Wild Dog Adventure Riding

Riding: Plan, Report and Racing => Racing Section => Topic started by: I&horse on October 25, 2009, 07:35:37 am

Title: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 25, 2009, 07:35:37 am
Atter doing the Goudinie funduro on Uiltije's farm ( :thumleft: Uiltjie) yesterday I realised that MX bikes are not meant for enduro's. I ended up deflating my tyres to soften the setup.
The power delivery and the gearbox is also not ideal for this type of riding and I ended up stalling the bike regularly and nearly saw my .... a few times!

So I think I'll keep my trusty old KX250 stroker for Z7 and look for and enduro bike. The problem is my budget is quite small (R30k).

It MUST have a happy button.

1) From what year did the KTM 300 get electric start?

2) Is it only the Honda's that suffer from valve problems or is it a 4-stroke thing?

3) It seems like the KTM's have the best suspension in this class. Is that true?
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Uiltjie on October 25, 2009, 07:45:31 am
Atter doing the Goudinie funduro on Uiltije's farm ( :thumleft: Uiltjie) yesterday I realised that MX bikes are not meant for enduro's. I ended up deflating my tyres to soften the setup.
The power delivery and the gearbox is also not ideal for this type of riding and I ended up stalling the bike regularly and nearly saw my .... a few times!

So I think I'll keep my trusty old KX250 stroker for Z7 and look for and enduro bike. The problem is my budget is quite small (R30k).

It MUST have a happy button.

1) From what year did the KTM 300 get electric start?

2) Is it only the Honda's that suffer from valve problems or is it a 4-stroke thing?  They all do! 

3) It seems like the KTM's have the best suspension in this class. Is that true? Could be, most probably.

Do a search on WDs, this was covered a while ago.  A lot of riders prefer MX bikes, as they have more snappy power at hand, and are much lighter.  My son for instance, swaps a happy buttom for weight......

Thanx for coming, it was a lekka day...... :thumleft:
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 25, 2009, 08:38:45 am

Do a search on WDs, this was covered a while ago.  A lot of riders prefer MX bikes, as they have more snappy power at hand, and are much lighter.  My son for instance, swaps a happy buttom for weight......

Thanx for coming, it was a lekka day...... :thumleft:

I'm hoping a softer suspension and longer gear ratio would make up for my lack of skills, am I fooling myself?

BTW, where do we get the photo's that were taken on the course? I don't see anything on the blog.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Uiltjie on October 25, 2009, 12:13:48 pm

Do a search on WDs, this was covered a while ago.  A lot of riders prefer MX bikes, as they have more snappy power at hand, and are much lighter.  My son for instance, swaps a happy buttom for weight......

Thanx for coming, it was a lekka day...... :thumleft:

I'm hoping a softer suspension and longer gear ratio would make up for my lack of skills, am I fooling myself?

BTW, where do we get the photo's that were taken on the course? I don't see anything on the blog.

Busy uploading, check Cape Enduro forum.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 26, 2009, 03:38:49 pm
Ermmm....

Does anyone know from which year the KTM 300 came with a happy button?
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: shark_za on October 26, 2009, 04:00:53 pm
2008 was the first one, the model designation is 300 XC-WE or XC-E
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: 2 Stroke Dan on October 26, 2009, 07:31:24 pm
On 2stroke kicking is fine, 4stroke happy button a must! KTM300 still primarily kickstart, very light elec. start circuit, for when
you're in that tight gulley.
A real Enduro bike is much less tiring in a Enduro, more pulling power low down and lower 1st. gear ratio. Usually less prone
to headshake due to frame geometry which means rider can relax a bit more.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Uiltjie on October 26, 2009, 09:51:23 pm
On 2stroke kicking is fine, 4stroke happy button a must! KTM300 still primarily kickstart, very light elec. start circuit, for when
you're in that tight gulley.
A real Enduro bike is much less tiring in a Enduro, more pulling power low down and lower 1st. gear ratio. Usually less prone
to headshake due to frame geometry which means rider can relax a bit more.

Very true, but if you look at the Regional and National circuit, more and more riders prefer MX bikes, for their weight and snappy power.  A gearing or gearbox change to longer ratio helps, but not a neccessity.  Not every rider can/wants to do 160km/h on an Enduro track, so, MX max speed of 120km/h is more than enough.  Average enduro speed is 45km/h, off road average speed 65km/h.

