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Author Topic: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement  (Read 1621 times)

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Offline Munro39

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DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« on: July 06, 2016, 09:33:08 pm »
Hi guys,

I have a question that may unfortunately be coming too late.

I noticed an oil leak on my engine a few weeks ago and suspected it was coming from the cam chain tensioner but the leak wasn't bad enough to be sure.

I took the bike in for a service with the specific request to identify and fix this oil problem. The guys told me they'd fix the problem - "it was just a loose nut" - but I noticed very quickly that it wasn't fixed and was just getting worse. Was clear where it was coming from once it started spewing out onto my exhaust.

In my frustration at paying so much money for nothing, I decided to replace the gasket myself and that part went quite smoothly. The bike hasn't been on in over 3 weeks so starting her up was a bit difficult, but I switched off pretty soon because it just didn't sound the way I remember.

It may just be the time span, but I'm worried its because the CTT wasn't removed at TDC as (SOME) instructions suggest. The bike was not moved at all while it was out so it shouldn't have slipped, but I'm scared to do serious damage.

What may have occurred if it wasn't done at TDC, and what can be done to be sure its ok? There's no rattling or clunking, but it just doesn't sound quite right.

Thanks in advance,

Neil
 

Offline Crab

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2016, 11:45:52 pm »
The cam chain may have slipped a tooth on one of the sprockets. Pull the cam cover off and check the valve timing.
Look for a shooting star and see Lynda's trail and remember all the great places you shared with her,she will never forget what she shared with you and will show you that in every starry night .
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2016, 11:03:21 am »
Crab is correct. If you remove the timing chain tensioner without turning the engine to combustion TDC it is quite likely for the timing chain to skip one tooth on the crank shaft.
The DR650SE does not have a guide under the timing chain sprocket on the crankshaft. If the timing chain tensioner is removed with one cam "ramped" the pressure exerted by the valve spring onto the rocker and the cam will turn the cam shaft and the chain will skip on the crankshaft sprocket.


There is unfortunately only one way to check the cam timing reliably and that involves the removal of the rocker box from the cylinder head.

Get yourself a top quality sealant (Like Würth Engine silicone 250 black) to seal the joint of the rocker box on the head.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." (Red Adair)
 

Offline Heddles

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2016, 06:17:32 am »
And a torque wrench. Over tightening of those little cambox bolts can lead to expensive damage and perpetual oil leaks from here on.. Torque spec on 6mm bolts is under 10nm.. And yes, while that might not seem to be enough, it is..


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Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2016, 10:48:03 am »
I would not recommend that you get a torque wrench to do this job. I would expect you to own one ::)
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." (Red Adair)
 

Offline Munro39

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2016, 07:22:04 pm »
Hi guys,

Thanks very much for your help. Checked those things today with some help from an engine guru, and saw that everything was fine w.r.t. your suggestions. Might just be paranoid about the sound of the bike after being left in the cold for too long - glad I checked though.

Taking her out in the morning to check that everything kicks back into gear.

One last question - there are too pipes that come off the petcock - one which is clearly the fuel line and another that goes to the top of the carb. What is the purpose of this second pipe? Does it detect the vacuum?

Thanks again
 

Offline Crab

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2016, 02:47:03 pm »
The second pipe uses vacuum from the engine to open the petcock.
Look for a shooting star and see Lynda's trail and remember all the great places you shared with her,she will never forget what she shared with you and will show you that in every starry night .
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2016, 02:50:14 pm »
The vacuum from the intake port of the engine is used to operate the automatic fuel tap. You might have noted that the tap has no "OFF" position. It closes automatically if the vacuum is removed - unless it's in the "PRI" (prime) position. Prime as the name suggests is used to quickly and easily prime the carb with fuel (fill the float bowl) after maintenance work (float bowl drained) or after you ran out of petrol or could not switch to REServe quick enough.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." (Red Adair)
 

Offline Umko

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2016, 09:58:32 am »
I estimate I spent 6 hours trying to remove this gasket from the engine. It was baked harder than the underlying aluminium!
I wanted to use Loctite 7200 gasket remover, but couldn't find any in Pmb so tried the Spanjaard equivalent. Despite about 6 applications, it was useless.
Does anyone know if the Loctite 7200 would have been more effective?
 

