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Online Kobus Myburgh

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Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« on: November 20, 2019, 08:04:24 pm »
Has this been posted somewhere yet?

Such a lekka video clip.

"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 
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Offline KarooKid

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2019, 08:57:58 pm »
Amazing. Hoe verlang ek nou na n bietjie bikery.

En ek kan nie help om te wonder nie - hoe goed was daai ouens sonder al die moderne foefies? Of hoe goed sou hulle met die moderne fietse gewees het.

True Adventure indeed
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Offline blockheadxl650v

Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2019, 09:36:07 pm »
Thanks Kobus. I enjoyed watching that.

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Offline Sandban(g)k

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2019, 04:18:15 am »
Lyk of hierdie droom van Honda weer gedroom word die jaar...

Roll on Dakar 2020  :peepwall:
 

Offline LRFan

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2019, 06:36:08 am »
Daai manne was ysters om daai groot fietse te hanteer in die Dakar!
 

Online Kobus Myburgh

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2019, 06:40:33 am »
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Online Kobus Myburgh

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2019, 06:43:02 am »
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Online Kobus Myburgh

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2019, 06:46:52 am »
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Online Kobus Myburgh

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2019, 06:49:27 am »
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Offline sidetrack

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2019, 09:31:41 am »
Ek sal graag n RD03 wil hÍ eendag
Little by little, one travels far

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Ride reports :
http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=134175.0 Penge's pass and the Old Forest http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=9421.0 - Orange Atlantic adventure http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=7514.0 - 805 km day trip http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=20260.0 - East Cape Bash http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=70199.0 - Two KTM thumpers head north
 

Offline BuRP

Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2019, 01:54:29 pm »
Lyk of hierdie droom van Honda weer gedroom word die jaar...

Roll on Dakar 2020

Honda was the one company - like in singular, the only one! - who drove the worldwide drive that "450cc is maximum!" for offroad racing, relentlessly at that.
With their tricks helped with their might they did get this right too, regrettably.
Since then they haven't won a Dakar anymore.
Ironic isn't it?
I for one think that serves them right.
Especially so after winning 6 times out of the 8 years that the XR650R was produced as homologation model to allow them to compete, read dominate, in the Baja.
Now it's going to be 2020, after what seems like an infinity of loosing, and they want to try again.

Dream on Honda, for you've lost it already, even when you win!
Perfect punishment for bullying your way forward trying to knock the smaller manufacturers - for they knocked you off the throne, very deservedly also!
Sparta MC50, 46 other 50cc's, Garelli Tiger Cross, Jawa 250, Kawasaki S1 250/3, S2 350/3, H1 500/3, H2 750/3, Suzuki GT380/3 - 10 year gap - KDX200, BMW 1150GS Adventure, Honda CBR600RR, Honda XR650R 2007 & 2003, Honda CRF230, Yamaha BWS100, BMW F800GS Adventure, Husqvarna 701 Enduro, KTM 790 Adv R, KTM 2020 XC-W TPI 300 Six Days, KTM 2016 500 EXC-W Six Days, KTM 790 Adv R Rally ordered
 

Offline Fuzzy Muzzy

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2019, 01:58:47 pm »
Lyk of hierdie droom van Honda weer gedroom word die jaar...

Roll on Dakar 2020

Honda was the one company - like in singular, the only one! - who drove the worldwide drive that "450cc is maximum!" for offroad racing, relentlessly at that.
With their tricks helped with their might they did get this right too, regrettably.
Since then they haven't won a Dakar anymore.
Ironic isn't it?
I for one think that serves them right.
Especially so after winning 6 times out of the 8 years that the XR650R was produced as homologation model to allow them to compete, read dominate, in the Baja.
Now it's going to be 2020, after what seems like an infinity of loosing, and they want to try again.

Dream on Honda, for you've lost it already, even when you win!
Perfect punishment for bullying your way forward trying to knock the smaller manufacturers - for they knocked you off the throne, very deservedly also!

Yoh.. someone has an axe to grind  :eek7:
Africa trip, Namibia, Botswana, Zambia, Malawi, Tanzania & Moz rr http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=61231.0
 

Offline sidetrack

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2019, 02:45:06 pm »
Lyk of hierdie droom van Honda weer gedroom word die jaar...