At the Goudinie Funduro, my son (who built the track and obviously knows it like back of his hand) and the best rider, did it at an average speed of 66km/h.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: shark_za on October 26, 2009, 09:54:37 pm
66kph is not enduro speeds.
National Offoad averages maybe.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Uiltjie on October 26, 2009, 10:05:33 pm
66kph is not enduro speeds.
National Offoad averages maybe.


That is what I said......

Average enduro speed is 45km/h, off road average speed 65km/h.


I also said that the best rider here (former National rider) for the day, and the builder/owner/designer of the track did it at 66km/h, NOT EVERYBODY!
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Uiltjie on October 26, 2009, 10:09:00 pm
I might just add that they did it after the Funduro at their own leisure, not with the kids/novices/lady riders on the track.  The track was closed at that stage, before you get off your rocker again.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: 2 Stroke Dan on October 27, 2009, 06:37:38 am
I fully agree with your speed estimates, and you are right about most guys using MX bikes, but I think that MX bikes are just more available
in especially the 2nd hand market.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Mark Hardy on October 27, 2009, 06:44:42 am
What about maintenence?

Would a MX bike used for enduros and off road races need more maintenence than a enduro bike.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: shark_za on October 27, 2009, 07:00:42 am
I would not say so.
It usually done on hours with the same specifications.

Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 27, 2009, 07:38:40 am
Maintenance is not my worry, but rather which bike will make it easiest for someone with my lack of skill.

I rode 2 enduro bikes, a 450 and a 250 2T after the race, and it seems like the softer suspension and taller gears make for easier riding. My MX bike's suspension just felt too hard so I got arm pump and I had to change gears all the more often because of the close ratio box.

I think in the hands of a pro, an MX bike wins.

Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: shark_za on October 27, 2009, 07:44:43 am
The top guys ride lighter MX bikes with modded suspension and different sprockets.

Watching the average guy ride up Aloes or the V on a MX bike is frustrating. Passing is hard in the tech stuff.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Woestersous on October 29, 2009, 10:25:05 am
Bought this yesterday, does not make sense at all as a enduro bike but it's red and gives me a silly grin :biggrin:  Need to service it, give some tlc and perhaps revalve fork, got it for goooood price, so I can spend a little on extras, pity that Hyde does not mak pipe protector for this bike.http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/9379/cr250r1.jpg (http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/9379/cr250r1.jpg)
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: 2 Stroke Dan on October 29, 2009, 06:44:53 pm
Wow! Geluk met die aankoop, jammer oor die Honda!
Speel sommer, Macassar en Bapsfontein die naweek.
Praat met Stroke-her.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Wolweseun on October 29, 2009, 08:01:03 pm
Get an Enduro bike and laugh at the MX bikes as you pass them battling in the gnarly sections

MX bike gear ratio is wrong and suspension is to hard
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: 2 Stroke Dan on October 29, 2009, 08:33:24 pm
Exactly! that, after all is why one is called an Enduro and the other a MX bike.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Mark Hardy on October 29, 2009, 09:23:19 pm
Have a good look at a WR 250. I reccon they are the best little enduro bikes around (my personal opion) excellent suspension, light,  good strong motor, spares are relativly inexpensive and readily available, reliable bike all round ....and has more than enough power and grunt to enjoy.

I had a nice little play on a XY250 and a WR 250 recently....for me the WR wins hands down for the weekend fun enduro riders.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Sláinte Mhaith on October 29, 2009, 09:30:18 pm
Have a good look at a WR 250. I reccon they are the best little enduro bikes around (my personal opion) excellent suspension, light,  good strong motor, spares are relativly inexpensive and readily available, reliable bike all round ....and has more than enough power and grunt to enjoy.

I had a nice little play on a XY250 and a WR 250 recently....for me the WR wins hands down for the weekend fun enduro riders.

