0/L/IMG_5745-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBTbKJW/A)

Long day for this side by side, did a lot of sight seeing

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CfjBnWb/0/L/IMG_5743-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-CfjBnWb/A)

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Hp6DTrz/0/L/IMG_5746-L.jpg) (https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-Hp6DTrz/A)



No.42 = Jason Manley
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: markdiver on April 01, 2016, 12:35:33 pm
Nice post Andrew, agreed, sometimes we have to just step back and realize others around us and their ideas & opinions, and if you can do that, then you also realize it is not always about oneself and your own needs.

Melvman - Kevin is truly a legend, to be doing this hardcore type (and it is) of racing at 60, is just extraordinary.   :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: SteveD on April 01, 2016, 08:28:08 pm
Melvman - Kevin is truly a legend, to be doing this hardcore type (and it is) of racing at 60, is just extraordinary.

(https://kamanya.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/16/03-2016-West-Coast-Baja/i-PBTbKJW/0/L/IMG_5745-L.jpg)

The other oke in the picture, rider 42, I think that is Melvman's kid.
He entered Amageza last year on a 690. The engine seized about 500km into the first day, which very much ended his race.

He rebuilt the motor completely, but it would lose power when it got hot. Nobody could figure out why...

Very shortly before Baja, he gave up on the 690, bought a 450 and started modifying it for rallye. The fuel tank came out of customs I think two days before the start, and he finished the build the night before he had to leave.

When he got there, he discovered the swingarm bearing was not so lekker. The prologue was enough to confirm that it needed replacing.
He found the right bearing, and with the help of a local with a moerse hammer was able to change it, finishing at around midnight before the start.
I think a wheel bearing replacement was required after Day1, but I may be wrong?

I am super, super chuffed that my riding buddy finished. I suspect Melvman is too.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Striggs on April 01, 2016, 11:07:16 pm
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .

My 10c worth....

these guys DID NOT pull over and get off the track as mentioned above.  That's from 3 of us that did the loop the correct way....there is also a video that has been uploaded elsewhere on this forum(not by me) that also clearly shows no effort to move aside.. Go find it and judge for yourself...  Law of averages dictate whether the route was accurately marked/plotted or not, how come the majority did not make this obvious error?

To say that the gps track didn't indicate the direction of travel is bollocks. When I stopped at the DSP, I saw that the routes shared a common road, so I did the obvious and logical thing...stop, zoomed in and checked the numbering of the waypoints, yes they were CLEARLY numbered, i.e. 93 94 95 etc.  so I followed the obvious, correct and safe route.  Why would I go from point 93 to 284 and proceed backwards to 283, 282 etc.  If, and only if, some serious mishap had happened, i.e. A head on collision, then all of this debate would become a more serious issue and we would not be bantering on about 30 mins here and there. We can go on about whether it was more difficult or not, the point is that they did a 90km section of the route incorrectly.  I don't believe that the 10 minute penalty is designed for a 90km error, but rather a minor deviation.  To suggest that the guys doing the route the wrong way around are the losers is ludicrous?  They simply did not follow the route. The essence of rally riding in my opinion is the ability to go fast and safe while navigating ACCURATELY. So would your argument be that if the route was easier the other way around they should get a bigger penalty?  What about the rest of the riders who suddenly felt the anxiety of potentially coming across more competitors racing in the wrong direction, thus slowing down to potentially avoid a life threatening situation? Shouldn't we be given some time to compensate for easing off?

I have had my fair share of protests and decision making being an organizer and MSA Steward/COC in the past, it is a thankless task.  My money would have been on disqualification. I think Alex took the soft decision. If it was me having gone the wrong way, I would have expected nothing less than a disqualification.  First rule of Motorsport is safety of ALL competitors and spectators.  Bottom line is that it was downright dangerous, caused by an error of navigation, NOT the organizers fault.

My overall experience of the event was great, I would do it again in a flash.... The privilege of riding in that area is priceless... But next time I see somebody going in wrong direction, I will make damn sure that my protest money is ready....
Apologies, that 10c turned into 50c...

Thank you for your input Striggs. I have no idea who you are , can you please ID yourself? If not here , then with a pm please , thanks !

I sat in the meeting with Alex and John and three of the riders and I had spoken to the 4th rider Gideon before he had to leave as well as after the meeting by telephone , so we had information that others did not have .

Some points –mine – not the organisation’s  ,I cannot speak for Alex or Amageza / Baja , this is in my personal capacity .

The Law of averages. I do not think that is relevant  . The 4 riders were the front runners . There were no tracks whatsoever to show them the way.  Roger Kane –Berman- an experienced rider and navigator , he went on to win the race- also made the same error as these 4 and he and rode for 15km in the wrong way before his Road Book showed him wrong . He told this to me in person.  That shows that it was an easy mistake to make at the time of entering the loop.  The lite guys did not have a Road book so once on the route they would simply follow the lines on the GPS . They would not , like Roger , come across anything on a Road book to indicate that they were wrong, until they met the first riders.  When they met the first riders they did not know who was wrong ,and by the time they saw more guys fuel would have been a problem if they turned around.

You say that you were an organiser and MSA Steward/COC in the past  . You are therefore experienced with Rallies and navigation and you cleverly found out how to use the Rally lite system to it’s full potential . Well done . But , the Rally lite system was not designed for someone experienced like you. It was designed for the first time Rally entrant to help them to ride the route easily , to not worry about navigation, but to focus on the ride.  For those purposes, it clearly did not work.

From what you say you found it necessary at that point to double check . Thank you, you are therefore confirming that there was a potential for error which adds weight to the 4 rider’s argument that it was an easy mistake to make.  You have also given valuable information on how to make the Rally Lite system more user friendly next year, if Alex uses it again .  :thumleft:

The Baja was a test run for the Amageza to see what issues will come up and could be dealt with .

Edit : Alex just told me the Rally Lite system was a failure and would not be used again .

For the riders further down the field ,  if you were going the right route , so were the riders with you or who followed you or your tracks or other people’s tracks .

Safety and Penalty given  :  I don’t know who the rider was on that video , if that was at the start of the loop then it surely couldn’t have been these 4 riders ? Maybe Roger coming back?

It is one transgression , one continuous transgression not a lot of little ones.  Yes 30 minutes is fairly lenient from your point , it could have been an hour ,but all factors were taken into consideration such as that the Rally lite system did not work to make things easier as it was supposed to .  For that reason disqualification was unnecessary and would have been too harsh.

Yes of course riding the route the wrong way is a security risk but in reality no one did get hurt , it was a very technical section and for most of it the riders were riding slowly, reducing the risk.

No real emotional harm would have befallen the other riders except the few minutes of overtaking and mostly the wrong way 4 made way. The real pain would have been the wrong way 4 as they would have had the pain of riding the rest of the route knowing it was wrong and not knowing the outcome . Their qualification into Amageza would have been affected and their placings .

I understand your frustration as you clearly did the right thing. It is difficult to please everybody and find a middle way .




Hallo Rynet!

My name is Ellio Striglia

You have some very valid and relevant points.  Some of which, admittedly I had not considered.  I don't feel hard done by and certainly not frustrated by the results or decisions made by Alex and co.  A lot is expressed tongue-in-cheek, but doesn't always come across like that in print... But, I do always worry about the repercussions from earlier decisions. I guess it's actally not my problem. Unless of course I am the victim of a head on collision.  I have the seen the outcomes of those type of errors/accidents, we all know that they can be serious, if not fatal.... and most frustratingly, avoidable. Excuse me if I am harping on about the safety issue, but until it happens to you or someone you know, it's never an issue.  That is the reason for my feeling that the penalty should have been more severe.  But, once again, not a decision for me to make. I just hope that it doesn't open the door for abuse into the future...

In essence I was trying to point out that it was also possible to make the correct decisions and take the correct route.  I made those decisions in the pit area, not by following other tracks. In fairness to those guys up front and running at a hot pace, it would not have been easy I agree. I started at the back of the pack on that day... The dust was hell... I did not ride the first long stage.

Difficulty in navigating with gps, I agree, not easy or user friendly for this type of event and speeds.  This was my first rally type event.... Test run for whether I want to do the amageza or not...   I'm used to slower speeds such as those in the roof and other extreme enduro type events. So I guess I have also learnt a lesson or two.  I do feel that if the routes had been given to us the night before (as Full Rally did) maybe we may have had time to orientate ourselves with the layout and icons etc. interestingly, what was glaringly apparent on the start line, was the amount of people who had no idea how to even get the route activated on their etrex's and to what level of zoom they should be at? Maybe I just take it for granted that if you are going to be using a gps, then well, learn how to use it properly before the event and understand fully its capability and more importantly, its shortcomings.

Maybe allow a bigger gps such as a Montana? Larger screen with ability to show icons properly. I'm used to a foretrex 401, so etrex is massive.. ;D

The video clip was taken on the section called Devils breath. It wasn't Roger (I also know him personally).

