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Author Topic: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013  (Read 63200 times)

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Offline Inprogress

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #240 on: November 25, 2013, 04:23:00 pm »
You are obviously twisting my words to mask your lack of defiance against this African Government :imaposer:

I said - it will be the TRIGGER that brought the ANC to its knees....

ja ou , it wont be

a) the fact zuma has 5 wives an 68 kids
b) the absolute corruption by the ANC
c)  the lack of service delivery
d) the lack of transparency and the new info bill
e) the absolute lack of faith the ppl have in the future
f) ANC's cronisems
g) their pathetic waste of public funds
h) nkandlagate
I) and so on and so on and so on


nee , wont be the above it will be the e tolls....unlikely .....way Africa votes is generally consistent ..just see Zim

In life one needs to choose your battles and from what it seems, the e-tag debacle is one of those battles we need to fight in order to come together as a nation of vast different cultures against what is wrong. We break the back of this battle (no one is suggesting we don't pay at all, just not like this), we move to the next battle as a united front against corruption, farm murders, Shell et al.

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #241 on: November 25, 2013, 04:27:47 pm »
Bring the ANC on its knees.....ja right !!!

jussus you okes are optimists hey , pipe dream optimists...... this is Africa ....... most ppl don't own cars let alone etags..... bring the anc onto its knees....

 :imaposer:

Why are you so upset that people don't agree with this thing and want to voice their displeasure?

Why are you doing your level best to try and get people to give up their resistance to this farce?

People who packed for Perth tend to sound very similar to you I'm afraid. They dont want the country to succeed because they decided long ago that it wouldnt, and ran away, now they will tell everyone that will listen how we are destined to failure.

That sort of thing tends to become self fulfilling! 

And another point - what is the big risk that everyone seems to think they are taking by not buying an etag (ie they wont let their family take the risk) - what is that risk?  As far as I understand it, the risk is you will pay more - period!





I think if you looked carefully you may realise that I was attacked for having an ETag..... speaking of PErth they have a similar system in Oz hey ...

my position is merely one of expediency, there is too much riding on this for it not to be iimplemented, that simple...the ruling party are in it up to their eyeballs
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Offline alanB

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #242 on: November 25, 2013, 05:36:01 pm »
Quote
my position is merely one of expediency, there is too much riding on this for it not to be iimplemented, that simple...the ruling party are in it up to their eyeballs


So you bought an etag not because you believe this system is a good idea, but because you think its just easier going along with it?  Is that right?

I have no issue with someone who thinks the whole scheme was a good idea and thus buys an etag for that reason.

But at what point do the citizens of the country start saying enough, if they don't think whats happening is a good idea?  Isn't a democratic country supposed to be run for the benefit of the ordinary people?  If they don't like something the government is trying to impose, should they not be able to resist and oppose it - at any stage of implementation?  Why shout them down?

Its ALWAYS going to be easier to just buckle and pay. 

But it may not be easy to defend your actions to your fellow citizens who don't agree - which may be why you are getting flack here.

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #243 on: November 25, 2013, 05:41:30 pm »
Quote
my position is merely one of expediency, there is too much riding on this for it not to be iimplemented, that simple...the ruling party are in it up to their eyeballs


So you bought an etag not because you believe this system is a good idea, but because you think its just easier going along with it?  Is that right?

I have no issue with someone who thinks the whole scheme was a good idea and thus buys an etag for that reason.

But at what point do the citizens of the country start saying enough, if they don't think whats happening is a good idea?  Isn't a democratic country supposed to be run for the benefit of the ordinary people?  If they don't like something the government is trying to impose, should they not be able to resist and oppose it - at any stage of implementation?  Why shout them down?

Its ALWAYS going to be easier to just buckle and pay. 

But it may not be easy to defend your actions to your fellow citizens who don't agree - which may be why you are getting flack here.



