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Offline Buff

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #100 on: November 24, 2017, 11:40:07 am »
Damn KTM and damn this *&%$ 790...  :patch: :patch: :patch:

I had just about put a deposit down on that Yamaha T7 and now the Orange brigade have the cheek to bring something like this to the party... it's not fair, I'm torn apart  :'( :'(
Do I go for loyalty and (dare I say it) boring power or do I go for a life of risk and excitement? The age old wife & mistress quandary is playing out in my head  :-[ :o :eek7:
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Offline 2StrokeDan

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #101 on: November 24, 2017, 12:02:14 pm »
The problem with these threads is that I see the 790 as a overweight tourer, while some see it as their answer to prayers.

It will never be a 690/701, but it seems like it could be a good option over something like BMW's GS800/850/925??, and perhaps even the T7.
 

Offline Dwerg

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #102 on: November 24, 2017, 12:05:51 pm »
I already have a dirt bike and a 690. I want something that can tour but handle dirt better than the other soft options
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Offline Fransw

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #103 on: November 24, 2017, 12:17:01 pm »
Damn KTM and damn this *&%$ 790...  :patch: :patch: :patch:

I had just about put a deposit down on that Yamaha T7 and now the Orange brigade have the cheek to bring something like this to the party... it's not fair, I'm torn apart  :'( :'(
Do I go for loyalty and (dare I say it) boring power or do I go for a life of risk and excitement? The age old wife & mistress quandary is playing out in my head  :-[ :o :eek7:

Buff, when will this bike be available in SA(the Yamaha)?
 

Offline Xpat

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #104 on: November 24, 2017, 12:26:25 pm »
The problem with these threads is that I see the 790 as a overweight tourer, while some see it as their answer to prayers.

It will never be a 690/701, but it seems like it could be a good option over something like BMW's GS800/850/925??, and perhaps even the T7.

That is your problem only. It doesn't and shouldn't be 701 as that bike is going nowhere (hopefully), so people can go for that one should it fits their needs better. I have 690 and should this 790 turn out to be pig will happily will stick with. There is no lightweight dirt worthy twin on the market. I think nobody with brain expects this bike to beat 690, leave alone KTM 500 (which I personally believe is the best current bike for you if you can look past your Yamaha obsession ) in technical terrain.

Assuming as you said this will turn out to be new SE, give us an example of long distance proper dirt trip where this bike would limit you seriously? Not dedicated rock climbing enduro trip where you are deliberately looking for as tough route as possible but typical long distance trip (which will usually have tons of sand, but not that much rocks).

Sure compared to 690 this will be overweight, but I - an average rider at best - will happily take it on my own through all the riverbeds in Kaokoland/Damaraland (again assuming it is light - i.e. less than 200 kg wet). I may battle a bit through the tricky sections on the VZP (and the road to it which is usually worse), but those are what - about 100 meters of length in total? Worst case scenarion I can walk it down and for the rest of the what - 1000 km loop - I will have a great time.

But yes, if Aprilia (or anybody else) can come up with reasonably reliable RXV550 twin, that would probably be my prefered choice to this.

And T7 - please, it is shaping up to be an overweight KLR or XT660Z, which will make lots of Yanks happy, so good target for Yamaha - as long as they keep it cheap. I don't mind 75 HP - perfectly fine. I don't like the lack of ambition and inovation in weight cutting. I'm sure they are going to use reliability/ruggedness excuse like with XT660Z - and yet there were number of XT660Z subframes that cracked from no obvious abuse, including mine. You can fanboy Yamaha as much as you want - I would bet that you will never even consider buying T7. Like you never did XT660Z.

And I don't like saying this - I really had my hopes high initially for T7 so that there is some choice, but realistically it is not going to happen. In the same way, this 790 may still turn to be a turd - we will see next year.

Offline 2StrokeDan

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #105 on: November 24, 2017, 12:35:39 pm »
Xpat, you are quite correct.

I seem to be one of a dying breed that will quite easily take my XT500/600/690/701 to a destination like Orange river Hell road and back from Stellenbosch, as a 2day trip.

