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Offline BOER!

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #20 on: March 29, 2011, 12:49:14 pm »
I have arranged bashes and trips.

I have at least a back up bakkie with bike trailer following, and basic medical aid kit.  But as to standby medical personel.

Nahh! 

The bakkie takes care of the emergency case of broken bones etc.  And broken bikes as well.  Ask Crop Sprang, Grantis, Rodger Dodger, Brink just from the Bosvark Bash.


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Online RobC

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #21 on: March 29, 2011, 12:55:19 pm »
Indemnities.... An interesting side point is that you can have people sign many and lengthy indemnities, but they will mean nothing if negligence can be proved. An indemnity does not indemnify the dependents against negligence on the part of the operator. At most, an indemnity is a informational about the dangers of participating.
I believe you are quite correct here... another reason why I no longer officiate at MSA events, their liability insurance cover means squat if the proverbial paw paw had to hit a fan. Now I just spectate and shake my head in wonder.
 

Offline Kenisis

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #22 on: March 29, 2011, 01:21:31 pm »
I think the Buddy System is the best way to go.

If one cannot ride wit a buddy then he/she should notify some one at either end of departure time and ETA. that way every one can be covered.

Same sort of things that Skippers do.

And if the PAW PAW were to strike the proverbial fan then call Ghost Busters Netcare 911/ ER24 or if you are very unlucky 10111.
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Offline DSNewbie

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #23 on: March 29, 2011, 01:23:38 pm »
For the Western Cape guys.
Taken from a 4x4 site, but a lot applies to DS riding in remote places.


Quote
In light of some recent events we have felt it essential to share the following information to inform 4x4ers how to react in the correct procedure when dealing with a medical emergency when out offroading. The time lapse between the injury and the time that the patient receives medical care is critical. Before we start I would like to thank Spike for this very informative piece of info.
Western Cape Offroad Emergency Procedures
PLEASE make note of the following number - 0219370300

Don't wait till your loved one is injured before thinking about your response. Write that number down! Put it in your phone. Make sure your offroading buddies have it as well.
This is the ONLY number to call when you have a medical emergency, for the entire Western Cape.

Don't be a rambo.
Don't try to move the patient.
Don't try a self rescue.
Don't phone your buddy who is in a rescue unit. That wastes time and he still has to phone Metro Control anyway. Your second call can be to your rescue buddy.
Don't panic and get irrational- that slows down the response.
If you are freaked out then get a calm person to do the phoning.

1. Phone 0219370300
2. First words out your mouth: Tell them you have an off road/wilderness/mountain emergency (this will speed up the response- they will immediately know they must respond differently)
3. Tell them the number of patients and the severity of the injury (eg. one male head injury- short and to the point)
4. Tell them your name
5. Tell them the number you are calling from
6. Answer any further questions about your location and the condition of the patient clearly and rationally. Have co-ordinates for your position if possible and tell them the format of the co-ordinates

Follow these guidelines and they can rapidly fly in a medic and possibly save a life.

Example of an emergency call:

Hello I need a mountain rescue. (he knows it's a Wilderness call)
I have one male with an open head injury. (he knows it's a "red" patient- life threatening)
My name is Piet Pompies (he knows you're genuine)
My number is 0812345678 (he knows he can get back to you if the call drops)
Then let them talk and ask questions (he will have already initiated a response and now he needs as much extra info as he can get)
Answer the questions without giving them a hard time.

They will also ask you questions such as where is the nearest road, is there a place for a helicopter to land, etc? If no landing spot they will short haul or winch so it's not a problem but they need all the info they can get
 

Offline Chairman Meow

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #24 on: March 29, 2011, 01:40:33 pm »
On the recent Great Karoo Gathering that I organized I did not make/or wanted to make even one cent on this event and the two major reasons were-
A. It was NEVER about the money..I have a job.
and
B. I felt that once you start charging and making some money of these kind of events you need to than be responsible for when the shit hits the fan and that was the last thing I wanted to be.

So to get back to the original question...............I think each his own-
A high risk pastime needs one take take high risk precautions and a shit load of commen sense.

