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Offline Xpat

Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #180 on: May 25, 2018, 06:41:40 pm »
For whatever it is worth, I have asked on advrider (you can go and get yourself knocked over if you wish here: http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/who-saw-this-coming-crf450l.1316544/) and this is the answer I got:


My question: Thanks. Any indication of real power? And are they serious with 1000 km service intervals? Not that it matters - I service my 500 every 1500 - 3000 km and its working just fine, just curious.


Answer: A decent interview had a Honda guy expecting something in the 40's. Intervals are covering most extreme use situations. Especially extended highway miles, that some may use the bike for, according to another Honda source. Most tidbits of info point to this L being more of a performance DS. Not quite race-ready, but more in that neck of the woods. NOT a 250L or WR250R....
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 06:43:02 pm by Xpat »
 

Offline Xpat

Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #181 on: May 25, 2018, 07:08:51 pm »
As long as this L comes with stainless steel valves all round it will be solid. Make peace with the service intervals and it will be a toss up between buying a CRF450L or KTM 500 for those looking for the route less traveled.

This is what I found on advrider:

Ginger Beard said: ↑
Does anyone know whether or not they are running ti valves? Hopefully they went with steel.


If you're asking about the new 450L they are titanium. Taken from Honda's website:

Titanium Intake Valves
Lightweight titanium intake valves permit use of smaller valve springs, reducing overall engine height.

Offline Hardy de Kock

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #182 on: May 25, 2018, 07:12:13 pm »
ttention: Hardy (Specialsed Adventures)
24/05/2018


2019 HONDA CRF450L

New model updates: Using the CRF450R moto-crosser as a base, Honda's new road-legal dual-purpose motorcycle has a tough, lightweight chassis built to find all the available grip, powered by an engine that delivers strong, usable power right from the bottom. Durable, high quality parts and long service intervals aim for a worry-free riding and ownership experience.

Contents:

1 Introduction

2 Model overview

3 Key features

4 Technical specifications

1. Introduction

A true dual-purpose motorcycle should be many things; off-road it needs to be light weight, with quality suspension and handling ability that keeps life easy as the going gets harder. Its engine has to make good power and torque from the bottom up - the sort that is supremely usable, allowing the rider to find all the rear wheel grip possible, whatever the terrain.

All the attributes that make it great fun off-road also enable it to be really useful around town; narrow and nimble, a dual-purpose machine slips through gaps, soaks up the hits from rough roads and stays well ahead of traffic thanks to smart, low-gear acceleration. It also needs to be turn-key reliable, with sensible intervals between major service work.

Competition machines can make a solid base for dual-purpose adaptation. But there is much to consider. Race-level performance brings with it an intensive maintenance schedule, which is simply too much for many 'hobby' trail riders, who just want to push a button and go - and keep on going, Furthermore, a barely-disguised race bike can mean crucial road-going elements - lights, indicators, ignition switch - are not as user-friendly and durable as they should be.

Honda understands this, and with a desire to produce a dual-purpose bike that draws strongly on the fundamental performance of a race machine, yet with much more 'normal' service intervals and high-quality road ancillaries, has taken its CRF450R moto-crosser as the base to start from, and created the new CRF450L.

It is unmistakably a race-bred CRF - and looks it - but with the additions and modifications needed to make it both road legal and supremely useable in a trail environment. As such, the CRF450L is a complete package, as happy roosting trails as it is linking them up on-road. And with Honda engineering and build quality at its core, is sure to do so for years to come.

Mr M. Uchiyama, Large Project Leader (LPL) 19YM CRF450L:

"The CRF450L is about having maximum fun out on the dirt. It looks like a CRF450R because, really, it is - just a trail-friendly, road-legal version. That's what the 'L' stands for - 'legal'. It's been engineered to deliver excellent handling feel, with linear engine torque that helps the rider make the most of the available grip in all conditions. AND, it contains its HRC-derived CRF technology within a real-world service schedule."

2. Model Overview

The journey from full race to road legal trail was a detailed one for the CRF450L. Road legality required the engine to gain EURO4 compliance, while from a longevity and usability viewpoint, the power output and character, needed careful attention.

It's still a CRF450R; just one that's quieter, both mechanically from the chassis and engine, as well as its new exhaust. Both fuelling and ignition maps are now managed by 02 lambda sensor; compression ratio has been lowered and crank mass increased for improved drivability. The gearbox is a 6-speed - for longer legs on the road - and a cush drive has been added to the 18-inch rear wheel.

