Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register

Author Topic: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit  (Read 1801 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline eberhard

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: Moto Guzzi (all models)
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 2,740
  • Thanked: 265 times
  • Time takes a cigarette...
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #20 on: January 02, 2019, 10:23:42 am »
I think a bit unfair - Bikegear (also a vendor here) who develop and sell the Desert Fox brand as theirs do extensive real world research and testing on their products and do not stock or sell "snazzy" bling stuff just for the sake of it. They stand behind their products and develop and improve them if necessary (and will replace/refund etc). They are really a very ethical and committed local bike gear company. It is possible this is a bad batch of caps or seals - I feel confident they will make it right.
PS a Coke bottle will work and I have used them on occasion - they are though not fool proof ... they also do not roll up and store easily  :lol8:

You make good and valid points.  :thumleft: :thumleft:

I never had Bikegear in particular in mind. I had no brand name in mind for that matter. That was why I started my opinion with “I’m generalising”. My point was that a so-called designer product is not necessarily the solution. Some of them come with their own problems, and that at a price. You make a very good point where you stated that a plastic bottle cannot be rolled up. That is a real and serious drawback with plastic bottles. They stay the same dimensions all the time. Yet they are highly disposable (obviously if and when I dispose of them I do so responsibly), they are very easily obtainable and are mostly free.

On the subject of caps: a lot of bottles, in particular I have bottles here in mind with liquid hazardous content, have these child protection caps. Highly irritating things and almost always problematic. I replace those caps with coca cola bottle caps (I’m sure sprite and fanta will also work). Works 100%. And the caps are totally free. Coming back to thinking outside of the box. The product itself may not be a bad product at all, but you may need to modify it a bit. Thereafter it often becomes an excellent product (like replacing a cap with a more suitable object). On the other hand you can get a plastic (cheap, disposable and saved from the dustbin) container (mostly not a cool drink bottle) and you modify that a bit. As to having to modify an expensive designer product. Both ending up working well, both having strong and weak points – just the difference in price.
eberhard
Agostini 1000
R90S
R80/7
R75/5 Big Boy 150 Vuka 110
 

Offline zebra - Flying Brick

  • Forum Vendor: Flying Brick Motorcycle Accessories 021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za
  • Bachelor Dog
  • *****
  • Bike: BMW (all models)
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 11,254
  • Thanked: 174 times
  • 8 Shropshire St, P Eiland S33°54.712 E018°28.208
    • [b]-Flying Brick- Motorcycle Accessories[/b]
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2019, 09:29:16 am »
OK, had a lengthy chat to Bike Gear, closed but they still called us in responses to a SMS- nice touch Matthew and team!  :thumleft:


Robin Brown was also in touch with Harold directly...



it M-A-Y just be dud cap or two - Bike Gear (and Flying Brick) will replace the bladder(s) affected, but so far we know of just the two cases.


Robin will likely pop in later today to collect a replacement bladder, and then give us /Bike gear feedback as soon as he has any...
(will ask Robin of any others he has heard of?)


Genie - not sure you got YOUR 5L fuel bladder from us, but no matter, if you want help, simply return it to us, and we will swap you out a new replacement  :thumleft:


More info as we get it, sold a good number of this 'batch; of 5L fuel bladders without issue, so will watch/wait, etc.
Cheers
Chris & the Team
Chris & Team 021 510 6455 S33°54.712 E018°28.208

MARINE DRIVE, into NEPTUNE street, 2nd left into SHROPSHIRE street, on the right hand side.
021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za sales@flyingbrick.co.za  support@flyingbrick.co.za
S33°54.712 E018°28.208
 

Offline Cracker

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: KTM 950 Adventure S
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 5,203
  • Thanked: 132 times
  • Top Biscuit!
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2019, 10:15:31 am »
Excellent service ........... you won't get that from ABI
Don't let fear hold you back ..... take it with you!
 

Online 2StrokeDan

  • Castrated Dog
  • ******
  • Bike: KTM 690 Adventure
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 20,601
  • Thanked: 573 times
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2019, 11:38:32 am »
I don't know any Jones'. :imaposer:

Sorry mate, I lost there. Elaborate a bit.  ???