Hindsight is supposed to be perfect science and yet in this case, it isn't...

If anything I hope that this discussion stimulated some positive outcomes for organizers and riders alike.  You are 100% correct, not everyone can be pleased, all of the time....

Cheers

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: 2StrokeDan on April 01, 2016, 11:24:07 pm
Ah the joys of racing..... Two days riding followed by two weeks of bitching

Not to mention the 6 months of pre-race hype, eh? Yes, all so childish. :pot:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 02, 2016, 12:50:37 am
If anything I hope that this discussion stimulated some positive outcomes for organizers and riders alike.  You are 100% correct, not everyone can be pleased, all of the time....
Cheers

Welcome to the Rallye scene Striggs :thumleft:

The Lite version of the Baja was an experiment I think. I would not be surprised to see the lite version disappear completely next year, as the Amageza Baja itself is a lite version of the Amageza already.

Yes it is a lot faster than an enduro, but if you ride to the road book unless you are very practiced, its actually quite a bit slower than off road for a lot of the time. You need to think about where you are going and slow down to read the road book, compare with the ICO, adjust the ICO at times, read you heading etc.. Unless you are an alien like Coma, Peterhansel or Despres who have been riding for years to a road book it is dangerous to go full gas while looking at all the instrumentation. 
:lol8:

I dare say that the best way to learn about rally is to actually plunge in and start riding to a road book (in a Baja rally event) rather than riding it using a GPS. Rather get a road book holder and learn how to navigate. Otherwise its just an extended off road race, and rally is not about that at all.

Rally is a navigational, long distance, endurance challenge in which often the not-as-fast guys come out on top because they made less mistakes and conserved their machines better.

Think 700km/day for 7 days in a row. Its a long way to ride 700km in a single day on a DS bike, never mind a race-ready 450 or 690. But can body and mind take it for 7 days in a row, for 10-14 hrs/day at least concentrating all the time? That is what its really about.

To your concern about the head-on collision risk is a very valid point, but the chance of a repeat of what happened to you guys in a big loop two weeks ago is very small simply because big rally loops seldom if ever cross, and when guys get lost they usually end up safely out of collisions way, sometimes more than 50km off the course! ;D

Hope you stick it out and try the navigational stuff. It really is a lot of fun once you get used to it. :deal:  

Please shout out if you want to learn more, there are guys here who have training road books done already, and there is a lot of good info right here in this Racing Section of Wilddogs if you want to read more about how to best do it.  

Neil :paw:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Striggs on April 02, 2016, 06:44:10 am
Good morning Bluebull

I will definitely be going road book route, I've spent a fair amount of time reading up on it, just couldn't get my stuff together in time for the Baja, just not sure where and how I am going to practice!?  I have seen the other threads discussing the equipment etc. and will make a nuisance of myself there asking lots of stupid questions. :lamer:

I do also agree that the events of the baja regarding directional issues is rare.

Cheers

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Rynet on April 02, 2016, 07:05:21 am
I guess rules are rules and talking about the other way around , can you explain how 2 riders that did the route the wrong way around are still in the results ?Funny that !!

Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification .


It was taken into consideration that the cause of the mountain loop being ridden the wrong way was the the GPS lite system which did not show that the rider was riding the route the wrong way and no clear marker at the split .
 The real losers are the 4 guys that rode the route the wrong way  , not the other riders.

By the time they discovered it they were too far in and fuel would have been an issue if they turned back . The 4 riders were the ones who gave way and pulled right off the tracks when the other riders approached . Despite that , and despite going some distance extra, and riding the route the more difficult way , through no fault of their own , they were actually the ones who suffered more than the other riders. They carried the penalties and the heart ache of riding so well and being pushed down the list of finishers.

It is unfortunate, but the issue had to be sorted before prize giving . I think it was a good call by Alex taking all the factors in consideration and giving a 30 minute penalty .

My 10c worth....

these guys DID NOT pull over and get off the track as mentioned above.  That's from 3 of us that did the loop the correct way....there is also a video that has been uploaded elsewhere on this forum(not by me) that also clearly shows no effort to move aside.. Go find it and judge for yourself...  Law of averages dictate whether the route was accurately marked/plotted or not, how come the majority did not make this obvious error?

To say that the gps track didn't indicate the direction of travel is bollocks. When I stopped at the DSP, I saw that the routes shared a common road, so I did the obvious and logical thing...stop, zoomed in and checked the numbering of the waypoints, yes they were CLEARLY numbered, i.e. 93 94 95 etc.  so I followed the obvious, correct and safe route.  Why would I go from point 93 to 284 and proceed backwards to 283, 282 etc.  If, and only if, some serious mishap had happened, i.e. A head on collision, then all of this debate would become a more serious issue and we would not be bantering on about 30 mins here and there. We can go on about whether it was more difficult or not, the point is that they did a 90km section of the route incorrectly.  I don't believe that the 10 minute penalty is designed for a 90km error, but rather a minor deviation.  To suggest that the guys doing the route the wrong way around are the losers is ludicrous?  They simply did not follow the route. The essence of rally riding in my opinion is the ability to go fast and safe while navigating ACCURATELY. So would your argument be that if the route was easier the other way around they should get a bigger penalty?  What about the rest of the riders who suddenly felt the anxiety of potentially coming across more competitors racing in the wrong direction, thus slowing down to potentially avoid a life threatening situation? Shouldn't we be given some time to compensate for easing off?

I have had my fair share of protests and decision making being an organizer and MSA Steward/COC in the past, it is a thankless task.  My money would have been on disqualification. I think Alex took the soft decision. If it was me having gone the wrong way, I would have expected nothing less than a disqualification.  First rule of Motorsport is safety of ALL competitors and spectators.  Bottom line is that it was downright dangerous, caused by an error of navigation, NOT the organizers fault.

My overall experience of the event was great, I would do it again in a flash.... The privilege of riding in that area is priceless... But next time I see somebody going in wrong direction, I will make damn sure that my protest money is ready....
Apologies, that 10c turned into 50c...

Thank you for your input Striggs. I have no idea who you are , can you please ID yourself? If not here , then with a pm please , thanks !

I sat in the meeting with Alex and John and three of the riders and I had spoken to the 4th rider Gideon before he had to leave as well as after the meeting by telephone , so we had information that others did not have .

Some points –mine – not the organisation’s  ,I cannot speak for Alex or Amageza / Baja , this is in my personal capacity .

The Law of averages. I do not think that is relevant  . The 4 riders were the front runners . There were no tracks whatsoever to show them the way.  Roger Kane –Berman- an experienced rider and navigator , he went on to win the race- also made the same error as these 4 and he and rode for 15km in the wrong way before his Road Book showed him wrong . He told this to me in person.  That shows that it was an easy mistake to make at the time of entering the loop.  The lite guys did not have a Road book so once on the route they would simply follow the lines on the GPS . They would not , like Roger , come across anything on a Road book to indicate that they were wrong, until they met the first riders.  When they met the first riders they did not know who was wrong ,and by the time they saw more guys fuel would have been a problem if they turned around.

You say that you were an organiser and MSA Steward/COC in the past  . You are therefore experienced with Rallies and navigation and you cleverly found out how to use the Rally lite system to it’s full potential . Well done . But , the Rally lite system was not designed for someone experienced like you. It was designed for the first time Rally entrant to help them to ride the route easily , to not worry about navigation, but to focus on the ride.  For those purposes, it clearly did not work.

From what you say you found it necessary at that point to double check . Thank you, you are therefore confirming that there was a potential for error which adds weight to the 4 rider’s argument that it was an easy mistake to make.  You have also given valuable information on how to make the Rally Lite system more user friendly next year, if Alex uses it again .  :thumleft:

The Baja was a test run for the Amageza to see what issues will come up and could be dealt with .

Edit : Alex just told me the Rally Lite system was a failure and would not be used again .

For the riders further down the field ,  if you were going the right route , so were the riders with you or who followed you or your tracks or other people’s tracks .

Safety and Penalty given  :  I don’t know who the rider was on that video , if that was at the start of the loop then it surely couldn’t have been these 4 riders ? Maybe Roger coming back?

It is one transgression , one continuous transgression not a lot of little ones.  Yes 30 minutes is fairly lenient from your point , it could have been an hour ,but all factors were taken into consideration such as that the Rally lite system did not work to make things easier as it was supposed to .  For that reason disqualification was unnecessary and would have been too harsh.

Yes of course riding the route the wrong way is a security risk but in reality no one did get hurt , it was a very technical section and for most of it the riders were riding slowly, reducing the risk.

No real emotional harm would have befallen the other riders except the few minutes of overtaking and mostly the wrong way 4 made way. The real pain would have been the wrong way 4 as they would have had the pain of riding the rest of the route knowing it was wrong and not knowing the outcome . Their qualification into Amageza would have been affected and their placings .

I understand your frustration as you clearly did the right thing. It is difficult to please everybody and find a middle way .