Or the Swartberg/Meiringspoort 4x4 route from Stellenbosch as a one day trip. :ricky:

The BMW GS range started this obsessive belief that small bikes cannot do distance.

Softcocks.

Now tell me how fucking tough I am....... :pot:
 

Offline Offshore

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #106 on: November 24, 2017, 12:46:34 pm »
Xpat, you are quite correct.

I seem to be one of a dying breed that will quite easily take my XT500/600/690/701 to a destination like Orange river Hell road and back from Stellenbosch, as a 2day trip.

Or the Swartberg/Meiringspoort 4x4 route from Stellenbosch as a one day trip. :ricky:

The BMW GS range started this obsessive belief that small bikes cannot do distance.

Softcocks.

Now tell me how fucking tough I am....... :pot:
A real Badass Dan, that is what you are. :thumleft:
 

Offline Xpat

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #107 on: November 24, 2017, 12:50:22 pm »
Xpat, you are quite correct.

I seem to be one of a dying breed that will quite easily take my XT500/600/690/701 to a destination like Orange river Hell road and back from Stellenbosch, as a 2day trip.

Or the Swartberg/Meiringspoort 4x4 route from Stellenbosch as a one day trip. :ricky:

The BMW GS range started this obsessive belief that small bikes cannot do distance.

Softcocks.

Now tell me how fucking tough I am....... :pot:

You are very tough  :thumleft:

But I didn't say you cannot take small bike wherever you like - I myself use 690 as my long distance cruiser (though I would rather take 4 days from CT up to Orange river and back to enjoy it properly). I just don't get why are you getting negative about this bike - it clearly is not a single and clearly is not going to be in the weight class of XT600,701. I would fully support you if this bike would be peddled as replacment of 701 and that bike would be discontinued. But it is not (hopefully) - so you can continue enjoying 701 for your trips if you wish so, while other people who may be looking for newer SE or LC8 may enjoy 790 (hopefully - as I said it may still turn out to be overweight turd.)

Ironically it is Yamaha (and all other Japanese) who dropped people like you (and myself), discontinued all lightweight single options and followed the heavy weight BMW trend. KTM (or its subsidiary Husky) are the only ones who are still supporting single lightweight segment. And 790 hopefully will not change anything on that, so I think KTM deserves kudos for providing lightweight single as well as (hopefylly) reasonably lightweight twin.  :thumleft:

Offline sidetrack

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #108 on: November 24, 2017, 12:53:25 pm »
The Aprillia RXV had the right idea then they went and ruined it with a close ratio gearbox, no aftermarket tank support and the reliability of a Lada
« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 12:54:47 pm by sidetrack »
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Ride reports :
http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=134175.0 Penge's pass and the Old Forest http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=9421.0 - Orange Atlantic adventure http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=7514.0 - 805 km day trip http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=20260.0 - East Cape Bash http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=70199.0 - Two KTM thumpers head north
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #109 on: November 24, 2017, 01:09:16 pm »
Xpat, you are quite correct.

I seem to be one of a dying breed that will quite easily take my XT500/600/690/701 to a destination like Orange river Hell road and back from Stellenbosch, as a 2day trip.

Or the Swartberg/Meiringspoort 4x4 route from Stellenbosch as a one day trip. :ricky:

The BMW GS range started this obsessive belief that small bikes cannot do distance.

Softcocks.

Now tell me how fucking tough I am....... :pot:

You are very tough  :thumleft:

But I didn't say you cannot take small bike wherever you like - I myself use 690 as my long distance cruiser (though I would rather take 4 days from CT up to Orange river and back to enjoy it properly). I just don't get why are you getting negative about this bike - it clearly is not a single and clearly is not going to be in the weight class of XT600,701. I would fully support you if this bike would be peddled as replacment of 701 and that bike would be discontinued. But it is not (hopefully) - so you can continue enjoying 701 for your trips if you wish so, while other people who may be looking for newer SE or LC8 may enjoy 790 (hopefully - as I said it may still turn out to be overweight turd.)