If you do not know any Jones', you do not have anyone to keep up to. :ricky:
 

Online 2StrokeDan

  • Castrated Dog
  • ******
  • Bike: KTM 690 Adventure
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 20,601
  • Thanked: 573 times
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2019, 11:41:27 am »
Thank you for the short term solution.
But it still appears to be a design fault in the use of materials in the cap.
Simple stupid Coke 2L plastic bottles hold petrol and do not leak.
So maybe the manufacturers of Desert Fox could use the same technology and solve all the problems.

I know I’m generalising, but I often find that a lot of these bike enhancement / improvement products tend to be a bit of a rip off. They look snazzy and come with fantastic uses and applications as per the salesman / sale brochure and promise to solve all your needs and problems. Instead they create more problems and that at quite a price you paid for it. Where something like a 2l plastic bottle at zero costs would have worked more efficiently, but definitely not looking as cool and without any designer name visibly printed on it. And your biker mates will laugh at you at the gathering. That’s the price people pay for keeping up with the Joneses.

I think a bit unfair - Bikegear (also a vendor here) who develop and sell the Desert Fox brand as theirs do extensive real world research and testing on their products and do not stock or sell "snazzy" bling stuff just for the sake of it. They stand behind their products and develop and improve them if necessary (and will replace/refund etc). They are really a very ethical and committed local bike gear company. It is possible this is a bad batch of caps or seals - I feel confident they will make it right.
PS a Coke bottle will work and I have used them on occasion - they are though not fool proof ... they also do not roll up and store easily  :lol8:

You flatten an empty Coke bottle underfoot, and blow it up again when needed.

But I do agree with you on the Desert Fox guys......could easily be a one-off slip.
 

Offline MGV

Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2019, 12:01:25 pm »
OK, had a lengthy chat to Bike Gear, closed but they still called us in responses to a SMS- nice touch Matthew and team!  :thumleft:


Robin Brown was also in touch with Harold directly...



it M-A-Y just be dud cap or two - Bike Gear (and Flying Brick) will replace the bladder(s) affected, but so far we know of just the two cases.


Robin will likely pop in later today to collect a replacement bladder, and then give us /Bike gear feedback as soon as he has any...
(will ask Robin of any others he has heard of?)


Genie - not sure you got YOUR 5L fuel bladder from us, but no matter, if you want help, simply return it to us, and we will swap you out a new replacement  :thumleft:


More info as we get it, sold a good number of this 'batch; of 5L fuel bladders without issue, so will watch/wait, etc.
Cheers
Chris & the Team

Hi Chris,

For what it’s worth, I’ve returned one Overland bladder late last year as a result of the same issue (Werner helped me and replaced with a new one - great service!). The second bladder did exactly the same this past weekend after single use again. This was a also a brand new bladder and new cap - same issue.

I’ll pop in over the weekend or early next week with the faulty bladder - thanks!

Marius
Honda CRF250L - the (slow) little red pig
 

Offline genie

  • Member
  • **
  • Bike: Honda CRF-1000L Africa Twin
    Location: Eastern Cape
  • Posts: 244
  • Thanked: 6 times
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2019, 12:27:52 pm »
Hi Chris, thanks for the feedback. I will go directly to Matthew as I’m in PE. I suspect it is either a dimensional or material issue or combination with the cap and insert as it occurs only after being exposed to fuel. I think the problem is the insert cap material that is “ swelling” after coming into contact with petrol.
 
The following users thanked this post: zebra - Flying Brick

Offline zebra - Flying Brick

  • Forum Vendor: Flying Brick Motorcycle Accessories 021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za
  • Bachelor Dog
  • *****
  • Bike: BMW (all models)
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 11,254
  • Thanked: 174 times
  • 8 Shropshire St, P Eiland S33°54.712 E018°28.208
    • [b]-Flying Brick- Motorcycle Accessories[/b]
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2019, 12:29:20 pm »
thanks, Marius - Werner told me about you this morning when we re-opened, when I discussed the  problem with Robin Brown's fuel bladder...


(so you are the OTHER case I am referring to, but if you have 2 problematic bladders, then that makes 3 in total!)


