Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register

Author Topic: Goodbye Sani Pass  (Read 4904 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Len vR

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: KTM 990 Adventure
    Location: Kwazulu Natal
  • Posts: 709
  • Thanked: 2 times
  • Biking in my blood...
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #20 on: June 09, 2015, 09:26:49 pm »
Going to Lesotho for 4 days with mates on Saturday 13th,coming down Sani on the 16th,will take pics and post.
 

Offline Kobus Myburgh

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: Honda CRF-1000L Africa Twin
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 6,964
  • Thanked: 390 times
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #21 on: June 09, 2015, 09:35:57 pm »
I recon the engineering and civil expertise will be a considerable chunk of that cost.
I agree to a point with this but unfortunately I don't believe that any project, of this nature, in SA is completed without some fatcat lining his pockets.

In my +- 20 years of construction, and this includes road building, I haven't seen a road at this cost before.

It would be very interesting to see the actual design as some of those grades and sharp turns are not suitable for asphalt.

Whatever they do won't take away the beauty of nature there though.  Pity it's not a South African Contractor involved.
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Offline friggs

  • Member
  • **
  • Bike: Triumph 800 XC
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 393
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #22 on: June 09, 2015, 10:20:44 pm »
I lived on a farm on the Sani Road for about 12 months a few years back. They were working on the road (from the main road coming from Himeville to the Sani Hotel) every day that I was there, they had been for a good year or two before I got there and they carried on for another year or two after I left (my old man lives in Himeville so he would update me form time to time on the progress or lack there of). It took them years to do that piece, always grading or widening or building new ditches for drainage and whatnot.

My point is, judging by how long it took them to tar the road to the hotel I dont see this happening any time soon... the biggest ballache will be trying to go up after they start because the road will be full of trucks, graders, diversions, etc. while they try and build all the drainage ditches and widening and leveling and all that jazz. I think the main reason someone should try do it now is because once they start on the road it will detract from the enjoyment of the views and scenery and actual riding because you will be dealing with all the construction.

Oh ya, that quoted price... bet you it ends up being double due to "delays" and "unforeseen problems" and what ever other excuse they come up with, TIA after all.
 

Offline T Rex

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: BMW R1200GS Adventure
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 1,894
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #23 on: June 09, 2015, 10:42:24 pm »


It would be very interesting to see the actual design as some of those grades and sharp turns are not suitable for asphalt.



If you have ever entered Lesotho via Montasana Pass , close to Phutaditjaba , they used concrete / sement on the steep sections ..just after the border.
 

Offline Alpine Al

  • You dont stop playin 'cause you get old, you get old 'cause you stop playin.
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: BMW R1200GS Adventure
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 783
  • If life throws you lemons reach for the tequila!!
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #24 on: June 09, 2015, 11:30:11 pm »
Lesotho has dosens of awesome dirt passes that will remain dirt for a long time yet. Sani is a beautiful pass to ride , but not a special challenge unless the weather is really bad. Tar or not it will remain beautiful and may even open up the possibility of riding the lesser known passes.


You are on the button there, many more really tough tracks to ride when you get past Sani and more stunning scenery too.
Bike history : Honda 50cc, Yamaha 175 DT, Honda 200R, Honda XL 500, Yamaha YZ 465, Yamaha IT490 CURENT BIKES: Honda CRF 450R, GS 1200. PRESENT BIKES : KTM 525 Street legal,  and BMW GSA.

Only a biker knows why a dog sticks his head out of a car window!!
 

Offline Cracker

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: KTM 950 Adventure S
    Location: Europe
  • Posts: 5,821
  • Thanked: 366 times
  • Top Biscuit!
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #25 on: June 10, 2015, 07:30:03 am »


It would be very interesting to see the actual design as some of those grades and sharp turns are not suitable for asphalt.



If you have ever entered Lesotho via Montasana Pass , close to Phutaditjaba , they used concrete / sement on the steep sections ..just after the border.

I'd say parts of the existing pass are not suitable for asphalt or concrete - the road will be taking a different path
Don't let fear hold you back ..... take it with you!
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

  • a Man of Character
  • Castrated Dog
  • ******
  • Bike: KTM 690 Adventure
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 24,669
  • Thanked: 1827 times
  • Slim like Bill, straight like Steve
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2015, 07:49:16 am »
Hello Neil!!  Nice to see you post here!

