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Author Topic: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013  (Read 58479 times)

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Offline KiLRoy

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #680 on: December 03, 2013, 01:54:55 pm »
Allan - plse dont spoil the spineless' argument with facts :biggrin:
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #681 on: December 03, 2013, 02:03:14 pm »
Busy morning here in Midrand, COC SANRAL
The minister of transport (Dipoa I think) was here and many other VIP's
We had to park our vehicles and other stations coverd our area so that the media could see the emergency vehicles and other services offered by SANRAL with regrds to road service.

Driving in the emergency lane on either side unfortunately doesn't work, nou way around the gate other than avoiding it at all.

If you sell a car or if it is written of it is your responsibility to remove the tag. The tag is linked to a specific car and owner. Once it's written off you should rather if possible remove the tag and go to a service centre in person and disable or allocate to another vehicle. Simple straight forward if you go in and do it in person. I do not trust the 'phone in transactions'. E mail is also affective, you will get a 'reply confirmation' e mail.

If SANRAL maintain the roads like they currently do and keep the cost low (like the 'special opening prices') it shoul work and the Country can upgrade the whole road system. I overheard many conversations here in favour of SANRAL. In 2008 the R21 and many other roads were only 2 lanes. Now it is even up to 5 lanes with added safety like lights, cameras and ems services.

What is road safety worth? Have you ever been involved in a bad accident or broke rims or mags in potholes?

I still don't like the idea too much because it is hurting my pocket as well, 2 x gates a day and petrol is going up again. But I have been here and heard the arguments in defence'. One thing is clear, not all is bad.

To buy a tag still is not compulsory, but it will make live easier in the end it seems and this; 'you have signed an agreement with them' is a stupid argument. You are under no obligation to top up after you have registered. If your prepaid account runs dry you will just get billed on your number plates like the other who never registered. I will wait it out a bit and see, as long as you pay your bill within 7 days it wount cost you more. You can cancell an account at any time as well. I have asked, they are gatvol for all my questions already :)

Thanks for the feedback.  :thumleft:  Nice to get an inside perspective.

My question is how is all this different from what any taxpayer should expect from their local authorities?

Why do we need an additional tax for this?

Whats happening to the money we pay in normal taxes?

Why is it impossible to deliver this service using the fuel levy which will cost me (and everyone else less) but they will collect the same amounts?

Where is the collection fee going - who are the shareholders and directors of all the entities in the gravy chain?

Why send money off shore. Who is going to be the real recipients of that?

Why not just eliminate the R30bn in wasteful, corrupt and fruitless etc spending that their own report admitted is what the government wastes each year - that would pay for this easily!

etc etc etc

Its not about getting good services - we should get those anyway!


I agre 100 persent Alan, but you see we are rated as a third world Country. However, once something happens in Europe (like the smokers law) we were the first so called 3rd world Country to enforce the law. That made me to quit smoking - lol. In Europe once again they got the example from this e-toll system. Roads are one of the most expensive items in a Counties infrastructure development. So they came. With this idea like the Bakwena road where a Dutch company sponsored it and 20 years profits were pumped into their account. It is basically a private business. SANRAL not too much different here but to me the big plus is the gates (ore you Englis okes uses 'gantries') which will not break your speed. If I have to pay and I have a choice between a manual operated gate or a overhead automated system I rather opt for the last not true? Wheather we like it or not, it is here to stay and it will spread through SA like cancer - good or bad.....
 

Offline alanB

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #682 on: December 03, 2013, 02:13:49 pm »
Quote
I agre 100 persent Alan, but you see we are rated as a third world Country. However, once something happens in Europe (like the smokers law) we were the first so called 3rd world Country to enforce the law. That made me to quit smoking - lol. In Europe once again they got the example from this e-toll system. Roads are one of the most expensive items in a Counties infrastructure development. So they came. With this idea like the Bakwena road where a Dutch company sponsored it and 20 years profits were pumped into their account. It is basically a private business. SANRAL not too much different here but to me the big plus is the gates (ore you Englis okes uses 'gantries') which will not break your speed. If I have to pay and I have a choice between a manual operated gate or a overhead automated system I rather opt for the last not true? Wheather we like it or not, it is here to stay and it will spread through SA like cancer - good or bad.....