Roll on Dakar 2020

Honda was the one company - like in singular, the only one! - who drove the worldwide drive that "450cc is maximum!" for offroad racing, relentlessly at that.
With their tricks helped with their might they did get this right too, regrettably.
Since then they haven't won a Dakar anymore.
Ironic isn't it?
I for one think that serves them right.
Especially so after winning 6 times out of the 8 years that the XR650R was produced as homologation model to allow them to compete, read dominate, in the Baja.
Now it's going to be 2020, after what seems like an infinity of loosing, and they want to try again.

Dream on Honda, for you've lost it already, even when you win!
Perfect punishment for bullying your way forward trying to knock the smaller manufacturers - for they knocked you off the throne, very deservedly also!
I don't think a Honda factory team raced in Dakar up to around 2012 so please elaborate ? Even when the 690 / 660 etc still competed Honda had no interest in pushing it's XR 650 as a serious contender. It was the Dakar organizers who pushed for smaller cc's
« Last Edit: November 22, 2019, 02:54:54 pm by sidetrack »
Little by little, one travels far

J.R.R Tolkien
Ride reports :
http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=134175.0 Penge's pass and the Old Forest http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=9421.0 - Orange Atlantic adventure http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=7514.0 - 805 km day trip http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=20260.0 - East Cape Bash http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=70199.0 - Two KTM thumpers head north
 

Online Kobus Myburgh

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2019, 06:50:11 pm »
Thatís a bit of a harsh statement to make Burp?

Enduros have seen a complete change since the fast open hare scrambles in an attempt to make it slower/safer.

Have you noticed what performance they get out of the 450ís in the modern era?  Imagine what they will do with a 650/690/750?  Iím in total agreement to the capacity decrease, whom ever decided on that.

Hondaís challenge to win the Dakar again has nothing to do with the ability of their bike, but everything to do with team management.  But thatís just my opinion ............ oh, and that of Joan Barreda.

I for one would love to see KTM dethroned, be it by Honda or any other brand for that matter.  Just because itís healthy competition.


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« Last Edit: November 22, 2019, 07:03:30 pm by Kobus Myburgh »
"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Offline BuRP

Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2019, 10:47:40 am »
healthy competition.

That bit, Kobus, I agree wholeheartedly with!
But Honda doesn't always play fair, my only gripe with them.
I like their bikes, hell, bought 3 new one's even, but that doesn't mean I approve of their policies.
Yes they're big, but that doesn't automatically mean you're free to use your weight to bully others - which they have done quite a number of times, and I disagree with you that pointing this out is being harsh.
By introducing the 250&450 4stroke classes also 2strokes were banned (Soichiro's legacy!), a clear stab at KTM at the time - which were upcoming but small still, hence a potential lethal stab!

But no, they adapted, better still they thrived, on both 2 and 4 stoke fronts.... and look at them now?
They're a large force to reckon with offroad giving Honda the finger, and currently they make solid inroads to roadbikes as well.
As a sidenote, BMW did this as well but have given up on the offroad sector (their 450 remember), ditto Ducati (now backed with Audi monies!) on the road-only front.
The joint European manufacturers have given Honda serious uphill in both EU & US markets.... and that is a very good thing!
Thus, no wonder we'll see a totally new Fireblade now, they want to win SBK again.
Same for the Dakar, their trophee cabinet is empty of late!

Good old, but honest, competition: nothing wrong with!  :thumleft:
Sparta MC50, 46 other 50cc's, Garelli Tiger Cross, Jawa 250, Kawasaki S1 250/3, S2 350/3, H1 500/3, H2 750/3, Suzuki GT380/3 - 10 year gap - KDX200, BMW 1150GS Adventure, Honda CBR600RR, Honda XR650R 2007 & 2003, Honda CRF230, Yamaha BWS100, BMW F800GS Adventure, Husqvarna 701 Enduro, KTM 790 Adv R, KTM 2020 XC-W TPI 300 Six Days, KTM 2016 500 EXC-W Six Days, KTM 790 Adv R Rally ordered
 

Online Kobus Myburgh

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2019, 05:33:09 am »
healthy competition.

That bit, Kobus, I agree wholeheartedly with!
But Honda doesn't always play fair, my only gripe with them.
I like their bikes, hell, bought 3 new one's even, but that doesn't mean I approve of their policies.
Yes they're big, but that doesn't automatically mean you're free to use your weight to bully others - which they have done quite a number of times, and I disagree with you that pointing this out is being harsh.
By introducing the 250&450 4stroke classes also 2strokes were banned (Soichiro's legacy!), a clear stab at KTM at the time - which were upcoming but small still, hence a potential lethal stab!