Ridden the WR250 and KDX200. Between the two of them I preferred the latter.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Mark Hardy on October 29, 2009, 09:35:42 pm
cool...will give it a try when I can find one here in zululand. the only kawa I have seen at the fun enduros is the new 450.... :o that thing is a beast. huge power, absolutly insane bike to ride. Too much for me.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Jayman on October 30, 2009, 06:59:05 am
 My 5 cents

An enduro bike is better for the average joe not racing and enjoying ourides, weekend.
The electric start is + which the mx dont have. The gearing on the mx bike is different , the cam profile is also diffrent, where the Enduro's have more torque on bottom and the Mx on top.

The mx bike require diffrent gearing, flywheel , susp , 18 inch etc etc etc. But when thats sorted you have a racing machine thats light and fast.

I would go for the WR 250, I am a big Yamaha fan. They r strong, parts not to expensive and seem to last forever when well maintained.  The KDX 200 is also an option.

For the pocket , get a enduro bike
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: shark_za on October 30, 2009, 07:23:38 am
Have you won the WFO series yet?
Or is it going down to Richmond ?
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 30, 2009, 07:59:53 am
WR250 is the 4-stroke right? I'm heavy so a 450 may be the answer NO?

I assume the WR250 comes with a happy button.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: shark_za on October 30, 2009, 08:07:18 am
WR has happy button and is 4T.

The 450 feels a lot heavier than the 250, the 250 is almost like a 2-stroke in weight.
The power is like a 200 2-stroke though.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: NIEKIE on October 30, 2009, 12:51:07 pm
IH i am in the learning process. I have a RMZ 450 (4 yrs now). Liked it, bought it when I did not do any much home work and was going to ride weekends.

I now got bitten a bit by the race thing. Did a race or two (more off road than enduro) and found the bike not well. Stiff suspension etc etc. Started looking for enduro bike. Looked at the 300 XCW but could not find one and seems like they are pre sold (new ones). I eventually settled for a 200 XCW. No happy button but starting is a breeze so far. Got it last week and rode first time last weekend. I like it very much. More than enough power. I think the 2 stroke gogga bit me. It is so light and handles like a dream.

For me it feels like a light 2 stroke is the way to go for enduro. Maybe on the off road races I'll run out of legs against the 4 strokes but I am not planning to win, just to enjoy.

Light is the answer. Enduro bike is the answer. MX is MX for a reason.

My 2c worth
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 30, 2009, 01:28:08 pm
I must also add that my KX hasn't had a lot of money spent on it lately, so the kick start is worn out and no longer square with the bike. Kicking it with wet muddy boots is a mission.
I'm also vertically challenged which makes it even more interesting when standing in a dip.

I think a happy button is a must for those times where you stalled in an akward place.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on October 30, 2009, 03:50:48 pm
Would a 525 be too heavy for enduro's? JohnST's bike fits right in my budget
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: B.V. on October 31, 2009, 07:27:59 am
Would a 525 be too heavy for enduro's? JohnST's bike fits right in my budget

yes. But it will work for offroad racing.
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: Jayman on November 02, 2009, 09:22:56 am
Have you won the WFO series yet?
Or is it going down to Richmond ?


Hi Shark

I had bike problems and lost to much time. I finished the race in 11 th place, thats realy bad compared to the other races. Well, its racing!!!!

I still managed to win the championship by 170 points. Next year I am entering the 200cc class.
Now its time for the roof
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: topbox on November 02, 2009, 09:26:29 am
WR250 is the 4-stroke right? I'm heavy so a 450 may be the answer NO?

I assume the WR250 comes with a happy button.

why did you leave so early ?

i got to ride the YZ250 2stroke with WR parts on it
and wr250 and 450
Title: Re: Which Enduro bike to buy??
Post by: I&horse on November 02, 2009, 09:50:08 am
WR250 is the 4-stroke right? I'm heavy so a 450 may be the answer NO?

I assume the WR250 comes with a happy button.

why did you leave so early ?

i got to ride the YZ250 2stroke with WR parts on it
and wr250 and 450

Pity I missed out

I was supposed to be home at 10h00, only left Zone 7 at 10h15, not a good move.... :-\.

Did you know about all the new fences they put up for the new highway they're building?
I spent another 1/2 hour riding up and down the new fences looking for a way to get through. In the process I found a lot of new paadjies to be explored in more detail. :mwink:

I guess it's going to be the 3-stroke in the end, it seems like the best compromise as far as enduro bikes go and I'm not keen on the maintenance costs of a 4-stroke.