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Offline bikegeklap

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New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« on: August 09, 2013, 02:05:47 pm »
Fellow Dogs.
Following a discussion on “tank slap” some time ago on BMW 1200 GS,
Thought you would want to know that the 2014 spec will include a steering damper like the  KTM 1190. This must be a mod. I would get the “new spec” should I purchase one today…

Is that BMW admitting that the bike would give tank slap???  ???
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Offline McEloff

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2013, 02:11:07 pm »
Interesting news...
I just googled it and found a list of all the changes (the rest seems to be software related)
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/bmw-announces-the-2014-upgrades-for-r1200gs-62964.html
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Offline Adventurer

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2013, 02:16:58 pm »
Surely they should retrofit all current models then as well?
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Offline bikegeklap

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2013, 02:23:19 pm »
That would be interesting... as that is clear indication a "potential tank slap" was expected..

I will speak to the sales man on the weekend and report if current models will get mod as well..

It will be interesting to see what they do in SA... and treat it as recall and get it fixed...
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Offline >Herman<

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2013, 02:41:45 pm »
Surely they should retrofit all current models then as well?

I agree!

Offline BikerJan

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2013, 02:52:24 pm »
 
Surely they should retrofit all current models then as well?

I agree!

 :patch: I have done just less than 3000 km's on my 1200 LC, the terrain varied greatly, most of it was done on gravel, twee spoor paadjies and relatively sandy roads. I have not experienced any instability whatsoever. I can see no reason why a steering damper will be fitted.
 

Offline bikegeklap

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2013, 02:55:26 pm »
I took the bike for a test ride this Saturday past...
I would agree with you... I dont understand why they would do this as the bike did not give reason to make a change...

However the change is inevitable... all 2014 spec will have it fitted ...

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Offline GSing

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2013, 08:23:22 pm »
Surely they should retrofit all current models then as well?

I agree!

As BMW will ever do that...???
 

Offline Jondu

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2013, 08:57:50 pm »
Surely they should retrofit all current models then as well?

I agree!

As BMW will ever do that...???

Hoop so

 

Offline SGB

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2013, 02:19:25 pm »
Looking at those pics, a retrofit will be quite costly.
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Offline SGB

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #10 on: August 31, 2013, 07:56:51 pm »
Fellow Dogs.
Following a discussion on “tank slap” some time ago on BMW 1200 GS,
Thought you would want to know that the 2014 spec will include a steering damper like the  KTM 1190. This must be a mod. I would get the “new spec” should I purchase one today…

Is that BMW admitting that the bike would give tank slap???  ???


I am sure BMW would admit to the bike potentially giving a "tank slap".  Most bikes can potentially do it.  We should differentiate between tank slap and head shake.   Mine has done a few head shakes, and it does come as a surprise if not expected.  But since then, by some experimenting, I have determined that the bike does not like too much mass on the front.  And since I have been applying my frame a little further back on the bike, the issue seems to have largely disappeared. 
I would still like a steering dampener just for a little extra comfort.
The head shake seems to be initiated by a hole or some road irregularity, and the worst thing one can do when it happens is to close the throttle.  All the mass then goes to the front and the shake develops into a slap.  But leaning back a little and opening the throttle "lightens" the front end and you ride it out.

Did some repeated runs on the same surface and we were able to simulate the difference in handling quite repeatably.  It is not an exact science however.  I think that BMW did well with the bike.  They got most of it spot-on.  This issue needs some attention, and it does carry a lot of press due to the "scariness" factor.  I am still thinking and riding to better define the issue.    I have a feeling that proper tyres will also help a bit.  The stock tyres do not instil confidence.... 

We also have to remember that the previous 1200's were not immune to the issue.  The 1200's have always been a little less stable on the straights, but cornered better due to the steeper steering head and reduced trail.  The geometry of the front end has not changed.  Only the engine moved a little forward and the swing arm is longer.  All of this is in the pot and still cooking....
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Offline Callie GS

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2013, 08:42:37 pm »
Fellow Dogs.
Following a discussion on “tank slap” some time ago on BMW 1200 GS,
Thought you would want to know that the 2014 spec will include a steering damper like the  KTM 1190. This must be a mod. I would get the “new spec” should I purchase one today…

Is that BMW admitting that the bike would give tank slap???  ???