Hallo Rynet!

My name is Ellio Striglia

You have some very valid and relevant points.  Some of which, admittedly I had not considered.  I don't feel hard done by and certainly not frustrated by the results or decisions made by Alex and co.  A lot is expressed tongue-in-cheek, but doesn't always come across like that in print... But, I do always worry about the repercussions from earlier decisions. I guess it's actally not my problem. Unless of course I am the victim of a head on collision.  I have the seen the outcomes of those type of errors/accidents, we all know that they can be serious, if not fatal.... and most frustratingly, avoidable. Excuse me if I am harping on about the safety issue, but until it happens to you or someone you know, it's never an issue.  That is the reason for my feeling that the penalty should have been more severe.  But, once again, not a decision for me to make. I just hope that it doesn't open the door for abuse into the future...

In essence I was trying to point out that it was also possible to make the correct decisions and take the correct route.  I made those decisions in the pit area, not by following other tracks. In fairness to those guys up front and running at a hot pace, it would not have been easy I agree. I started at the back of the pack on that day... The dust was hell... I did not ride the first long stage.

Difficulty in navigating with gps, I agree, not easy or user friendly for this type of event and speeds.  This was my first rally type event.... Test run for whether I want to do the amageza or not...   I'm used to slower speeds such as those in the roof and other extreme enduro type events. So I guess I have also learnt a lesson or two.  I do feel that if the routes had been given to us the night before (as Full Rally did) maybe we may have had time to orientate ourselves with the layout and icons etc. interestingly, what was glaringly apparent on the start line, was the amount of people who had no idea how to even get the route activated on their etrex's and to what level of zoom they should be at? Maybe I just take it for granted that if you are going to be using a gps, then well, learn how to use it properly before the event and understand fully its capability and more importantly, its shortcomings.

Maybe allow a bigger gps such as a Montana? Larger screen with ability to show icons properly. I'm used to a foretrex 401, so etrex is massive.. ;D

The video clip was taken on the section called Devils breath. It wasn't Roger (I also know him personally).

Hindsight is supposed to be perfect science and yet in this case, it isn't...

If anything I hope that this discussion stimulated some positive outcomes for organizers and riders alike.  You are 100% correct, not everyone can be pleased, all of the time....

Cheers



Hello Ellio , is that Italian ?  :biggrin:

Thank you for your post and good points. Yes the safety is very important to Alex and Amageza too . You hit the nail on the head, when making decisions the Org does set a precedent , yes , and it was considered. Since the Rallye lite system will not be used these errors should not occur again .  And if there is ever a Loop again , maybe the Org can put markers at that point .

Yes good point also about the GPS. If the Lite system was to be used again the GPS should have a bigger screen so the waypoints are bigger and visible without zooming in , but Alex has said the Lite system will not happen again .

Good points about the routes being given the previous nights .  As for your point that the riders didn't know how to use the GPS , yes I agree, and even the Road Book riders don't know how to use it , they don't realise how important the GPS is to be used together with the Road books  , some of them don't even know if it is switched on or not ( and as a non -techie I can relate !)

I agree with BB that it is better to do the whole Roadbook thing , it is not that hard and best to jump right in and do it .

Glad that you were happy on the whole and that we had this chat . :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rynet on April 02, 2016, 07:39:04 am
Some personal thoughts on the Ralley Lite system .

I personally did not like the admin as a marshal of dealing with 4 different groups of bike riders , being Rally Open and Restricted and Lite Open and Restricted. It is much more work .


The Lite system also caused issues with the Loop and then the prize giving was 30 minutes late too !

However the main reason for me is the scoring . For me there are lots of different things that is amazing about a rally, but really , at the CRUX -  how did I score? , where did I place in comparison to the other riders ?
How does my placement compare to others as the Ralley progresses day by day ? How do I score against my friends ? If I don't finish , how did I do the day before ?

And how do you compare that if some used a Roadbook and others had it easy by just following an arrow ? 


I know it's silly but I am still pleased about my 7th place out of 20 riders in the 2011 Amageza .  :biggrin:  :imaposer:

The Roadbook is what makes it a Rally as BB says above and I agree with him. I also agree with him that it is best to just jump right in and start using it . It is not that hard to use and makes it exciting .

It is worth it , but yes the new to road book riders will have to start prepping long before the Event  ,you can't just pitch up on the day . Sometimes new riders prep their bikes, but forget about the Road book- and GPS training and to study the regulations .


Most importantly , it will then not be just speed that counts , it will be brawn and brains .   :biggrin:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: White Rhino on April 02, 2016, 07:57:28 am
Team Verve - White Rhino's ride report with some mouth watering pics here .... http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190571.0 (http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190571.0)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Geel Kat on April 02, 2016, 08:55:59 am
Cool Ride Report White Rhino  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: EbenMocke on April 02, 2016, 04:12:27 pm
Hi All

Here is the "wrong way round brothers" version of the BAJA :ricky:.

First , what a awesome race and awesome time we had...... the terrain, SS and everything els was great...we really enjoyed our-selfs tremendously.
Prologue did not go as planned for me as my gps died at the start and i had no time so i had to start way last on day 1'SS......number 28 you are the sweeper, heheheheheheh.  Maybe not such a bad thing as i had tracks galore and how nice it was to have bikes on the track the whole day almost with you.... Day one ended up with me and Gavin (66) having a flyer even with him having to race without a clutch form Alexander bay.

So Day 2 we were leading and had to start 1 and 2 on the SS................... :ricky:

So standing on the start line Gavin (66) noticed he had 2 tracks on the GPS, so asked which one to follow as the one showed we need to go right and the other left...........so where do we go????????????? ( so yesterdays track was still loaded onto the gps)
We were informed that we just needed to stay to the right and that the Track never crosses each other.......so this is what we did........we were flying all the way to the DSP (at some stages clocking 150 kph on those red dune roads.....) DSP reached , refueled hopped on our ponies and off we went, GPS showing we were on the right track.....  ( may i ad, reading the gps at 130kph, covered with dust, is virtually impossible. The screan is 2 inches  x 1,5 inches, and you have to be zoomed in to about 200m for you to be able to see where you are going. The icons is impossible to see, so any speed zones , danger zones is a no see event and you have to deal with it when you get there) Gavin (66) hit a culvert at about 120kph and was just lucky to have kept it upright....... ( so regte ooooooo fok dit was naby geval) heheheheheh

So off we went in the lead and on a roll. Into the mountain and at some stage I stopped and said to him, shit brother i do not know how many of the okes is gonna do this mountain stage , this is just insane, Alex was not joking.........

And then the first biker from in front..........................it was like you through us both with a bucket of cold ice water...............I told him, it was only one guy and that he may have been lost, but then a second and a third.......ooooooooooo F(*&^%$$

We stopped and I spoke to Roger, he confirmed to me that his heading and cap was right and that we were going the wrong direction.  I still could not believe it........then it dawned on me that Alex said that the light and rally tracks differed a little...... I told Gavin that maybe the light guys had to do the mountain stage the other way round as we were right on the gps........  After deliberating for about 10 min we made the decision to continue in this direction ( you will see I say "this direction" as we were technically not going the wrong direction according to our navigation system) as we did not have fuel to go back.   So we continued to the DSP.

At the DPS we were stopped and there was being asked if we could continue....after about 10 min again we were allowed to continue.  By this time Roger and another guy had passed us and we had some catching up to do......Man did we enjoy this, we "braaaaaaped" the hell out of the 501 and 450 to catch those buggers.....heheheheh.

Ended Day 2 SS first again made peace with the fact that we did go the wrong way and may be DQ.... but like any gps rider there was no indication of heading that can be used as a reverence........

We did not lodge a complaint as we felt the organizers needed to do what they felt was right as this is there race and we will take what comes our way.......no matter what we had a hell of a time........

The Gps is a very good idea, i would urge Alex to still use this as method for guys to get into the Rally seen.......There will always be stuff that goes wrong but that can be sorted and worked out......We only learn form our mistakes, how els??????

We had a great time and will def be back again hopefully "the right way round" next time... heheheheheheheheh

Had A Ball,,,, The Mocke Brothers (28) (66)
Keep it in the limiter........


Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 02, 2016, 04:17:11 pm
Nice to hear your Story Eben. And welcome to the forum! :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Hondsekierie on April 02, 2016, 08:11:12 pm
Human errors occur but the unfortunate part is that you have a skewed result where people paid pretty sums to participate.  Cancelling the Rally Lite version in future is a bit of a cop-out.  This is after all regarded as a professional event and not some fun, exploratory adventure ride where the rules can be amended to suit whomever.

According to any racing rules it should have been immediate disqualification even though the guys in front were the fast ones up till then (we however know that the fastest guy don't always win a navigational rally).  In hindsight the Race Director should have conveyed the DQ message to the DSP as he would have witnessed the whole thing going pear shaped from his chopper as it unfolded.