Tell you what, if you prepared to pay the difference between the e tag rates and the non e tag rates on my behalf then I will be a rebel....
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Offline Bundu

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #244 on: November 25, 2013, 06:08:38 pm »
then why did you not right at the beginning say that you can't afford the non e-tag rates - why come with manly protector stories?
 

Offline punisher

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #245 on: November 25, 2013, 06:15:08 pm »
i cant afford the non tag  or the tag rates ...............  i will do nuffink 
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Offline badballie

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #246 on: November 25, 2013, 06:19:23 pm »
Wonder what you gonna do when the discounted rates are abolished ?
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Offline Bundu

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #247 on: November 25, 2013, 06:24:58 pm »
Wonder what you gonna do when the discounted rates are abolished ?

EXACTLY! most people are under the impression e-tolls are limited to CPI increases for ever, which is true! BUT, the discounts the presently tagged e-sheep will get, will have to be reduced for the project not to collapse - see attached document

 

Offline Bundu

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #248 on: November 25, 2013, 06:38:53 pm »
Quote
Even if you have a look at the impossible scenario 1 (the perfect world for them), there is not enough of a discount to reduce. If so, it would require that cost bracket 4 users are receiving a R720 per month discount, on average. If we then add realistic compliance rates of below 66%, we see that within the next 7 years prices for cost bracket 4 need to increase by at least R1600/month per vehicle.

We are being lied to at every step with this project, and if we accept it, then we are going to be forced to pay these increases every year, or government will have to subsidise them to the value of the difference each year - again, we pay. People need to understand that! And those opposed to paying these exorbitant rates need to ensure that others don't just bend over and accept it, because if a majority do, then the system might just work, and we'll all be stuffed, because of their apathy.

Accept E-TOLLING now by purchasing an e-tag and paying, and you will be subject to increases in line with what I posted. Eventually even cost bracket 1 users (people who pass a single gantry once a day) will be paying R500 per month just to keep the system operational...
 

Offline KiLRoy

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #249 on: November 25, 2013, 09:34:21 pm »
I must say ICM, although i do value differences of opinion, i really dont understand your stance on this. As a person who continually point african countries' inefficiencies and governments' corruption and inability out, i thought you would be first in the trenches of resistance. Now you rather hide behind women and children. Resistance takes guts dude. Take some cement with your coffee and man up against injustice. Its YOUR chance to make a difference which can have a lasting effect on SA's political landscape as most of us believe.

Time to stand tall mate :thumleft: 
 

Offline RobC

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #250 on: November 25, 2013, 09:53:29 pm »
I must say ICM, although i do value differences of opinion, i really dont understand your stance on this. As a person who continually point african countries' inefficiencies and governments' corruption and inability out, i thought you would be first in the trenches of resistance. Now you rather hide behind women and children. Resistance takes guts dude. Take some cement with your coffee and man up against injustice. Its YOUR chance to make a difference which can have a lasting effect on SA's political landscape as most of us believe.

Time to stand tall mate :thumleft: 
:thumleft: and here I am agreeing... what next! :sip:
 

Offline Tonteldoos

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #251 on: November 25, 2013, 11:54:01 pm »

there is too much riding on this for it not to be iimplemented, that simple...the ruling party are in it up to their eyeballs

Guess you could say the same of Nkandla... therefore we must support it (Nkandla)..  ::)
« Last Edit: November 25, 2013, 11:54:37 pm by Tonteldoos »
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #252 on: November 26, 2013, 04:40:22 am »
Have you peered into the faces of the advocates of the E-toll?  While they might make lofty pronouncements about the virtues of E-toll, their faces reveal that they don't believe what they say.  :sip:
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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #253 on: November 26, 2013, 05:44:48 am »
From fb
 

Offline ptashark

Re:
« Reply #254 on: November 26, 2013, 05:56:22 am »
That's not in SA.
 