It is sad to see Sani tarred, but I guess that for the daily users this is a blessing coming. I just hope that a tar surface won't be seen as so safe that many start going up or down too fast.
 

Offline Kobus Myburgh

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: Honda CRF-1000L Africa Twin
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 6,964
  • Thanked: 390 times
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #27 on: June 10, 2015, 07:57:40 am »


It would be very interesting to see the actual design as some of those grades and sharp turns are not suitable for asphalt.



If you have ever entered Lesotho via Montasana Pass , close to Phutaditjaba , they used concrete / sement on the steep sections ..just after the border.

I'd say parts of the existing pass are not suitable for asphalt or concrete - the road will be taking a different path

When I went up there over Easter some work on grade and horizontal alignment already started (not sure if this was done in preparation) - widening especially the last section before you get to Sani Mountain Lodge.  I think this section could potentially be Ok for concrete providing they anchor alternate panels properly.
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Offline EtienneXplore

  • previously KnopKop
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: BMW G650 X-challenge
    Location: Rest of Africa
  • Posts: 3,594
  • Thanked: 15 times
    • www.etiennexplore.com
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #28 on: June 10, 2015, 08:13:44 am »
Lesotho has dosens of awesome dirt passes that will remain dirt for a long time yet. Sani is a beautiful pass to ride , but not a special challenge unless the weather is really bad. Tar or not it will remain beautiful and may even open up the possibility of riding the lesser known passes.



Very true.

For sure, just go and ride Ongeluks Nek close to Matat in the pouring rain, Sani is a walk in the park compared to that nightmare!   :biggrin: :biggrin:


Offline BLK

Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #29 on: June 10, 2015, 08:14:13 am »
The mystique will be lost for ever

 :(
 

Offline BlueBull2007

  • Caribbean
  • Global Moderator
  • Bachelor Dog
  • ***
  • Bike: AJS (all models)
    Location: Other
  • Posts: 10,355
  • Thanked: 391 times
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #30 on: June 10, 2015, 02:25:42 pm »
Its interesting to see that people are more relaxed about the idea of upgrading this road. There is another thread here somewhere where guys got really hot under the collar. I expect some of it was because for some the Sani pass is their Roof of Africa, which is quick different from "The Roof" to those in the know.

Hello Neil!!  Nice to see you post here!

It is sad to see Sani tarred, but I guess that for the daily users this is a blessing coming. I just hope that a tar surface won't be seen as so safe that many start going up or down too fast.

Hi Danie :wave: Glad you missed me. I needed the sabbatical. Good to see you back too!

I like your photo by the way. :thumleft:
Rally nut. What could possibly go wrong?
Living the Rally Dream - Ride Report
Current bike: KTM 350 EXC   Previous bikes:  2010 WR450F, 2006 KTM450EXC,KTM 450RR, BMW800GS, KTM450EXC, BMW650 GS, BMW650 Dakar, and Honda XR250
 

Offline Roxtar

  • REV IT UP
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: KTM 990 Adventure
    Location: North West
  • Posts: 2,855
  • Thanked: 129 times
  • Aka Sprocket Face
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #31 on: June 10, 2015, 03:19:54 pm »
Tarring or concreting will for sure change the character forever of Sani, not that it was ever difficult except maybe in really bad weather....... but yes our 10th province will open up and bring some extra revenue to the adjacent towns as mentioned above..........
Long live the Underdog.........
 

Offline 2-Stroke

  • Forum Vendor
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: Britten (all models)
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 941
  • Thanked: 26 times
  • The Bike Show
    • The Bike Show
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #32 on: June 10, 2015, 05:05:57 pm »
Hello Neil!!  Nice to see you post here!

It is sad to see Sani tarred, but I guess that for the daily users this is a blessing coming. I just hope that a tar surface won't be seen as so safe that many start going up or down too fast.

Ahmen, brother! The last I want when I'm barrelling up and down there is competition!  ;D
 

Offline CruiserBMW

  • Member
  • **
  • Bike: Harley Davidson (all models)
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 166
  • Thanked: 1 times
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #33 on: June 10, 2015, 05:13:08 pm »
Yes if the taring is gonna happened then it will become Harley pass
 

Offline gser

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: BMW R80GS
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 2,507
  • Thanked: 24 times
  • Gelukkig nog nie hard GeSloeg nie
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #34 on: June 10, 2015, 06:24:26 pm »
 Well, well !
 SnowyCorner gaan gevaarlik wees as dit ge-ys op teer.
 Nouja, wie weet waar die teerpad gaan loop op die stadium, miskien is SnowyCorner nie meer daar nie.
 We shall see.
 

