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Author Topic: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine - UPDATE - SEPT 2010 !!!!  (Read 30935 times)

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Offline Goose

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BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine - UPDATE - SEPT 2010 !!!!
« on: May 03, 2010, 09:07:37 am »
As per Michnus's suggestion to start a new post from: http://www.wilddog.za.net/forum/index.php?topic=48764.0

Seems that there's a massive problem with the Boxer engine that has been tuned for EU conditions.
The problem with the 14.7:1 fuelratio's is that the engine runs far too lean for SA conditions.

Anyone with aviation knowledge knows that fuel mixture is critical to ensure optimal burn and operation. The hotter & higher you go - the less dense air becomes and we have found that on hot days with a bit of a load (maybe a passenger, maybe just a bit of luggage) the bikes start "pinging" really badly.
THIS is causing serious damage to the engine - in fact in 2008 I seem to remember quite a few boxers actually self-destructing.

MY personal issue is that if I ride with my wife and hit the 5000 - 5500 rpm range and this mill below me self-destructs and either seizes dead at 140km/hr - we are going to get seriously hurt............ or she's going to blow out huge amounts of oil, which would be exceptionally dangerous for us and perhaps fellow riders behind us when that oil is deposited on the road.

So do I want to ride a potential death-trap....? No that is not an option.

Solution is actually extremely simple...............


We need approximately 20 GS & GSA's in the Western Cape (being sea-level the testing is also then done where maximum performance of the engine should be noted) to be tested thoroughly with the results then being sent to BMW Motorrad for a response.

Please place your names on the list below..... and I will arrange the testing date as well as see whether BMW SA would perhaps send a representative to be present to check that the testing is done correctly (of course if needed?)

Once we have the list and date set, I will post the details of what's needed and how we go about the whole thing.



« Last Edit: September 24, 2010, 07:44:04 am by Goose »
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Offline Duracell

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2010, 10:36:58 am »
I own a 2009 model gs1200. I bought it with 2600km end December 2009. It now has 6200km on the clock. Used if for everyday commuting and some fun on week-ends. It become clear that it uses oil. In +- 3600km it uses almost 500ml oil. I find some oil dripping from the cranccase where the starter bolts on. I took it to speedbike in Klerksdorp. Nearest BMW dealer. I also complain that it have the tendency to "sluk-and-stotter" at 5000rpm in 6th when open up to overtake traffic. It also sometimes happen with a fast pull-away at a traffic light.

Speedbike responce was that there is no oil-leak. It is my own fault because the bike moered over in thick sand a few times during a week-end's fun on dirt and sand. They found oil in the aircleaner box and explained that the oil that i see dripping was from the airbox. It leaked via the breather pipe to the airbox. They said that i used dirty feul, that is the reason for the "sluk-and-stotter". But i must bring the bike back at another time so that they could have a look at that. I Pay R1685-00 for labour.

I took the bike and used it now again for +- 500km. The bike never falled over again but it used another 200ml of oil. The "sluk-and-stotter" still happens from time to time after two full tanks af feul.

Any suggestions what the reasons could be or what i could do???
     
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Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2010, 10:39:02 am »
I own a 2009 model gs1200. I bought it with 2600km end December 2009. It now has 6200km on the clock. Used if for everyday commuting and some fun on week-ends. It become clear that it uses oil. In +- 3600km it uses almost 500ml oil. I find some oil dripping from the cranccase where the starter bolts on. I took it to speedbike in Klerksdorp. Nearest BMW dealer. I also complain that it have the tendency to "sluk-and-stotter" at 5000rpm in 6th when open up to overtake traffic. It also sometimes happen with a fast pull-away at a traffic light.

Speedbike responce was that there is no oil-leak. It is my own fault because the bike moered over in thick sand a few times during a week-end's fun on dirt and sand. They found oil in the aircleaner box and explained that the oil that i see dripping was from the airbox. It leaked via the breather pipe to the airbox. They said that i used dirty feul, that is the reason for the "sluk-and-stotter". But i must bring the bike back at another time so that they could have a look at that. I Pay R1685-00 for labour.

I took the bike and used it now again for +- 500km. The bike never falled over again but it used another 200ml of oil. The "sluk-and-stotter" still happens from time to time after two full tanks af feul.

