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Offline growweblaar

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #40 on: May 25, 2015, 09:12:22 pm »
World's first cast bashplate...?  ;)


PS: I read somewhere that bronze expands slightly just before it sets, which is why it's so good for detail on sculptures; other metals/alloys don't have this characteristic...?
 

Offline shanti

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #41 on: May 25, 2015, 09:26:51 pm »
one of the main reasons bronze is used is because of the vast range of colours that can be patina-ed , also its ability to withstand corrosion combined with its strength , bronze shrinks as it cools (shrinkage ) never heard of it expanding or seen indications of expansion on the sculptures I have cast in bronze but you never know , the detail is picked up by the quality of the mould , ceramic shell moulds are used which have the ability to pick up very fine detail from the wax original , if the pour is good and the metal is at perfect temp with no impurities and oxygen present high detail can be achieved , other things also factor on achieving good castings - runner and riser placement - a good reservoir for the hot metal to draw from while cooling etc   - the bashplate was just cast quick quick with not too much attention paid - need to find out if I am wasting my time - good little exercise though

Offline zacapa

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #42 on: May 25, 2015, 11:16:56 pm »
Make a cast aluminium bash plate sub 0.85 kg for my XR650L that is 5mm thick and I will want your bank details to put money into your account.
 

Offline Welsh

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #43 on: May 26, 2015, 05:49:44 am »
Make a cast aluminium bash plate sub 0.85 kg for my XR650L that is 5mm thick and I will want your bank details to put money into your account.

Do the maths it is not going to happen.... 8)
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Offline shanti

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #44 on: May 26, 2015, 08:49:33 am »
Make a cast aluminium bash plate sub 0.85 kg for my XR650L that is 5mm thick and I will want your bank details to put money into your account.

I am not convinced as yet if this is the way forward - what began as playing around has achieved a result - it will definitely protect your engine but for how many times I am unsure about - I will finish it off and weigh it just for the exercise but I did find that it has been done before . a guy in the states cast a whole run for the TY250 - seems after repeated hits they eventually cracked .
http://www.trialscentral.com/forums/topic/35787-ty-250-cast-aluminum-skid-plate-have-you-ever-saw-one/

Possibly this thread should be moved to Jou Ma or just Jou Moer  ;)


Offline Gérrard

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #45 on: May 26, 2015, 09:09:32 am »
Make a cast aluminium bash plate sub 0.85 kg for my XR650L that is 5mm thick and I will want your bank details to put money into your account.

I am not convinced as yet if this is the way forward - what began as playing around has achieved a result - it will definitely protect your engine but for how many times I am unsure about - I will finish it off and weigh it just for the exercise but I did find that it has been done before . a guy in the states cast a whole run for the TY250 - seems after repeated hits they eventually cracked .
http://www.trialscentral.com/forums/topic/35787-ty-250-cast-aluminum-skid-plate-have-you-ever-saw-one/

Possibly this thread should be moved to Jou Ma or just Jou Moer  ;)



Not at all. No matter what, in the end you gain knowledge  :thumleft: When I start bike build there's a lot of stuff I don't know, and with help I gain knowledge, despite fails along the way.
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Offline Titanic

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #46 on: May 26, 2015, 09:39:00 am »
Make a cast aluminium bash plate sub 0.85 kg for my XR650L that is 5mm thick and I will want your bank details to put money into your account.

I am not convinced as yet if this is the way forward - what began as playing around has achieved a result - it will definitely protect your engine but for how many times I am unsure about - I will finish it off and weigh it just for the exercise but I did find that it has been done before . a guy in the states cast a whole run for the TY250 - seems after repeated hits they eventually cracked .
http://www.trialscentral.com/forums/topic/35787-ty-250-cast-aluminum-skid-plate-have-you-ever-saw-one/

Possibly this thread should be moved to Jou Ma or just Jou Moer  ;)



I'm very impressed with what you tried and achieved. Sure, according to the clever people it won't work and not a good idea etc., but at the end of the day I'll rather fit a cast bash plate than the original plastic (actually think it is more like fibreglass).
 

Offline Bensien

Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #47 on: May 26, 2015, 09:49:05 am »
Would it not be possible to anneal the finished product in order to make it less brittle? There are also additives that can be mixed into to molten metal before casting to make it more ductile. Aluminium casting technology has progressed to the extent that it is replacing forged items for critical applications in the automotive industry.
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Offline shanti

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #48 on: May 26, 2015, 12:17:40 pm »


Make a cast aluminium bash plate sub 0.85 kg for my XR650L that is 5mm thick and I will want your bank details to put money into your account.