The nice thing about self fulfilling prophecy is that its as powerful as you want it to be  :biggrin:

The thing a lot of people are just not realising is that THEY have to make it happen, not the government.  If they simply don't go along, the system fails - that's the truth. 

And its failed for that very reason in many countries around the world.  It can fail here too.  Unless we really don't want it to.

http://www.itweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65216

http://tunneltalk.com/Discussion-Forum-16Jul13-Australia-PPP-toll-tunnel-crisis.php

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/7971689/Toll-relief-road-has-failed-report-claims.html

https://theconversation.com/as-another-toll-road-bites-the-dust-what-is-the-future-for-ppps-12386

http://blogs.reuters.com/muniland/2013/01/19/are-private-toll-roads-a-losing-idea/


Its really painful, and a bit strange, watching people fight with themselves over this.

All you need to do is decide.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 02:39:21 pm by alanB »
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #683 on: December 03, 2013, 02:50:54 pm »
Quote
I agre 100 persent Alan, but you see we are rated as a third world Country. However, once something happens in Europe (like the smokers law) we were the first so called 3rd world Country to enforce the law. That made me to quit smoking - lol. In Europe once again they got the example from this e-toll system. Roads are one of the most expensive items in a Counties infrastructure development. So they came. With this idea like the Bakwena road where a Dutch company sponsored it and 20 years profits were pumped into their account. It is basically a private business. SANRAL not too much different here but to me the big plus is the gates (ore you Englis okes uses 'gantries') which will not break your speed. If I have to pay and I have a choice between a manual operated gate or a overhead automated system I rather opt for the last not true? Wheather we like it or not, it is here to stay and it will spread through SA like cancer - good or bad.....

The nice thing about self fulfilling prophecy is that its as powerful as you want it to be  :biggrin:

The thing a lot of people are just not realising is that THEY have to make it happen, not the government.  If they simply don't go along, the system fails - that's the truth. 

And its failed for that very reason in many countries around the world.  It can fail here too.  Unless we really don't want it to.

http://www.itweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65216

http://tunneltalk.com/Discussion-Forum-16Jul13-Australia-PPP-toll-tunnel-crisis.php

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/7971689/Toll-relief-road-has-failed-report-claims.html

https://theconversation.com/as-another-toll-road-bites-the-dust-what-is-the-future-for-ppps-12386

http://blogs.reuters.com/muniland/2013/01/19/are-private-toll-roads-a-losing-idea/


Its really painful, and a bit strange, watching people fight with themselves over this.

All you need to do is decide.

the real differences is that politicains tumble and parties lose power when implementing unpopular policies, see the poll tax in the UK..... in ZA it makes no difference cos the middle class the ones paying the tolls in this case do not sway the vote .....

unless Jesus returns in april 2014 the ANC will be voted into power yet again ...by the masses who don't even have a car ...and cant see the link between a haigher bread price and the e tolls in Gauteng...
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Offline Koet

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #684 on: December 03, 2013, 02:51:47 pm »
the real differences is that politicains tumble and parties lose power when implementing unpopular policies, see the poll tax in the UK..... in ZA it makes no difference cos the middle class the ones paying the tolls in this case do not sway the vote .....

unless Jesus returns in april 2014 the ANC will be voted into power yet again ...by the masses who don't even have a car ...and cant see the link between a haigher bread price and the e tolls in Gauteng...

Very true
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Offline KiLRoy

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #685 on: December 03, 2013, 02:54:29 pm »
Quote
I agre 100 persent Alan, but you see we are rated as a third world Country. However, once something happens in Europe (like the smokers law) we were the first so called 3rd world Country to enforce the law. That made me to quit smoking - lol. In Europe once again they got the example from this e-toll system. Roads are one of the most expensive items in a Counties infrastructure development. So they came. With this idea like the Bakwena road where a Dutch company sponsored it and 20 years profits were pumped into their account. It is basically a private business. SANRAL not too much different here but to me the big plus is the gates (ore you Englis okes uses 'gantries') which will not break your speed. If I have to pay and I have a choice between a manual operated gate or a overhead automated system I rather opt for the last not true? Wheather we like it or not, it is here to stay and it will spread through SA like cancer - good or bad.....