Very unfortunate but yes, Alex keeps on delivering the only proper navigational rally.  A marked improvement on the 2015 Amageza, this will hopefully become one of the official Dakar feeding events with huge numbers of international racers.  Would love to see Toby Price come trying his luck against our own Bonova :ricky:       

 

 

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rynet on April 03, 2016, 08:52:15 am
Human errors occur but the unfortunate part is that you have a skewed result where people paid pretty sums to participate.  Cancelling the Rally Lite version in future is a bit of a cop-out.  This is after all regarded as a professional event and not some fun, exploratory adventure ride where the rules can be amended to suit whomever.

According to any racing rules it should have been immediate disqualification even though the guys in front were the fast ones up till then (we however know that the fastest guy don't always win a navigational rally).  In hindsight the Race Director should have conveyed the DQ message to the DSP as he would have witnessed the whole thing going pear shaped from his chopper as it unfolded.

Very unfortunate but yes, Alex keeps on delivering the only proper navigational rally.  A marked improvement on the 2015 Amageza, this will hopefully become one of the official Dakar feeding events with huge numbers of international racers.  Would love to see Toby Price come trying his luck against our own Bonova :ricky:       

 


HSK where did this anger come from ? Please go and read the previous pages and you will see that the error of the Loop guys were not mainly human error , it was the the Lite system that failed in its purpose .  I took great care to explain in previous posts and I did that so that riders can get a better understanding, did you even read the previous posts dealing extensively with this issue ?

Did you see my post where I quoted the specific regulation that dealt with riding the route the wrong way ? Quoted here again :" Page 18 of the Regulations : Driving ( on the course) in the opposite direction to that of the official route carries a 10 minute penalty and at the discretion of the races stewards can be increased or lead to a disqualification" .


 The regulations that Alex uses are based on the Dakar’s own rules . Which “racing rules” do you want him to follow instead  ? MotoGP ?   How dare you say Alex should have DQ the Loop riders ? Not even in the Dakar is riding against the route an auto DQ.  Please refrain from trying to cause damage here on this thread or elsewhere, to Alex or the Baja/ Amageza .

You clearly have a strong feeling about this . Let me tell you that Alex also had strong feelings about this .  :biggrin:  If Alex had to make the decision based purely on strong feelings, then he may also have DQ ‘d the riders, but instead he and the Steward, John did the right thing and debated it extensively after taking all the factors into consideration , starting with perusing the regulations and the Lite System .

They also spoke to three of the Loop riders as well as with four of the fastest , most senior , most experienced Rally riders who actually took part in this race , and these four riders said that DQ is not needed in this particularly case . They were the ones who would have been most prejudiced by finding these riders riding from the other side and their scoring could have been prejudiced. So, the direct competition of the four Loop riders confirmed that DQ is not needed , why should Alex listen to you , as you were not even riding the event .


Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rynet on April 03, 2016, 09:04:44 am
Human errors occur but the unfortunate part is that you have a skewed result where people paid pretty sums to participate.  Cancelling the Rally Lite version in future is a bit of a cop-out.  This is after all regarded as a professional event and not some fun, exploratory adventure ride where the rules can be amended to suit whomever.

According to any racing rules it should have been immediate disqualification even though the guys in front were the fast ones up till then (we however know that the fastest guy don't always win a navigational rally).  In hindsight the Race Director should have conveyed the DQ message to the DSP as he would have witnessed the whole thing going pear shaped from his chopper as it unfolded.

Very unfortunate but yes, Alex keeps on delivering the only proper navigational rally.  A marked improvement on the 2015 Amageza, this will hopefully become one of the official Dakar feeding events with huge numbers of international racers.  Would love to see Toby Price come trying his luck against our own Bonova :ricky:       
 


I disagree with your statement that cancelling the Ralley Lite system is a cop-out .

   There are logical ,practical and logistical reasons why the Lite system's problems outweigh the benefits . As stated previously resources will have to be spent to improve the technology  , the training of the riders, extra staff to do the admin and the time –keeping at the event . And at the end of the day you still sit with two different groups of riders , where one group of riders cannot compare their times with the other group ,because two different systems were used, even a slightly different route .

  Why do you say that resources should be spent on making the Lite system better ? Don’t you think those resources should rather be spent on making the current Rally with Road book navigation better ?

   The sooner the novice ralley riders tap into buying and using a Road book the sooner they will get up to speed to real Rallying which is the Road book navigation  . How can a non RB rider stand a chance of qualifying for Dakar itself, if they don’t use the RB. No my friend , if anything , using the Lite system is a cop-out .  Anyway I had no influence on it being scrapped, the decision was made entirely by Alex . But the more I think about it the more I realise Alex is right . It is just not worth it  ,it detracts from the crux and spirit of what Rally is all about .



Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016 Updates
Post by: Ash001 on April 03, 2016, 01:03:49 pm
Kevin my trust worthy riding partner. BIG UPS for Kevin, I only hope I can still ride like he does at the age of 60. Was a pleasure to ride with him.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rolling Stone on April 03, 2016, 02:30:32 pm
Human errors occur but the unfortunate part is that you have a skewed result where people paid pretty sums to participate.  Cancelling the Rally Lite version in future is a bit of a cop-out.  This is after all regarded as a professional event and not some fun, exploratory adventure ride where the rules can be amended to suit whomever.

According to any racing rules it should have been immediate disqualification even though the guys in front were the fast ones up till then (we however know that the fastest guy don't always win a navigational rally).  In hindsight the Race Director should have conveyed the DQ message to the DSP as he would have witnessed the whole thing going pear shaped from his chopper as it unfolded.

Very unfortunate but yes, Alex keeps on delivering the only proper navigational rally.  A marked improvement on the 2015 Amageza, this will hopefully become one of the official Dakar feeding events with huge numbers of international racers.  Would love to see Toby Price come trying his luck against our own Bonova :ricky:        
 


I disagree with your statement that cancelling the Ralley Lite system is a cop-out .

   There are logical ,practical and logistical reasons why the Lite system's problems outweigh the benefits . As stated previously resources will have to be spent to improve the technology  , the training of the riders, extra staff to do the admin and the time –keeping at the event . And at the end of the day you still sit with two different groups of riders , where one group of riders cannot compare their times with the other group ,because two different systems were used, even a slightly different route .

  Why do you say that resources should be spent on making the Lite system better ? Don’t you think those resources should rather be spent on making the current Rally with Road book navigation better ?

   The sooner the novice ralley riders tap into buying and using a Road book the sooner they will get up to speed to real Rallying which is the Road book navigation  . How can a non RB rider stand a chance of qualifying for Dakar itself, if they don’t use the RB. No my friend , if anything , using the Lite system is a cop-out .  Anyway I had no influence on it being scrapped, the decision was made entirely by Alex . But the more I think about it the more I realise Alex is right . It is just not worth it  ,it detracts from the crux and spirit of what Rally is all about .




Talk about anger??
You are the official Amageza/Baja spokesperson here on the forum, are you not? Or are all these comments on here just your personal opinions?
It is a public forum and people will have opinions, sometimes we shoot from the hip and sometimes we should listen and try to understand what is being said and if it possibly has some value.
You may not always agree, but it will help to listen.
IMO if it was not for some harsh words and sound and sometimes not so sound advice handed out on this forum over the the last couple of years, Amageza would not be where it is today. It most probably would have died in 2012.
In the Past Alex would let us rant and rave and advise as much as we liked. I am sure he was reading all the posts and decided what to use or not to use. I am sure that a lot of valuable feedback came from Amageza threads.
What you are doing here is not exactly constructive either.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: 2StrokeDan on April 03, 2016, 05:45:48 pm
Has anybody here contacted GJ to hear what he has to say about this "misunderstanding"?

He was one of the riders going "upstream".
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 03, 2016, 06:25:49 pm
Has anybody here contacted GJ to hear what he has to say about this "misunderstanding"?

He was one of the riders going "upstream".

GJ already posted here. Im sure he would tell us his version if he wanted to. :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: rubiblue on April 03, 2016, 07:37:49 pm
Hi All

Here is the "wrong way round brothers" version of the BAJA :ricky:.

And then the first biker from in front..........................it was like you through us both with a bucket of cold ice water...............I told him, it was only one guy and that he may have been lost, but then a second and a third.......ooooooooooo F(*&^%$$

Had A Ball,,,, The Mocke Brothers (28) (66)
Keep it in the limiter........


Was great to meet you Eben. At the end and being the first biker that came the other way. I must say when I saw you I thought "oh vok" I made a booboo. But the road book made 100% sense. But the doubt sets in when a few more came after you. Someone had just come up that hectic uphill for you guys and said to me the road ahead is "fucking hectic". This reassured me as I was going down it, knew Alex would never send us up those on these bikes. You and boet can ride bikes proper. Congrats to both of you for riding a solid race,albeit some of it in the wrong direction. Hope to see you guys at the next one.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rynet on April 03, 2016, 07:41:23 pm
Human errors occur but the unfortunate part is that you have a skewed result where people paid pretty sums to participate.  Cancelling the Rally Lite version in future is a bit of a cop-out.  This is after all regarded as a professional event and not some fun, exploratory adventure ride where the rules can be amended to suit whomever.