I am sure BMW would admit to the bike potentially giving a "tank slap".  Most bikes can potentially do it.  We should differentiate between tank slap and head shake.   Mine has done a few head shakes, and it does come as a surprise if not expected.  But since then, by some experimenting, I have determined that the bike does not like too much mass on the front.  And since I have been applying my frame a little further back on the bike, the issue seems to have largely disappeared. 
I would still like a steering dampener just for a little extra comfort.
The head shake seems to be initiated by a hole or some road irregularity, and the worst thing one can do when it happens is to close the throttle.  All the mass then goes to the front and the shake develops into a slap.  But leaning back a little and opening the throttle "lightens" the front end and you ride it out.

Did some repeated runs on the same surface and we were able to simulate the difference in handling quite repeatably.  It is not an exact science however.  I think that BMW did well with the bike.  They got most of it spot-on.  This issue needs some attention, and it does carry a lot of press due to the "scariness" factor.  I am still thinking and riding to better define the issue.    I have a feeling that proper tyres will also help a bit.  The stock tyres do not instil confidence.... 

We also have to remember that the previous 1200's were not immune to the issue.  The 1200's have always been a little less stable on the straights, but cornered better due to the steeper steering head and reduced trail.  The geometry of the front end has not changed.  Only the engine moved a little forward and the swing arm is longer.  All of this is in the pot and still cooking....

 ??? ;D ;D
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Offline Titanic

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2013, 03:06:12 pm »
I thought these tank slap episodes were blown out of proportion, but check this articles. Totally unrelated to BMW or tank slapping.
It was part of a report on the Econo run:
http://www.iol.co.za/motoring/bikes-quads-karts/rfs-bike-econorun-is-not-for-sissies-1.1571794#.UiXbaz_SkrM
*****
The only casualty was veteran racer Reg Gurnell, who got into a huge tank-slapper on a brand new, liquid-cooled BMW R1200 GS late on the first day; he rode it out, but by then the bike was off the road and it spat him off as the front wheel hit the ditch. Gurnell walked away with a sprained wrist and a bruised elbow, and spent the rest of the 2013 Econorun making rude comments at the rest of the riders.
 

Offline Gryshond

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2013, 07:17:08 am »
The whole tankslap business has been blown out of all proportion. I experienced some instability on mine when slowing down from 90 km/h and letting go of the handlebar. This was completely gone once those terrible tourance tyres were replaced.
 

Offline COLES

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2013, 08:12:35 am »

BMW GS 1200 L C

TAKEN DELIVERY OF MY RED L C THURSDAY LAST WEEK FOR ME JUST A GREAT MOTOR CYCLE THE RIDERS THAT HAVE RECOVERED FROM THE SO CALLED TANK SLAP MUST BE REAL EXPERTS AT RIDING MOTOR CYCLE

SPEED ON BROTHERS HELL AINT HALF FULL
 

Offline Gryshond

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2013, 08:49:44 am »
I thought these tank slap episodes were blown out of proportion, but check this articles. Totally unrelated to BMW or tank slapping.
It was part of a report on the Econo run:
http://www.iol.co.za/motoring/bikes-quads-karts/rfs-bike-econorun-is-not-for-sissies-1.1571794#.UiXbaz_SkrM
*****
The only casualty was veteran racer Reg Gurnell, who got into a huge tank-slapper on a brand new, liquid-cooled BMW R1200 GS late on the first day; he rode it out, but by then the bike was off the road and it spat him off as the front wheel hit the ditch. Gurnell walked away with a sprained wrist and a bruised elbow, and spent the rest of the 2013 Econorun making rude comments at the rest of the riders.

I suspect that as soon as someone runs out of talent on the new bike they will blame the famed tank slapper issue.
 