The nice thing about self fulfilling prophecy is that its as powerful as you want it to be  :biggrin:

The thing a lot of people are just not realising is that THEY have to make it happen, not the government.  If they simply don't go along, the system fails - that's the truth. 

And its failed for that very reason in many countries around the world.  It can fail here too.  Unless we really don't want it to.

http://www.itweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65216

http://tunneltalk.com/Discussion-Forum-16Jul13-Australia-PPP-toll-tunnel-crisis.php

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/7971689/Toll-relief-road-has-failed-report-claims.html

https://theconversation.com/as-another-toll-road-bites-the-dust-what-is-the-future-for-ppps-12386

http://blogs.reuters.com/muniland/2013/01/19/are-private-toll-roads-a-losing-idea/


Its really painful, and a bit strange, watching people fight with themselves over this.

All you need to do is decide.

the real differences is that politicains tumble and parties lose power when implementing unpopular policies, see the poll tax in the UK..... in ZA it makes no difference cos the middle class the ones paying the tolls in this case do not sway the vote .....

unless Jesus returns in april 2014 the ANC will be voted into power yet again ...by the masses who don't even have a car ...and cant see the link between a haigher bread price and the e tolls in Gauteng...

Maybe, but the chances are very good the ANC will not get elected in Gauteng - even if I do vote COPE :laughing4:  Losing control of the heartland.... :ricky:
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #686 on: December 03, 2013, 02:56:25 pm »
Maybe, but the chances are very good the ANC will not get elected in Gauteng - even if I do vote COPE :laughing4:  Losing control of the heartland.... :ricky:
They will then wish Jesus had returned... :sip:
 

Offline alanB

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #687 on: December 03, 2013, 03:04:13 pm »
the real differences is that politicains tumble and parties lose power when implementing unpopular policies, see the poll tax in the UK..... in ZA it makes no difference cos the middle class the ones paying the tolls in this case do not sway the vote .....

unless Jesus returns in april 2014 the ANC will be voted into power yet again ...by the masses who don't even have a car ...and cant see the link between a haigher bread price and the e tolls in Gauteng...

Very true

Like I said self fulfilling prophecy...its as powerful as you want it to be!

In any event, you don't need to vote to stop this - just don't pay, or at least make it bloody difficult for them to collect the money - that on its own should be enough.

Its your money they want, not your vote. 

We need to realise money is far more powerful than votes FWIW. 
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 03:15:57 pm by alanB »
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Offline alanB

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #688 on: December 03, 2013, 03:49:27 pm »
Madiba's PA:

Quote
Zelda la Grange (@ZeldalaGrangeSA), former secretary to Nelson Mandela, tweeted that the e-toll system was not comparable to traffic fines.

"Cant compare traffic fines to etolls. Traffic fine: u committed an offence. Etoll: u pay because the money was used for corruption elsewhere."
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #689 on: December 03, 2013, 03:58:54 pm »
the ANC official facebook page with 43 000+ members shows some interesting opinions

http://www.facebook.com/african.national.congress

"Rhulani Stephan Meet you at the polls next year. Uv just lost votes to the DA
Like Reply 5 2 hours ago

Mpho Mohale The ANC even comment on it, just to show us ( the voters) that they don't care. They (ANC Leadership) are the ones who introduced this. I thought it was a government program and it would make good if the ANC never commented on it. Comrades you are goi...See More
Like Reply 5 2 hours ago

Gavin Von Meyer You still got the guts to advertise it!!! What an own goal you just scored, where 1-nul, equals 1 million votes, you just scored 10 own goals, believe it, or not.
Like Reply 4 about an hour ago

Thapelo Mohlabi That freeway has bin there ever since, all u thugs did ws to add only two lanes, and u lied & told us its part of "2010 world cup infrastructure improvement plan" ... Now u want'o milk the poor masses dry. Its high tym people stand against u bullies
Like Reply 2 about an hour ago

Thabang Nkwaired Shozi ANC RULES.....MY ANC MY KHONGOLOSE....no matter what I'll stand by you....AMANDLA
Like Reply 2 about an hour ago

