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Offline Casting from Turd

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Oil Question
« on: January 07, 2019, 01:15:29 pm »
My GSA has 15w50
Can I top it up with 20w50

Both are liquid molly full synthetic
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Offline Roadhawg

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2019, 01:28:51 pm »
My GSA has 15w50
Can I top it up with 20w50

Both are liquid molly full synthetic

Shouldn't be a problem if everything else is equal.  Remember 15W50 or 20W50 tells you nothing about the oil's quality, only it's viscosity.  Those 2 products should have much the same viscosity at operating temp though.

EDIT: I kinda read that as replacing all the oil with the 20W50, you'd probably be fine, maybe not in winter temps though.  Topping up would be even less of an issue. Only conceivable problem would be if one of them was a very outlandish synthetic fluid that wasn't compatible with the other, but in Engine oil products I think they are almost always made from similar base fluids, and those both being LM products are surely the same.

« Last Edit: January 07, 2019, 01:32:57 pm by Roadhawg »
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Offline Grunder

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2019, 01:35:21 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.
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Offline Roadhawg

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2019, 01:42:06 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.

I think you may have misheard or misunderstood.   With a wetclutch you need to stay away from regular automotive oils (mineral or synthetic) with certain additives that reduce wear and friction in motors but could cause slipping in your clutch (which needs friction to function).   If you stick to any oil that has a JASO MA or MA2 rating on it you should be fine in regards to the clutch.

All the big expensive KTM's have wet clutches and specify fully synthetic oils. So it's not the base fluid, its the additives in it. :thumleft:
Stu
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Offline Grunder

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2019, 01:46:00 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.

I think you may have misheard or misunderstood.   With a wetclutch you need to stay away from regular automotive oils (mineral or synthetic) with certain additives that reduce wear and friction in motors but could cause slipping in your clutch (which needs friction to function).   If you stick to any oil that has a JASO MA or MA2 rating on it you should be fine in regards to the clutch.

All the big expensive KTM's have wet clutches and specify fully synthetic oils. So it's not the base fluid, its the additives in it. :thumleft:

Ah ok. Thank you for the clarification
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Offline Jughead

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2019, 02:44:06 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.

I think you may have misheard or misunderstood.   With a wetclutch you need to stay away from regular automotive oils (mineral or synthetic) with certain additives that reduce wear and friction in motors but could cause slipping in your clutch (which needs friction to function).   If you stick to any oil that has a JASO MA or MA2 rating on it you should be fine in regards to the clutch.

All the big expensive KTM's have wet clutches and specify fully synthetic oils. So it's not the base fluid, its the additives in it. :thumleft:

According to @BuRP, that is "nonsense".

http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=231174.msg4174503#msg4174503

But I've only been working on bikes for 45 years, so i guess I still have some learning to do.
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Offline BlingKing

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2019, 02:50:57 pm »
My GSA has 15w50
Can I top it up with 20w50

Both are liquid molly full synthetic

Is your bike an LC or AC bud?
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Offline Roadhawg

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2019, 03:11:04 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.

I think you may have misheard or misunderstood.   With a wetclutch you need to stay away from regular automotive oils (mineral or synthetic) with certain additives that reduce wear and friction in motors but could cause slipping in your clutch (which needs friction to function).   If you stick to any oil that has a JASO MA or MA2 rating on it you should be fine in regards to the clutch.

All the big expensive KTM's have wet clutches and specify fully synthetic oils. So it's not the base fluid, its the additives in it. :thumleft:

According to @BuRP, that is "nonsense".

http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=231174.msg4174503#msg4174503

But I've only been working on bikes for 45 years, so i guess I still have some learning to do.

I think we are both right.   However, Having friction modifiers and extreme pressure additives (both of which could cause issues in a clutch system) in a regular automotive setting would be advantages. Less friction, less wear.   So I don't know why they would be left out of regular engine oils so I would assume that most car/truck oils would have them in and MAY cause an issue with your clutch.

I know some of the "regular" oils people use in bikes and then say "well I used a car/truck oil and mine is fine" are in fact rated JASO MA or MA2.
Stu
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Offline Casting from Turd

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2019, 03:12:11 pm »
My GSA has 15w50
Can I top it up with 20w50

Both are liquid molly full synthetic

Is your bike an LC or AC bud?

2012 AC
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Offline Grunder

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2019, 03:18:37 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.

I think you may have misheard or misunderstood.   With a wetclutch you need to stay away from regular automotive oils (mineral or synthetic) with certain additives that reduce wear and friction in motors but could cause slipping in your clutch (which needs friction to function).   If you stick to any oil that has a JASO MA or MA2 rating on it you should be fine in regards to the clutch.

All the big expensive KTM's have wet clutches and specify fully synthetic oils. So it's not the base fluid, its the additives in it. :thumleft:

According to @BuRP, that is "nonsense".

http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=231174.msg4174503#msg4174503

But I've only been working on bikes for 45 years, so i guess I still have some learning to do.

I think we are both right.   However, Having friction modifiers and extreme pressure additives (both of which could cause issues in a clutch system) in a regular automotive setting would be advantages. Less friction, less wear.   So I don't know why they would be left out of regular engine oils so I would assume that most car/truck oils would have them in and MAY cause an issue with your clutch.