Sure, pop in, and we will see if we can assist you with a different cap style - we have a couple - else refund, whatever you want.


We returned your fuel bladder to Bike Gear before we closed, they re-open on the 14th Jan, so hope to hear feedback then.
Please do drop off the other problematic one, and we will ship that back in time for their re-opening.


Cheers!
Chris
Chris & Team 021 510 6455 S33°54.712 E018°28.208

MARINE DRIVE, into NEPTUNE street, 2nd left into SHROPSHIRE street, on the right hand side.
021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za sales@flyingbrick.co.za  support@flyingbrick.co.za
S33°54.712 E018°28.208
 

Offline zebra - Flying Brick

  • Forum Vendor: Flying Brick Motorcycle Accessories 021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za
  • Bachelor Dog
  • *****
  • Bike: BMW (all models)
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 11,254
  • Thanked: 174 times
  • 8 Shropshire St, P Eiland S33°54.712 E018°28.208
    • [b]-Flying Brick- Motorcycle Accessories[/b]
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #28 on: January 03, 2019, 12:30:04 pm »


Quote from: genie on Today at 12:27:52 pm>Hi Chris, thanks for the feedback. I will go directly to Matthew as I’m in PE. I suspect it is either a dimensional or material issue or combination with the cap and insert as it occurs only after being exposed to fuel. I think the problem is the insert cap material that is “ swelling” after coming into contact with petrol.
perfect - so noted.
Cheers, Chris & Team


Chris & Team 021 510 6455 S33°54.712 E018°28.208

MARINE DRIVE, into NEPTUNE street, 2nd left into SHROPSHIRE street, on the right hand side.
021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za sales@flyingbrick.co.za  support@flyingbrick.co.za
S33°54.712 E018°28.208
 

Offline kwassi

Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #29 on: January 03, 2019, 03:19:08 pm »
We have been testing bladders and we came upon the same issue.
Solo travellers should not be considered unsociable, they are expressing their independence until they choose to do otherwise.
 

Offline Weedkiller - Adie

Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #30 on: January 03, 2019, 05:48:18 pm »
Firstly, I dont know the issue or cause with the Desert fox bladders.

There are not many flexible materials that is truly fuel resistant.  We tried various gasket materials over the years to seal a fuel cap. Neoprene, rubber, Nitrile etc etc.  Long term (1 day) in petrol will cause ALL of them to swell and in some cases disintegrate.

We are now testing an 30shore epoxy 'rubber' for our fuel caps.  hope that works.

Adie
Laat ons Stof maak.
 

Offline Cracker

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: KTM 950 Adventure S
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 5,203
  • Thanked: 132 times
  • Top Biscuit!
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2019, 06:08:03 pm »
Cork?
Don't let fear hold you back ..... take it with you!
 

Offline eberhard

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: Moto Guzzi (all models)
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 2,740
  • Thanked: 265 times
  • Time takes a cigarette...
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2019, 06:27:07 pm »
Cork?

I always ride with three or four wine and champagne corks in my toolbox. Their applications are wide and surprising.  :thumleft:
eberhard
Agostini 1000
R90S
R80/7
R75/5 Big Boy 150 Vuka 110
 

Offline BiG DoM

  • A Grahamstown Greyhound!
  • Bachelor Dog
  • *****
  • Bike: BMW R1200GS HP2
    Location: Eastern Cape
  • Posts: 16,844
  • Thanked: 155 times
  • License Plates: GSpot EC and HUSKY EC
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #33 on: January 03, 2019, 07:00:30 pm »
Cork?

I always ride with three or four wine and champagne corks in my toolbox. Their applications are wide and surprising.  :thumleft:

I am already hearing some suggestions in my head ... in addition to fuel ehhrr ... bladders  >:D
"Love is the feeling you get when you like something as much as your motorcycle" - Hunter S. Thompson

Scoots: BMW HP2  Husky 701 Husky  TE610E  BMW G450X  KTM 250XCW  BMW R100S YAMAHA BWS 

 :ricky:
 

Offline Cracker

  • Forum Whore
  • ****
  • Bike: KTM 950 Adventure S
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 5,203
  • Thanked: 132 times
  • Top Biscuit!
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2019, 07:22:08 pm »
I always carry one when travelling with the missus.
Don't let fear hold you back ..... take it with you!
 