Lerato Lilo Vilakazi This is going to take away the youth votes for the ANC, this gives me every good reason to vote for EFF or Patriotic Alliance next elections.
Like Reply 2 about an hour ago

Carol Zion Zandamela ANC has become a party for the rich not the people.
Like Reply 3 about an hour ago via mobile

Sifiso Uba-Ultra Mathebula Dis suddens me dat for de 1st time since - was allowed 2 vote, I won't vote fo Anc n hope ma Grandparents n all does dat fought hard for dis struggle won't turn on dea graves! Anc u have failed us as de people who have supported n struggled with yoll! We have neva complained @ all and fo de 1st time in 20yrs u will have lost Gauteng! De masses r Angry n dey feel betrayed n held for a ransum!
Like Reply 3 about an hour ago

Justice Pheello Mphanya This is not the government for the people,its for a sellected few.
Like Reply 3 about an hour ago

Bobb's Mabuza Viva ANC viva asambeni macommanies sovotela iANC better life 4 ol neh kunjalo
Like Reply 3 about an hour ago

Joe Mabulane Yet u expect us to vote for ANC?no 1 in his sober mind can vote for a party tht implement e tolls whilst majority citizens are agaunt it.**** ANC & thier bid headed president
Like Reply 3 about an hour ago via mobile

Bhekithemba Vellem one of the clear,disrespectful corrution in da history of ANC.shame to ZumaANC
Like Reply 3 2 hours ago

Lebohang Matlala lanyaa lona le president ya lona ya dom kop, sies
Like Reply 2 2 hours ago

Zintle Mtolo Oh so the **** you comment was removed? Lol too late I munched it already, going to tag city press editor
Like Reply 3 2 hours ago
8 Replies 14 minutes ago

Yolanda Yhayha Qongqo Well, consider yourselves out of Gauteng's parliament after 2014 elections.
Like Reply 3 2 hours ago

Rhulani Andricks There's no way I'm voting for this bull**** anc
Like Reply 3 2 hours ago

Simbongile Chris Mhlekwa Chris Safa thina simpofu yinkandla Road etolling..**** Anc
Like Reply 1 about an hour ago

Ntethelelo Mvelo Manzezulu Ndlovu E-toll proudly brought to you by Nkandla/Gupta government
Like Reply 1 28 minutes ago

Tlali Joseph D Joseph I think even My futer President wil do better viva EFF viva
Like Reply 1 54 minutes ago

Karabo Morudu EFF it is!
Like Reply 2 59 minutes ago

Floyd Shabangu People in Gauteng dont mind paying R2 for using a public toilet but dont wanna pay for etolls. It is the media which serves the DA which is busy with negetive publicity around etolls.
Like Reply 1 about an hour ago Edited

Clearly Tlalas Kgatla 1nce again the ANC is stealing from the people makin us pay f0r their debts n'fraud Anc takin advntage of the power thy has as government the poor keep getn poor n'd'1s takn illegaly r stil in power you should be ashamed
Like Reply 2 about an hour ago

Seripa Bethuel Maupye We're voting 4 ambherete next year, etolls wil vote 4 ANC...
Like Reply 2 about an hour ago

Zak Khoza angvamisile ukuthuka inhlamba but nisijwayela ama toilet ase western cape guys........how do people who dont even pay etolls, the zumas and co choose for us a system that we must pay. kahle kahle nidakwa umbuso...
Like Reply 1 about an hour ago

Vin-lee Marv Lol u have a funny way, of saying u don't want our votes anymore. U won't even enjoy the profits, course I don't think u'll be the rulling party next year.
Like Reply 2 2 hours ago Edited

Sbosh Bongi Nyivana Velelo kukunya oku nisixelela kona to Hell with ANC yamasimba
Like Reply 2 2 hours ago

Aaron Mrabalala If any one votes for ANC ever again or ever support ZUMA they need to be shot! Why dont you toll ur President prvt road.
Like Reply 2 2 hours ago

