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Author Topic: De-cat header pipe  (Read 1032 times)

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Offline Pannas

De-cat header pipe
« on: October 31, 2018, 10:51:19 am »
Ok, so I want to de-cat my 800GS... before I butcher the mid section, is there anyone here who has that front section lying around, or maybe want to swap their already de-catted front section for a standard one?  ???
 

Offline BuRP

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2018, 11:26:10 am »
I had mine de-catted ("gutted") by Stealth Exhaust in Montana / Pretoria (plus has two cars done same by them).
Gutting is opening the pipe, taking the cat out and closing/rewelding again.
Quick & good job, droolworthy welding quality, very reasonable price and, perhaps most importantly for those worried about warranty, it's invisible - so what's not to like?
Oh, they all ran better, surprise surprise hmm?  :)

I'm sure there's others who do this, ask around?
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Offline Jacobsroodt

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2018, 12:44:56 pm »
With cat removed you have to do something to get fueling sorted as the bike is now definitely running too lean.
BoosterPlug will sort the bike.
BoosterPlug, LED Spots, Tool Tubes, RustStop, Kappa Screens, Top boxes, Tank Bags - whatever works for me.
 

Offline BuRP

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2018, 02:38:37 pm »
With cat removed .... the bike is now definitely running too lean.

JR, that's quite a statement to make.
Got any proof that can be verified on this, like in objective stuff?

BoosterPlug will sort the bike.

You see, that isn't true what you say above.
The BP is active only in open loop, during acceleration, and only then it enrichens the mix a bit - mind, a bit only, we both do not know if it actually is a correct mixture.
During coasting i.e closed loop the BP is inactive, the mixture is not affected, and this is quite likely (but I do not have any proof on this...) the lion's share of most riders' riding - which means too-lean running bike (if at all...) will remain too-lean running!


We all know you're the local agent for BP, and I actually bought 2 of them, for 2 bikes, and yes, I was/am happy with them.
But, do note I didn't fall for some rather bloated statements that a BP is the end of all woes, in fact it hardly is: it's a neat patch which is cost effective, for those not wanting to go full PC-V, and yes it works fine in this regard.
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Offline Jacobsroodt

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2018, 03:33:08 pm »
With cat removed .... the bike is now definitely running too lean.

JR, that's quite a statement to make.
Got any proof that can be verified on this, like in objective stuff?


Euro 3 regulations passed in 2003 states:

"(4)
On the basis of the assessment of the technical feasibility
and cost-effectiveness, a single set of new Type I test
limits, applicable from 2003 for all motorcycles, has
been identified, corresponding to a reduction of 60 % for
hydrocarbons and carbon monoxide for four-stroke
motorcycles, and 70 % for hydrocarbons and 30 % for
carbon monoxide for two-stroke motorcycles. For four-
stroke motorcycles, further reductions in nitrogen oxides
were not considered feasible with the envisaged technol-
ogies. For two-stroke motorcycles, the application of
advanced direct injection technology, which has the
greatest reduction potential in terms of carbon monoxide
and hydrocarbons, is inevitably linked to a moderate
increase of the nitrogen oxides limit, relative to the
present-day limit value, bringing the limit in line with
four-stroke motorcycles. On the basis of the emission
inventory, which confirms the marginal share of motor-
cycles in total road-transport emissions of nitrogen
oxides, this is regarded as acceptable."

The optimal AFR where an engine is happy is 13,6:1. Most engines run at an AFR of 14,4 to 14.7:1, which is at the edge of being ridable. Euro 3 stated that bikes should past the test on 10000km, but Euro 4 regulations require bikes to still pass on 20000km. Already bikes like the 650 VStrom comes with "pullaway assist" to electronically up the rpm to prevent stalling. Air cooled R1200 engines start ceasing up temporarily due to piston expansion, leading to premature piston wear. Go and ask any tuner about lean running - a well published occurrance on the R1200;s.

