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Author Topic: Husky 701 Alternative 2nd tank connection point  (Read 2266 times)

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Offline Amsterdam

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #20 on: August 01, 2018, 12:15:20 pm »
First prize is of course no dirt entering your tank at all.  But not being able to guarantee that I followed other people's lead with the following modification.  I have removed the 10 micron filter in-tank filter altogether (leave the screen at the bottom of the pump though) and replaced it with an external car filter.  These filters are also for fuel injection systems and I checked with the filter manufacturer regarding the filter size which is also 10 microns.  The advantage of these external filters is that you can easily replace them without drawing any fuel from the tank, they have a much larger cross sectional area than the in-tank filter and on top of that they are cheap.  My installation is maybe not the neatest but you can hide it a bit.  I am always concerned about things bouncing about and rubbing, hence the foam and hose clamp construction.

And also remember to clean/replace the 2nd in-line filter on occasion.

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Offline BuRP

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #21 on: August 01, 2018, 01:26:48 pm »
My hunch is that these pumps "go" because they suck water.
See my pic of the 'holes' in the pump's shroud above: the pump will suck water as soon as this gets into the tank, and this ain't good for the pump.
I'd reckon keep your tank clean by draining a little once in a while: just crack the 4 bolts of the pump loose, let it leak a bit (kindof a flush), the nip them up again.

w@nted,
I probably have to 'break' the subframe a bit to get to the filter.
But, remember this is a huuuuuge surface area compared to the OEM puny little thing, so it will last for a very long time.
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Offline BuRP

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #22 on: August 01, 2018, 01:30:36 pm »
Remember that any filters installed in the pressurized line are post pump, so any water&filth getting into the tank will go through the pump, no matter what!
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Offline w@nted

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #23 on: August 01, 2018, 02:09:22 pm »
Remember that any filters installed in the pressurized line are post pump, so any water&filth getting into the tank will go through the pump, no matter what!

Yes that is my concern as well. Apparently the guglatech in tank filter keeps water out as well...They have a nice video showing how the filter does not let water through, only clean petrol.
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Offline Amsterdam

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2018, 06:59:41 pm »
My understanding of what breaks the pump is this - The fuel filter that is installed in the tank after the pump plugs with normal dirt that is unfortunately in much of the petrol we get.  This results in a very low flow through the filter and in turn, the pump does not get cooled by a normal flow of petrol through it and it gets very hot as the trapped fuel is heated up due to friction of the pump.  This damages the pump.  The above scenario was what we actually found last weekend when we had to do a field repair on a KTM 500 (different tank but the same setup as the 690/701).  The pump was quite warm as was the in-tank filter.
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Offline BuRP

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2018, 07:12:09 pm »
Hello Chris from Flying Brick,

as I didn't know the Guglatech name I googled.
Nice product indeed, I'm interested.

But, the video clip about installing this on a 701 shows a shortcoming, two actually.
It appears that the fitment of the actual fuelcap, the green inner bit, is a problem as it does not fit the bag's neck-ring.
Apparently it can me made to fit, but I'm not convinced by this video as the guy skips the actual closing of the cap - can't help wondering why.
No idea how old this video is, has this problem been solved since perhaps?

Secondly, the RG-tank would need a filter too if this is installed, and I have.
Got something for that as well, or is there perhaps a kit for a 701 with both tanks?

In addition, can these filter-bags be cleaned/washed?
The website is quiet about this, hence me asking as it seems you're the SA Agent.


Edited: Amsterdam, you may well be correct, but google guglatech - it'll prevent dirt and water entering the tank!
« Last Edit: August 01, 2018, 07:15:30 pm by BuRP »
Sparta MC50, 46 other 50cc's, Garelli Tiger Cross, Jawa 250, Kreidler RS (plated), Kawasaki S1 250/3, S2 350/3, H1 500/3, H2 750/3, Suzuki GT380/3 - 10 year gap - KDX200, BMW 1150GS Adventure, Honda CBR600RR, Honda XR650R 2007 & 2003, Honda CRF230, Yamaha BWS100, BMW F800GS Adventure, Husqvarna 701 Enduro 2018, KTM 790 Adv R 2019, KTM 2020 XC-W TPI 300 Six Days, KTM 2014 500 EXC-W Six Days, KTM 790 Adv R Rally 2020
 

Offline Amsterdam

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #26 on: August 01, 2018, 09:29:50 pm »

Edited: Amsterdam, you may well be correct, but google guglatech - it'll prevent dirt and water entering the tank!

And since we often fill from bottles and other uncontrolled sources preventing water ingress is definitely a plus.
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Offline w@nted

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2018, 07:25:31 am »
Hello Chris from Flying Brick,

as I didn't know the Guglatech name I googled.
Nice product indeed, I'm interested.

But, the video clip about installing this on a 701 shows a shortcoming, two actually.
It appears that the fitment of the actual fuelcap, the green inner bit, is a problem as it does not fit the bag's neck-ring.
Apparently it can me made to fit, but I'm not convinced by this video as the guy skips the actual closing of the cap - can't help wondering why.
No idea how old this video is, has this problem been solved since perhaps?

