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Author Topic: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?  (Read 1073 times)

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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2021, 05:43:40 pm »
You'll only need the TITS if there is going to be long liaisons, with that long open road dead-sitting.

Otherwise it's Buff's rucksack with bricks and squats for you.
 

Offline voorvel

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2021, 05:54:59 pm »
Rowing worked well for me.
Interval based: row as hard as possible for 1 minute, relax some for 2 minutes and continue for as long as possible

If I was going to be serious about things, I would have fitted an old dirt bike handlebar to the rower.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2021, 09:29:46 pm by voorvel »
 

Offline Grunder

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2021, 06:12:34 pm »
You'll only need the TITS if there is going to be long liaisons, with that long open road dead-sitting.

Otherwise it's Buff's rucksack with bricks and squats for you.
Sex is also good for stamina.

I've never been part of an enduro race...still...

It's good.
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Offline Bill the Bong

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2021, 07:54:32 pm »
I donít really believe riding a bike helps that much, it just ups the maintenance. I go for a couple of runs with my dog and cycle with the wife. She has a fatbike, so we go slow and maybe 6 km. But I ride standing the entire distance. Might get a cramp or 2.,Also do 70m sprints while towing a Land Rover cross-ply tire. Then I have a moerse truck tire which I flip and roll. I might also bliksem it with one of those massive hammers. Nothing really else. I already know how to ride a bike.
 

Offline geopat

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2021, 08:59:47 pm »
Not to mention that if you had a really great set of tits the other riders would probably pick your bike up for you, follow.behind you and generally make your life easier
 

Offline Beserker

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2021, 10:43:33 pm »
As someone who's done the Tankwa Rally a few times now the best advice I can give you is do Squats, lots and lots of them with a weight on your back. Pack bricks in a backpack if you have to. This mimics standing and sitting repeated on the bike. If you're doing Tankwa you'll be doing a couple of hundred of squats every day on the bike because of all the rocks. Pushups will help as well and also one of those hand squeezing jobbies for your clutch hand.

I was just thinking that. Some of the worst pain I've had on a bike was cramping hands. That is something you can train easily, just takes dedication.

Don't do the hand squeeze jobbies - it accelerates arm pump as your fore arms  are getting used to being built.

Focus on stretching and warming up mobility , al fingers and wrist.

The best cure for armpump is addressing the major culprit causing it - in rock climbing we refer to it as over crimping - holding on to tight in the believe that it actually helps.

This mostly because of stress induced not enough TITS - go play with your bike
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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #26 on: September 02, 2021, 11:54:10 am »
As someone who's done the Tankwa Rally a few times now the best advice I can give you is do Squats, lots and lots of them with a weight on your back. Pack bricks in a backpack if you have to. This mimics standing and sitting repeated on the bike. If you're doing Tankwa you'll be doing a couple of hundred of squats every day on the bike because of all the rocks. Pushups will help as well and also one of those hand squeezing jobbies for your clutch hand.

I was just thinking that. Some of the worst pain I've had on a bike was cramping hands. That is something you can train easily, just takes dedication.

Don't do the hand squeeze jobbies - it accelerates arm pump as your fore arms  are getting used to being built.

Focus on stretching and warming up mobility , al fingers and wrist.

The best cure for armpump is addressing the major culprit causing it - in rock climbing we refer to it as over crimping - holding on to tight in the believe that it actually helps.

This mostly because of stress induced not enough TITS - go play with your bike

Interesting viewpoint. Never thought of it like this. seems like one needs strong hands, but go for lots of reps and not short weightlifting type of work.

Any tips to make feet stronger, boots with proper shank/metal plate most important, but on top of that after a few days in the saddle my feet start to hurt?
Think I will try the bicycling, standing up, approach maybe to try and tick that box
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Offline Bill the Bong

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #27 on: September 02, 2021, 12:53:32 pm »
You will not be meerkatting in the Tankwa, you will need to ride in the attack posision. A strong lower back is key. After a few days you will have so much pain everywhere, your feet will be minor
 

Offline Beserker

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #28 on: September 02, 2021, 04:35:00 pm »
Agree with the Bong above..core strength is hey.

Feet: 

If you cycle with cleats, you will know the spindle of the pedal is below the ball of your feet, not below the arch, which is where most on a bike place their feet as it keeps the rear brake at hand - this is contrary to maintaining your feet, and it eats at your endurance reserves.

Keep the balls of your feet on the pegs, moving only to brake - the added advantage is that your ankle acts as a proper hinge, reducing impact stress on the rest of your body.
Automatically, as you are not jarred around, you stay on balance easier and thus requiring less fatigue inducing body english (e.g. the urge to hang of the bars and get arm pump)

Standing position: 

It is not Meerkatting aka the Bong , it is in the attack position.  Transitioning to attack position from sitting, if your arms are in the correct position, i.e. elbows up, head up, those should hardly move off their respective axis's.
Slide your butt back and up, very different from "squatting up" to Meerkat.