And Euro 5 is coming in 2020.
In one of the first articles on the effect of stricter emissions on the new R1250 cycleworld writes:

https://www.cycleworld.com/2019-bmw-r1250gs-and-bmw-r1250rt-announced
More Displacement, More Power, And BMW ShiftCam Technology
The big highlight is that both power and torque have been increased for the R1250GS and R1250RT to a claimed 136 hp at 7,750 rpm and 105 pound-feet of torque 6,250 rpm, a gain of 11 hp and 28 pound-feet respectively. How these gains have been achieved is a mixture of displacement and technical improvements. Both models are up 84cc to 1,250cc, a move weve seen regularly from other manufacturers to help meet ever stricter emissions requirements while retaining current power levels.



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Offline Jacobsroodt

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2018, 03:38:44 pm »
About a year ago, the big thing in the motorcycle news was the tighter emission standards for 2017. There were a lot of speculations but nobody really knew to which degree it would affect our bikes.

It was clear that the gasoline fueled engines would have to run even leaner than earlier, and the motorcycle engines with virtually no flywheel weight would still have to meet the same requirements as the heavier car engines. So the motorcycle manufacturers would once again face a much bigger challenge than the car industry.

There is no doubt that the motorcycle manufacturers R&D departments have been working overtime, and that they are using every trick in the book to make the 2017 bikes run reasonably well.

The leaner mixture will make the engines run hotter, but most modern water cooled engines can survive the new leaner requirements and have an acceptable operating lifespan with few or no mechanical changes.

A few engine types have been equipped with titanium exhaust valves, and we will most likely see more bikes being changed this way in the future. The exhaust valves are by far the components that are under the highest thermal stress, and they have a very hard time with the lean mixture.

And there is no doubt that we will experience more damaged exhaust valves and valve seats on high mile motorcycles than we have seen before.

Top end power on the lean burn engines are more or less the same as on previous models at least in the brochure (The customers will not be happy if a new bike have less power than the old model).

But the manufacturers have been remarkably quiet on the fact that the leaner mixture is reducing low end power, torque and rideability.

Take a look at the chart below where power and torque curves are displayed for a 2016 and a 2017
BMW R1200GS. The mechanical setup on the two bikes is identical, so the difference in output is closely connected to the programming of the fuel Injection.

Bottom line is that compared to the older models, the 2017 motorcycle will:

-     Have a higher combustion temperature and a higher degree of thermal stress
-     Have reduced power and torque at low to medium RPM.

As mentioned earlier, a lot have been done on the bikes (especially on the electronic side) to minimize the negative effects of the lean air/fuel mixture. But despite all the technology, the only way to release the full potential in the engine is to add a bit more fuel.

Bottom line is that the new bikes need the BoosterPlug fuel injection optimization more than ever, and the feedback we have received from customers with 2017 motorcycle models is possibly even better than usual :-)
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Offline Jacobsroodt

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2018, 03:59:29 pm »
My signature says it, but here is the formal disclaimer: I am the BoosterPlug agent for South Africa.

"Quote from: Jacobsroodt on Today at 12:44:56 pm

    BoosterPlug will sort the bike.

You see, that isn't true what you say above.
The BP is active only in open loop, during acceleration, and only then it enrichens the mix a bit - mind, a bit only, we both do not know if it actually is a correct mixture.
During coasting i.e closed loop the BP is inactive, the mixture is not affected, and this is quite likely (but I do not have any proof on this...) the lion's share of most riders' riding - which means too-lean running bike (if at all...) will remain too-lean running!"

My response:
1. Retaining the Lamda sensor is essential to ensure that the mixture does not go past the set factory parameters, so KEEP THE LAMBDA SENSOR WORKING!
2. BoosterPlug adds 6% petrol whenever there is a change in rpm or tps, or whenever there is movement from one block on the fuel map to the other (which is all the time at idle and reduces slowly as rpm increases), but gets induced by changes in rpm or tps.
3. Add 6% to 14.5 to get 13.6, or close to the perfect AFR needed. Adding more than 6% is too much, so 6% is just perfect.
4. Above 5000 rpm manufacturers have a bit more leeway to play with richer mixtures, but under 5000 the combined effect of Euro regulations and the size of blocks on the fuel map makes BoosterPlug the ideal solution to lean mixtures.
5. The lambda sensor needs 2.5 seconds of constant throttle and rpm to induce closed loop and regulate the mixture. In real world conditions constant rpm and tps are relatively scarce occurrences, so that the AIT sensor (its signal gets altered by the BoosterPlug to provide a slightly richer mixture) is in operation most of the time.