Offline BiG DoM

  • A Grahamstown Greyhound!
  • Bachelor Dog
  • *****
  • Bike: BMW R1200GS HP2
    Location: Eastern Cape
  • Posts: 16,844
  • Thanked: 155 times
  • License Plates: GSpot EC and HUSKY EC
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #35 on: January 03, 2019, 08:21:22 pm »
 
I always carry one when travelling with the missus.

 :imaposer:  Champagne?
"Love is the feeling you get when you like something as much as your motorcycle" - Hunter S. Thompson

Scoots: BMW HP2  Husky 701 Husky  TE610E  BMW G450X  KTM 250XCW  BMW R100S YAMAHA BWS 

 :ricky:
 

Offline eberhard

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Bike: Moto Guzzi (all models)
    Location: Gauteng
  • Posts: 2,740
  • Thanked: 265 times
  • Time takes a cigarette...
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #36 on: January 03, 2019, 09:04:43 pm »
You can always silence something by corking it up.
eberhard
Agostini 1000
R90S
R80/7
R75/5 Big Boy 150 Vuka 110
 

Offline BlueBull2007

  • Caribbean
  • Global Moderator
  • Bachelor Dog
  • ***
  • Bike: AJS (all models)
    Location: Other
  • Posts: 10,190
  • Thanked: 270 times
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #37 on: January 04, 2019, 03:03:31 am »
:imaposer:

Well done guys. :thumleft:

Chris & Co., keep up that excellent service. You guys are truly an example to the many other half-baked types in South Africa these days.
Rally nut. What could possibly go wrong?
Living the Rally Dream - Ride Report
Current bike: KTM 350 EXC   Previous bikes:  2010 WR450F, 2006 KTM450EXC,KTM 450RR, BMW800GS, KTM450EXC, BMW650 GS, BMW650 Dakar, and Honda XR250
 
The following users thanked this post: zebra - Flying Brick

Offline Weedkiller - Adie

Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #38 on: January 08, 2019, 08:53:45 am »
No Hi Jack intended but more for curiosity.

In our search for a 'proper' gasket we tried whatever we could get without success.  We finally decide to try to mold silicone's and epoxy's etc. 

Everything we tested was sold as 'the best gasket material for petrol'

Pic 1. Comparison of soaked and non soaked samples. We dunk the pieces in petrol for 12 hours.  The Blue piece was said to be 'the best' but actually turned out the second worst.  The white sample showed about ZERO expansion and also passed the 'flex and fold' test.

We will do a final test today with the white to simulate a real life test.

Adie
Laat ons Stof maak.
 

Offline zebra - Flying Brick

  • Forum Vendor: Flying Brick Motorcycle Accessories 021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za
  • Bachelor Dog
  • *****
  • Bike: BMW (all models)
    Location: Western Cape
  • Posts: 11,254
  • Thanked: 174 times
  • 8 Shropshire St, P Eiland S33°54.712 E018°28.208
    • [b]-Flying Brick- Motorcycle Accessories[/b]
Re: Desert Fox Fuel bladder caps will not fit
« Reply #39 on: January 08, 2019, 09:01:04 am »
thanks, Adie.


UPDATE: it s-e-e-m-s as if, with this improved Desert Fox cap design (cap and integrated bung design), that in one or two instances the BUNG part (it is a 2 part cap) is not seated all the way 'home/down' inside the cap, meaning screwing it down is then difficult.


We did a 24 hour fuel-soak test on a brand new cap, and we could refit it with ease, so we are going to check every bung-cap is indeed seated all the way 'home', so to speak.


Chris & Team
Chris & Team 021 510 6455 S33°54.712 E018°28.208

MARINE DRIVE, into NEPTUNE street, 2nd left into SHROPSHIRE street, on the right hand side.
021 510 6455 info@flyingbrick.co.za sales@flyingbrick.co.za  support@flyingbrick.co.za
S33°54.712 E018°28.208