Although squats will help, better go check what skiers do: put your back up against the wall, move your feet away from the wall till your lower leg is 90' to your feet, in turn 90' to your upper leg, 90' to your back. (wall sits) google it, not sure what it is called.

Best exercise, and it is easy to do as we have a lot of sand where I stay, get a stretch of deep loose sand, about 20 m long.
Get a wheelbarrow, and fill it with as much weight as you dare.
Push it up and down the stretch of sand, concentrating on your core, keeping your back neck and head in a line.
The body will not be as bent over as in the attack position, a bit straighter up but the action of your legs pushing the wheelbarrow, contracting your core, the strengthening of your back in the process, almost all in one exercise will help a lot. 

Just don't let your wife see you pushing that barrow, they get notions of gardening which will destruct your fitness regime.

Build the core, build the balance, build the endurance - but also exercise good riding technique with the focus on how it allows you to save energy.

Riding technique is a life saver, and you need to do it by ondogram, i.e. do as much as possible not necessarily focusing on speed, but technique so it comes instinctively, like having your balls of your feet on the pegs.....so TITS is the thing.

I'll post some more if you want.
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Offline Xpat

Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #29 on: September 02, 2021, 05:39:48 pm »
Plenty of good advice here, but I think you need a reality check. The rally starts three weeks from now. No matter what exercise you are going to do you are going to improve your fitness only marginally by then and if anything you run the risk of overcooking it and being fatigued for the rally.

Given this constraints I believe you will achieve much bigger bang for buck focusing on improving your riding efficiency / technique (as Berserker also alluded to) - i.e.TITS. Efficiency in my experience trumps fitness every time (unless the fitness is combined with the efficiency of course). I have ridden with chainsmoking overweight (more like obese) senior gentlemen compared to whom I was an Ironman champion. But thanks to their riding efficiency I had absolutely no chance to keep up (even with their frequent smoke stops) and had to find some lame excuse to split from them to save any remaining dignity.

I also used to ride DeWildt on 300 and in the whoops section between mountain and watertower had to stop at least once or twice to catch my breath. Now I ride it on 990 and don't have to stop at all - and I'm definitely not fitter than I was then about 12 years ago. The secret for us later bloomers (I think you also started riding late) is to ride often to keep those muscle memories alive (mine atrophy significantly if I skip just couple of weekends).

For me the key is always remembering to stay relaxed as much as possible even through the whoops. inevitably you will tense up here and there, but I have a tendency to stay tense and that kills you quick as you are basically trying to have a sparing match with planet Earth. No matter how strong or fit you are - you are going to lose and quick. Staying relaxed as much as possible - going with the flow so to speak- is the trick that helps me last much longer (and enjoy the ride much more). So rather than focusing on going as fast as possible - I try to ride only as fast as it enables me to stay relaxed - which sometimes means to slow down a bit, but other times (in sand) might actually mean to speed up a bit. And it naturally forces you into correct body position (which in my case is usually more forward over handlebars than I am if not focused on the relaxation) as you cannot be relaxed when you hanging off the handlebars and trying to hold on for dear life.

So I would try to squeeze in as much riding as possible. I know your time is limited, but maybe just do an hour every day / every other day focusing on that relaxation. You live in Kalahari with desert right at your front door, so just try to steal every short ride you can - I believe this will make much bigger difference in the short time you have than any type of exercise you can figure out. Rather use the exercise time to ride - no matter how short.
 
« Last Edit: September 02, 2021, 05:42:00 pm by Xpat »
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #30 on: September 02, 2021, 05:50:15 pm »
I rest on my handpalms.

If I ride very technical places, I make a point of relaxing my hands all the time, opening my fingers and stretching my hands, while always having them on the bars.

My problem is a duff left wrist, and this needs concentrating on as it hurts very easily. the rest of my body can take a lot of fatigue and punch.
 

Offline Beserker

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #31 on: September 02, 2021, 07:06:36 pm »
Rowing worked well for me.
Interval based: row as hard as possible for 1 minute, relax some for 2 minutes and continue for as long as possible

If I was going to be serious about things, I would have fitted an old dirt bike handlebar to the rower.

I concur, rowing (machine) is seriously good, it also ramps up your cardio vascular ability big time.  What I especially appreciate is that it also allows you to practice good breathing technique and you can also focus on core muscle, step 1 to relaxing and doing things in an energy efficient manner.
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Offline BuRP

Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #32 on: September 02, 2021, 10:42:11 pm »
What is TITS?

time in the saddle.

OK, I'll be the first to owe up.
When I started reading about TITS here I got excited.... I mean, who wouldn't want some of that to get fit eh?
But I reckon riding is also fine...
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Offline Beserker

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #33 on: September 02, 2021, 11:08:25 pm »
Plenty of good advice here, but I think you need a reality check. The rally starts three weeks from now.

