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Author Topic: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine - UPDATE - SEPT 2010 !!!!  (Read 31955 times)

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Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2010, 04:37:45 pm »
As far as I can see - the fix for this issue is in fact as easy as sitting compiling an email.

If anyone knows the Power Commander system, you'll know that by merely changing parameters on the unit, you can control fuel & air mixtures. Virtually the same type of system exists in the Beemer software... so if BMW can get the Germans to supply said software.... we can get the testing done and settings altered and with a mere update to the onboard computer software - problem will be solved!

The problem will be to get BMW to see this as a problem and the solution.

My problem is that I'm potentially riding on a bike, which could either blow it's motor or seize totally at high speed with either my wife or son onboard. The consequences are NOT nice to think of.... all this apart from the coss of the engine failure.

For interest sake - did you chaps see The New Consumer Protection Act, 2008: Liability of the manufacturer for defective products that came into effect today!!  :mwink:

http://www.polity.org.za/article/the-new-consumer-protection-act-2008-liability-of-the-manufacturer-for-defective-products-an-update-2010-02-25

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Offline The TRANSPORTER

Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2010, 04:51:35 pm »
The 2010 new version GSA that I currently have seems fine, I haven't heard any pinging, and have done a few kilos at 5000rpm....

On my 1200 GSA 09 also ..nada nothing... ;D
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Offline michnus

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2010, 06:43:31 pm »
will it be possible for you guys to get a GS911 and also check which software version is on each bike, apparently only a hand full of JHB BMW dealers are on 24hours link to BMWGA and update software when a bike gets serviced there. And apparently it's also possible they change Airflow ratio with these updates.

Might be possible why some ping and others not.

KobusL

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2010, 06:46:43 pm »
My GS pinged once, and it was my fault IMHO, 44 degrees, pillion and luggage, uphill, incorrect gear selection - geared down and carried on.

This is the only time in the just over 10000km it has happened, and I just ride the thing.

I do ride like a granny though  :ricky:
 

Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2010, 07:13:05 pm »
will it be possible for you guys to get a GS911 and also check which software version is on each bike, apparently only a hand full of JHB BMW dealers are on 24hours link to BMWGA and update software when a bike gets serviced there. And apparently it's also possible they change Airflow ratio with these updates.

Might be possible why some ping and others not.


Michnus - this is what Iwan & I was told last week at BMW - that they could do a software update to the latest version, BUT that there would not be any fuel/air mixture changes as these cannot be changed..?
So we'll see - our bikes are booked in for the 11th May - then we will do a complete statement


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Offline HP FREAK

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2010, 08:24:40 pm »
will it be possible for you guys to get a GS911 and also check which software version is on each bike, apparently only a hand full of JHB BMW dealers are on 24hours link to BMWGA and update software when a bike gets serviced there. And apparently it's also possible they change Airflow ratio with these updates.

Might be possible why some ping and others not.


Michnus - this is what Iwan & I was told last week at BMW - that they could do a software update to the latest version, BUT that there would not be any fuel/air mixture changes as these cannot be changed..?
So we'll see - our bikes are booked in for the 11th May - then we will do a complete statement



Goose wat is die kilos op die fietse? Waar le die hitte as die fietse so maak?In watter rat maak hulle die meeste so 4 de ,5 de of 6de?Het jy al die airfilter laat vervang? Jammer oor al die vra maar ek dink ons kan begin om sekere goed uit  te skakel.
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Offline wrench

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2010, 08:32:01 pm »
The 2010 new version GSA that I currently have seems fine, I haven't heard any pinging, and have done a few kilos at 5000rpm....

On my 1200 GSA 09 also ..nada nothing... ;D

A problem of this nature is less likely to happen at higher altitudes because of less density of the air.
 

Offline Captain Zef

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2010, 08:36:33 pm »
The 2010 new version GSA that I currently have seems fine, I haven't heard any pinging, and have done a few kilos at 5000rpm....

Usually pings on a hot day..... is it still hot up there?
 

Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2010, 09:14:42 pm »
The 2010 new version GSA that I currently have seems fine, I haven't heard any pinging, and have done a few kilos at 5000rpm....

Usually pings on a hot day..... is it still hot up there?

Exactly - hot & loaded....and you doing a few kilo's won't help matey.......... rather put on a bit of luggage..... as the extra kilo's to your body-frame is not heavy enough....    :peepwall:
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Offline Vark

Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #29 on: May 03, 2010, 10:20:12 pm »
Eish!!!

OK, I'm in.

2008 GSA, 21000Km. Remus header pipes, standard silencer. The rest is standard.
I don't have serious pinging (except when I ride in tricky places where the engine gets hot due to not enough airflow), but it does not like 5k-5.5k revs in general - feels a bit dead there. And this is why I opted for the free flow pipes. This helped a bit, but it's still not as smooth as my 2006 GS.

Let me know where and when, and if I should put my standard pipes back for the test.
The 2006 GS is also still available should it be required (still have not sold it).


 

Offline Boxer

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2010, 11:06:06 am »
My 2008GSA pings on hot days...Done all the software upgrades at the dealerships.....Dealer advised nothing else can be done !! :( :(
 

Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #31 on: May 04, 2010, 07:12:35 pm »
Ok chaps - the powers that be have been in contact and we are looking at Saturday the 22nd May to do have a get-together in Somerset West (exact address and place to be PM'd to those that want to join us - moral supporters are welcome but please note this is for a specific purpose, so the testing will be done on the bikes as per invitation ONLY!    ;))

The plan is to test a group of GS/GSA's on a professionally run and managed Dyno System to get an objective test result on our machines so that the info can be used in a constructive way to get BMW to resolve the problems that are being experienced.
I will be approaching Auto Atlantic to see whether they would be interested in sending a representative to join us, to allow total transparency with the testing. This will NOT be a brand or dealership bashing exercises, rather we want constructive and positive input to help our discussions with BMW.

As the testing of a group of bikes may well take a while, it could keep the Dyno busy for most of the Saturday and it could be quite nice to use the opportunity to have a bit of a get-together with a bit of refreshments..... but I would ask each bike-owner taking part to contribute a bit towards this to help make the event successful.

In the interest of what we are trying to achieve, Wrench has kindly offered to do all the testing and diagnostics at no cost. He does however have expenses - minimal it might be (he may well get staff to work overtime) and I'd like to ensure that a small contribution from everyone would help cover his costs.

For all those interested - please PM me as soon as possible and I will send you the exact details of when and where we will be gathering!  :thumleft:

I would also appreciate it if this event could be "advertised" as much as possible to GS/GSA owners that might not have seen it here on the Wilddog forum as I will limit my input, findings and comments to this forum.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2010, 08:36:58 pm by Goose »
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Offline Fudmucker

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #32 on: May 04, 2010, 07:22:29 pm »
If there is going to be a similar exercise at altitude in Gauteng,
I have a 2009 GS to add to the pool...  :-\
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KobusL

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #33 on: May 04, 2010, 07:26:10 pm »
Will tell all my OMB riding mates, and will try arrange as many of them as possible.
Will PM you once I know who can go.

15th is a problem for me as I am away, but will support the effort.

Also keen to hear what BMW says on the 11th...
 

Offline 2 Stroke Dan

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #34 on: May 04, 2010, 07:35:04 pm »
The SuperTenere is available at a Yamaha dealer near you, "ping" the agent.
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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #35 on: May 04, 2010, 07:36:57 pm »
The SuperTenere is available at a Yamaha dealer near you, "ping" the agent.