Secondly, the RG-tank would need a filter too if this is installed, and I have.
Got something for that as well, or is there perhaps a kit for a 701 with both tanks?

In addition, can these filter-bags be cleaned/washed?
The website is quiet about this, hence me asking as it seems you're the SA Agent.


Edited: Amsterdam, you may well be correct, but google guglatech - it'll prevent dirt and water entering the tank!

Hi BuRP

I have been in contact with guglatech SA...The tank filters for the 701 (Rear oem and rade tank) have had a technical modification done to make them fit properly in the front and rear tanks. I am waiting for feedback regarding delivery of these new models, as they are being shipped from Italy. Looks very promising... :thumleft: I have ordered two, front Rade and rear oem... :ricky:
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Offline w@nted

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2018, 07:54:33 am »
Here is an extract of the modification from the suppliers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Offline BuRP

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2018, 12:48:07 pm »
Thanks w@nted,

didn't know they have an SA agent, thought Chris/FB was it: sorry for misusing your name here Chris, was going to order from you  :thumleft:


Once you have yours installed w@nted, please let us know how it works?
I mean better you play the Guinea Pig here, I'll be happy to follow the leader if he's a happy piggie  :P


For all reading here, these filters are kinda bags through which you put fuel into your tank.
This bag-material will let fuel through but not water, and also it filters out a lot (I doubt all but it is a lot) of contaminants.
The fact that it stops water is really surprising, it will stay inside this 'bag'.
For more visit their website, watch the one youtube .... genuine amazing!
Sparta MC50, 46 other 50cc's, Garelli Tiger Cross, Jawa 250, Kreidler RS (plated), Kawasaki S1 250/3, S2 350/3, H1 500/3, H2 750/3, Suzuki GT380/3 - 10 year gap - KDX200, BMW 1150GS Adventure, Honda CBR600RR, Honda XR650R 2007 & 2003, Honda CRF230, Yamaha BWS100, BMW F800GS Adventure, Husqvarna 701 Enduro 2018, KTM 790 Adv R 2019, KTM 2020 XC-W TPI 300 Six Days, KTM 2014 500 EXC-W Six Days, KTM 790 Adv R Rally 2020
 

Online Rough Rider

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2018, 01:05:47 pm »
 :sip:
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Offline w@nted

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #31 on: August 02, 2018, 01:11:03 pm »
Thanks w@nted,

didn't know they have an SA agent, thought Chris/FB was it: sorry for misusing your name here Chris, was going to order from you  :thumleft:


Once you have yours installed w@nted, please let us know how it works?
I mean better you play the Guinea Pig here, I'll be happy to follow the leader if he's a happy piggie  :P


For all reading here, these filters are kinda bags through which you put fuel into your tank.
This bag-material will let fuel through but not water, and also it filters out a lot (I doubt all but it is a lot) of contaminants.
The fact that it stops water is really surprising, it will stay inside this 'bag'.
For more visit their website, watch the one youtube .... genuine amazing!

I will definitely install one as soon as stock arrives and give feedback. Chris from flying brick is one of the retailers in SA  :thumleft:
Bikes: Honda CB1, Yamaha XT660R, BMW F800GS, BMW R1200GS DOHC, BMW R1200GS LC Trophy edition, Husqvarna 701 Enduro
 

Offline Vansafrica

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #32 on: August 02, 2018, 01:57:08 pm »
Hi Guys,

We are the distributors of the Guglatech range of filters.

The filter is indeed ready for shipment for the Rade Garage tank and for the Husky 701 standard fuel cap.

I have been giving some contradictory info the last few days, but only because I wanted to test the product before release, but the secret is out! HAHAHA

Drop us a mail via www.guglatech.co.za or contact your local dealer for assistance. Stock should arrive within the next 3 weeks from Italy.

R
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Offline w@nted

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #33 on: August 02, 2018, 01:59:58 pm »
Hi Guys,

We are the distributors of the Guglatech range of filters.

The filter is indeed ready for shipment for the Rade Garage tank and for the Husky 701 standard fuel cap.

I have been giving some contradictory info the last few days, but only because I wanted to test the product before release, but the secret is out! HAHAHA

Drop us a mail via www.guglatech.co.za or contact your local dealer for assistance. Stock should arrive within the next 3 weeks from Italy.

R

Haha Awesome!

Let me know if you need someone to test the products for you...  :deal:
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Offline Mayhem

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #34 on: September 14, 2018, 01:47:22 pm »
I have just finished fitting mu Raid garage tank and all is well, I did the fuel tank tap install as described but there is a serious floor to this method.... there is no way to actually get to the tap once the tank is back in the bike. This may be a neater installation but it is more work to do and not rely any benefit.
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Offline Vansafrica

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #35 on: September 15, 2018, 09:23:19 am »
Hi Guys,

We are the distributors of the Guglatech range of filters.

The filter is indeed ready for shipment for the Rade Garage tank and for the Husky 701 standard fuel cap.