The plastics are lifted directly from the CRF450R and all lighting is LED, with the front headlight in particular throwing out a penetrating beam. Increased volume for the titanium fuel tank adds range and all the items that make the CRF450L ready to purchase as a licensed, road going machine - such as speedometer and horn - are present as standard.

3. Key Features

3.1 Engine

Based on the CRF450R, with first major service at 32,000km
EURO4 compliant, with electric start
Greater crank inertia improves drivability and feel for traction
6-speed gearbox
While the chassis was more straightforward to convert from its CRF450R moto-crosser specification to a dual-purpose performance level, the 449cc engine needed more consideration from Honda's engineers. Requirements were several: the need for it to pass EURO4 emissions and noise regulations, and to be usable for a wide variety of riders in many differing situations both on and off-road.

While the fundamental architecture of the four-valve Unicam powerplant remains the same, many details have been changed to support the broader role: the crank's mass has been increased, resulting in 13% more inertia which, for a trail rider, equals improved torque feel and response; valve timing has been revised to give the broader, smoother spread of power and torque; the gearbox is now 6-speed, rather than 5 for longer range use on tarmac; left and right engine covers wear outer covers to reduce noise;

Elsewhere, the ACG has been uprated, to provide the required electrical power for the LED lights and to maintain battery charge during lower-speed running. The battery itself is a high-volume unit.

Bore and stroke are unchanged from the CRF450R, at 96mm x 62.1mm, but the piston uses 3 rings instead of 2 for greater durability. Compression ratio is 12.0:1 (compared 13.5:1). The redesigned airbox feeds the PGM-FI, managed by a lambda sensor in the large-volume single exhaust (which replaces the 'stubby' dual-pipe design of the CRF450R). An Air Injection (AI) system and catalyser clean up the spent gases.

The four-valve Unicam cylinder head features a finger rocker arm on the inlet valves; valve lift is 7.7mm with 6.7mm exhaust valve lift. Inlet valve diameter is 38mm. The valve springs are oval in cross section and valve angle is 9 intake/10.5 exhaust.

The clutch spins 7 friction discs with a 2mm clutch plate efficiently dissipating heat; the springs generate a good, consistent connection. The front sprocket is a 13T, the rear 51T.

Peak power is 18.4kW, with peak torque of 32Nm. Important from the hobby trail-rider's perspective is the engine's reliability and gap between service intervals. And this is where the CRF450L's build quality and design really stands out; it will go 32,000km between major strip downs, with an air filter oil and oil filter change every 1000km.

3.2 Chassis

Drawn from the 18YM CRF450R, with minor adaptations for its dual purpose role
Full LED lighting, increased fuel tank volume and sidestand
Larger radiator volume, plus electric fan
Styling closely mirrors that of CRF450R
Having received a ground-up redesign in 2016, the CRF450R's chassis was a perfect place for the CRF450L to start out from, with changes to match the machine's vastly broader usage range, and road legal mission.

Firstly, the tapered dual-spar aluminium beam frame was made slightly wider at the swingarm pivot points, to allow for the greater engine width resulting from the 6-speed gearbox. The headstock was modified to mount a steering lock and the aluminium swingarm injected with urethane to reduce noise. The rear subframe is the same, with mounting point adjusted to take the taillight and the right-exit single exhaust muffler.

Rake and trail are set at 28.5/122mm with wheelbase increased 18mm from the CRF450R to 1500mm, for greater stability. Both the R and the L feature 22mm fork offset.Wet weight is 130.8kg; seat height is 940mm.

A 49mm Showa steel-sprung USD fork - adjustable for preload plus compression damping - is matched by a fully adjustable Showa rear shock, operated through Pro-Link. A 260mm wave-pattern disc delivers effective heat dissipation, power and feel from the two-piston brake caliper working it; a matching 240mm wave-pattern disc and single-piston caliper is at the rear.

Whereas the CRF450R machine uses a 19-inch rear wheel, the CRF450L's is an 18-inch (to fit enduro-spec tyres), with the addition of a cush drive to absorb chain shock; a sealed 520 chain is protected by a plastic chain guard. The front wheel is a 21-inch and both rims are finished in black. Tyres are sized 80/100-21 front and 120/80-18 rear.

The CRF450L's style draws fully on that of the CRF450R. Carried over are the rear mudguard, side panels and bash plate. Svelte side shrouds hide a larger radiator volume plus electric fan. All lighting (including the indicators and license-plate light) is LED; a speedometer, horn, brake-light switch and mirrors satisfy legal requirements while a sidestand adds convenience. The CRF450R employs a 6.3L titanium fuel tank; the CRF450L ups the volume 1.3L to 7.6L. The fuel cap also locks in place.