According to any racing rules it should have been immediate disqualification even though the guys in front were the fast ones up till then (we however know that the fastest guy don't always win a navigational rally).  In hindsight the Race Director should have conveyed the DQ message to the DSP as he would have witnessed the whole thing going pear shaped from his chopper as it unfolded.

Very unfortunate but yes, Alex keeps on delivering the only proper navigational rally.  A marked improvement on the 2015 Amageza, this will hopefully become one of the official Dakar feeding events with huge numbers of international racers.  Would love to see Toby Price come trying his luck against our own Bonova :ricky:        
 


I disagree with your statement that cancelling the Ralley Lite system is a cop-out .

   There are logical ,practical and logistical reasons why the Lite system's problems outweigh the benefits . As stated previously resources will have to be spent to improve the technology  , the training of the riders, extra staff to do the admin and the time –keeping at the event . And at the end of the day you still sit with two different groups of riders , where one group of riders cannot compare their times with the other group ,because two different systems were used, even a slightly different route .

  Why do you say that resources should be spent on making the Lite system better ? Don’t you think those resources should rather be spent on making the current Rally with Road book navigation better ?

   The sooner the novice ralley riders tap into buying and using a Road book the sooner they will get up to speed to real Rallying which is the Road book navigation  . How can a non RB rider stand a chance of qualifying for Dakar itself, if they don’t use the RB. No my friend , if anything , using the Lite system is a cop-out .  Anyway I had no influence on it being scrapped, the decision was made entirely by Alex . But the more I think about it the more I realise Alex is right . It is just not worth it  ,it detracts from the crux and spirit of what Rally is all about .




Talk about anger??
You are the official Amageza/Baja spokesperson here on the forum, are you not? Or are all these comments on here just your personal opinions?
It is a public forum and people will have opinions, sometimes we shoot from the hip and sometimes we should listen and try to understand what is being said and if it possibly has some value.
You may not always agree, but it will help to listen.
IMO if it was not for some harsh words and sound and sometimes not so sound advice handed out on this forum over the the last couple of years, Amageza would not be where it is today. It most probably would have died in 2012.
In the Past Alex would let us rant and rave and advise as much as we liked. I am sure he was reading all the posts and decided what to use or not to use. I am sure that a lot of valuable feedback came from Amageza threads.
What you are doing here is not exactly constructive either.

RS this is funny , but you are barking up the wrong tree . Ask Alex who usually goes to him after a Rally with a laundry list of complaints and suggestions from the riders about how he can do the event better. At the Baja I spoke and listened to the people responsible for tents and cleaning , the caterers,  EMO , the photographers, the other Marshalls and as many of the riders I could and even some team managers . On this thread I specifically asked for discussions and made a list of issues raised  . Alex asks for this input and strives to improve the event year after year , and he succeeds in doing that . Currently he is up to speed with the complaints on this thread and thanked me for my handling it , but no I am not speaking in any official capacity as I have explained previously . When Alex’s Baja admin is over he will also read and deal with this thread .

Yes I was a bit short with HSK , because we have explained the Loop saga over and over and I feel it is done now .

You are still welcome to discuss . Ranting and raving is not encouraged .  ;)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rynet on April 03, 2016, 07:46:35 pm
Hi All

Here is the "wrong way round brothers" version of the BAJA :ricky:.

And then the first biker from in front..........................it was like you through us both with a bucket of cold ice water...............I told him, it was only one guy and that he may have been lost, but then a second and a third.......ooooooooooo F(*&^%$$

Had A Ball,,,, The Mocke Brothers (28) (66)
Keep it in the limiter........


Was great to meet you Eben. At the end and being the first biker that came the other way. I must say when I saw you I thought "oh vok" I made a booboo. But the road book made 100% sense. But the doubt sets in when a few more came after you. Someone had just come up that hectic uphill for you guys and said to me the road ahead is "fucking hectic". This reassured me as I was going down it, knew Alex would never send us up those on these bikes. You and boet can ride bikes proper. Congrats to both of you for riding a solid race,albeit some of it in the wrong direction. Hope to see you guys at the next one.

Thanks rubiblue, cool post and made me smile.  :biggrin:  You too EbenMocke , welcome to the forum .  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: 2StrokeDan on April 03, 2016, 07:47:16 pm
Has anybody here contacted GJ to hear what he has to say about this "misunderstanding"?

He was one of the riders going "upstream".

GJ already posted here. Im sure he would tell us his version if he wanted to. :thumleft:

Weet jy hoe hakkel daai man? It would take him a week to get to the refuel point where everything went pearshaped. :peepwall:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rynet on April 03, 2016, 07:48:52 pm
Has anybody here contacted GJ to hear what he has to say about this "misunderstanding"?

He was one of the riders going "upstream".

GJ already posted here. Im sure he would tell us his version if he wanted to. :thumleft:

Weet jy hoe hakkel daai man? It would take him a week to get to the refuel point where everything went pearshaped. :peepwall:

 :imaposer: :imaposer:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Bill the Bong on April 03, 2016, 09:12:30 pm
It seems from the guys that did the Lites class, that this format certainly has legs.  Maybe just not in conjunction with a rallye class, where both are competing for the same thing.  Determining an over-all winner becomes rather tricky.

But to me at least, it appears that a GPS-based long distance cross country race might have some kind of future.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: AlexRG on April 03, 2016, 09:13:01 pm
Hi,

To me this was a superb event and I loved every moment of it.

The best feeling was seeing how I improved on my Amageza 2015 experience (last of the finishers and coming in at night, dead tired... almost every night).

To echo what's been said in this thread - just get into it and learn how to work the navigation, there is no substitute for getting in on the deep end!

Gripes: ... a plan needs to be made on how to deal better with the quads and sideXside's... they are downright dangerous and the dust is insane. Maybe they should start like 2hrs earlier or something to minimize dealing with dust and overtaking? I have to say the riders/drivers were as courteous as can be and I did not have an issue with anyone in particular, but if the up-take and entries increase we'll sure have a bigger problem in future.

Cheers,
Alex RG


Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 03, 2016, 09:39:41 pm
Hopefully the bikes will be allowed to go first, then the quads and then an hour later the side by sides.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kamanya on April 03, 2016, 09:46:01 pm
Hopefully the bikes will be allowed to go first, then the quads and then an hour later the side by sides.

Every day!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on April 04, 2016, 12:05:16 am

****
Maybe a totally different look at the Lite vs Roadbook issue would be to make it Roadbook only but with +-90km refuel points.
It should be more than a Amageza qualifier, it must be a 'Try before you Buy' design.   >:D
****

As this is/must be/can be a feeder to Amageza the 2 SPECIAL stages must be of the same TECHNICAL spec as Amageza but minimal Liason.  I think the refuel point on day 2 worked quite well.  If I looked at the fuel level of the 'see through tanks' I am sure most were still more than half. (Ok, the DSP was only at km67 of leg1 ??) Now that the org have some info it might even be practical to have bulk fuel at two seperate DSP's.  Maybe the org must send out a questionnaire to the entrants w.r.t how many Jerries and how much fuel was decanted (amongst other things as post mortem) to get 'proper' stats.

It will almost halve the bike prep cost.  I think day 2 worked 100% in that respect.  The 'serious to win' riders will have a full 300km prepped bike and do not need to refuel where the 'do I like this S!@#t' will lose the two refuel times.  They will be back next year with a 300km range bike.

There are THREE simple factors to consider.  Money1, Money2 and Money3.

Money 1. (the Org)
Planning the event.  One boeviak with a 250km loop per day will be more cost effective both time, resources and logistics.  The route planning might be a bit more complex but all other factors will outweigh that.

Money 2. (the entries)
a) Prepping a 90km roadbook bike is MUCH more cost effective than a 300km type.
b) Allowing Twats and Side By Sides will attract additional riders.
c) Looking at the ACTUAL need for a SEPARATE CAP heading instrument an additional saving of more than R6 000.00 could be made. (The compulsory Etrex can be the CAP instrument)

Money 3. (all parties)
Rider running cost for the event.  I think the Baja single Bouviak was a huge success for both org and rider. You only needed to get 'there and back'. The more cost effective the event the more entries the cheaper, the more feed for Amageza bla bla bla.

Looking at (inaccurate) BIKE stats. 68 entries, 43 finishers. There was a close to 50/50 Lite/roadbook ratio. How many of these finishers will actually do the 2016 Amageza and how many the 2017? The Lite finishers must now spend R 35 000.00 on nav tower and 300km fuel to be Amageza ready.  Due to the 90km fuel range some Roadbook riders must now spend at least R10 000.00 for fuel tanks.

