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Author Topic: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)  (Read 33937 times)

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Offline Veemax

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #600 on: February 22, 2012, 09:31:17 pm »
The question is , is that hole apparent on the inside too ? I'd plug it. But that's a bad show to release it from production like that.
(Tiger1050/DR650SE/DR650ES/VS800/VZ800/LS650/XLX350R/GN400-tracker/YZX200)

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Offline Wildcoast

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #601 on: February 23, 2012, 06:19:46 am »
Go to thumper talk ,a guy went big bore high comp on an older DR and picked up alot of cracks on casings etc, I think Procycle stocks a 670cc piston for older Dr's.

My bike has been started and runs, I seem to have "injured" my new tank , sending it off to plastic re-builders.
Headlight not working.
Very very frustrating times......
 

Offline Veemax

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #602 on: February 23, 2012, 08:35:52 am »
WC I made a split in my IMS tank mount way way wayyyy out in the bush completely alone ( new DR ) , I managed to make it to my farm and save the petrol by siphoning into a milk can ( very Voortrekker ! )

I had the whole night to contemplate a fix,  or the 47km walk to town !

By morning I was ready to execute a fix , using the polyethylene from a peanut jar lid , a fire poker, a small tin , and a gas stove.

I melted the PE in the tin , heated the fire poker , then melted the tank with the poker while pouring on the molten PE , it sealed up the tank and it's still like that today !

The real point of my story was I was a moron. I had tightened the rear mounts too tight and stressed the plastic. Today I use nice fat cable ties to anchor the rear with vectors that don't load the plastic. You've gotta watch those tanks , very reliable but don't think they are indestructable like I did !!

It's amazing how resourceful a lazy biker stuck in the bush can be , when it's either a two day walk,  or get clever .... ;D
(Tiger1050/DR650SE/DR650ES/VS800/VZ800/LS650/XLX350R/GN400-tracker/YZX200)

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theotherguy

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #603 on: February 23, 2012, 09:04:29 am »
as i recall (must be time to clean the airfilter again) the stock one also has that hole.
on the internal fitting there is a nipple which goes into it.
 

Offline Veemax

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #604 on: February 23, 2012, 11:03:33 am »
Aha ! ( who said NIPPLE ??? )
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Offline volroom

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #605 on: February 23, 2012, 01:24:22 pm »
as i recall (must be time to clean the airfilter again) the stock one also has that hole.
on the internal fitting there is a nipple which goes into it.

Thx.. AFAIK this might not be the stock filter for the DR. Got it from Suzuki, they looked at it, said it would fit and it does. If I don't see need for hole might use big washer that would cover or conjure up some other plan. thx. Hold in there WC...she'll be done soon. I know I can't wait - learning to be patient here
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Offline SuperDavexlv750r

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #606 on: February 23, 2012, 05:48:32 pm »
Go to thumper talk ,a guy went big bore high comp on an older DR and picked up alot of cracks on casings etc, I think Procycle stocks a 670cc piston for older Dr's.

My bike has been started and runs, I seem to have "injured" my new tank , sending it off to plastic re-builders.
Headlight not working.
Very very frustrating times......

Saw that casing story. Appears it turned out to be casting marks?

Don't know - but it also doesn't really make sense that the compression would cause this.If the cracks were cracks( pardon the crack) it may have been caused more likely due to heat I think.

Possibly what I should do is go up to next size piston  - Wossner make 10:1 pistons in increments of 0,5mm,that way if in years to come I suffer a failure then there is still meat left to go up another size.

I think do the cam profile they propose or as similar as possible, PowerKote everything that needs coating thereby improving heat transfer and longevity due to certain properties of the thermal coatings. Go with Wossner with slightly higher compression. Balance crank and if there is still some money left over look at TDM40 pumper carb. I do have exhaust can and probablywould have a new header pipe with 3mm increase in diameter made up. Fit bigger valves in head 32mm and 36mm. If necessary do some flowing of the head as well.

I reckon I should make between 15% and 20% more power and torque, than currently making and have a robust kannie dood responsive motor that will cruise cooler and be more economical as well.

So about 42rwbhp - 44rwbhp and between 62nm- 65nm. could be marginally more based on my calculations.

So what do you think?

If you don't wings - you will never fly!

Honda XLV 750 R, Suzuki DR 650 R, Honda CBR1100xx (Blackbird), Honda XRV 750 Africa Twin, Suzuki RF 900 R, Yamaha FJ 1100, Honda CBX 1000, Suzuki GT 750, Yamaha DT 125
 

Offline volroom

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #607 on: February 23, 2012, 06:38:20 pm »
I'd think if veemax is getting 42rwbhp having done what he has done, you'd get a bit more! like maybe...50rwbhp! I would love to do mod like this, but money in the end decides. You have to think like Veemax, you might not get the money back but..your worth it!