4. Technical Specifications

 

 

ENGINE

 

Type

Liquid-cooled 4-stroke single cylinder uni-cam

Displacement

449cc

Bore and Stroke

96.0mm x 62.1mm

Compression Ratio

12.0:1

FUEL SYSTEM

 

Carburation

PGM-FI Fuel injection

Fuel Tank Capacity

7.6 litres

ELECTRICAL SYSTEM

 

Ignition

Digital CDI

Starter

Electric

DRIVETRAIN

 

Clutch Type

Wet multiplate

Transmission Type

Chain

Final Drive

Chain

FRAME

 

Type

Aluminium twin tube

CHASSIS

 

Dimensions (LWH)

2,280mm x 825mm x 1,260mm

Wheelbase

1500mm

Caster Angle

28.5

Trail

122mm

Seat Height

940mm

Ground Clearance

315mm

Kerb Weight

130.8kg

SUSPENSION

 

Type Front

49mm Showa steel-sprung USD fork

Type Rear

Showa monoshock using Honda Pro-Link system

WHEELS

 

Type Front

Aluminium spoke

Type Rear

Aluminium spoke

Tyres Front

80/100-21
Tyres Rear

120/80-18

BRAKES

 

Front

Single Disk

Rear

Single Disk

 

All specifications are provisional and subject to change without notice.

*The CRF450L will be launching in South Africa in the last quarter of 2018.

                                                                     

This is how I received the press release from Honda SA - but I suspect there is a few typo's in it. - Will get Barend to address the issues
 
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Offline BiG DoM

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #183 on: May 25, 2018, 07:19:22 pm »
Great to be getting more info. Thanks Hardy.

Xpat - Yes ADVRider is rather exhausting . I have been a member since its early days but seldom frequent it regularly anymore, mostly dip in and out and very specifically. I have lived in USA and unfortunately I recognise too well the arrogance and bigotry from some (not all mind). 
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Offline shark_za

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #184 on: May 25, 2018, 07:27:40 pm »
Ok so this like a down tuned KTM 500 with better suspension,
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #185 on: May 25, 2018, 07:31:52 pm »
Ok so this like a down tuned KTM 500 with better suspension,

and vastly better reliability.
 

Offline Xpat

Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #186 on: May 25, 2018, 07:37:42 pm »

Ok so this like a down tuned KTM 500 with better suspension,

Nope, so far it is 250L with better suspension and pricetag of KTM 500.

I still think the info is just wrong, but that press release has been hanging all over the web for 2 days already, so I'm getting confused. Unless it is one of those cases where it really gets released with 25 HP for Euro and California nazis, but comes out with a screw or two which if not Loctited may wriggle out and somehow release another 25hp...

My Husky 630 came out kind of  like that...
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 07:38:05 pm by Xpat »
 

Offline shark_za

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #187 on: May 25, 2018, 07:50:41 pm »
Cant be 25HP, my TTR is listed as that.
 

Offline BiG DoM

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #188 on: May 25, 2018, 07:52:54 pm »

Ok so this like a down tuned KTM 500 with better suspension,

Nope, so far it is 250L with better suspension and pricetag of KTM 500.

I

 :imaposer:  ... and an extra piston ring.
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Offline Operator

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #189 on: May 25, 2018, 08:27:36 pm »
Still question that 18.4 kW power output - the 2018 CRF450R claims to put out more than twice this (almost 60HP). Surely they could not have castrated it on this model so much? Must be at typo.

Copy and paste error surely
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #190 on: May 25, 2018, 08:31:48 pm »
Cant be 25HP, my TTR is listed as that.

My 1981 XT500 claims 27 horsepower........must be wrong.

Perhaps Honda's used all the power on Marquez's bike?
 

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #191 on: May 25, 2018, 08:39:40 pm »
As long as this L comes with stainless steel valves all round it will be solid. Make peace with the service intervals and it will be a toss up between buying a CRF450L or KTM 500 for those looking for the route less traveled.

This is what I found on advrider:

Ginger Beard said: ↑
Does anyone know whether or not they are running ti valves? Hopefully they went with steel.


If you're asking about the new 450L they are titanium. Taken from Honda's website:

Titanium Intake Valves
Lightweight titanium intake valves permit use of smaller valve springs, reducing overall engine height.
Bad move, L owners should buy good feeler gauges with the bike. So you lower comp, add piston ring and heavier flywheel but keep racing valves ? I had SS valves and the bike had plenty of power and still revved quick with the bonus of not having to adjust them at each stop
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Offline Bill the Bong

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #192 on: May 25, 2018, 09:49:38 pm »
KTMs also use titanium valves.
 