Just my worthless 1 Randella.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: White Rhino on April 04, 2016, 05:30:44 am
Road book holders take up a lot of physical space but gives a lot of valuable, often life saving information.

The GPS is very small with very limited information.

Could the future of Rally offer a heavy duty digital screen with tulips and road book information with the ability to digitally mark up and annotate be the way forward. This could work for Rally & Rally lite. Something about 4" X 3".
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Crossed-up on April 04, 2016, 07:10:12 am
We've been looking at electronic navigation systems and aids and it always boils down to how fragile they are. There are electronic roadbooks available, but imagine if you break it or it fails. At least with paper you can always make a plan.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on April 04, 2016, 08:32:24 am
We've been looking at electronic navigation systems and aids and it always boils down to how fragile they are. There are electronic roadbooks available, but imagine if you break it or it fails. At least with paper you can always make a plan.


I'v been researching the Paper vs digital Roadbook to death.  :biggrin:

Again, me thinks we must see the trees from the forest. First we need to look at the entrants and then their aspirations. Like in my post above the 'Race to win' vs the 'try before I buy' groups. The former will kit the machine with the 'correct' eq first the nav and then the range presuming it is a limited fuel event.  The latter group can use a digital book.

For me safety is first, so the issue of a broken roadbook is not the end of the world if a few safety rules are are in place like more pre-loaded waypoints etc.  You could even supply the paper roadbook to ALL riders and rent a fold up 'cradle' that can be McGuivered if really neccessary for that 0.1% chance.

BUT, I'm not sure the electronic roadbook will be much (if any) cheaper than the traditional paper holder. The Trippy now go for R 11 000.00 but there might be more cost effective options.

PS.
One of the options we evaluate here at Rockfox is to rent out a fully kitted out nav tower. (fixed or handlebar mount) 

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 04, 2016, 08:54:16 am
Please dont go for a paperless RB.

I have heard about this alternative to the ERTF. Holding thumbs you can get it sorted :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 04, 2016, 09:05:33 am
Please dont go for a paperless RB.

I have heard about this alternative to the ERTF. Holding thumbs you can get it sorted :thumleft:

Agree BB !
 "The job is not done until all the paper work is done"
Hard paper can not be easely influence by the weather conditions in space ( space weather, that is the  atmospheric weather from the earth's surface to anywhere in space including the suns own "weather" )
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on April 04, 2016, 09:40:42 am
Please dont go for a paperless RB.

I have heard about this alternative to the ERTF. Holding thumbs you can get it sorted :thumleft:

Agree BB !
 "The job is not done until all the paper work is done"
Hard paper can not be easely influence by the weather conditions in space ( space weather, that is the  atmospheric weather from the earth's surface to anywhere in space including the suns own "weather" )

That was my conclusion as well (see other freds on this forim), but there will always be 'technofreaks' that hope all will be solved with a battery and a screen.  ;D  I will always look for options to grow the sport.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kamanya on April 04, 2016, 10:32:52 am
....

http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/rally-navigator-create-rally-roadbooks-with-google-earth-and-gps.851881/page-22 (http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/rally-navigator-create-rally-roadbooks-with-google-earth-and-gps.851881/page-22)

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-sHGxr42IiQc/VDi591K_BhI/AAAAAAAAsY0/u6admKE6yAc/w1118-h629-no/690_dash.png)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rokie on April 06, 2016, 05:07:01 am
roadbook for kindle a possibility  :peepwall:(??) 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: 2StrokeDan on April 06, 2016, 07:23:11 am
Please dont go for a paperless RB.

I have heard about this alternative to the ERTF. Holding thumbs you can get it sorted :thumleft:

Shall we also stick with ignition points and carburettor? You will almost inevitably be asked this at some stage. :peepwall:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Cracker on April 06, 2016, 07:36:05 am
Please dont go for a paperless RB.

I have heard about this alternative to the ERTF. Holding thumbs you can get it sorted :thumleft:

Shall we also stick with ignition points and carburettor? You will almost inevitably be asked this at some stage. :peepwall:

Said in jest, no doubt, but not a stupid question - this one.

Currently you can use points, carbs, cdi and efi. Why not do the same with the RB?

Print the roll for those who want it and give the file to those with electronic gadgets. Real life testing will show the 'better' way.

I'm sure though, in time, points and carbs will be banned - and no doubt, so will the bog roll ...............
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kamanya on April 06, 2016, 07:46:28 am
A major issue with the electronic stuff at the moment is direct sunlight.

When in shadow or darker conditions they're fine, in direct sunlight they are unreadable. Add to that a fine layer of dust and there's nothing to see.

Kindle would be great idea.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 06, 2016, 08:00:23 am
. . . tot die weerlig naby slaan, dan staan al die onbeskermde  elektroniese toerusting, kaput !
Elektromagnetisme is nie n speelmaat met meeste automotiewe toerusting nie. Nie eens te praat van ander atmosferiese invloedmakers daarop nie.
Gee my o.a. papier padkaarte/boeke/roadbooks/papiernotas as die belangrikste basise roete navigasie hulpmiddel en ek gebruik dan daarna ander navigasie hulpmiddels. Dus , "safety first" geld by my.  Papier is geduldig.

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Bill the Bong on April 06, 2016, 08:28:12 am
Until you drown your bike and the roadbook.  Then the paper sucks.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 06, 2016, 08:43:07 am
Yes , dit het my al gebeur , # , die roadbook houer het ek daarna ge-mod en dit probeer water "splash/dump proof" te maak. Dit het gehelp  in gietende reen. Gelukkig nog nie die "dump" toets met die roadbook op die fiets gedoen nie. Alhoewel in n 3 minute emmerwatertoets by die huis, was dit O.K.
Vir my is daar meer "pro's" as "con's" met "roadbooking"
n Kompromie tussen beste en beter. Swakker is nie deel van die kompromie nie !
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 06, 2016, 01:37:49 pm
I continued to use a wet road book no problem after this
(https://bluebull2007.smugmug.com/Rally/Sertoes/Sertoes-other/i-M6dnRjk/0/L/untitled9large-L.jpg)
It still scrolled and my ink did not even run. It was soaked. Okay I had to help it a little so that it did not pull too tight, but it worked fine.

Call me old fashioned but paper rocks and Kindle's, EgoPhones & electronic stuff do not. ;D

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 06, 2016, 02:29:31 pm
BB, best said and demonstrated !
Cool pic ! with Springbokkie !
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 06, 2016, 02:55:22 pm
Embarrassing! Took me 45 minutes to get that damn thing working again.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 06, 2016, 03:19:27 pm
You wish a Waterbokkie then ? (Nyala , I think)
Water does not mix well with electrics and/or fuel or one or the other and add air to it , bad combinations: now fix that !
45 minutes , not bad BB
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: White Rhino on April 07, 2016, 03:45:56 am
Has anybody attempted to develop / invent a better way of getting the roadbook loaded with any degree of success?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kamanya on April 07, 2016, 07:16:23 am
Has anybody attempted to develop / invent a better way of getting the roadbook loaded with any degree of success?

http://www.aurora-rally.com/ (http://www.aurora-rally.com/)

These are pretty cool. Very tough. Held together by magnets and lots of cool features. Pricey! Many of the Upington guys have them.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on April 07, 2016, 08:08:20 am
Has anybody attempted to develop / invent a better way of getting the roadbook loaded with any degree of success?

The Rockfox roadbook have direct access to the drive belts once the lid is removed.  We took the one belt off to make the shaft turn easier and rolled the complete 400 tulip roadbook without much problems. It was a two person job, one holding the roll and one the winding.  During this process we looked at how a cradle for the roll could simplify the process.  We are now developing a simple 'clip on' holder to hold and align the paper for an easy one man operation.  We also use a plastic 'leader' to attach the paper to the shaft.

Removing the roll it is also much easier if the drive belt is slipped off.

And it is mmuucchh cheaper, smaller, lighter than ANYTHING on the market.  >:D
(Picture is before black powder coating)

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Bill the Bong on April 07, 2016, 09:30:53 am
Has anybody attempted to develop / invent a better way of getting the roadbook loaded with any degree of success?

I stand in front of the bike with the roll held on top of the RB holder.  Use a piece of electrical tape to stick the bottom of the paper roll to the buff tape extensions you have previously stuck to the bottom roller.  Turn the manual wheel 2 revolutions and then take over with the thumb controller.  Manipulate the tension and straightness by increasing pressure on the roll moving it sideways. 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 07, 2016, 01:06:49 pm
Adie, maak ene waarvan die tolle/rollers ,ens 'n los magasyn is wat apart is van die hoof kassie wat die dryfmeganismes, ratte, katrolle, dryfbelde, ens., n apparte kas is, m.a.w, die drydstelsel is los van die sub-kassie wat die papierrolle en tolle is , wat dan net inklip in die hoof-kas in.
n Mens kan dan  2 van die magasyn tiepe roller/tolle sub-kassie he en net dit uithaal en vervang, in-en-uit-klip met n ander ene waarvan die nuwe rol instruksies reeds ingerol is. So iets , dink ek sal beter werk want dan kan die inrolwerk ook weg, enige plek weg van die rallyfiets gedoen word.
Dan wanneer , se bv. by DSP n rol nuwe instruksies in die roadbook ingerol moet word, is dit n pyn, dan kan n ou met my voorstel, slegs net die reeds gevulde magasyn sub-kassie met die nuwe instuksies inklip, natuurlik klip jy die "gebruikte magasyn net eers eenvoudig uit.
Sal ook lekker werk wanneer dit reen , die wind sterk waai , ens.
Die magasyn kaartrol sub- kassie kan dan ook makliker waterdig gemaak word.