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #255 on: November 26, 2013, 06:40:33 am »
I must say ICM, although i do value differences of opinion, i really dont understand your stance on this. As a person who continually point african countries' inefficiencies and governments' corruption and inability out, i thought you would be first in the trenches of resistance. Now you rather hide behind women and children. Resistance takes guts dude. Take some cement with your coffee and man up against injustice. Its YOUR chance to make a difference which can have a lasting effect on SA's political landscape as most of us believe.

Time to stand tall mate :thumleft: 

Women an children first man .....

u seem to think that my / your choice is really going to make a difference.....that's the crux of the matter....you believe civil uprising an disobedience is going to make a difference....not so....my point is merely if one is going to lose then lose early and save yourself a whole pile of kak.... you may win tomorrow, or the next day but in the long run you are going to lose......me I lose early...this is not a fight I think is worth fighting....

there are far more serious afflictions affecting this country ...we should be focused on those with the same vim an vinegar
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Offline Raka

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Re:
« Reply #256 on: November 26, 2013, 06:45:50 am »
That's not in SA.

I know, its merely a suggestion....
 

Offline alanB

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #257 on: November 26, 2013, 07:03:58 am »
ICM, I think you have decided the country is going to the dogs, and now want to see it go there.  You would rather that happened than take the chance in believing and then risk being disappointed?

In any event - people resisting the government does make a difference - just look at how long the bloody tolls have been delayed and how the process and fees have changed from the very mild resistance shown to date!

How is any democratic government going to force millions of people to do something they dont want to, if they all continue to refuse?

Its only when enough people go along, that the government can say that the defaulters are anti'social, and make examples of them, because they will be safe in that the majority will agree, but until then they are on very shaky ground.

What exactly is the government going to do if everyone refuses to pay?  Of course it makes a difference!

But believing it wont - you have defeated yourself without those fat bastards lifting a finger!

Your choice, not their's or anyone elses.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2013, 07:57:34 am by alanB »
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Offline KiLRoy

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #258 on: November 26, 2013, 07:29:21 am »
I must say ICM, although i do value differences of opinion, i really dont understand your stance on this. As a person who continually point african countries' inefficiencies and governments' corruption and inability out, i thought you would be first in the trenches of resistance. Now you rather hide behind women and children. Resistance takes guts dude. Take some cement with your coffee and man up against injustice. Its YOUR chance to make a difference which can have a lasting effect on SA's political landscape as most of us believe.

Time to stand tall mate :thumleft: 

Women an children first man .....

u seem to think that my / your choice is really going to make a difference.....that's the crux of the matter....you believe civil uprising an disobedience is going to make a difference....not so....my point is merely if one is going to lose then lose early and save yourself a whole pile of kak.... you may win tomorrow, or the next day but in the long run you are going to lose......me I lose early...this is not a fight I think is worth fighting....

there are far more serious afflictions affecting this country ...we should be focused on those with the same vim an vinegar

Your logic fails in 3 ways....

1. There is no threat towards women and children.  None at all. You are using it as an excuse to be spineless.  The only possible threat is the SA you will leave for your child. I but i guess you have an exit strategy with your foreign passport?

2. How can't say civil disobedience will fail, if you havent tried it yet. SA actually has a very good track record of civil disobedience bringing change. But you need to do it first. What is a fact however - is that doing fuckall will bring fuckall change. You can bank on that.

3. You seems to think people cant change the destiny of a country. Well you are wrong. Thats a fact.

Let me ask you something - what are the real reasons why you capitulate? Fear or backbone less?
 

Offline punisher

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Re: E-Tolls go live - 3 December 2013
« Reply #259 on: November 26, 2013, 07:33:57 am »
How far is one prepared to accept the destruction to ones life , by the few , for the fews massive gain , that is the real question
If we as a nation accepts this scam ( up to 70% monies collected leaves the county) then what next ?????  They have eaten our medical system , our school system ,our power supply .......  How far are YOU prepared to do NOTHING ,

Some south africans make me fukking sick
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