I have been giving some contradictory info the last few days, but only because I wanted to test the product before release, but the secret is out! HAHAHA

Drop us a mail via www.guglatech.co.za or contact your local dealer for assistance. Stock should arrive within the next 3 weeks from Italy.

R

Hi Guys,

Just an update. We are still awaiting shipment from Italy on the new 701 filters. With the strike at post office and the European Summer break we have been way behind schedule. Sorry for the inconvenience. We will update you guys asap.

R
WWW.VANSAFRICA.COM

2005 BMW R 1200GS
2016 KTM 300 XCW
 
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Offline BuRP

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #36 on: September 17, 2018, 08:16:35 pm »
Ah, that explains, thanks Vans!
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Offline zebra - Flying Brick

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #37 on: October 08, 2018, 03:00:15 pm »
OK, finally: here is a description received from RADE Garage, requested by ourselves, on why it might NOT be a good idea to the the alternative tank connection point, but read it and share your thoughts:
(The BOLD and underlining are my emphasis, not the Author...)


Dear Radek, Chris,
there a three reasons why not to connect main and auxiliary tanks through the air ventilation.  There can be split into a technical, safety and (depending on local regulations) legal reason.

First of all the technical reason. The fuel pump installed by KTM/HSQ is and was never design to pull fuel through generation a vacuum. The fuel pump is known to be a source for issues even without adding the additional strain of vacuum based fuel transport.

Second changing the airings of fuel tanks can lead to higher fire risks especially when both tanks a full. Gas tends to expand at higher temperature and so pressure in tanks rises. Therefore they have and need airing. When tank fuel lines a connected through airing the expansion can lead to either spilling of fuel through the “last” airing and/or deformation (when using “lock” valves to stop fuel spilling)  of the tanks resulting in a higher gas pollution and fire risk.
Last but not effective for all countries it is strictly forbidden to change fuel tank airings and regulated that tanks have to be aired separately. This of course differs a lot from all over the world, but these regulations result from the potential pollution and fire risks.
Out of these reasons and the situation that either adding the fuel pump adapter or – in case of 701 – making use of the OEM option for connecting an auxiliary is plain simple no solid argumentation any professional technician is suitable to accept a bricolagee ( construction or creation from a diverse range of available things) such as solution connecting tanks through airing lines.
These insights are also based on discussion having had with private friends at KTM HQ R&D in Austria, never the less you will never receive an official statement from them. But just the way how KTM/HSQ R&D  designed the connection of an auxiliary tank to the main tank for the 701 give a clear insight ;-).Feel free to contact me for any further questions and information & bye, Jakob Weinknecht, Austria.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2018, 03:04:19 pm by zebra - Flying Brick »
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Offline BuRP

Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #38 on: October 08, 2018, 03:45:23 pm »
Whoa Chris,

Yes, that specific alternative connection (through the modified breather of the std fuel-cap) was not what Amsterdam (OP) suggested!
Sure, it also floats out there, and it is this what Rade comments on here, solely.
I agree with his reservations on the venting bits, expansion of gas will or may push out fuel - which is a risk, and one of the reasons why I think this way is stupid to implement, and Rade clearly thinks this too but is more politically correct than me.
Regarding the vacuum-remarks, realize that 1 Bar equals 10 meters of water equals around eleven meters (!) of fuel..... so 20 centimeters (if it is that much, the height difference between bottom-of-aux-tank & std fuel-cap!) represent a waffle&twat, something I cannot type (I can but it won't be displayed lol) but is the exact same as 'nada', negligible hence not part of the argument - except of course for bookkeepers & speedcops, for them 0.00000000001 is wrong  ;)
The possible if not likely spilling of fuel is a problem though, and dangerous, plus the fact that one has to sequentially fill the tanks is another one.

This thread though lends its existence to Amsterdam's clever mentioning that the factory has catered for mounting a fueltap on the std tank, and connecting a secondary tank via this has zero drawbacks (of course, it is what KTM intended), in fact it has an advantage - one can keep the tap closed until the std tank is empty and only then switch over to the aux tank, in the knowledge that whatever one had in the aux tank is now available to do whatever's needed, or to find a petrol station.


(Later edited)
On the (il)legality of modifying fuel breathing systems: come on now chaps, let's keep it real please? Yes, modding is illegal (prolly also in SA), but pls tell me how the venting of the aux tank is 'legal' i.e environmentally correct?
It isn't, it's not even close and will fail Euro1, never mind 4 or 5..... and no, I'm not complaining, I love this Rade tank & Filter, but 'legal' it isn't  :P
« Last Edit: October 08, 2018, 03:51:35 pm by BuRP »
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Offline zebra - Flying Brick

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Re: Alternative 2nd tank connection point on 701/690
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2018, 08:15:56 am »
Hi BuRP - yes, i was refering to the 'other' method, and not the 'Amsterdam' method - and I also thought the comments would make for interesting reading in any case, but yes, this pertains to Method THREE and not Method TWO!


Cheers
Chris
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