Onthou net, ek net 30%  wins met die verkope , plaaslik en internasionaal.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Dustman on April 07, 2016, 01:13:42 pm
Will it not work if you make something like a crank to turn the roller while guiding the paper with the other hand? (Like the handle of the pencil sharpener)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on April 07, 2016, 01:54:38 pm
@gser
Ons het daarna gekyk (cartrige model) maar die ekstra gewig (15% swaarder en 9% groter), kompeksieteit ens ens het dit onprakties gemaak.  Aurora gebruik magnete om aan te dryf so daar is geen 'clutch' of koppeling nie.  Hulle het basies ou modelvliegtuig tegnologie gebruik en dit aan die roadbook holder 'gepatenteer'.  Een van ons ontwerpe het die 'cartridge' die motor met dryf en al aangehad. Dit kon sywaarts uitgly.  In totaal was dit net 2mm per kant groter as ons huidige ontwerp. As ek reg onthou sou dit nogsteeds die kleinste en ligste eenheid wees.  >:D

Die twee hoof redes dat ons eers 'cartride less' gegaan het is 1) die Aurora patent, ek dink hulle het ook die 'Roadbook Cartridge' ge patenteer en dan eenvoud sodat ons sommer uit die staanspoor 'n beter produk kan lewer. Die enigste wysiging aan die eenheid gaan Policarb in plaas van Perspex vir deksel wees.

Ons idee was ook om die cartridge te 'laai' terwyl die roadbook opgemerk word.  Dit is egter nie so goeie idee want mens wil so 300 to 400mm van die rol op 'n slag sien. 

Die 'Loader' waarna ons kyk sal aan die holder haak en die papier gids sodat dit 'mooi' inloop. dit behoort op alle holders te werk. 
@Rhino, ons kyk na 'n tipe slinger om vinniger mee op te rol.  Die  probleem met 'n lang roadbook is dat dit 'afrol' as jou hand glip.  :(

Work in Progress.

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on April 07, 2016, 02:09:07 pm
Dankie Adie !
Geantwoord !
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on April 07, 2016, 02:10:42 pm
Adie that is really great stuff! :thumleft:

My only advice is to make it slightly wider to accommodate a wider road book which sometimes happens.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: White Rhino on April 08, 2016, 05:15:02 am
Has anybody attempted to develop / invent a better way of getting the roadbook loaded with any degree of success?

http://www.aurora-rally.com/ (http://www.aurora-rally.com/)
These are pretty cool. Very tough. Held together by magnets and lots of cool features. Pricey! Many of the Upington guys have them.

I looked at this model. Very cool and high-end engineering developed by a Greek engineer (PhD)!  :thumleft:

Adie - Your Roadbook ticks so many boxes. Best value for money. Well done. Proudly SA :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Rokie on April 08, 2016, 08:57:52 am
Interesting stuff from here: http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190818.0 (http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=190818.0)

More about Rally Comp:

The Rally Comp device (yellow box) will be key in navigating the Sonora Rally. In this shot I'm 0.48km from a WPM (hidden waypoint), and the arrow has popped up to guide me in to the exact point. The arrow pops up when you get within 800 meters (same as Dakar). Once you get within 50 meters you've "achieved" that point and the arrow disappears until you're close to the next WPM in order.

Another great feature of the Rally Comp is the "Pass Alert" function which allows cars to warn bikes or other cars they want to pass (same as Sentinel in Dakar). When the button is pressed in the faster vehicle, a LOUD beeper on the receiving vehicle triggers warning them of the presence of the another vehicle, and giving time for the slower vehicle to move over and make room for a safe pass.

There are MANY more functions in the Rally Comp including automatic timing and scoring, track recording, compass, odometer, and more. It's clear this device will make rally safer and more enjoyable for competitors, and easier to score for the rally organization. We're thrilled to be using it for all competitors in Sonora Rally



And I remember very well reading this part of your thread!!! My heart sank with your bike!!!

(https://bluebull2007.smugmug.com/Rally/Sertoes/Sertoes-other/i-M6dnRjk/0/L/untitled9large-L.jpg)

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Geel Kat on April 08, 2016, 09:19:27 am

Adie - Your Roadbook ticks so many boxes. Best value for money. Well done. Proudly SA :thumleft:


The Rockfox kit, roadbook holder and Trip/CAP worked really well  :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: tehdutchie on April 12, 2016, 10:58:53 pm
Any more videos that have been posted on youtube?

Loved the ones so far!! Seems like great terrain!!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: AlexRG on May 02, 2016, 07:00:46 pm
Hi,

I have x9 vids up on youtube... various small clips joined together... not to show my riding (LOL) but rather for those who did not make it to see the terrain...

Super Special (Prologue), Stage 1 Start, Superman fell, Stage 1 snippets, Stage 2 Dune fail, Stage 2 Dune win, Stage 2 Mountain Section (3 parts).

On this link: https://www.youtube.com/user/AlexRG76 (https://www.youtube.com/user/AlexRG76)

Cheers!

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on May 03, 2016, 10:17:57 pm
I really enjoyed watching those videos Alex, thanks a lot for posting them :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: AlexRG on May 04, 2016, 08:13:38 pm

Pleasure Neil! Would have been of no use to keep it to myself... Nice terrain hey?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Crossed-up on May 04, 2016, 09:18:56 pm
I really enjoyed watching those videos Alex, thanks a lot for posting them :thumleft:

Me too. Thanks.

I only went over that road in the Jeep but I remember every steep hill and nasty boulder so clearly when I look at the vid.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Tman21 on November 14, 2016, 02:56:00 pm
Where can I get more info on the race other than here : http://www.amageza.com/west-coast-baja

Looks like a cracker of an event!

I am pretty interested in this event, and if I have it correctly the 2018 Amageza should follow around 10-12 months later if you guys catch my drift?

What do I need, what sets the classes apart bike wise, 450 or 690? etc etc.  Thanks
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Crossed-up on November 14, 2016, 03:52:08 pm
If you want to know if the event will happen email info@amageza.com. At least you'll get on the mailing list.

More info is available on the 2016 event at http://www.amageza.com/west-coast-baja.

There's rumours that Amageza will be held in September next year, but nothing's certain yet. At one stage it was going to skip a year, but now it looks more likely we'll have one in 2017 after all. Let's hope.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Crossed-up on November 14, 2016, 03:55:49 pm
Classes are 450 and under, and above 450.  In 2016 some rode with roadbooks and some with GPS. There no saying if Alexander will continue with this format. It was supposed to be a qualifier event for Amageza, but GPS is not training for roadbook navigation.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Tman21 on November 14, 2016, 04:35:16 pm
Classes are 450 and under, and above 450.  In 2016 some rode with roadbooks and some with GPS. There no saying if Alexander will continue with this format. It was supposed to be a qualifier event for Amageza, but GPS is not training for roadbook navigation.

Thanks, Ive scouted this thread and the website.  Looks pretty cool, the roadbook is a tad bit intimidating I must say.  I will send a mail so that I can get the info.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on November 21, 2016, 07:27:15 pm
Did you maybe receive a reply Tman21?

I see last year entries opened in October and this year is very quiet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Crossed-up on November 21, 2016, 08:03:44 pm
There probably will not be a Baja next year. Keep your eyes open for another type of navigational challenge aimed at adventure bikes.

2017 Amageza will probably happen after all, but moved to September.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on November 21, 2016, 08:12:09 pm
Eish, feels like someone just kicked over my bucket(list).  :'( :'(
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Tman21 on November 21, 2016, 08:28:11 pm
Automatic response only!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: GraZer on November 21, 2016, 08:46:37 pm
Quote
There probably will not be a Baja next year. Keep your eyes open for another type of navigational challenge aimed at adventure bikes.

2017 Amageza will probably happen after all, but moved to September.

That is very disappointing to hear. Have been really looking forward to the Baja next year.
Should I now be planning to fit a large GPS in place of my roadbook?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on November 21, 2016, 09:10:43 pm
ktmkobus & GraZer: Come on guys, don't lose hope now. Just imagine a Baja that's a little bit longer. :deal:

GaZer you especially should be fine given your great 1st time performance at the Amageza this year! You did so awesomely! :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: gser on November 22, 2016, 06:47:52 am
To Alexander : Bring the West Coast Baja on . . . .
                         . . . .  and the Amageza 2017  . . .
                         the Europeans are also coming in mass . . . .
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Tman21 on November 22, 2016, 08:11:47 am
Anyone that competed this or last year that can give me a day by day breakdown of KM?