Offline the_BOBNOB

  • is not a
  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: KTM 990 Adventure
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 8,621
  • Thanked: 169 times
Re:
« Reply #35 on: June 10, 2015, 06:29:47 pm »
I did Sani today.

It is tarred from Himville to the Sani Pass Hotel.

Then it is good old Sani to the top. From the top it is tarred to Mokuthlong.

There is not 1 sign of tarring or prep work for tarring.

I could not spot 1 land surveyor pole nothing.

Tarring it will not work as no truck or bus can make those corners. It will require major engineering to smooth out the corners.
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

  • a Man of Character
  • Castrated Dog
  • ******
  • Bike: KTM 690 Adventure
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 24,669
  • Thanked: 1827 times
  • Slim like Bill, straight like Steve
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #36 on: June 10, 2015, 07:25:26 pm »
If I were to be given this contract, I'd simply make the tar road go straight up, and use a winch to pull vehicles to the top.

Going down is a freewheeling affair. :eek7:
 

Offline BatmanGS

  • Member
  • **
  • Bike: KTM 690 Adventure
    Location: Kwazulu Natal
  • Posts: 239
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #37 on: June 10, 2015, 08:04:45 pm »
Yes I agree the road is going to be a challenge to build.

The only feesable way to build this road will be for many sections to be built like a large bridge on stilts.

As we saw in January this year, when the road was washed away at the top by the heavy rains in this valley the force of the water does a lot of damage so the water will need to flow under the road in many places.

I understand that we the SA Tax payer is going to pay for this road anyway as Lesotho starts at the top of the mountain.

Best we go and ride it again before its too late.
'It's not what you Ride ...........It's who YOU ride with'
 

Offline Kobus Myburgh

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: Honda CRF-1000L Africa Twin
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 6,964
  • Thanked: 390 times
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #38 on: June 10, 2015, 08:36:35 pm »
Yes I agree the road is going to be a challenge to build.

The only feesable way to build this road will be for many sections to be built like a large bridge on stilts.

As we saw in January this year, when the road was washed away at the top by the heavy rains in this valley the force of the water does a lot of damage so the water will need to flow under the road in many places.

I understand that we the SA Tax payer is going to pay for this road anyway as Lesotho starts at the top of the mountain.

Best we go and ride it again before its too late.

This sort of clarifies my question of who the no mans land between the border posts belong to.

In 2010 SA already handed the Lesotho Government R40m for their upgrade.

http://www.vertical-endeavour.com/80-lesotho/environment/141-r40-million-towards-upgrade-of-sani-mokhotlong-road.html

Are we really going to now pay more as tax payers?  I guess they will toll it as well.  :patch:
« Last Edit: June 10, 2015, 08:38:02 pm by ktmkobus »
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Offline Lestutu

  • Member
  • **
  • Bike: Kawasaki KLR 650
    Location: Kwazulu Natal
  • Posts: 189
Re: Goodbye Sani Pass
« Reply #39 on: June 11, 2015, 04:49:12 pm »
Point of clarification: The LTDC story (start of the thread) is not new, they've been saying this for at least 10 years. But it doesn't help when they confuse things ...

Firstly: There is NO money to tar Sani Pass. The powers-that-be may wish for it to happen, but with a load of other priorities, SP is way down the ladder. Put another way, although it's deemed a priority (by the politicians), the people who have to find the money (KZN Treasury) have to organise "Infrastructure Fairs" to try and get the private sector to pay for things like clinics, schools, pedestrian bridges and provincial roads. Guess how successful they've been ...

Secondly, the road from the top of SP to Mokhotlong is built by the Chinese. Now, as people will know who've been on it lately, is clearly designated to be tarred. But whether the Chinese will succeed where the Kuwaitis (who built the Mokhotlong-Oxbow road years ago) failed, remains to be seen ...

And there's not much point in having a tarred road ending at SP top, whether from the east or the west. So, the chances are that we'll see reasonable dirt surfaces deteriorate over time. But that's still a whole lot better than a tarred road full of potholes!! 

The journey IS the destination!