In practice it seems like removing all the back pressure from the exhaust is not the smartest thing to do as engines are designed to operate optimally with a certain amount of back pressure dialed in, but enriching the mixture is essential to bring some balance to the force.

I like the way you reason though BuRP >:D
« Last Edit: October 31, 2018, 04:01:39 pm by Jacobsroodt »
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Offline Weedkiller - Adie

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2018, 06:00:24 pm »
I went on a trip with 2 F800's last weekend.  Dont think any is de-catted yet.

Bike 1BP.  2009 44 000km on clock with boosterplug, free flow airfilter and some slip on exhaust.
Only topbox and lady rider.

Bike 2 2011 with 106 000km. stock standard and paper filter.
Two fully loaded soft luggage bags and male rider.

A. Bike with boosterplug (no luggage) was 1.1l lighter over a 250km distance at average 120kph.  I will not contribute that to the Boosterplug as there was much more weight and wind resistance on the non BP bike and we were riding against a gusty wind.

B. BP bike was only 0.4l lighter on 250km gravel average about 70kph.

BP bike stalled a lot when she made the 100point turns.

I did ride the bike on other occasions and could not feel any difference in performance.

And then Bike 3.  F800 2011 with 98 000km, No BP and already De-catted, Acro Slip on and freeflow airfilter.  Constantly 1.5l per 250km heavier than standard bike above (did not go on same trip this time)  The de-catting made no difference at all in performance or consumpsion.

None of the owners of the bikes above notices any twitchy throttle etc etc on the F800.  Everyone came from 650GS.

All I can say for anyone out there it is 90% a perception thing.  Not saying the BP is a wast of money, but it is not a fix all either. 

Now, lets get technical on De-catting.  Why will it make the engine run leaner/hotter.  The primary part of the exhaust is designed to get the air out as efficient as possible.  The cross sectional area of the cat is the same as the header just in front and behind so no back pressure is created and scavanging is optimum.  Past the CAT you find the valve (new engines) and then the muffler. I can go on and on with technical info .........

The CAT should not affect the flow of air in the exhaust.  It is designed to maximise the surface area for the bad molecules to react 'chemically' with the Platinim and act as what is known as a 'scrubber' in the chemical industry.

Must go for supper.

Adie
Laat ons Stof maak.
 
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Offline Weedkiller - Adie

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2018, 07:29:42 pm »
Ok, back from supper and a quick 'gold Rush' episode.

** Snip **
In practice it seems like removing all the back pressure from the exhaust is not the smartest thing to do as engines are designed to operate optimally with a certain amount of back pressure dialed in, but enriching the mixture is essential to bring some balance to the force.
** Snap **

Engines do not need back pressure.  It is and old wifes tale which I also beleived in UNTILL I GOT INVOLVED IN RACING.  Nowdays a major part of the design budget goes into the design of the exhaust to balance performance and emissions.  AND remember this start at the EXHAUST VALVE and ends at the exhaust outlet.  Most EU (performance) bikes are now fitted with a valve just before the muffler.  This is to manage emissions AND power at lower rev range. (Creating back pressure to REDUCE sound !!!!!)

Go do some research on exhaust/ecu design and management.  there are a lot of 'I know it all' out there, but seriously, are they cleverer than the majority of factory designers?

LASTLY. Most people decat incorrectly.

The idea is to have smooth airflow from the exhaust valve all the way to the muffler tip.  In order to accomodate the requred surface area of the CAT the exhaust cross section must increase.  This cause a negative pulse back up the exhaust to the valve.  If designed correctly this can 'assist' the scavanging effect etc etc.  By just removing the tubes and re-weld the cap back the total function of the exhaust design is compromised.  You might even get worse performance as the negative pulse is now so big that it reduce airflow.  sometimes it can be felt as a 'flat spot' at certain revs.

The correct way is to replace the gut of the cat with a tube the same dia as the exhaust before the 'cap' is welded back.  If this transition is not smooth you will be robbed of high end performance as the laminar flow at the tube edge is disturbed and the gas flow become 'turbulant'.