Im sitting with some cash and cant decide on a weapon. . . My 2015 250FE does not have enough sack to haul me around even if im only 92KG :ricky:

This year 1 prologue and 2 or 3 racing days?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: MaxThePanda on November 22, 2016, 10:30:18 am
Anyone that competed this or last year that can give me a day by day breakdown of KM?

Im sitting with some cash and cant decide on a weapon. . . My 2015 250FE does not have enough sack to haul me around even if im only 92KG :ricky:

This year 1 prologue and 2 or 3 racing days?

If enduro bike def look at 450/500. The 250 is tiny for that kind of distance - most days are 350-500km, but it's also the training, the roadbook prep, etc. and the mileage mounts up. I don't think there's much to choose between the 450 and 500 - they both work well. The 450's a bit more 'racy' and the 500 pulls tree stumps and longer gears better.

I think someone ran a 350 one year, and I believe they are pretty durable, but bear in mind that if you like the Baja you'll definitely want to do Amageza and that's not the little bike's forte.

I think the KTMs are the cheapest solution. You really can whack on the Acerbis 19l tank and a handlebar mounted roadbook setup and line up at the start. Done. That's how Rally Management Services do their rental bikes. Simpler is cheaper and often better. Less to go wrong, less to break, and less saving.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Dirty Fun on November 22, 2016, 10:47:39 am
Maybe I must give this a go on my 300 2t next year >:D
If a 125 can finish the Dakar, I don't really have a excuse.
Will maybe just have to make a plan with fuel range.  Does the bikes need to be on the road, like with rally bikes? I have natis papers, but not on the road currently. Can be done if need be.
I don't have the money for a extra bike :(
Possible or silly idea?
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: bonova on November 22, 2016, 10:55:49 am
Maybe I must give this a go on my 300 2t next year >:D
If a 125 can finish the Dakar, I don't really have a excuse.
Will maybe just have to make a plan with fuel range.  Does the bikes need to be on the road, like with rally bikes? I have natis papers, but not on the road currently. Can be done if need be.
I don't have the money for a extra bike :(
Possible or silly idea?

Needs to be on the road as there are liaison sections.
But jeez - Do it man! smash a big tank on.... run it a bit rich in mid to top range by lifting the needle one clip above usual? why not?
You will have to carry an acurate oil reserve for filling at fuel stations, and maybe a spare set of rings / top end and gaskets in case?
Then again - don't listen to me haha 
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Dirty Fun on November 22, 2016, 11:07:07 am
Maybe I must give this a go on my 300 2t next year >:D
If a 125 can finish the Dakar, I don't really have a excuse.
Will maybe just have to make a plan with fuel range.  Does the bikes need to be on the road, like with rally bikes? I have natis papers, but not on the road currently. Can be done if need be.
I don't have the money for a extra bike :(
Possible or silly idea?

Needs to be on the road as there are liaison sections.
But jeez - Do it man! smash a big tank on.... run it a bit rich in mid to top range by lifting the needle one clip above usual? why not?
You will have to carry an acurate oil reserve for filling at fuel stations, and maybe a spare set of rings / top end and gaskets in case?
Then again - don't listen to me haha

Thank you Bonova :thumleft:
I like the way you think :biggrin:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Tman21 on November 22, 2016, 02:08:29 pm
Might have found a solution, 200km drive after work tomorrow lets see what it brings!
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Bill the Bong on November 22, 2016, 02:22:18 pm
Alexander gave me dates for the Baja as well as the OTHER event already, so those two should be on.  Watch this space...

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Bill the Bong on November 22, 2016, 02:24:59 pm
Maybe I must give this a go on my 300 2t next year >:D
If a 125 can finish the Dakar, I don't really have a excuse.
Will maybe just have to make a plan with fuel range.  Does the bikes need to be on the road, like with rally bikes? I have natis papers, but not on the road currently. Can be done if need be.
I don't have the money for a extra bike :(
Possible or silly idea?

I have pretty much decided to use a 300 2T on the Baja. It just depends on how the regs are written.  I have a couple of other rallye bikes as well if I need to fall back  :)
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Kobus Myburgh on November 22, 2016, 03:08:22 pm
Alexander gave me dates for the Baja as well as the OTHER event already, so those two should be on.  Watch this space...

And you've obviously sworn not to say a thing .......

My blerrie nerves man. Bou ek verniet 'n bike of nie?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Dirty Fun on November 22, 2016, 03:24:57 pm
Alexander gave me dates for the Baja as well as the OTHER event already, so those two should be on.  Watch this space...

Great news :thumleft: :ricky:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Dirty Fun on November 22, 2016, 03:32:04 pm
Maybe I must give this a go on my 300 2t next year >:D
If a 125 can finish the Dakar, I don't really have a excuse.
Will maybe just have to make a plan with fuel range.  Does the bikes need to be on the road, like with rally bikes? I have natis papers, but not on the road currently. Can be done if need be.
I don't have the money for a extra bike :(
Possible or silly idea?

I have pretty much decided to use a 300 2T on the Baja. It just depends on how the regs are written.  I have a couple of other rallye bikes as well if I need to fall back  :)

Lekker :biggrin:
I will keep an eye on regs. Glad to hear a 300 2t may do the job and that I would possibly not be alone :thumleft:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Crossed-up on November 22, 2016, 04:36:10 pm
The last Baja didn't have a leg longer than about 110 km. That should suit the 300 2Ts just fine.

If there is to be a Baja then that is great news. Speak to us, Alexander.
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: GraZer on November 23, 2016, 11:41:55 am
Happy Days!

2017 Baja is on!!!

Quote
Good morning everyone!

I trust you are all rested, strong and ready to race!

I don't know how you feel, but I've had enough time to rest after Amageza. Time to go find a new track in a new mountain!

To kick things off, the 2017 West Coast Baja is ready for entries. Same location, Port Nolloth, Northern Cape Province, South Africa. Same dates: 18 - 20 March 2017. But different routes. This time we are making it slightly longer. At least 6 hours in the saddle for the fastest rider. So more like the 2016 Amageza Rallye Special Sections. Fuel requirements are 275km for Rally and 150km for Lite. Yep, the 'Lite' category is still there. We have had no complaints regarding the racing of ATV's (quads) with the bikes, so they stay. But, unfortunately the SSV's are gone. Safety concerns after the 2016 West Coast Baja and the lack of interest from that sector of motorsport has let to their exclusion from the 2017 West Coast Baja.

Now, please keep in mind that we have awesome relations with the owners of the land in the area we intend racing on, so I urge you not to plan extensive training missions to that area. Keep in mind the reconnoitering clause in the SR's. Speaking of :  The website and SR's are being fine tuned to fit the 2017 West Coast Baja and will be available by this weekend.

So what has changed:

Longer stages.
No more SSV class vehicles.
No bivouac or meals. You stay where you want. The start and finish will be a static DSP and will be close to town.
You will receive your next stage road book immediately at the end of each stage.
Briefings will be at a predetermined location every evening.
A road book is no longer included in the rally-class entry fee, but purchased separately.
There will be spectator points published prior to the race.
Early Bird Special NOW OPEN !!

From today (23 Nov '16) until 7 Dec '16 :  R6 270 Vat incl. (bike entry) , thereafter it will be the full price at R8 447,40. The special for ATV's is R6 897.00, and from 8 December, R9 292.14. For this period only - 5 paid entries from 1 team will receive 1x free Assistance Vehicle entry.

So fetch your double-hail walk-gun and go raid your piggy-bank! You don't have 'baja' time!!

Cheers,
Alexander
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on November 23, 2016, 11:57:54 am
Ha, you beat me to it Jonathan! ;D

:thumleft:

:thumleft:

:thumleft:

:thumleft:

 :hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2:

 :blob5: :blob5:

 :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky: :ricky:

Someone Start a 2017 thread...  :deal:

Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Weedkiller - Adie on November 23, 2016, 11:58:57 am
Happy Days!

2017 Baja is on!!!


Now I must re-think things due to no SSV's.  Seems as if my aim to do at least one event on a bike 'is forced apon me'  >:D

Adie
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: BlueBull2007 on November 23, 2016, 12:00:05 pm
Adie: Talk to Alexander. He is a reasonable man when he not the race director on the day :deal:
Title: Re: West Coast Baja 2016
Post by: Cracker on November 23, 2016, 12:29:21 pm
Happy Days!

2017 Baja is on!!!


Now I must re-think things due to no SSV's.  Seems as if my aim to do at least one event on a bike 'is forced apon me'  >:D

Adie

fix the diff and tie a pole to the steering and you got a quad - you think?  ;D