Offline Crab

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2016, 10:26:25 am »
A nice sharp woodwork chisel removes gasket material very well,  just don't dig into the aluminium
Look for a shooting star and see Lynda's trail and remember all the great places you shared with her,she will never forget what she shared with you and will show you that in every starry night .
 

Offline Umko

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2016, 10:45:17 am »
( just don't dig into the aluminium)
Crab, I'm an elderly oke with kak eyesight and shaky hands. Let me loose with a "sharp wood chisel" and the gasket will still be there but all the aluminium gone!
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2016, 11:19:32 am »
I estimate I spent 6 hours trying to remove this gasket from the engine. It was baked harder than the underlying aluminium!
I wanted to use Loctite 7200 gasket remover, but couldn't find any in Pmb so tried the Spanjaard equivalent. Despite about 6 applications, it was useless.
Does anyone know if the Loctite 7200 would have been more effective?

Both the OEM timing chain tensioner gasket as well as the pre 2004 cylinder base gasket are made from some dark grey compound (some sort of resin bound graphite is my guess) and are EXTREMELY difficult to remove.
I have tried pretty much everything chemically to soften or remove these gaskets.

With regards to various types of gasket removers I learned that they remove plenty of things like paint, glue, thread locking compound and even liquid sealants but do diddly squat to burned on paper or fibre or graphite resin gaskets.

The only way to get these gaskets removed is to use a scraping tool and patience - lots of patience.

6 hours is a bit extreme but the removal of the TCT gasket often takes as long as the whole rest of the job :-\

Another good reason to manufacture your own gasket from 0.5mm (20/1000") oil resistant sheet.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." (Red Adair)
 

Offline Umko

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2016, 12:39:44 pm »
Thanks so much, le cap, for your comprehensive and (as always) very knowledgeable reply.
You can change the aphorism on the bottom of your page to, "If you think it's expensive to hire a professional, wait until you try to do it yourself"!
 

Offline Umko

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2016, 01:47:30 pm »
lecap, you speak of making one's own gasket. I did, in fact, buy some gasket material to make the small gasket at the back of the CTT.
In the "old days", one made a gasket by gently hammering through the paper onto the metal with a small ballpeen hammer. That was when the mating surfaces were made of steel.
But with aluminium?
 

Offline Crab

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2016, 02:07:33 pm »
Put grease on the surface, place the paper on the grease, remove and cut out to the grease mark.
Look for a shooting star and see Lynda's trail and remember all the great places you shared with her,she will never forget what she shared with you and will show you that in every starry night .
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2016, 10:57:37 am »
Small holes like the ones for the mounting screws of the tensioner are easiest made with a simple hole punch and a hammer. Get a 7mm hole punch for 6mm screws. They are available from most tool shops and cheap as chips. Larger holes and outside contours you can cut with a Stanley knife or a scalpel.

The gasket for the timing chain tensioner is easily drawn onto the sheet with a pencil, a compass and a ruler. The method using grease, oil or Prussian blue to print the gasket onto the sheet requires a bit of practice else it will end up an inaccurate mess especially for large gaskets.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2016, 10:58:47 am by lecap »
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Offline Umko

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #16 on: July 24, 2016, 11:25:39 am »
Thanks, Crab and lecap. Both "common sense" solutions but, as the saying goes, "Common sense is not so common"!
 

Offline lecap

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Re: DR650 Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket Replacement
« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2016, 12:01:02 pm »
Thanks, Crab and lecap. Both "common sense" solutions but, as the saying goes, "Common sense is not so common"!

Personal hygiene and common sense: Those who would need it most usually don't have a lot :-\ :evil6:
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." (Red Adair)