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Author Topic: 2014 Amageza Cross-Country Rallye - build up thread  (Read 103559 times)

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Offline Camelman

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #140 on: February 19, 2014, 01:51:23 pm »
QUADS????!!! ;)

Spent the last week scoping out some possible/likely routes in Richtersveld and Orange River/Pofadder surrounds. God it was hot!

Now you don't really believe with all your heart that I'll draw a public map, tell you were we're going, then sit back and watch the guys ride every likely route do you?  ;)

Which means: Wherever you think we're going, we're not. Disinformation my bud, disinformation!

But at least you're training. Thats good!  :thumleft:
 

Offline MaxThePanda

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #141 on: February 19, 2014, 02:30:21 pm »
Haha. Exactly. Maybe I was really scoping dune sections along the Botswana border.

Offline Biker Al

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #142 on: February 19, 2014, 02:46:54 pm »
This has my Interest,

Would an XR 400 make it? They are dependable as anything, great in the difficult stuff but slow on the open.

On another thought, Is there a thread yet on what the ideal budget package would be should a person want to do this as a once off and then sell the bike? My first thought would be an XR 650 with a couple of extra bobs on. Should sell fairly easily if one wanted to after the trip. Just asked my Brothers if they would be keen to join me to hit it together.



 

Offline MaxThePanda

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #143 on: February 20, 2014, 08:37:35 am »
There's a guy on this forum doing it on a 250 - I'm sure a XR400 with enough fuel would be fine. But I'm doing my first, so don't take my word for it...

Offline LoopSoosStroop

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #144 on: February 20, 2014, 09:10:13 am »
There's a guy on this forum doing it on a 250 - I'm sure a XR400 with enough fuel would be fine. But I'm doing my first, so don't take my word for it...

That will be me... but to be perfectly honest I'm starting to wonder about the wisdom of this move. The TTR is not a dune climbing monster, I found that out at Maraisburg a few weeks ago. If there are big ones in the Geza I'm going to have issues. Everything else I'm confident about. Range, weight, reliability, comfort.

A XR400 will do better on the dunes. 
 

Offline SteveD

Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #145 on: February 22, 2014, 06:21:49 pm »
This has my Interest,
Would an XR 400 make it? They are dependable as anything, great in the difficult stuff but slow on the open.
On another thought, Is there a thread yet on what the ideal budget package would be should a person want to do this as a once off and then sell the bike? My first thought would be an XR 650 with a couple of extra bobs on. Should sell fairly easily if one wanted to after the trip. Just asked my Brothers if they would be keen to join me to hit it together.

There is a guy who rode his first Dakar in 2000 on an XR400. You may have heard of him? Cyril Despres? The only disadvantage is you may end up wearing a bandana and abandoning your friends in mud holes.
 

Offline N[]vA

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #146 on: February 22, 2014, 08:48:58 pm »
Wow I didn't know that
So much of win it hurts! ^.^


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Offline Cracker

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #147 on: February 23, 2014, 08:46:27 am »
There's a guy on this forum doing it on a 250 - I'm sure a XR400 with enough fuel would be fine. But I'm doing my first, so don't take my word for it...

That will be me... but to be perfectly honest I'm starting to wonder about the wisdom of this move. The TTR is not a dune climbing monster, I found that out at Maraisburg a few weeks ago. If there are big ones in the Geza I'm going to have issues. Everything else I'm confident about. Range, weight, reliability, comfort.

A XR400 will do better on the dunes. 

Pieter, keep an eye open for when/if we ride maraisburg with the big bikes, I need to train and refine the 650 somewhere. It may have a bit more power but is as heavy as lead and dune riding on the heavies is all about momentum

Wasn't it N[]vA that used a 400 at last years amageza?
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Offline N[]vA

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #148 on: February 23, 2014, 01:47:12 pm »
There's a guy on this forum doing it on a 250 - I'm sure a XR400 with enough fuel would be fine. But I'm doing my first, so don't take my word for it...