Yanga Maweza The ANC has failed us. Theyve turned their backs on us. Zuma and his ministers are just enriching themselves. They havent explained the R215m in question yet theyre forcing us to pay more, sucking the last cent out of us taxpayers. The ANC is just an animal farm, all animals are equal, but some animals more equal than others. Wish they lose in the next election. Batsho ngezisu ezikhulu.
Like Reply 2 2 hours ago

Thabelo Maraka Rubbish
Like Reply 2 hours ago

Goolam Dawood Kapsch
Like Reply 9 minutes ago

Ghaan Lesufi with this evil-tolls
you are saying to the masses that you dont need the're dirty rubbish VOTES
U can even c here dat derys no anc membrs comenting
Like Reply 1 23 minutes ago

Franklin Jooste Do u even own a car John siyabonga ****
Like Reply 1 27 minutes ago

Mari Anne I regret voting ANC. They have betrayed me and my fellow South Africans. Betrayed.
Like Reply 1 33 minutes ago

Molopeng James Spilo Mashiane I won't vote for Anc anymore
Like Reply 1 38 minutes ago

Jeffrey Nkogatse very stupid of you...bt ppl's Xs will play a role next year
Like Reply 1 41 minutes ago

Muji Saaj Padia rubbish!why should we pay for our roads?civil disobedience.do not buy e-tags!
Like Reply 1 58 minutes ago

Dumi Mgoza my beautifull sister the apartheit gov built the n1 free way,we travelled 4 free.the thiefs gov make us pay and they call it democracy,freedom.next year we must all rsa citizens go out and vote,not 4 thieves "
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #690 on: December 03, 2013, 04:00:45 pm »
Die mense is kwaad... :sip:
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #691 on: December 03, 2013, 04:04:39 pm »
Die mense is kwaad... :sip:

but seem illiterate. or is the brave new BBM/whatzap world?

pity us all
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #692 on: December 03, 2013, 04:11:14 pm »
Die mense is kwaad... :sip:

but seem illiterate. or is the brave new BBM/whatzap world?

pity us all

possibly and most of them probably have highly paid jobs in govt
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #693 on: December 03, 2013, 04:11:52 pm »
Road users seemed a little worked up on the roads this afternoon to say the least
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #694 on: December 03, 2013, 04:32:54 pm »
I see Cosatu have come up with an "unsheeping" procedure


 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #695 on: December 03, 2013, 05:12:58 pm »
I see Cosatu have come up with an "unsheeping" procedure




an unsheeping procedure from Cosatu , am I the only one who says the irony in this  :pot:  fuck must be one of the funniest posts of the year, albeit unintentionally

nee meneer, the entertainer is thee ... :laughing4:
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 05:14:30 pm by IceCreamMan »
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #696 on: December 03, 2013, 05:17:08 pm »
I see Cosatu have come up with an "unsheeping" procedure




an unsheeping procedure from Cosatu , am I the only one who says the irony in this  :pot:  fuck must be one of the funniest posts of the year, albeit unintentionally

nee meneer, the entertainer is thee ... :laughing4:

says the man that was hiding behind a woman to motivate his e-tagging sheepishness  :lol8:
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #697 on: December 03, 2013, 05:19:37 pm »
I see Cosatu have come up with an "unsheeping" procedure




an unsheeping procedure from Cosatu , am I the only one who says the irony in this  :pot:  fuck must be one of the funniest posts of the year, albeit unintentionally

nee meneer, the entertainer is thee ... :laughing4:

says the man that was hiding behind a woman to motivate his e-tagging sheepishness  :lol8:

They can maybe unsheep them, but can they give them their balls back?
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #698 on: December 03, 2013, 05:21:19 pm »
I see Cosatu have come up with an "unsheeping" procedure




an unsheeping procedure from Cosatu , am I the only one who says the irony in this  :pot:  fuck must be one of the funniest posts of the year, albeit unintentionally

nee meneer, the entertainer is thee ... :laughing4:

says the man that was hiding behind a woman to motivate his e-tagging sheepishness  :lol8:

They can maybe unsheep them, but can they give them their balls back?

sanral not go0t those hey ...my wife keeps those
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #699 on: December 03, 2013, 05:22:16 pm »
I see some companies have issued their staff with e-tags...

Does anybody know if that will be seen as a taxable benefit?