If you own a bike one assume you have sufficient medical cover with rescue (ie helicopter lifts etc) benefits or alternatively you take the chances that comes with this territory.

just my 2c.
 

Offline Snafu

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #25 on: March 29, 2011, 02:03:46 pm »
First things first........................If not, dont point fingers!!!
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Offline Buff

Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #26 on: March 29, 2011, 02:20:14 pm »
And while we're on facilities, please ensure there a flush toilets for everyone, pissing in the bush is so barbaric... oh wait, we are barbarians at bashes  ;)  :pot:
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Offline Freak

Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #27 on: March 29, 2011, 02:25:00 pm »
Another reason i decided to give the bash outride a miss, was the fact that i wasnt comfortable riding in a possibly big group like that. Each must look out for him/herself. Access the dangers and ride/ participate accordingly. I give the wc bash a fat thumbs up. It was perfect. And accidents will happen.


Ps... The other reason i gave the outride a miss... Was mainly because i wasnt sober long enough to leave the yard last weekend...

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Offline 2phat

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #28 on: March 29, 2011, 02:37:10 pm »
My first Bash and my 2c:
I cannot see how organizers can be made responsible for providing emergency services. We were very lucky to have someone like Gavin there! If people will start insisting on that then no one will want to go through the onbaatsugtige  trouble of organizing a bash - I for one would not like be held in any way responsible for a noob like me breaking his neck because he rode where he should not have.
I was al geared up and ready to go on the outride on Saturday, but after speaking to some people who came in on bits of the route on Friday, and hearing how some of them battled, I contemplated whether to go or not as I was either going to hold up everyone or get hurt (I have only been on a DS bike for 6 months after 30 years of tar). Friday night I (or my ego) still thought I should man up and go, but when I woke up with only a few hours of sleep and a babbelaas on Sat I decided not to - I'm still young and there will be other opportunities.  :mwink: I also accepted that the risk was with me. I cannot ask of the organizers to take the risk or the flak or the inconvenience for my inexperience.
Like a few posters said - ride with buddies, make sure you have insurance and be very thankful that you are with a bunch of people who will go all out to help you if you get into trouble! :thumleft:
 

Offline Nimmo

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #29 on: March 29, 2011, 02:40:29 pm »
My 2c

Attending a BASH is a personal decision and it is your own responsibility.  
Where do the organizers draw the line on distances on out rides (to provide medical aid) during the bash 100km, 200km, 300km?  It would be in practical.

BUT

That said - it would be reassuring to know during a bash there is a medic present should something happen on out rides (without holding the organizers liable)

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Offline Adventurer

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #30 on: March 29, 2011, 02:59:35 pm »
Having no medical backup is always a risk, but one I'm prepared to take. How often have members here bitched about the costs of various official events of this type, i'e. Rally Raid, the old GS Challenge...etc etc, one of the contributing costs of these events is full medical backup, these various bashes organised by various forum members are CASUAL get-togethers, not many of them include pre-planned routes either, and even on a pre-planned route type Bash you are not obliged to follow the route, so how can anyone be expected to supply full medical coverage anyway?
It is an absolute bonus to have a fully qualified medic attending a Bash, but I'm sure this type of person is there for the Bash primarily, secondarily as a medic if he so chooses.
We all attend these Bashes knowing full well that medical backup is not officially supplied, we should also all have a reasonable medical aid to take care of any serious incident.
These Bashes were started in part to get away from the 'high-priced' events we so love to complain about, IMO we should keep them that way.
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Online RobC

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #31 on: March 29, 2011, 03:01:42 pm »
The way I see it all the organizer does is organize a location/venue, the rest is up to the attendees... keep it so. :thumleft:
 

Offline Pleco

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #32 on: March 29, 2011, 03:04:43 pm »
I do Health and Safety management as a job. (unfortunately  :eek7:)

The first things I teach, are:

1. If you find yourself in a situation where your safety depends on the actions / reactions of other people, you are in the wrong situation. (think of riding through a green intersection without looking first. Is your safety under your control, or the idiot that is going to run the red light?)