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Offline buzzlightyear

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #36 on: May 04, 2010, 07:39:31 pm »
Leka Goose, all the best with your efforts.  :thumleft:
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Offline The TRANSPORTER

Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - Testing of bikes needed!!!
« Reply #37 on: May 04, 2010, 07:52:34 pm »
Ok chaps - the powers that be have been in contact and we are looking at either Saturday the 15th May or 22nd May to do have a get-together in Somerset West (exact address and place to be PM'd to those that want to join us - moral supporters are welcome but please note this is for a specific purpose, so the testing will be done on the bikes as per invitation ONLY!    ;))

The plan is to test a group of GS/GSA's on a professionally run and managed Dyno System to get an objective test result on our machines so that the info can be used in a constructive way to get BMW to resolve the problems that are being experienced.
I will be approaching Auto Atlantic to see whether they would be interested in sending a representative to join us, to allow total transparency with the testing. This will NOT be a brand or dealership bashing exercises, rather we want constructive and positive input to help our discussions with BMW.

As the testing of a group of bikes may well take a while, it could keep the Dyno busy for most of the Saturday and it could be quite nice to use the opportunity to have a bit of a get-together with a bit of refreshments..... but I would ask each bike-owner taking part to contribute a bit towards this to help make the event successful.

In the interest of what we are trying to achieve, Wrench has kindly offered to do all the testing and diagnostics at no cost. He does however have expenses - minimal it might be (he may well get staff to work overtime) and I'd like to ensure that a small contribution from everyone would help cover his costs.

For all those interested - please PM me as soon as possible and I will send you the exact details of when and where we will be gathering!  :thumleft:

I would also appreciate it if this event could be "advertised" as much as possible to GS/GSA owners that might not have seen it here on the Wilddog forum as I will limit my input, findings and comments to this forum.


Goose its a good idea and we all look forward to see the outcome of this ,one thing is it possible to get a powercommander or chip and do an altered run with the settings changed just for info and evidence of improving or changing the air/fuel ratios?? I for one would like that for future references as im looking to get one...or then most of us if it works better... :thumleft: :thumleft:
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Offline Goose

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #38 on: May 05, 2010, 08:56:12 am »
Before you commence with testing, might it not be prudent to contact BMW in Germany to tell them what you intend to do and why. If they are not aware of the problem, they may just be very interested, and at least offer some input.

As a matter of interest, when the dyno testing is done, how will engine temperature be recorded? The boxer is designed to have a constant airflow over it (and its oil cooler), so I presume a blower of some sort is part of the dyno apparatus. Any engine can be made to pre-ignite if it is overheated.

Apologies if I'm being an idiot, but I don't know what is involved in dyno testing.


P.S. I don't own a boxer, but I think it is such an iconic machine that it would be a great pity to have it exterminated by the non-scientist, non-engineer fraternity that appear to have taken over the minds of those that set the rules.


Very valid query indeed.

I think personally that it would have been nice to notify Germany - however my resources are limited and it would actually have been really nice if someone could indeed supply me with the correct contact details so it does not fall in the cracks.

With regard to the engine temp..... there's one almighty blower situated right in front of the bike. Constant airflow is without a doubt important and this is provided by one of the most professional setup's I've seen... so no worries here.

As previously mentioned - I will be asking BMW here in Cape Town to send one of their chaps to be present to see what we're trying to achieve...... remember as far as I know a lot of us are just crazy nuts who love and adore our bikes.... if it was not so, we would not have this moerse KTM/BMW rivalry..... mine for instance sleeps in a garage on a tiles floor with it's own carpet underneath as well...... so we only want to resolve the issue and have the best care for our scoots!  :)
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Offline Operator

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Re: BMW R1200GS/GSA - Boxer Engine Issues - DYNO TESTING ARRANGED!!!
« Reply #39 on: May 05, 2010, 10:00:44 am »
I would do this testing with full transparency towards BMW Motorrad and  have an official
representative involved in the whole process.


Goose, how would you react if your engine pops and you want to put in a warranty claim and they claim no liability because of the fact that your bike was on a dyno of a non-dealer?
If the sh*t hits the fan, manufacturers are grasping for any excuse.  :-\

Not that I'm saying  Wrench doesn't know his stuff...............on the contrary  ;)
I have the utmost respect for him.



How about even starting a thread on ADVrider...............get input from the USA market.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2010, 10:33:31 am by Operator »