Offline BlingKing

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2013, 10:17:44 am »
I thought these tank slap episodes were blown out of proportion, but check this articles. Totally unrelated to BMW or tank slapping.
It was part of a report on the Econo run:
http://www.iol.co.za/motoring/bikes-quads-karts/rfs-bike-econorun-is-not-for-sissies-1.1571794#.UiXbaz_SkrM
*****
The only casualty was veteran racer Reg Gurnell, who got into a huge tank-slapper on a brand new, liquid-cooled BMW R1200 GS late on the first day; he rode it out, but by then the bike was off the road and it spat him off as the front wheel hit the ditch. Gurnell walked away with a sprained wrist and a bruised elbow, and spent the rest of the 2013 Econorun making rude comments at the rest of the riders.

I suspect that as soon as someone runs out of talent on the new bike they will blame the famed tank slapper issue.

That is a bit of a broad brush stroke, given that you weren't there  :deal:

The episode was witnessed by Glynese de Villiers, who was right behind Reg and it is as reported. Glynese is a Superbike/Safety Instructor who many on this forum will attest to being embarrassed by when she beats them on her GS which she instructs with at Superbike School, i.e. no clown on the subject of bike behavior.

Reg is a multiple overall winner of the Economy Run, Boxer Cup, Botts and Superbike racer so running out of talent on a straight piece of newly tarred road at 108 Km/h on the GPS, nah don't think so.
Everyone knows how fiercely loyal I am to the BMW brand, however in this occasion the blame rests firmly with the bike.
In Reg's own words the handlebar literally wrenched out of his hand. (Yes hand he only had one resting lightly on the right hand bar on cruise control) and the resulting vicious (his words) tank slap is what sent him off the side of the road.
He almost recovered it but then hit a drainage 'donga' and that was the end of that Class win for our team.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2013, 10:20:34 am by BlingKing »
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Offline BikerJan

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2013, 10:25:53 am »

*****
In Reg's own words the handlebar literally wrenched out of his hand. (Yes hand he only had one resting lightly on the right hand bar on cruise control) and the resulting vicious (his words) tank slap is what sent him off the side of the road.

Is this not maybe what is the cause of the problem? Guys riding with cruise control on, with no hands on the handle bar, or only 1 hand very lightly on the handle bar? Maybe the old 1200 would have done the same thing with cruise control, or maybe any bike for that matter?
 

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2013, 10:30:51 am »

*****
In Reg's own words the handlebar literally wrenched out of his hand. (Yes hand he only had one resting lightly on the right hand bar on cruise control) and the resulting vicious (his words) tank slap is what sent him off the side of the road.

Is this not maybe what is the cause of the problem? Guys riding with cruise control on, with no hands on the handle bar, or only 1 hand very lightly on the handle bar? Maybe the old 1200 would have done the same thing with cruise control, or maybe any bike for that matter?

I'll tell you - the Explorer is ROCK solid at cruise control speeds (anything above 80 kph, can't set it lower).  However, at 30 kph and decelerating, with no hands on the bars it had a fairly concerning shake on the bars with pretty well-worn stock tyres.  New tyres sorted that out, but I can only imagine that tyres and / or suspension setup would play a part in the GS's headshake?
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Offline BlingKing

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Re: New BMW R1200 GS (2013) “Tanks slap”
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2013, 10:34:27 am »

*****
In Reg's own words the handlebar literally wrenched out of his hand. (Yes hand he only had one resting lightly on the right hand bar on cruise control) and the resulting vicious (his words) tank slap is what sent him off the side of the road.

Is this not maybe what is the cause of the problem? Guys riding with cruise control on, with no hands on the handle bar, or only 1 hand very lightly on the handle bar? Maybe the old 1200 would have done the same thing with cruise control, or maybe any bike for that matter?

Well then why isn't there a friggin warning sticker on the tank that says ONLY OPERATE THIS MOTORCYCLE WITH BOTH HANDS ON THE WOBBLY HANDLEBARS!!!!
I ride a large of portion of the Economy Run with NO hands on the handlebars (some idjits will do anything to be aerodynamic!) I've never had a problem except for this year on the 700GS, but that I accept 3.3 Bars in the tyres and suspension turned up max pre-load will do that to you. Reg had his tyre pressure at normal 2.7/2.5.

I often cruise on my Adventure with cruise control, feet on forward pegs, no hands on handle bars. I have never had a wobble ever on any of my 19 Adventures?  :dontknow:
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