I know some of the "regular" oils people use in bikes and then say "well I used a car/truck oil and mine is fine" are in fact rated JASO MA or MA2.

You see...

Oil is an interesting topic  :snorting:
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Offline Casting from Turd

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2019, 03:21:42 pm »
My GSA has 15w50
Can I top it up with 20w50

Both are liquid molly full synthetic

Shouldn't be a problem if everything else is equal.  Remember 15W50 or 20W50 tells you nothing about the oil's quality, only it's viscosity.  Those 2 products should have much the same viscosity at operating temp though.

EDIT: I kinda read that as replacing all the oil with the 20W50, you'd probably be fine, maybe not in winter temps though.  Topping up would be even less of an issue. Only conceivable problem would be if one of them was a very outlandish synthetic fluid that wasn't compatible with the other, but in Engine oil products I think they are almost always made from similar base fluids, and those both being LM products are surely the same.

Thanks. They are both the same Liquid Molly product just a slightly diff viscosity . The one I can gt at the local coop is 20w50 and the one I have just had put in on the service is 15w50.

So as I understand it shouldnt be a problem
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Offline Roadhawg

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2019, 03:35:00 pm »
Oil remains an interesting topic for me.

People are saying that if its a wet clutch you should stay far away from full synthetic oils.

But I often hear that the  clutch is much smoother on it.

Boggles me. 

I'm too scared too take the plunge. So I am still on mineral oil.

I think you may have misheard or misunderstood.   With a wetclutch you need to stay away from regular automotive oils (mineral or synthetic) with certain additives that reduce wear and friction in motors but could cause slipping in your clutch (which needs friction to function).   If you stick to any oil that has a JASO MA or MA2 rating on it you should be fine in regards to the clutch.

All the big expensive KTM's have wet clutches and specify fully synthetic oils. So it's not the base fluid, its the additives in it. :thumleft:

According to @BuRP, that is "nonsense".

http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=231174.msg4174503#msg4174503

But I've only been working on bikes for 45 years, so i guess I still have some learning to do.

I think we are both right.   However, Having friction modifiers and extreme pressure additives (both of which could cause issues in a clutch system) in a regular automotive setting would be advantages. Less friction, less wear.   So I don't know why they would be left out of regular engine oils so I would assume that most car/truck oils would have them in and MAY cause an issue with your clutch.

I know some of the "regular" oils people use in bikes and then say "well I used a car/truck oil and mine is fine" are in fact rated JASO MA or MA2.

You see...

Oil is an interesting topic  :snorting:

Tell me about it haha  My day job is selling oil, and my dad has been doing it like forever so I grew up with the stuff.   The problem is that the answer to almost all questions is "It depends" so be wary of someone telling you absolutes haha

(It is frustrating because people expect you to know what oil is needed for some machine that they imported from china and threw the manual away. It's like, sure, I can make a recommendation based on info you give me but it's a best guess you know....and that's if they can give you any information at all haha)
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Offline ChrisL - DUSTRIDERS

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2019, 03:39:39 pm »
 My day job is selling oil,

What oil you sell RH?
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Offline Roadhawg

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2019, 03:55:48 pm »
My day job is selling oil,

What oil you sell RH?

Mostly industrial stuff. Hydraulic oils, compressor and industrial gearbox oils etc but obviously the automotive side as well, and then greases and cleaning stuff. Can supply most big brands but we mostly do our own brand which is made to the same spec, but cheaper (not paying for the name brand). It is still more expensive than the KAK some people make locally using recycled base oils etc. All our stuff is purely virgin base oil.  I can PM for more details, don't wanna spam anyone. :thumleft: 

It's not the most glamorous job on the planet but you do see some cool stuff now and then.  Giant ball mill on the mines was cool (we have a really advanced open gear lube for them) and lately an extremely high pressure food processing system that's being used to stop Listeriosis.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2019, 03:56:30 pm by Roadhawg »
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Offline 73 Peanut

Re: Oil Question
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2019, 04:20:24 pm »
Don't the older Bmw bikes use 20w50 and the newer air cooled 2010 up  use 10w40 ?????
 

Offline jaybiker

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2019, 05:59:41 pm »
Whatever any of the others advise you John, take a tip from me.

Synthetic oil will definitely cause your clutch to slip, JASO or no JASO!  :deal:
 

Offline buzzlightyear

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2019, 06:04:13 pm »
1200 has a dry clutch...
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Offline Bill the Bong

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2019, 06:33:43 pm »
1200 has a dry clutch...

Only one to have read everything  :thumleft:
 

Offline jaybiker

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Re: Oil Question
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2019, 07:40:40 pm »
1200 has a dry clutch...

Whatever any of the others advise you John, take a tip from me.

Synthetic oil will definitely cause your clutch to slip, JASO or no JASO!  :deal:




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Offline Mapog

Re: Oil Question
« Reply #19 on: January 07, 2019, 09:51:46 pm »
Jip, lots of BS going around.....
The aircooled BM engine are more like a motorcar engine than a bike engine.

So you can use motorcar oil in it. No need for Jaso spec(which is in fact a Japanese engine oil spec).

Diesel engine oils work best in these engines.

Shell Rimula, Caltex Delo400......