I didn't realize this, other than what you are already doing I will focus on good stretching - I do yoga with the Mrs. (she calls my attempt "floppy fish" style), but in even 3 weeks it will help, and you can take this from an initial unbeliever.  Check out "Yoga with Addrienne" on YouTube.  Awareness as to your body position, and the muscles you will engage, how you breath will go a long way in managing energy and soreness.

And then , as XPat  also mentioned, I will spend as much time on the bike, playing in anything off road. I call it warm up - don't crash, don't get hurt, just get to know you and your bike better.
This relationship is crux and will see you through the race - especially it enables you to manage the first day or so of the race before you settle in.

When I started reading about TITS here I got excited.... I mean, who wouldn't want some of that to get fit eh?
But I reckon riding is also fine...

Riding is also more fun  ::)
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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #34 on: September 03, 2021, 09:41:18 am »
Thanks again all for the feedback. Really appreciate it.

And yes Berserker/xpat, dont stop, its solid advice.


I am not nowhere wrt fitness. Weightlifting is my thing. But I am not where I should be as I had a bad fall of the 300 a few weeks back. Hurt my shoulder, can only now start doing proper pullups again. But I am at 80% again, sitting here with full body muscle sore after ramping up on training again this week.
Since the start of this thread I already added some rowing, will add more. (even though I just do 5minutes, its at max resistance and not slow, same with cycling).
I do focus on hack squats in gym, its easy on your back, I will add the wall sits. They can get pretty tough. And I will continue a big focus on core, especially as I cant work my back hard (its useless). Already big on gardening so the wheelbarrow work is happening, but I find shoveling hard on my back, to the point of overworking it and impacting normal training.

I am squeezing in as much riding time as I can. Did 30minutes yesterday after work on the 300. But I still have zero confidence after the aforementioned fall. I find riding on the 300 much much more tiring than on 990, (granted, stuff happens faster). so that should help. Attack position on 300 is also a lot harder on me than same on 990.

I will today probably put leave in for end of last week and see if I can get proper saddle time on the 990. Do some of Xpats routes as well as longer open stretches. (and finish my rear tyre, want to do rally with motoz desert H/T)


question: My english is failing me....standing on balls of your feet and having ankle work to absorb impact? balls of your feet referring to rear of feet, not front toe area? Isnt that the position with least impact absorption? I stand in middle of my foot most of the time, will be looking into this.
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Offline Xpat

Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #35 on: September 03, 2021, 10:00:40 am »
Ball of feet is front right behind your toes. You definitely should not be riding standing on your heels  ;)

Are you riding 300 or 990 in the rally? If 990 why are you wasting time on 300, especially as you say that you struggle on it offroad in proper attack position? You are just building wrong habits. I suspect you use it because you try to go fast, but if so that is wrong.

Rather use 990 from now on for everything (assuming you are riding it in the rally) - the bigger heft will give you better exercise in shorter time anyway and most importantly you are getting efficient on the bike you are going to be using in the race.

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #36 on: September 03, 2021, 10:24:38 am »
doing rally on 990.

I just find the 300 more tiring in a shorter time, especially on the forearms.
so I use it for 'bang for back' for my time vs getting fit.

and I plan to sell it after rally, so getting last use of it. (I am not a scrambler kind of guy)
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Offline Dwerg

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Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #37 on: September 03, 2021, 10:30:39 am »
3 weeks? Might as well go to the pub.....

But seriously, you have a lot to loose and little to gain at this point. How much roadbook training have you done?
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Offline Buff

Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #38 on: September 03, 2021, 10:50:12 am »
You doing the Tankwa on your 990? :o What class are you riding?
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Offline Xpat

Re: Getting bike (trip/race) fit?
« Reply #39 on: September 03, 2021, 11:02:03 am »
doing rally on 990.

I just find the 300 more tiring in a shorter time, especially on the forearms.
so I use it for 'bang for back' for my time vs getting fit.

and I plan to sell it after rally, so getting last use of it. (I am not a scrambler kind of guy)

So you are training to get tired? I'm not sure that training to exhaustion in the shortest possible time is the way to go for rally when you are going to be on a bike whole day. Rather than getting stronger / fitter at this point in time (i.e. increase your fuel tank so to speak) I think it is much more important to get more efficient / economical with what you already have (i.e. increase the mileage you are getting from your current tank). I.e. at this stage the right strategy IMO is econorun (in terms of conservation of energy), rather than trying to race.

The trick IMO isn't to get strongest forearms you can get (the strongest man on the planet doesn't have a chance on the bike if he has wrong body position), the trick is to get accustomed to ride in a way that you almost don't use them (if you have right body position your arms should be most of the time loose).

My 2c - I will stop hounding you now. I'm quite curious how this is going to turn out.  8)
« Last Edit: September 03, 2021, 11:03:07 am by Xpat »