First sentence says it all.

** snip **
Making sense of what goes on inside exhaust systems has perplexed many intelligent people since the invention of the internal combustion engine, Lee, so don't feel badly if conflicting claims have you confused. Step one is to keep an eye on who is making the claims; if they have a product to sell, the profit motive may be the largest factor in play.

To grotesquely oversimplify, on a street vehicle with catalytic converters, mufflers and plenty of joints, bends and length, it pretty much comes down to providing the most gas flow (least restriction) possible. Furthermore, the catalytic converter is a meaningful restriction to gas flow, thus there is precious little to gain by changing to a low-restriction muffler and tailpipe on an otherwise stock car. That changes somewhat with superchargers, nitrous or other power adders that roughly double an engine's output. Then any reduction in exhaust restriction is usually beneficial.

We are not aware of any case, either racing or on the street, where a restriction, or "backpressure," is beneficial to power or economy.
** snap**

I have done a lot of research on exhaust design (full length) and it is a moerse intresting 'dark art' subject and hence all the 'performance claims'

Lastly.
The biggest issue is noise.  By de-catting you change the airflow (pulses etc) which normally will give a slightly 'nicer' sound on well tuned systems.  99% nothing more or nothing less.  This will result in more active right hand and whala, the bike 'feels' more powerfull.

Go look at a NC700 header right next to the head, as iniffiecient as can be.

Decat and GO!!!!!!!

Adie
Laat ons Stof maak.
 
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Offline Pannas

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2018, 08:33:20 pm »
ma se hare..... as ek geweet het ek gaan so 'n kakstorm opskop met my vraag, het ek stil gebly.....

so, in die einde, klink dit my ek gaan my tyd mors om die cat uit te haal, omdat daar geen rerige voordele is nie...?
 

Offline Weedkiller - Adie

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2018, 09:00:55 pm »
ma se hare..... as ek geweet het ek gaan so 'n kakstorm opskop met my vraag, het ek stil gebly.....

so, in die einde, klink dit my ek gaan my tyd mors om die cat uit te haal, omdat daar geen rerige voordele is nie...?

Nope, jy het die regte vraag gevra VOOR jy geld uithaal wat eerder op ander plesier gebruik kon word.  Dis hoe mens leer.  :pot:

Adie
Laat ons Stof maak.
 
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Offline Pannas

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2018, 09:06:19 pm »
nou maar goed so - laat ons gaan stof maak....  :biggrin:
 

Offline BuRP

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2018, 10:10:33 am »
klink dit my ek gaan my tyd mors om die cat uit te haal, omdat daar geen rerige voordele is nie...?

Pannas,

any piston engine is a gaspump, it pumps air - which requires work to be done i.e it needs an enery-input!
It really needs an intake airfilter which represents an intake air restriction i.e choke, but luckily we're clever enough to keep this at a very low value, it hardly affects an engine's performance.
Euro-laws (Euro, not Africa...) require CATs & DPFs to be mounted, representing rather large exhaust gas flow restrictors, and if not perfect (none are!) then they may clog up over time, increasing the restriction even more.
It follows that the engine has to deliver extra work i.e consumes extra fuel to push/force the exhaust gasses out of the system, this is a simple fact: an engine with Cat/Dpf uses more fuel compared to an engine with a Cat/Dpf-less exhaust system.
And that leads to the valid conclusion that an engine with its Cat/Dpf removed runs better and is more frugal - which is the same as 'more performance'.
Clearer now?
You decide...


JR,

citing Euro regulations is hardly proof, ditto mentioning "ideal" AF-ratios (and you give away your age here a bit pel lol).
I have a problem with your "too"-lean wording, 'too' - sorry, there is no 'too lean' anymore.
Oh wait, yes there is, if the engine refuses to ingine i.e does not run, then yes, it's 'too' lean.
Let's not go into past history here too much, but are you familiar with Mazda's superlean engines these days?
They run (run, i.e ignite!) on varying lean mixtures which go as lean as 35/1 or thereabouts!
Fwiw, Mazda is at the very forefront of this technology, in fact they're streetlengths ahead.... but others try to catch up.

