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Offline Woestynhond

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2015, 12:25:49 pm »
copperslip sal nie skade doen nie, beter as om die stud af te draai v roes... n stukkie van die geweefde veselglas wat met high heat silicone  gesmeer is en droog laat word het om die header pyp sal werk.....
Daai header gaannie lank mooi blink bly nie so hou op om makeup aan die fiets te sit en gaan maak hom eerder vuil in die modder!.... ;D
and she said " What are you doin today ? ".
and I said " Nothing ".
and she said " But you did that yesterday ".
and I said "I haven`t finished yet ".
 

Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2015, 12:55:30 pm »
copperslip sal nie skade doen nie, beter as om die stud af te draai v roes... n stukkie van die geweefde veselglas wat met high heat silicone  gesmeer is en droog laat word het om die header pyp sal werk.....
Daai header gaannie lank mooi blink bly nie so hou op om makeup aan die fiets te sit en gaan maak hom eerder vuil in die modder!.... ;D

baie dankie vir die advies!!!!! ek sal doen soos jy voor gestel het buide met die copper slip en di glasvesel en silicon.

vir die res:

Ek het die bike 2 en n bietjie jaarterug gekoop, van toe af het ek haar net soos n slet behandel!!!!! olie en lugvultertjie is altyd mooi versorg, maar ekt haar gery soos n goedkoop slet.

so nou sit ek net bietjie pampelang in want syt gedreig om te loop....
so een van die dae is sy weer mooi en lief vir my....
net om twee jaar later weer gepamperlang te word!

I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

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Offline chopperpilot

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2015, 01:49:51 pm »
Ek smeer net 'n lagie silicon, waar die FMF aan die header pyp pas.


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Offline Morokai

Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #23 on: April 21, 2015, 07:28:29 am »
ok, so alles is nou mooi skoon en oppad terug vanaand.

Twee vragies:
1) Sal julle aanraai dat ek copperslip op die boude sit wat die header pyp aan die head vas maak?
2) Die Splinter nuwe OEM muffler gasket wat ek gekoop het is presies die selfde buite diameter as die FMF pyp, so dit gaan nie werk nie.
    waste ander opsies is daar om daai seel daar te kry, het laas gungum gebruik... miskien heat resistant silicon?



Ek het gum gum gebruik om my FMF pyp aan te heg. werk soos n bom
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Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #24 on: April 21, 2015, 08:36:11 am »
Ek het die vorige keer ook gun gum gebruik.

toe het die pyp gekraak, nie a.g.v. die gun gum nie, maar ek kon nie vas stel of ek n 100% seel gehaad het nie.

Chopper:
sukkel mens nie erg om die silicon weer af te kry as jy weer die pyp afhaal nie?

die gungum het eintelik bitter maklik af gekom. +1
« Last Edit: April 21, 2015, 08:36:35 am by Matie spero »
I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #25 on: April 21, 2015, 09:05:47 am »
ok, so alles is nou mooi skoon en oppad terug vanaand.

Twee vragies:
1) Sal julle aanraai dat ek copperslip op die boude sit wat die header pyp aan die head vas maak?
2) Die Splinter nuwe OEM muffler gasket wat ek gekoop het is presies die selfde buite diameter as die FMF pyp, so dit gaan nie werk nie.
    waste ander opsies is daar om daai seel daar te kry, het laas gungum gebruik... miskien heat resistant silicon?



I am not quite sure if I got the first question. You should definitely use copper compound on the bolts that hold the header on the cylinder head. Also replace the crush gasket when ever you had the header pipe off. I like to use a bit of copper compound on the crush gasket too, prevents it from sticking on the aluminium of the cylinder head the next time you disassemble.
And don't forget to torque the header pipe bolts again after one or two rides or they WILL come loose.

The second question: Unfortunately many aftermarket exhaust manufacturers think the OEM gaskets for the silencer connector are useless rubbish. Their gasket less direct slip on systems in fact are the rubbish as they are almost always leaking to varying degrees, either don't clamp at all or are near impossible to detach after having been fitted for a longer period of time. Sealing with gun gum or silicone is problematic (besides looking shite) as the gun gum will sooner or later crack and the silicone will burn - besides from none of the products actually being able to seal INSIDE the cylindrical connection.
Common problems caused by loose or leaking silencer connections are gas grilled rear shocks and holes burned into air boxes (commonly found on KLR's) and vibration cracks in silencer shells and mounting brackets.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." (Red Adair)
 

Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #26 on: April 21, 2015, 09:29:14 am »
ok, so alles is nou mooi skoon en oppad terug vanaand.