Ironically it is Yamaha (and all other Japanese) who dropped people like you (and myself), discontinued all lightweight single options and followed the heavy weight BMW trend. KTM (or its subsidiary Husky) are the only ones who are still supporting single lightweight segment. And 790 hopefully will not change anything on that, so I think KTM deserves kudos for providing lightweight single as well as (hopefylly) reasonably lightweight twin.  :thumleft:

I do not know what the Japanese are up to, seems to be completely isolated from events. No 2stroke enduro's, except the 10 year old YZ250 2T, no lightweight adventures..... :'(

I am so disappointed in Yamaha, I'll sommer kak KTM out. :ricky:
 

Offline Xpat

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #110 on: November 24, 2017, 01:46:36 pm »


I do not know what the Japanese are up to, seems to be completely isolated from events. No 2stroke enduro's, except the 10 year old YZ250 2T, no lightweight adventures..... :'(

I am so disappointed in Yamaha, I'll sommer kak KTM out. :ricky:


 :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:

Despite apearances, I would like nothing more than if Japanese would commit seriously to the lightweight concept - be it single 600cc or twin. Imagine the choice that would bring to the market. The excuses used for not doing so is emissions (but then KTM/Husky still can do it) and market demand. While I'm sure most people prefer comfort over real dirt worthiness, it seems to me that the heavyweight travelling comfort market is very saturated with many offerings, so being leader in lighweight may give to - whoever attempts it - edge and lead in - admitedly smaller - but still IMO globaly sizeable market niche.

Another problem IMO is that people automatically equate engine size and price - i.e. the bigger the engine the more are they willing to pay. I for one (and I know Im minority) would be happy to pay GSA/1290 money for lightweight very dirtworthy 600 cc single/twin with great suspension, good range and some luggage carrying capability. But that would require mentality shift in the market and with manufacturers, as historically 600 singles were cheap ass rugged workhorses with cheap components that may run on one oil change for 30k km. And its probably never going to happen as I think that increasing health and safety requirements will see bikes or anything similar banned in the next 30 years.

Offline MiniDan

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #111 on: November 24, 2017, 02:09:53 pm »
Xpat, you are quite correct.

I seem to be one of a dying breed that will quite easily take my XT500/600/690/701 to a destination like Orange river Hell road and back from Stellenbosch, as a 2day trip.

Or the Swartberg/Meiringspoort 4x4 route from Stellenbosch as a one day trip. :ricky:

The BMW GS range started this obsessive belief that small bikes cannot do distance.

Softcocks.

Now tell me how fucking tough I am....... :pot:

Kak!!! You're an old softy and emphasis is on the OLD!!!!

 

Offline Kelevra

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #112 on: November 24, 2017, 02:23:06 pm »
Don't know what you bunch are on about. For who exactly to you want them to build these light-weight super adventure go anywhere touring racers. Have you seen the youth of today- useless with no sense of adventure, and old people ride GS's. Maybe 10 or so people on this forum. A boy of maybe 10 years old burst out in tears when I started my bike outside of spar the other day FFS what happened.

PS The bike you want already exists Minxy is selling hers.....but here is the problem, you want it affordable (cheap) too
« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 02:29:40 pm by Kelevra »
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Offline Omninorm

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #113 on: November 24, 2017, 03:38:33 pm »
If all your riding buddies are on 650 singles then you will never need more.
Had an Xchallenge, Xcountry and now the 690 and they are plenty bike to go 120 on the highway and do all the dirt you could want. Its when you have a 650 and the other guys have 800, 1000, 1200, 1300 twins where the rthe crap comes in. They want to cruise 160 on the highway or long stretches....you want to go explore oasis hues on the way there. You and your mates need to be on similar bikes for riding to work.

Also KTM is still selling the 690 in 2018 if you check on the parts and sales websites the 2018 is already listed. No change to the engine it seems. In some countries its listed under Enduro and others under Adventure.

But yeah... Id like the 790 or 850gs probably over my 1200 just because of the 21 front so if Im there with a pig, with people with other pigs, I can do the rougher or sandier sections easier.