In short there is no 'ideal' AF ratio anymore, as it depends on the specific engine at hand.
So, if my engine is designed to run at 20/1 and is reliable, then adding an enrichment feature is better?
No Sir it ain't!

Enter the motor of the F800, the subject here.
I have zero idea what the 'ideal' AF for this engine is, however I bet it's a lot leaner than your generic figures above!
This engine's a modern one, we all know it runs on the lean side (of same generic ideals mentioned above, which is rather far removed than too lean!) because it's quite frugal, and we all also know that they last, some get very old!
"Too" lean JR?
Nope!
But I'll admit that my pants told&tell me that mounting a BP is lekker, for it has a lil more woema when I turn the ear  :P
However, as said here & above it ain't a global savior for all that has a piston, it merely is a nice 'patch' - and removing a CAT falls in the same class.

Peace to all, do what you like/prefer, it's your bike after all  :thumleft:


« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 11:56:06 am by BuRP »
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Offline Jacobsroodt

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2018, 12:51:19 pm »
Of course you are right BuRP. The EU is of the opinion that engines run too rich for the environment, hence stricter regulations - which I fully support as we are messing with the atmosphere.
The question is rather what the optimal AFR is, and this article explains it well:
https://www.hotrod.com/articles/innovate-air-fuel-ratio-meter/

"We mentioned the stoichiometric air-fuel ratio (14.7:1) that is the ideal ratio for lowest emissions, but this isn't the best ratio for power. It used to be that 12.5:1 was considered the best power ratio, but with improved combustion chambers and hotter ignition systems, the ideal now is around 12.8:1 to 13.2:1.

When it comes to fuel mileage and increased fuel efficiency, this ratio changes again. All new cars run at 14.7:1 air-fuel ratio at part throttle because this is the lowest emission point. But depending upon the engine, its possible to run an engine at leaner mixtures like 16:1 or more at part throttle to gain mileage. The difficulty with this is that driveability and throttle response suffers at these ratios. Engine response is lazy and stumbles are commonplace."

On bikes, lean mixtures cause all kinds of hiccups like the feeling of falling over in a roundabout and feathering the clutch in an attempt to ride smooth. Stalling is commonplace, especially on the F800 machine. So adding just a bit of petrol when needed most helps to ride easier and smoother. I can only vouch for my bikes. On my 2008 F800GS the snappy throttle was cured and the engine vibrations at 4000 rpm cured, amongst others. On the 2013 the throttle cam was changed and the amount of turn needed for full throttle made more - to overcome the snatchiness. Adie, on the 2013 the effect was not as much as the other bikes, so the effect might differ from bike to bike. On my 2014 F800GS it felt like someone threw a brick in front of the front wheel every time I closed the throttle, with front suspension diving, and I stalled it 8 times the first day I rode it in traffic. I almost fell in front of oncoming traffic after a U-turn stall. Post BoosterPlug I had to learn not to feather the clutch any more as the throttle was so smooth, I haven't stalled it once since. Ride by wire on 2016 and onwards improved the situation, but the downside is an engine management system that does not always do what the throttle tells it to do.

BoosterPlug is not the ultimate solution, but it does what it advertises pretty well and the effect is not a placebo one. I have had too many feedbacks from riders from all kinds of bikes.

But the discussion stays an intriguing one. Engineers are spending 1000s of hours to find ways of improving fuel consumption and curbing emissions. What is interesting is that, with their new 1.0l 3 cylinder turbo engine, VW says that it has pretty much reached the ceiling of efficiency in a petrol engine. Nonetheless, euro 5 regulations in 2020 will become a reality, so it will be spell bounding to see what comes next. In the meanwhile BMW and KTM are struggling with heat (cylinder head and exhaust), electronics help to ensure smooth gear changes as lean running affects gearchanges and Suzuki has pullaway assist. Everyone is trying to find ways to overcome the damage caused by increased combustion chamber temperatures, and increasing capacity to make up for power losses.

Interesting times.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 12:55:21 pm by Jacobsroodt »
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Offline katana

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2018, 01:23:11 pm »
My 2c.  The biggest issue with CAT's on motorcycles is the location - under the rear shock.  Remove the CAT and the bike will hold less heat and your shock should last a lot longer.  My 1200 shock was finished at 20k kms.