But no, they adapted, better still they thrived, on both 2 and 4 stoke fronts.... and look at them now?
They're a large force to reckon with offroad giving Honda the finger, and currently they make solid inroads to roadbikes as well.
As a sidenote, BMW did this as well but have given up on the offroad sector (their 450 remember), ditto Ducati (now backed with Audi monies!) on the road-only front.
The joint European manufacturers have given Honda serious uphill in both EU & US markets.... and that is a very good thing!
Thus, no wonder we'll see a totally new Fireblade now, they want to win SBK again.
Same for the Dakar, their trophee cabinet is empty of late!

Good old, but honest, competition: nothing wrong with!  :thumleft:

I think your knowledge on the subject matter is better than mine and will therefore not try and argue it.   :thumleft:

I would however like to give you a different scenario.  Itís not necessarily all my own words but based on something I read and my interpretation thereof.

The ASO, as an independent organization, changed the rules to make it more competitive at a time where KTM dominated the Dakar.  Without competition, their event would certainly die a slow death.  I find it hard to believe that the Japanese big 4 did not have the ability to build a competitive machine to that of the KTM 690/650.  They somehow might have lost interest?  ASO however recognized the fact that all manufacturers had some form of competitive 450 in their line up and and the rule change was in favor of the longevity of their event?

For the demise of the 2 strokes:  This was not a single handed Honda decision.  While it is well documented that Sachiro did not like 2 strokes for their Ďstinkí, the Japanese manufacturers phased out 2 strokes due to their greed.  The 2 strokes were a lot easier to maintain by the home mechanic and parts were affordable and lasted relatively long.  Along comes the 4 stroke introduction, on the back of the environmentalists pressure into the MX scene.  A bike thatís heavier with less power in a straight line comparison, BUT to make it competitive, it is a highly strung motor, complicated and with lighter (weaker?) parts which requires more maintenance and regular rebuild.  A lot more complicated than the 2 strokes and the general garage mechanic is forced to outsource the work necessary.  The manufacturers benefit.  When the likes of Ricky Carmichael and Bubba Stewart switched to the big 4 strokes, the masses followed.  Simple marketing that we as the masses blatantly followed.  If we, as the consumer, resisted this movement, the manufacturers would have no choice but to give in to our needs?  So who killed the 2 strokes?

KTM on the other hand, possibly stuck to their strategy of satisfying the needs of their customers and hence the continuation of a line up that suits a wide consumer market.  Hats off to them, I like that.   :thumleft:

To blame Honda being solely responsible for the demise of the 2 strokes and the capacity decrease in the Dakar just does not sound entirely true to me.

"If you have men who will only come if they know there is a good road, I don't want them.  I want men who will come if there is no road at all."

-David Livingstone-
 

Offline sidetrack

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Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2019, 07:30:22 am »
healthy competition.

That bit, Kobus, I agree wholeheartedly with!
But Honda doesn't always play fair, my only gripe with them.
I like their bikes, hell, bought 3 new one's even, but that doesn't mean I approve of their policies.
Yes they're big, but that doesn't automatically mean you're free to use your weight to bully others - which they have done quite a number of times, and I disagree with you that pointing this out is being harsh.
By introducing the 250&450 4stroke classes also 2strokes were banned (Soichiro's legacy!), a clear stab at KTM at the time - which were upcoming but small still, hence a potential lethal stab!

But no, they adapted, better still they thrived, on both 2 and 4 stoke fronts.... and look at them now?
They're a large force to reckon with offroad giving Honda the finger, and currently they make solid inroads to roadbikes as well.
As a sidenote, BMW did this as well but have given up on the offroad sector (their 450 remember), ditto Ducati (now backed with Audi monies!) on the road-only front.
The joint European manufacturers have given Honda serious uphill in both EU & US markets.... and that is a very good thing!
Thus, no wonder we'll see a totally new Fireblade now, they want to win SBK again.
Same for the Dakar, their trophee cabinet is empty of late!

Good old, but honest, competition: nothing wrong with!  :thumleft:

I think your knowledge on the subject matter is better than mine and will therefore not try and argue it.   :thumleft:

I would however like to give you a different scenario.  Itís not necessarily all my own words but based on something I read and my interpretation thereof.