Twee vragies:
1) Sal julle aanraai dat ek copperslip op die boude sit wat die header pyp aan die head vas maak?
2) Die Splinter nuwe OEM muffler gasket wat ek gekoop het is presies die selfde buite diameter as die FMF pyp, so dit gaan nie werk nie.
    waste ander opsies is daar om daai seel daar te kry, het laas gungum gebruik... miskien heat resistant silicon?



I am not quite sure if I got the first question. You should definitely use copper compound on the bolts that hold the header on the cylinder head. Also replace the crush gasket when ever you had the header pipe off. I like to use a bit of copper compound on the crush gasket too, prevents it from sticking on the aluminium of the cylinder head the next time you disassemble.
And don't forget to torque the header pipe bolts again after one or two rides or they WILL come loose.

The second question: Unfortunately many aftermarket exhaust manufacturers think the OEM gaskets for the silencer connector are useless rubbish. Their gasket less direct slip on systems in fact are the rubbish as they are almost always leaking to varying degrees, either don't clamp at all or are near impossible to detach after having been fitted for a longer period of time. Sealing with gun gum or silicone is problematic (besides looking shite) as the gun gum will sooner or later crack and the silicone will burn - besides from none of the products actually being able to seal INSIDE the cylindrical connection.
Common problems caused by loose or leaking silencer connections are gas grilled rear shocks and holes burned into air boxes (commonly found on KLR's) and vibration cracks in silencer shells and mounting brackets.

Thanks lecap, you got both questions 100%

will use the coper slip, have the new crush casket, and will tighten after first two rides.

on the muffler seal, what I take from what you said is:
1) OEM gasket si shit en in my case does not fit.
2) Gungum will crack and looks shit.
3) silicon will burn, and looks like shit.

so what would you recommend for the seal, or are you saying I should not seal at all?
I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #27 on: April 22, 2015, 10:20:07 am »
...

so what would you recommend for the seal, or are you saying I should not seal at all?

Ideally modify the exhaust to take the OEM gasket. If you use the OEM header and a slip on with a connector pipe it should be no more than a simple chop off and weld job although it might be a bit of a mission to find the correct diameter tubing. (You might have to roll and weld it from a piece of sheet).

Next best is just fit it "dry" without anything. Make sure it does not blow against the air box or shock. Comes with all the disadvantages mentioned earlier.
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Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #28 on: April 22, 2015, 11:12:00 am »
...

so what would you recommend for the seal, or are you saying I should not seal at all?

Ideally modify the exhaust to take the OEM gasket. If you use the OEM header and a slip on with a connector pipe it should be no more than a simple chop off and weld job although it might be a bit of a mission to find the correct diameter tubing. (You might have to roll and weld it from a piece of sheet).

Next best is just fit it "dry" without anything. Make sure it does not blow against the air box or shock. Comes with all the disadvantages mentioned earlier.

great stuff thanks!!!

if I was still in Struisbaai, I would have modified the exhaust...

but trying to get that done here in PTA after all the driving around to get other parts and sorting out other shit on her, not gonna happen!!!
every mission is a 1:30 round trip to drop off an then again to collect...

I will continue to search for something in the line of a thin asbestos gasket that will fit.

what about that cloth people use to wrap their exhausts????


I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!
 

Offline Serfie

Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #29 on: April 22, 2015, 03:21:40 pm »
"Oxidation of the stainless steel due to exposure to high temperature and atmospheric oxygen. There is only one way to avoid this: Double walled headers as found on most classic Jap. bikes" - lecap



Aw thanx lecap...mine is exactly the same and I haven't been through mud in ages...nothing to worry about then...
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Offline Serfie

Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #30 on: April 22, 2015, 03:28:00 pm »
but trying to get that done here in PTA after all the driving around to get other parts and sorting out other shit on her, not gonna happen!!!
every mission is a 1:30 round trip to drop off an then again to collect...



Welcome to Gauteng Matie...I have had nearly 17 years of that, BUT soon that will change when I move to Kleinmond!!! What did you do at Struisbaai?...also far removed from bigger areas?
“So much of life can never be explained…it can only be witnessed and experienced…but above all...life just goes on…no matter what!!”

Previous bikes - 1980 XL125S: 1986 IT200: 1989 XT250:  1999 Africa Twin 750XLV: 2011 XR250 Tornado: 1999 XJR900 Diversion:  1996 Varadero XL1000V: 2007 Transalp 650
Currently - 2008 KLR650 / 2008 DR650 / 2015 SYM CROX 125 / 2015 Kawasaki Versys KLZ 1000/ 2014 BMW F700GS
 

Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #31 on: April 22, 2015, 03:48:06 pm »
but trying to get that done here in PTA after all the driving around to get other parts and sorting out other shit on her, not gonna happen!!!
every mission is a 1:30 round trip to drop off an then again to collect...