I am not convinced as yet if this is the way forward - what began as playing around has achieved a result - it will definitely protect your engine but for how many times I am unsure about - I will finish it off and weigh it just for the exercise but I did find that it has been done before . a guy in the states cast a whole run for the TY250 - seems after repeated hits they eventually cracked .
http://www.trialscentral.com/forums/topic/35787-ty-250-cast-aluminum-skid-plate-have-you-ever-saw-one/

Possibly this thread should be moved to Jou Ma or just Jou Moer  ;)



I'm very impressed with what you tried and achieved. Sure, according to the clever people it won't work and not a good idea etc., but at the end of the day I'll rather fit a cast bash plate than the original plastic (actually think it is more like fibreglass).


thank you - from the experiment I managed to come to a few conclusions - to make an effective casting from the plastic bash plate a hard copy has to be made - this is due to the compression needed in the sand to achieve a good form to cast into - I got my hard copy now and at some point in the week when time allows give it a final grind and check for consistency in the thickness of the cast .
The bash plate appears to very strong as hitting it with a ball pein hammer is just succeeding in denting the plate slightly - its shape doesnt really allow for a flat on hit from a forward direction .

Would it not be possible to anneal the finished product in order to make it less brittle? There are also additives that can be mixed into to molten metal before casting to make it more ductile. Aluminium casting technology has progressed to the extent that it is replacing forged items for critical applications in the automotive industry.

I have been reading up on annealing the metal - it seems that it can be annealed by using a low heat - it realigns the structure and removes stress points in the casting - will pursue that a bit , also adding Magnesium apparently helps with ductile strength - once I have completed my hard copy I might take it the next step and do another casting using some more 'flexible' ali that I have with an additive of magnesium - maybe not so Jou Moer yet

Offline Tiger8

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #49 on: May 26, 2015, 01:07:34 pm »
Very interesting, to think and create outside of the box, even when told the result will be futile or undesireable, is when new discoveries usually get made. I like that you are trying anyway even against conventional wisdom and practice. If we try things for ourselves we tend to learn more than a book can teach. (Even if the book turns out to be right sometimes  ;D )

Watching your creation with interest  :thumleft:
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Offline Jughead

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #50 on: May 26, 2015, 01:31:13 pm »
O yes, something else I wanted to mention... lots of big holes to allow flexibility... like toilet paper. Ever noticed it does not break on the holes  :lol8:

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Offline shanti

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #51 on: May 27, 2015, 02:58:54 pm »
nearly at the end of this journey - I must admit there is a certain elegance to the bash plate if they can have any . I am looking into softer ali to cast from and possibly annealing it afterwards - not sure how far I am going to take this or if it is worth the journey .
The casting came out quite uniform in thickness 6mm on the flat areas , 8mm on the rim and 16mm on the thicker underside sections .
Strength wise I have hit it with various hammers and put a few dents in - there is slight bending , a more flexible ali might allow for more bending .
Weight wise - the bashplate weighs 1.52kg which is far away from my steel 7.3kg previous one

Improvements :
the top of the bashplate could be extended to make use of the engine mounting bolt points .
the stator side could be built up a bit to provide a bit more protection .
when fitting rubber could be used at the bottom between the bike frame and plate( could add a channel in the casting to accommodate this )

right then - who is for a cast aluminium helmet ?  :imaposer:
« Last Edit: May 27, 2015, 02:59:27 pm by shanti »
 

Offline Titanic

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #52 on: May 27, 2015, 03:07:00 pm »
Damn I like this.
I want one!!
 

Offline the_BOBNOB

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #53 on: May 27, 2015, 03:08:23 pm »
that is absolutely brilliant - great job  :thumleft:
 

Offline LuckyStriker

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #54 on: May 27, 2015, 03:15:14 pm »
nearly at the end of this journey

That's very impressive. I didn't expect it to turn out as well as it did.
Looking forward to hearing how it performs
 

Offline Tiger8

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #55 on: May 27, 2015, 03:28:22 pm »
Great Job  :thumleft:

5.8kg's weight saving! Now go out and ride so you can tell us how it performs in the real world..............and reward yourself with a bit of helmet therapy  :biggrin:
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Offline shanti

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #56 on: May 27, 2015, 03:34:30 pm »
so how does one test this - its been whacked a few times with no damage other than small dents to my nicely ground shape , I dont fancy riding hard at the nearest rock to see what happens - its not so much the hard bike but the soft thing attached to it I am concerned about - it might well end up in some helmet therapy  :biggrin:

Offline Titanic

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #57 on: May 27, 2015, 04:52:02 pm »
Shanti
How tricky will it be to try and cast a shroud? Those fairings on the side of the tank. They are much thinner, but there is a hell of a demand for them. I've made some from plate, but it requires extra brackets to be made to fit them.
 

Offline shanti

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #58 on: May 27, 2015, 05:31:17 pm »
Shanti
How tricky will it be to try and cast a shroud? Those fairings on the side of the tank. They are much thinner, but there is a hell of a demand for them. I've made some from plate, but it requires extra brackets to be made to fit them.


I think they are too thin to  cast - I saw what you made with bending the ali - well done , that is the way forward - casting has some applications but I wouldnt even go there with the side shrouds - might be worthwhile making up a bending jig specific for the shrouds and having the flats cut out from a CAD drawing if you where looking at production . If you couldn't weld ali or have the equipment I guess you could pop rivet the brackets on (use some sikaflex also ) .

Offline SmuGS

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Re: cast aliminium bash plate
« Reply #59 on: May 27, 2015, 06:43:10 pm »
Really impressed.. :thumleft:
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