I have had a BP in my 1200 for the last 5+ years.  It worked amazingly in the beginning - read my reviews at the time.  However, I firmly believe my seat of pants dyno that tells me my clever ECU has learned to compensate for a 'faulty' temp reading. 
"The only man that has to remember anything, is the man who tells a lie" Mark Twain
 

Offline BuRP

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2018, 03:05:31 pm »
I have had a BP in my 1200 for the last 5+ years.  It worked amazingly in the beginning - read my reviews at the time.  However, I firmly believe my seat of pants dyno that tells me my clever ECU has learned to compensate for a 'faulty' temp reading.

Re-tune ze pants Swaer, which will cost you all of what, 3 minutes?
Saddle off, disconnect the BP, reconnect the std plug and off you go, re-tuning!

Then come back here and admit you did grow calluses on yer bum but have now re-calibrated your dikgat  :P
Your ECU will learn nothing bru, it's a stupid computer!
Sparta MC50, 46 other 50cc's, Garelli Cross, Jawa 250, Kawasaki S1 250/3, S2 350/3, H1 500/3, H2 750/3, Suzuki GT380/3 - 10 year gap - KDX200, BMW 1150GS Adventure, Honda CBR600RR, Honda XR650R 2007 & 2003, Honda CRF230, Yamaha BWS100, BMW F800GS Adventure, Husqvarna 701, KTM 790 Adv R ordered
 

Offline katana

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2018, 05:22:54 pm »
I have had a BP in my 1200 for the last 5+ years.  It worked amazingly in the beginning - read my reviews at the time.  However, I firmly believe my seat of pants dyno that tells me my clever ECU has learned to compensate for a 'faulty' temp reading.

Re-tune ze pants Swaer, which will cost you all of what, 3 minutes?
Saddle off, disconnect the BP, reconnect the std plug and off you go, re-tuning!

Then come back here and admit you did grow calluses on yer bum but have now re-calibrated your dikgat  :P
Your ECU will learn nothing bru, it's a stupid computer!
My 70kg ass is callouses free thank you.   :spitcoffee:  Any ECU stores information, not all of it permanently though.   
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Offline Bring It On

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2018, 09:13:57 pm »
ma se hare..... as ek geweet het ek gaan so 'n kakstorm opskop met my vraag, het ek stil gebly.....

so, in die einde, klink dit my ek gaan my tyd mors om die cat uit te haal, omdat daar geen rerige voordele is nie...?

Nope, jy het die regte vraag gevra VOOR jy geld uithaal wat eerder op ander plesier gebruik kon word.  Dis hoe mens leer.  :pot:

Adie

Very well answered there Adie :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:
I could not agree more with you.  ;) :thumleft:

Getting back to the original question Pannas asked.....

Here's the link to when I did mine a while ago. To date, I'm 100% still very happy with it & no regrets. ;) :thumleft: :thumleft:

http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=84635.msg3762500#msg3762500

Enjoy. ;D
"Always Believe In Yourself"

Quote: "Riding a Bike feeds something inside us, that Nothing else can"
Quote: "I Ride because it can turn the Worst Day into the BEST"
 

Offline Bring It On

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Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2018, 09:19:09 pm »
@Pannas

I see you also here in the WC. You more than welcome to pop around sometime if you in CT area & take a closer look at the job I did on my scooter's zorst.  ;D
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 09:38:40 pm by Bring It On »
"Always Believe In Yourself"

Quote: "Riding a Bike feeds something inside us, that Nothing else can"
Quote: "I Ride because it can turn the Worst Day into the BEST"
 
The following users thanked this post: Pannas

Offline Pannas

Re: De-cat header pipe
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2018, 09:44:43 am »
Very well answered there Adie :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:
I could not agree more with you.  ;) :thumleft:
Getting back to the original question Pannas asked.....
Here's the link to when I did mine a while ago. To date, I'm 100% still very happy with it & no regrets. ;) :thumleft: :thumleft:
http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=84635.msg3762500#msg3762500
Enjoy. ;D

ok, so cut it out and go?
no booster plugs, or re-tuning, or anything...?