Any suggestions what the reasons could be or what i could do???
     


You mentioned that magic figure of 5000rpm.....  join the club matey.............
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Offline KiLRoy

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2010, 10:47:38 am »
my 1150 GSA pings too.  sometimes better after a service, worse on hot days and under load.  Also pops and back fires a bit on the overrun.  Pingings sonds like scraping a piece of wire on a tight stretched steel wire.
 

Offline Gypsybaron

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2010, 10:53:43 am »
I own a 2009 model gs1200. I bought it with 2600km end December 2009. It now has 6200km on the clock. Used if for everyday commuting and some fun on week-ends. It become clear that it uses oil. In +- 3600km it uses almost 500ml oil. I find some oil dripping from the cranccase where the starter bolts on. I took it to speedbike in Klerksdorp. Nearest BMW dealer. I also complain that it have the tendency to "sluk-and-stotter" at 5000rpm in 6th when open up to overtake traffic. It also sometimes happen with a fast pull-away at a traffic light.

Speedbike responce was that there is no oil-leak. It is my own fault because the bike moered over in thick sand a few times during a week-end's fun on dirt and sand. They found oil in the aircleaner box and explained that the oil that i see dripping was from the airbox. It leaked via the breather pipe to the airbox. They said that i used dirty feul, that is the reason for the "sluk-and-stotter". But i must bring the bike back at another time so that they could have a look at that. I Pay R1685-00 for labour.

I took the bike and used it now again for +- 500km. The bike never falled over again but it used another 200ml of oil. The "sluk-and-stotter" still happens from time to time after two full tanks af feul.

Any suggestions what the reasons could be or what i could do???
     

Get it to a dealer that wants to do business with you again  :peepwall:

I had bad dealings with Speedbike years ago - not BMW related but same owner (Piet Spoed). No use crying over spilt milk though, I'll just try not to deal with them again. Some other people have had excellent service from them, and some not. I must say, Piet wasn't the culprit but his workshop crew was. I didn't take it further, the amount was way too little for all the effort. Eventually a bike shop in Potch fixed it for me - but they've gone out of business sometime during the past 10 years.
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Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2010, 11:05:41 am »
my 1150 GSA pings too.  sometimes better after a service, worse on hot days and under load.  Also pops and back fires a bit on the overrun.  Pingings sonds like scraping a piece of wire on a tight stretched steel wire.

Hein it may well be a very widespread issue.... only the Dyno-testing will show you the correct info.

The problem as always is that if there's a problem during the warranty period, then the engine will be sorted/exchanged... one can also make sure you trade your bike in or sell it before the warranty expires. However - what about the poor bastard that buys the bike out of the warranty period and then has a motor that blows?

case-in-point I went and test-rode a 2008 GS with 6200km on the clock on Friday for a forum member. The bike's still new and in good nick.... BUT warranty either finished or about to expire. If this bike is bought and say in the next 3000km the engine blows.... where does it leave this man with his "new" bike?

maybe we do the testing to include a couple of the 1150's ?
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Offline Excalibur

Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2010, 11:13:37 am »
Goose, do you still have your standard pype with Cat on the  bike?
 

Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2010, 11:17:24 am »
Goose, do you still have your standard pype with Cat on the  bike?


Yep - all standard - obviously to ensure full warranty applies!
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Offline Excalibur

Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2010, 11:34:54 am »
Goose, I believe with each service(10 000 intervals), the BMW dealer will check your fuel settings. That is part of the checklist they run before excecuting the official service(oil/oil filter/air cleaner etc) Question is, is it neccessary to adjust the electronics(fuel settings) per interval(10 000 kays)?. I could understand if they replace sparkpugs (suppose to be every 40 000), then adjustment could be possible.

I think fuel is a big factor here. The EMS is highly advanced and should pick up any irregualarities in the juice. You would be surprized to see what shit you get in the fuel now a days.

Your approach is right, get a bunch together and do a test at a dealership. Maybe the factors altitude/climate contributes as well. Question what is the solution.