The ASO, as an independent organization, changed the rules to make it more competitive at a time where KTM dominated the Dakar.  Without competition, their event would certainly die a slow death.  I find it hard to believe that the Japanese big 4 did not have the ability to build a competitive machine to that of the KTM 690/650.  They somehow might have lost interest?  ASO however recognized the fact that all manufacturers had some form of competitive 450 in their line up and and the rule change was in favor of the longevity of their event?

For the demise of the 2 strokes:  This was not a single handed Honda decision.  While it is well documented that Sachiro did not like 2 strokes for their Ďstinkí, the Japanese manufacturers phased out 2 strokes due to their greed.  The 2 strokes were a lot easier to maintain by the home mechanic and parts were affordable and lasted relatively long.  Along comes the 4 stroke introduction, on the back of the environmentalists pressure into the MX scene.  A bike thatís heavier with less power in a straight line comparison, BUT to make it competitive, it is a highly strung motor, complicated and with lighter (weaker?) parts which requires more maintenance and regular rebuild.  A lot more complicated than the 2 strokes and the general garage mechanic is forced to outsource the work necessary.  The manufacturers benefit.  When the likes of Ricky Carmichael and Bubba Stewart switched to the big 4 strokes, the masses followed.  Simple marketing that we as the masses blatantly followed.  If we, as the consumer, resisted this movement, the manufacturers would have no choice but to give in to our needs?  So who killed the 2 strokes?

KTM on the other hand, possibly stuck to their strategy of satisfying the needs of their customers and hence the continuation of a line up that suits a wide consumer market.  Hats off to them, I like that.   :thumleft:

To blame Honda being solely responsible for the demise of the 2 strokes and the capacity decrease in the Dakar just does not sound entirely true to me.
The reason for cc change in Dakar was because of speed, they were worried the big bikes made the event too dangerous. Since the 450 rule change many Japanese teas still don't take part (eg. Suzuki and Kawasaki). If I remember Yamaha was the first with their modern 4 stroke YZ 400 MX bike in the late 90's. Ag nee Yamaha come in 2SD !
Little by little, one travels far

J.R.R Tolkien
Ride reports :
http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=134175.0 Penge's pass and the Old Forest http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=9421.0 - Orange Atlantic adventure http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=7514.0 - 805 km day trip http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=20260.0 - East Cape Bash http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=70199.0 - Two KTM thumpers head north
 

Offline BuRP

Re: Honda True Adventure - The Dream
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2019, 12:29:09 pm »
Yamaha was the first with their modern 4 stroke

Do you know that Yamaha is at the forefront of high power 4stoke technology? They even help (at a fee of course) other manufacturers, Toyota amoung them.
What Honda (cars!) was 10 years ago is Mazda at the moment, revolutionary lean running engines - just a pity for them their reputation is bland, middle of the road etc, however their cars are great!
Kobus, the Dakar has a rather turmoiled history, and because of its worldwide popularity (read: money hence power) it had to be throttled - as well as eventually relocated, for in Africa people literally threw their kids in front of the participants for monetary gain.
It has grown into a world spectacle of such proportions that now, with the Middle East next it is used/abused for political gain - women's rights anyone?
The ASO ruled (still?) it, but obviously this is done in tight collaboration, perhaps read dependency here, with the manufacturers.... and who's the biggest again?
Nudge nudge bru, what we hear or read is just the summary of the results, packaged to be PC for the applicable environment - so just apply some common sense, same as you undoubtedly also do when reading an inevitably good bike review written by a journo who's been lavished in luxury in some exotic location by, and at cost of, the manufacturer  ;)

But back to the thread: good that Honda's gearing up for the Dakar (and SBK too), for this will give especially KTM more reasons to do even better ..... as I said, I like competition!  :thumleft:
Sparta MC50, 46 other 50cc's, Garelli Tiger Cross, Jawa 250, Kawasaki S1 250/3, S2 350/3, H1 500/3, H2 750/3, Suzuki GT380/3 - 10 year gap - KDX200, BMW 1150GS Adventure, Honda CBR600RR, Honda XR650R 2007 & 2003, Honda CRF230, Yamaha BWS100, BMW F800GS Adventure, Husqvarna 701 Enduro, KTM 790 Adv R, KTM 2020 XC-W TPI 300 Six Days, KTM 2016 500 EXC-W Six Days, KTM 790 Adv R Rally ordered