If you do the rebuild, pls make new thread to keep us updated! My guess would be around 50rwbhp on the dyno
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Offline SuperDavexlv750r

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #608 on: February 23, 2012, 10:04:06 pm »
I'd think if veemax is getting 42rwbhp having done what he has done, you'd get a bit more! like maybe...50rwbhp! I would love to do mod like this, but money in the end decides. You have to think like Veemax, you might not get the money back but..your worth it!

If you do the rebuild, pls make new thread to keep us updated! My guess would be around 50rwbhp on the dyno

This is my thinking.Spend upto R20k on bike and motor and Iwill have a lovely machine without electronics that could possibly embarrass some newer and bigger bikes on and off road.

the grin factor is worth it.

Or I could sell DR and XLV and then still not have enough money to buy a bike that can do what my DR would be able to do when modded..

Such a motor will last a long long time and give much satisfaction too.
If you don't wings - you will never fly!

Honda XLV 750 R, Suzuki DR 650 R, Honda CBR1100xx (Blackbird), Honda XRV 750 Africa Twin, Suzuki RF 900 R, Yamaha FJ 1100, Honda CBX 1000, Suzuki GT 750, Yamaha DT 125
 

Offline Veemax

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #609 on: February 24, 2012, 07:55:29 am »
My hot KLR, to repeat the saga ... was measured at 45 rwBHP. I then had to rebore,  as the air filter literally fell off and the bore got scored ...so I went Schnitz big bore kit , settling on the 9.85: 1 choice for compression ... the bore was 102.5 for 685cc , ( which left me the option of going 701 kit at a later date ) . Then I radically altered the gearing with a much smaller rear sprocket. One could guess the power might have been at 48 bhp by then ?

Anyway, long story short, I sold the KLR to a mate , Simon

In a flat out burn on a deserted road in the Kouebokkeveld , my old DR, still with tired bore at that stage , with my wife on the back ... stayed with this KLR , he could simply not get away , the bikes were a dead match !

Which tells me Suzuki's claim for 46 beeaitchpee for this mill is no lie. The interesting thing about the old DR is it's stock gearing is very tall, and seems a dead match for my radically regeared KLR.

Now if you modify this DR for more power , you are going to struggle to gear it up for more speed, the laauuuuunch in first is already quite tall as you will have noticed. Hmmm. So, faster it might not be , but quicker through the gears for sure.

Certainly you have a KTM killer in the making , and I reckon as it looks like it already makes a genuine mid-40's bhp , you are looking at getting into the mid 50's with the mods on the table here !

As an aside , woo weeee, I see the tracking page for my Progressive Springs shows arrival half an hour ago at my local post office . yesssss.





(Tiger1050/DR650SE/DR650ES/VS800/VZ800/LS650/XLX350R/GN400-tracker/YZX200)

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Offline Veemax

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #610 on: February 24, 2012, 04:09:15 pm »
Progressive Springs arrived and are IN.

Here how they look vs Stock ones ( which are 28mm under minimum free length spec )



I used the recommended spacer length of 3.75" , and went for a ride .... mmmm ..... bit too firm , the front is topping ... not everyone is a grossly fat American , clearly this starting point is for a monster dude.

I'll wittle away until it feels right

Good to be on the side of too stiff , at least now I can operate !

Landed cost R1203. Solves the problem of ancient squishy front end ...

Certainly the whole bike feels better , I just need to reduce the preload a tad and I'm on the money. More later.
(Tiger1050/DR650SE/DR650ES/VS800/VZ800/LS650/XLX350R/GN400-tracker/YZX200)

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Offline volroom

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #611 on: March 01, 2012, 07:30:38 pm »
Need some advice...geese, doing things yourself can take frieken long! Anyways, at last got the sprocket and chain. Chain too long, it's a DID. VX2, LeCap..need to remove two links, normally I just moer the links out with a punch..not these. How do I get it out?

And, I'm having the bike dynoed nxt week. Would have bee last week already..but delays, delays. Question is: should I put on the dirt tyres on (mitas E09 rear) and have it dynoed with knobblie? I hear that dyno shows less horsepower and the knobbly gets chowed a bit. Currently I've got siracs on. Should I have it dynoed with the syracs, then the wheels have to come of again and chain..ok, I'm frieken LAZY!