Welcome to Gauteng Matie...I have had nearly 17 years of that, BUT soon that will change when I move to Kleinmond!!! What did you do at Struisbaai?...also far removed from bigger areas?

that where I spent my youth!!!! til 5 years ago, moved uphere.
I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!
 

Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2015, 10:28:38 am »
ok so I have also done the header weld grind that every one is talking about.

then when I wanted to refit the header is saw that the header port hole itself is quite smaller than the inlet to the header pipe.
in the photo below I put the crush gasket back, the gasket is the same size as the header pipe.

now the question:
Grinding down the weld does not remove any obstruction as the actual port is smaller then the weld reduced the header pipe.
what is your thoughts on doing "port matching" between the header pipe and the header i.e. also grind the port hole a bit open to almost match the header pipe?
I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!
 

Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2015, 10:31:46 am »
here's an example of what I am refereeing to:
I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!
 

Offline chopperpilot

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2015, 02:38:43 pm »
Sal graag die DR performance gurus se opinies hieroor wil hoor! :thumleft:

Ek self gaan nie daar karring nie. Dalk eendag as die enjin moet oop! ;)

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Offline Kykdaar

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #35 on: April 24, 2015, 04:21:30 pm »
Sal graag die DR performance gurus se opinies hieroor wil hoor! :thumleft:

Ek self gaan nie daar karring nie. Dalk eendag as die enjin moet oop! ;)



Ja, behalwe as daar n blob welding daar in die pad hang hang gaan  ek ook nie die grinder ding doen nie.
 

Offline pielas

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #36 on: April 24, 2015, 04:50:13 pm »
I know very little about porting and the nitty-gritty of airflow dynamics, but do know that when working in ports the opposite of what you might expect is often true.  Your argument to get rid of the ridge makes sense , and as such I would be very careful before proceeding.

Bigger is not always better ( velocity decrease), a mirror finish is not better than  as a rough one ( laminar flow), Wave dynamics, are affected by the lenth of the port, conrod angle, etc

Rather have an expert on this have a look at it. My XR 650 R was "gas flowed" by Tim Basson by the previous owner and it made a big difference. To do porting successfully you will need an air-flow bench and a solid understanding of the principles involved. This is a specialist job, and mainly done by people who do it and it only.

I know you dont want to do a whole porting exercise, but working in there is a "dark art"and can easily do more harm than good. If you decide to go through with it, please do it after the dyno, and we can do a dyno afterwards again and compare graphs. I will contribute half of the R's for the after dyno.  :thumleft:
Results should be interisting, .

Edit: spelling
« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 04:52:01 pm by pielas »
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Offline chopperpilot

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #37 on: April 24, 2015, 05:49:08 pm »
As die exhaust port so klein is, help dit dan enigsins om die header weld te grind, behalwe as jy natuurlik 'n vol gas flow op die head doen.


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Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #38 on: April 25, 2015, 08:46:54 am »
You should only grind the weld's end blob (if there is a significant one), not the whole bead. Grinding the bead weakens the weld significantly.
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Offline Matie spero

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Re: DR650 Exhaust question
« Reply #39 on: April 28, 2015, 10:33:50 am »
I know very little about porting and the nitty-gritty of airflow dynamics, but do know that when working in ports the opposite of what you might expect is often true.  Your argument to get rid of the ridge makes sense , and as such I would be very careful before proceeding.

Bigger is not always better ( velocity decrease), a mirror finish is not better than  as a rough one ( laminar flow), Wave dynamics, are affected by the lenth of the port, conrod angle, etc

Rather have an expert on this have a look at it. My XR 650 R was "gas flowed" by Tim Basson by the previous owner and it made a big difference. To do porting successfully you will need an air-flow bench and a solid understanding of the principles involved. This is a specialist job, and mainly done by people who do it and it only.

I know you dont want to do a whole porting exercise, but working in there is a "dark art"and can easily do more harm than good. If you decide to go through with it, please do it after the dyno, and we can do a dyno afterwards again and compare graphs. I will contribute half of the R's for the after dyno.  :thumleft:
Results should be interisting, .

Edit: spelling

Hi Pielas

You are 100% right that I do NOT WANT TO DO A PORTING exercise.

I will try and make contact with a professional and ask him this question, as it (in my mind) makes sence to grind it open a bit.

but I hear your comments about the bigger not always better and velocity getting lost...




I could agree with you! But then we both would be wrong.....

Political Correctness is a doctrine, recently fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and promoted by a sick mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end!