I run a complete fullflow aftermarket exhaust sytem, while my bike was in and out of warranty. Sorry, I am not a good contributor to the atmosphere, but I just put leaded(LRP or premium as we know it)fuel, no skipping a beat or any pinging.  
« Last Edit: May 03, 2010, 11:41:14 am by Excalibur »
 

Offline Duracell

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2010, 11:36:21 am »
     
[/quote]

Get it to a dealer that wants to do business with you again  :peepwall:


I agree. Any recommendations - somebody mentioned Bavaria Motorad??
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Offline michnus

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2010, 11:44:28 am »
Goose, I believe with each service(10 000 intervals), the BMW dealer will check your fuel settings. That is part of the checklist they run before excecuting the official service(oil/oil filter/air cleaner etc) Question is, is it neccessary to adjust the electronics(fuel settings) per interval(10 000 kays)?. I could understand if they replace sparkpugs (suppose to be every 40 000), then adjustment could be possible.

I think fuel is a big factor here. The EMS is highly advanced and should pick up any irregualarities in the juice. You would be surprized to see what shit you get in the fuel now a days.

Your approach is right, get a bunch together and do a test at a dealership. Maybe the factors altitude/climate contributes as well. Question what is the solution.

I run a complete fullflow aftermarket exhaust sytem, while my bike was in and out of warranty. Sorry, I am not a good contributor to the atmosphere, but I just put leaded(LRP or premium as we know it)fuel, no skipping a beat or any pinging.  

That's the problem Exaliber, they can't set any of it, they can adjust the throttle bodies and that's about it, they can't adjust the fuel settings, and that is why Goose and the others have an issue with. BMW can't and do not check the air fuel ratio and thus none of their mechanics can give sound advice on this subject.
Read the other thead Goose posted, you will get an idea.  ;)

Offline Excalibur

Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2010, 12:23:20 pm »
Thanks Michnus :thumleft:
 

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2010, 12:31:27 pm »
Owners:
1. Goose (Peter)                 2009     GSA
2. Pokkel (Iwan)                 2009     GSA
3. Snafu (Ossie)                 2009     GSA   
4. Kola (Kobus)                   2009     GS (10000km) - date and time dependant

Will chat to a few mates tonight, might be able to add:

2005GS 50000+ km
2006GS 40000+ km
2007GS 30000+ km
 

Offline Adventurer

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2010, 12:41:42 pm »
The 2010 new version GSA that I currently have seems fine, I haven't heard any pinging, and have done a few kilos at 5000rpm....
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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2010, 01:13:43 pm »
Owners:
1. Goose (Peter)                 2009     GSA
2. Pokkel (Iwan)                 2009     GSA
3. Snafu (Ossie)                 2009     GSA   
4. Kola (Kobus)                   2009     GS (10000km) - date and time dependant

Will chat to a few mates tonight, might be able to add:

2005GS 50000+ km
2006GS 40000+ km
2007GS 30000+ km

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2010, 02:16:45 pm »
my 1150 GSA pings too.  sometimes better after a service, worse on hot days and under load.  Also pops and back fires a bit on the overrun.  Pingings sonds like scraping a piece of wire on a tight stretched steel wire.

Single spark or twin spark? Chatted to Mike from Ryder motorrad here in Durban about it as my 1150 single spark had the same issue and apparently there is a replacement coding plug that fixes this. Pitty I only found out about this plug now else I would still have my beast.
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Offline Stofpad

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2010, 02:20:29 pm »
I have a 2006 1200GS with about 55000km's on. It depends when and where and how long it will take, but will be keen to help.

I think for accurate testing the same fuel should be used. I found that using Total also make my bike idle differently.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2010, 02:22:11 pm by Stofpad »
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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2010, 02:52:37 pm »
I have a 2009 GSA with freeflow Acropovic to offer.
 

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2010, 02:55:08 pm »
I see a link to this thread has been posted on bmwmotorcycleclubcape.
 

Offline buzzlightyear

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2010, 02:56:18 pm »
my 1150 GSA pings too.  sometimes better after a service, worse on hot days and under load.  Also pops and back fires a bit on the overrun.  Pingings sonds like scraping a piece of wire on a tight stretched steel wire.

Single spark or twin spark? Chatted to Mike from Ryder motorrad here in Durban about it as my 1150 single spark had the same issue and apparently there is a replacement coding plug that fixes this. Pitty I only found out about this plug now else I would still have my beast.

If memory serves me correctly some people used the 1100 coding plug on the 1150 and that sorted the issues.
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