That will be me... but to be perfectly honest I'm starting to wonder about the wisdom of this move. The TTR is not a dune climbing monster, I found that out at Maraisburg a few weeks ago. If there are big ones in the Geza I'm going to have issues. Everything else I'm confident about. Range, weight, reliability, comfort.

A XR400 will do better on the dunes. 

Pieter, keep an eye open for when/if we ride maraisburg with the big bikes, I need to train and refine the 650 somewhere. It may have a bit more power but is as heavy as lead and dune riding on the heavies is all about momentum

Wasn't it N[]vA that used a 400 at last years amageza?
a DRZ 424
So much of win it hurts! ^.^


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Offline g1_

Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #149 on: February 25, 2014, 04:15:07 pm »
sub
 

Offline BlueBull2007

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #150 on: February 27, 2014, 12:02:21 am »
There's a guy on this forum doing it on a 250 - I'm sure a XR400 with enough fuel would be fine. But I'm doing my first, so don't take my word for it...

That will be me... but to be perfectly honest I'm starting to wonder about the wisdom of this move. The TTR is not a dune climbing monster, I found that out at Maraisburg a few weeks ago. If there are big ones in the Geza I'm going to have issues. Everything else I'm confident about. Range, weight, reliability, comfort.

A XR400 will do better on the dunes. 

Ja a 250 might be a little on the light side, esp. when it comes to doing 700km/day. I would be worried about blowing up the engine, or finishing late everyday, nursing the engine more than the dunes.

How long does it take you to ride 700km of dirt roads, with a few tough technical sections thrown in?



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Offline LoopSoosStroop

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #151 on: February 27, 2014, 07:24:58 am »
Ja a 250 might be a little on the light side, esp. when it comes to doing 700km/day. I would be worried about blowing up the engine, or finishing late everyday, nursing the engine more than the dunes.

How long does it take you to ride 700km of dirt roads, with a few tough technical sections thrown in?


I've never done that distance on this bike in a day, but the time will be determined by the speed limits etc. 12 hours on 700 km? The TTR mill will not have issues with long days or distance, very unstressed, that is why it does not make as much power as the water cooled engines.

But yes, dunes.... Going to have to ride to 120% of my ability to get over long, tall ones. Struggling here might cost me some time.
 

Offline BlueBull2007

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #152 on: February 27, 2014, 11:21:14 pm »
Just to give you an idea guys like Mark Coma average about 80-85km/hr over a 600km special, without stops. Thats about 7.5 hours. If I really push it my average would probably be about 50-60km/hr over the same distance. That's 10-12 hours for 600km. Add 2 hours for start/refuels/mandatory stops  etc. That makes it about 14 hours. Then add the 100-200km liaisons typically associated with a long special stage, where you must ride at the speed limit so lets say the average speed there is may 70km/hr, mostly because its tar- So you're looking at about another 2-3 hours or 15-17 hours in the saddle, longer the slower you go. If you come off or have a mechanical that delays you it is easily possible for you not to get in before midnight.

When you get to the bivouac, you still have to attend the briefing (if you got there on time!),maintain your bike, change tyres, refuel (again), eat, prep your road book, rehydrate, eat again and sleep before the start at 4am tomorrow. Skip any of these steps and you dramatically increase your chances for a disaster the next day.

That sets the scene for what we call the snowball effect: The cumulative effect of one small problem on subsequent days can snow ball into a DNF very easily and is the reason why so few people worldwide get to finish desert rallies.

So going slow is not an option really because the snowball will eat you after 3 days. Fatigue sets in or you ride less fatigues at the cost of something else. Risk of crashing goes up, causing more delays even if you are unhurt. Chances of a DNF start to really go up.

In rallies you have to ride as fast as you can whenever you can do so safely. So that would mean pushing that poor 250cc really hard and risking the engine.

Then add to it some sections in the dunes or fesh fesh where you have wring the things neck and even a 450 will struggle after a couple of days.

I don't want to discourage you, if you want to go for it on a 250 good for you, but you are investing a lot of time and effort into the Amageza. I would like to see you at the finish. Just be aware that the challenge will be much harder to finish on that bike over the planned 3,500km even though you probably ride it very well over shorter distances.