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Previous: BMW 1200GS LC, BMW F800GS, Suzuki Vstrom 650, Honda Transalp XLV700, BMW Xchallenge, BMW Xcountry, Yamaha WR250F, Honda NC750X, Honda XR150, Kawasaki KLX450R, Yamaha YZ250, Kawasaki KX450, Yamaha YZ250F, KTM 250 XCW, Yamah DT125, Yamaha DT50, Honda NSR250
 

Offline Pistonpete

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #114 on: November 24, 2017, 03:54:19 pm »
The Kriegsmarine are on their way...
'Routine is the thief of time'
 

Offline Xpat

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #115 on: November 24, 2017, 03:55:42 pm »
If all your riding buddies are on 650 singles then you will never need more.
Had an Xchallenge, Xcountry and now the 690 and they are plenty bike to go 120 on the highway and do all the dirt you could want. Its when you have a 650 and the other guys have 800, 1000, 1200, 1300 twins where the rthe crap comes in. They want to cruise 160 on the highway or long stretches....you want to go explore oasis hues on the way there. You and your mates need to be on similar bikes for riding to work.

Also KTM is still selling the 690 in 2018 if you check on the parts and sales websites the 2018 is already listed. No change to the engine it seems. In some countries its listed under Enduro and others under Adventure.

But yeah... Id like the 790 or 850gs probably over my 1200 just because of the 21 front so if Im there with a pig, with people with other pigs, I can do the rougher or sandier sections easier.

I have to say that this buddy riding concept is completely foreign to me - isnt bike riding supposed to be the ultimate individualistic endeavour, kind of like a cowboy riding into the sun or something?  :peepwall: :pot:

I don't even get the whole headset thingy where you talk to other people while you ride - for me riding is the ultimate me time and talking to other people just disturbs my zen and mindspace.

But that is me, I'm selfish bastard, and I consider solo riding way safer as I don't have to keep situational awareness of what others are doing, but rather can focus fully on mi ride. I'm willing to ride only with people where there is no codependency - everybody is big and ugly enough to take care of themselves if shit hits the fan, and if our riding preferences differ we just part ways and make our own way with no hard feelings. So I take zero consideration of what other people ride when chosing my bike - I look only for what fits my riding best.

Anyway - I'm way offtopic. Back to 790 then...

Offline jpcussen

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #116 on: November 24, 2017, 05:52:23 pm »
Yeah, small thumpers end up leaving everyone waiting while they hammer away on the tar at 120-140kmh, and then moan about it. Tar, is a necessary evil and is best put behind as fast as possible. I was considering the 690 at one point until we rode with one in the group and I realised that is a limitation of note.

For me, riding is a hobby best savoured with mates, the laughs, the memories, the dicing, learning and helping others - Riding alone for me has little appeal.
If you are not falling, you are not trying hard enough.

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Offline Xpat

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #117 on: November 24, 2017, 06:28:37 pm »
Each to their own.

But to say that tar is necessary evil in SA is not correct in my experience. I'm pretty sure if people care they can always find nice dirt alternative anywhere in SA, but they usually just focus on collecting bucket lists instead of looking for the most interesting routes. I don't know CT (though I'm pretty sure I would be able to get to Orange river off tar along the west coast), but in Joburg people use that excuse that it is 1000 km of tar to Namibia. That is their choice, but indeed there is an obvious alternative that is dirt most of the way and runs on tracks that were raced in Amageza 2015.

So tar is a matter choice, not necessity in SA.

Offline 2StrokeDan

Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #118 on: November 24, 2017, 06:32:31 pm »
Yeah, small thumpers end up leaving everyone waiting while they hammer away on the tar at 120-140kmh, and then moan about it. Tar, is a necessary evil and is best put behind as fast as possible. I was considering the 690 at one point until we rode with one in the group and I realised that is a limitation of note.

For me, riding is a hobby best savoured with mates, the laughs, the memories, the dicing, learning and helping others - Riding alone for me has little appeal.


You can savour your mates in a bar too. Nothing like a solo. Answer to no one except yourself.
 

Online Renrew

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Re: KTM 790 ADVENTURE
« Reply #119 on: November 24, 2017, 06:44:28 pm »
I REALLY like both :ricky:

Kraftfahrzeuge Trunkenpolz Mattighofen
KTM 1190R
KTM 990R
KTM 950R Super Enduro_0km ;)
KTM 300 XC-W