2. You must watch that your buddy does not get into those situations. (If you see your buddy pushing the limits, stop and tell him to take a breather)

3. Shit happens. Plan for the worst, hope for the best. (ICE on you, and route plan left at home / organizers etc is essential)

In other words, take care of your own safety and watch your buddy's back. And then if all else fails follow a plan.
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Offline Billbob

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #33 on: March 29, 2011, 03:32:14 pm »
This seems to have developed into a two part question, soooo -
1) Bashes / organised??? trips
The venue or route is arranged. For the rest you do your own thing and take responsibility for yourself.
2) The legal nonsense. If you organise anything there is a legal responsibility. This is one of the reasons I mostly ride on my own and should I join someone else's ride it is on the understanding that I am responsible for my own kak.
Having been involved with organising numerous off road races, 4x4 jamboree's and challenges etc, I know one of the major costs are arranging for medical cover / facilities.
For what it's worth my vote would be to leave it alone. :ricky:
« Last Edit: March 29, 2011, 03:32:37 pm by Billbob »
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Offline Buff

Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #34 on: March 29, 2011, 03:42:09 pm »
2. You must watch that your buddy does not get into those situations. (If you see your buddy pushing the limits, stop and tell him to take a breather)

Oh cr@p, we're going to have to put Stoetie & George in straight jackets next year !!!  :o  :D
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Offline Kamanya

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #35 on: March 29, 2011, 04:52:28 pm »
Come on, while we're being all safety conscious, let's have something like this at the next one...

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/_NbDVYHQF6k?fs=1&amp;amp;hl=en_US" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/_NbDVYHQF6k?fs=1&amp;amp;hl=en_US</a>
I wonder where that gravel road goes? And that, has usually made all the difference. (Apologies to Mr Frost)

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Offline KAROODONKIE

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #36 on: March 29, 2011, 06:32:23 pm »
I sure  did stirr things up  - and maybe it`s a good thing to get people talking about this specific topic of medical care and responsibilities.

The comment I made was to not step on anybody`s toes.
I just felt that since we were in a remote area with no cell signal and at an organised Bash, that when you ask for a phone to contact an ambulance - there will be numbers of the hospital / doctor to call. And you not get that sheepish-eye look .....
It could not have taken the organisers of the event 5 minutes to find out where the closest hospital is and who`s the doctor on call and put their numbers to the phone.
I did not acspect an ambulance to be on site, or following us on the ride!!!
We all know the risk of adventure riding!
It`s just you can not organise an event, someone is making money, bringing together 100 bikes, greating a bigger than usual risk, in a very remote area ...... and then say "I don`t know how to get you to a hospital" if someone gets injured.

As to Bradleys: With you by my side - I`ll fall any day ...!!!
Thanks for everything you did, you where spot-on with everything.
You`re a GREAT OKE  :thumleft:

As for the rest of the WC Bash - It could not have been better!!!!!!!!
 ;D  :biggrin:  ;D

This is my 2c - for what its worth ....
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... satisfaction brought her back !!
 

Offline Pistonpete

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #37 on: March 29, 2011, 06:58:47 pm »
 :imaposer: :imaposer: :imaposer:
If there is any bucks over...i will know on Friday...then it gets pumped back into the Recce Riders to venture forth to find new tracks. Hell...i might even break even on the bucks i had to upfront!
So as for someone making money... :laughing4: :laughing4: :laughing4:
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Offline Chairman Meow

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2011, 07:56:35 pm »
Nice one.....exactly what these rouge gatherings should be about.  :thumleft:
 

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Re: Medical Facilities at Bashes
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2011, 08:26:13 pm »
Man, if I had to place responsibility for everything that has happened to me on outrides, bash or other, on the organizers, I would have zero friends left.
That last incident when JohnST stuck a green mankini in my eye and I almost went blind would have seen me a rich man.
Although I would sign an indemnity form if Kilroy or the other mods required it, I donít think it is necessary. If I go to any camping place I accept that my safety is my responsibility. I donít like to have a nanny look after me. Especially not that nursy type on page one. Al het sy sulke oulike Boer(!)e kuite.
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