Just getting the old sprocket off today drove me to my limits...nuts stripping and all
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Offline Wildcoast

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #612 on: March 01, 2012, 08:36:50 pm »
Angle grind the pins on the links you want out till they flush with the links, then wedge in a screw driver and moer it!
 

Offline SuperDavexlv750r

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #613 on: March 01, 2012, 08:38:43 pm »
Volroom - I fully understand your frustrations.

So I will be tackling the removal of motor and stripping to start my upgrade.

Waiting to hear about local availability of Wossner Piston- or I will import.

Ordered my gasket set yesterday - R900 complete OEM.

Spoke to motor engineers and a fellow biker who rides a Kawa 650 KLR, fitted with a Triumph piston nogal, that is now 702cc and makes 50rwbhp and about 60ft lb. Sounds high but I can't argue as he has his own dyno and a workshop at home that skriks vir niks,Says his bike is so lekker to ride now.

He is prepared to help me with my rebuild on the motor.

Yes Please! Let it be...
If you don't wings - you will never fly!

Honda XLV 750 R, Suzuki DR 650 R, Honda CBR1100xx (Blackbird), Honda XRV 750 Africa Twin, Suzuki RF 900 R, Yamaha FJ 1100, Honda CBX 1000, Suzuki GT 750, Yamaha DT 125
 

Offline volroom

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #614 on: March 01, 2012, 10:06:07 pm »
Angle grind the pins on the links you want out till they flush with the links, then wedge in a screw driver and moer it!


That's the answer! thx!!
2003 R1150GS
 

Offline lecap

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #615 on: March 02, 2012, 08:39:29 am »
Progressive Springs arrived and are IN.

Here how they look vs Stock ones ( which are 28mm under minimum free length spec )



I used the recommended spacer length of 3.75" , and went for a ride .... mmmm ..... bit too firm , the front is topping ... not everyone is a grossly fat American , clearly this starting point is for a monster dude.

I'll wittle away until it feels right

Good to be on the side of too stiff , at least now I can operate !

Landed cost R1203. Solves the problem of ancient squishy front end ...

Certainly the whole bike feels better , I just need to reduce the preload a tad and I'm on the money. More later.

Which springs did you buy? Why do they come without preload spacers ??? If the springs are too hard reducing the preload will not help much (same as the other way around).
Might be more promising to replace the preload spacer with a correctly sized additional spring.

Angle grind the pins on the links you want out till they flush with the links, then wedge in a screw driver and moer it!


Uh oh. Maybe time to invest in a chain tool? ::)
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Offline Veemax

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #616 on: March 02, 2012, 08:55:49 am »
Hi Le Cap. Clearly this spring kit is multi-function/multi-model , it comes with a polymer spacer ( to cut ) and a fat table to select starting point preload, and some instructions and guidelines.

It is indicated for the 90-95 DR650S.

It took me three steps to achieve the sag I wanted ( full tank of gas ) , but with each cut it gets easier and the long Afrikaans words required trying to start the FINE thread via a 22mm socket + T-bar get shorter, as the spacer gets shorter hahahahah. It helps when you get smart and mark the starting point of the thread : )

Having the front end restored, if not enhanced, by these springs, has balanced the bike out nicely , less braking dive and more stable over rough terrain and at speed , due to... I assume.... what is now corrected geometry.

My bike is going so LEKKER now , while you guys work on yours mine is pointed towards the Karoo for a 700km ride.

Oh, one last niggle...maybe its fixed maybe it isn't : That Oil Return pipe from the head , the join at the head is a BITCH. I got a brand new OEM O-ring from Suzuki , and refitted the thing very very VERY carefully , with GREASE , as per the manual.

It seems to still weep.

Should I try with a sealer instead of grease ? What would be the best sealer ( hate silicone ) ....

Dammit I paid microscopic attention to the tube and the head surfaces , could find no fault , dressed the surface oh so carefully with fine waterpaper ... taking huge care not to get carborundum into the engine ....still not completely oil tight ....which is annoying !

I'm headed in high 30's temps in technical conditions in sand , it's gonna get TESTED .



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Who are we, but to provide entertainment for our neighbours? - Jane Austen
 

Offline DeepBass9

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #617 on: March 02, 2012, 09:22:38 am »
Glad you like the springs Veemax, they really lift the front nicely and the handling is sooo much better.

I haven't been riding mine much lately, I need to replace the steering bearings so I've left the old girl standing. Hopefully sort that out next week.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2012, 09:27:10 am by DeepBass9 »
 

Offline Veemax

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Offline DeepBass9

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Re: Older DR 600/650 thread (Pre mid 90's)
« Reply #619 on: March 02, 2012, 10:20:06 am »
Nice bike.