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #193 on: May 26, 2018, 12:22:14 am »
I promise to resurrect my XR650L with a high compression Wiseco 657cc piston soon. No longer shall I be left behind by dropped valves or other misery in the head department after 38 000 reliable km on my favorite Valley and SA trails.
Oh Fuckit - it's now  2018! and I need to get with it rather sooner than later while I still breathe. My take on things CRF450L related:

* It's a cool bike that may turn out to be a proper gem or maybe not.
* No knowledge or evidence of outright performance parameters so we have to wait until XYZ goes for a test race and reports back here on this forum.
* I'm still in XR heaven so it will take a lot to get me CRF motivated.
* Right now we know fuckall about how this particular CRF hangs together and how it could work in the real world.
* Until then - breathe - relax - breathe - Repeat. Honda has thrown us a curveball  :thumleft: and we gotta see how it works out.
 

Offline BiG DoM

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #194 on: May 26, 2018, 08:31:46 am »

Honda has thrown us a curveball  :thumleft: and we gotta see how it works out.


I think it is a full toss they have thrown rather than a curve ball  8)
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Offline volroom

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #195 on: May 26, 2018, 08:50:29 am »
So just asking, how many mfg's at the moment have dual sport options like this? street legal lightweight enduros? I for one hope the sales go up, and that the market changes a bit from those that do 95% tar and 5% dirt to something more balanced. I mean, you often hear guys saying that the days of overweight tankers adventure bikes are over. Maybe its a global trend, in which case the mfg WILL listen. Perhaps make less overly powerful adventure bikes, and something more balanced - less power, more light weight. I would like something that is not as enduro as this, it's a racing mx bike in disguise. I would like to see something between that and the 1000cc + Adv bikes, arond 600-700cc perhaps, twin, 200kg curb weigh, etc. just thinking aloud
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Offline wolf skaap

Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #196 on: May 26, 2018, 08:53:31 am »
The L is going to be an X with lights and perhaps softer spring rates.

Both will have the same emission controls and my guess is that they might require an ecu remap, once you uncork them.

Seeing as they both have the new R frame, they will share the new intake system which means they can make huge power.

Both will have the 3-ring piston. I guess if you want Yamaha reliability, you might aswell start with that. Sadly they still have a bit more to do when it comes to the valve train.

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« Last Edit: May 26, 2018, 08:56:57 am by wolf skaap »
Let the good times roll!
 

Offline wolf skaap

Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #197 on: May 26, 2018, 08:55:33 am »
So just asking, how many mfg's at the moment have dual sport options like this? street legal lightweight enduros? I for one hope the sales go up, and that the market changes a bit from those that do 95% tar and 5% dirt to something more balanced. I mean, you often hear guys saying that the days of overweight tankers adventure bikes are over. Maybe its a global trend, in which case the mfg WILL listen. Perhaps make less overly powerful adventure bikes, and something more balanced - less power, more light weight. I would like something that is not as enduro as this, it's a racing mx bike in disguise. I would like to see something between that and the 1000cc + Adv bikes, arond 600-700cc perhaps, twin, 200kg curb weigh, etc. just thinking aloud
T7

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Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #198 on: May 26, 2018, 09:03:36 am »
So just asking, how many mfg's at the moment have dual sport options like this? street legal lightweight enduros? I for one hope the sales go up, and that the market changes a bit from those that do 95% tar and 5% dirt to something more balanced. I mean, you often hear guys saying that the days of overweight tankers adventure bikes are over. Maybe its a global trend, in which case the mfg WILL listen. Perhaps make less overly powerful adventure bikes, and something more balanced - less power, more light weight. I would like something that is not as enduro as this, it's a racing mx bike in disguise. I would like to see something between that and the 1000cc + Adv bikes, arond 600-700cc perhaps, twin, 200kg curb weigh, etc. just thinking aloud

Its coming and its orange and called the KTM 790 Adventure.  :lol8:

PS. And maybe the Yamaha T7 but I fear it may not make the weigh-in cut  ::)
« Last Edit: May 26, 2018, 09:06:29 am by BiG DoM »
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Offline wolf skaap

Re: Honda CRF450L is coming
« Reply #199 on: May 26, 2018, 09:24:31 am »
Yes it's going to be close for the T7

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