Its a bugger really because its the long distances that are cool to ride, but the toll on bikes makes it a very expensive sport and limits the use of smaller cc engines.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2014, 11:22:50 pm by BlueBull2007 »
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Offline Cracker

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #153 on: February 28, 2014, 07:52:31 am »
So, a finish is statistically unlikely - but therein lies the challenge

To finish on a rally bike is expected but there's a much bigger story in finishing on a 250

the best equipment makes it a race
the worst equipment makes it a challenge
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Offline LoopSoosStroop

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #154 on: February 28, 2014, 08:08:38 am »
I don't want to discourage you, if you want to go for it on a 250 good for you, but you are investing a lot of time and effort into the Amageza. I would like to see you at the finish. Just be aware that the challenge will be much harder to finish on that bike over the planned 3,500km even though you probably ride it very well over shorter distances.

So, a finish is statistically unlikely - but therein lies the challenge

To finish on a rally bike is expected but there's a much bigger story in finishing on a 250

the best equipment makes it a race
the worst equipment makes it a challenge

Yes, I think this is probably the year where the Amageza changes from being a "free for all" ralley to a "proffesional" ralley. It's sad in a way, but I suppose that's the way these things work and evolve.

My budget is allready under pressure, and I have not paid for a crapload of things yet; petrol (bike and bakkie),  tyres (two sets), new chain+sprockets, trunk, radio, neck brace, list goes on. I have allready spent a lot, prob R50k+ on bike, kit , MSA stuff and minimum AMA entry fee. This is actually unfair to my family this year, but I'm pushing the limits.

Building or buying a roadworthy 450 ralley bike would be ideal, but just would not have happened this year or any other year (planning for kiddo no 2). So I'm taking a huge risk doing it on the TTR, but it's my only chance at the Amageza or any ralley. If I fail I'll go down fighting.

 

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #155 on: February 28, 2014, 08:18:53 am »
Vetkat - remember BB's post relates more to the Dakar ... not to say the AmaG will not be very challenging ... and snowballs can occur but I cannot see this type of liaisons etc on the Amageza ... well hopefully because they are a rally killer IMHO.
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Offline MaxThePanda

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #156 on: February 28, 2014, 11:42:36 am »
Vetkat! Go for it!! Yours is a much better story than the 'pros' on fancy kit. I would love to see you finish and make a success of it. I'll be chasing up the rear alongside you anyway! :)

Offline LoopSoosStroop

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #157 on: February 28, 2014, 11:59:47 am »
Vetkat! Go for it!! Yours is a much better story than the 'pros' on fancy kit. I would love to see you finish and make a success of it. I'll be chasing up the rear alongside you anyway! :)

 ;D Maybe you can tow me up those dunes with your 690...
 

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #158 on: February 28, 2014, 05:49:16 pm »
Vetkat! Go for it!! Yours is a much better story than the 'pros' on fancy kit. I would love to see you finish and make a success of it. I'll be chasing up the rear alongside you anyway! :)

+1000

Vetkat, you are the guy everyone will be supporting, because you're the underdog. I have huge respect for you giving it a go on the 250, especially after reading your latest posts.

Flip, even if we have to tow you to the finish we will help you if we can!

The bad news is that Alexander is designing the Amageza to be at the level of a typical Dakar day. The good news is it is only 5 days, not 14. Only once has a 250 finished the Dakar so it is possible. The guy tried 5 times!

Yes its not really fair on the family but sometimes you need to do something for yourself.

Don't worry about the dunes too much. None of them are anything like we see in the Dakar, so Im pretty sure you will get through through these sections. Worst comes to worst you can just go around them and take a penalty if there is a WPM on the top.

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Offline markdiver

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Re: Amageza 2014 (Kalahari Safari): Entries Open
« Reply #159 on: February 28, 2014, 06:01:21 pm »
Go for it Vetkat.  Stay focused, relax, think all the time while you are riding, keep it upright and we all end up at the end for a beer.  :thumleft:
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