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Offline Kobus Myburgh

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #80 on: September 30, 2016, 08:44:58 am »
Something like Yamaha's RZ350 YPVS was always destined to be a legend bike, right from the start. It was a small 350cc two-stroke twin that could easily beat most bikes twice it's size.

Now think of a bike today that could beat most bikes twice it's size.......

And in 4 wheel format the Banshee is gonna be right up there IMO.
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Offline lecap

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #81 on: September 30, 2016, 10:17:33 am »
The OP asks on what bikes we ride TODAY will there be legend status put in future.

XT500, while still being ridden today, has been out of production for over 30 years. Same with KX500, etc. Does it count for this thread?
It actually does not matter because it has been seen as legend for a while already, as long back as 1979/80 when it won the first two Dakars.

Today's bikes? 1290 Superduke?  H2/R?  2015 Yamaha R1?  690? [701 just a disguised 690]  XT660Z?  AT1000? 

I can hear you.

Will any bike which uis outstandingly good today ever become a legend without it breaking new ground? I mean beyond having three kW more and more trick suspension and brakes and a new paint scheme?

Some of the bikes on my list I actually don't want to ride today any more because there are better successors to the iconic firsts. I would neither trade my KLR nor one of my DR's for an XT500 :peepwall:

The idea behind my list was to try and make you guys think which more recent bikes were absolute firsts and not just a further development of an old concept.

Are there any ???

Ther XT500 is a legend. It was quickly surpassed by the XT550 and the XT600 and so on which don't have the same status because they weren't the first big DS and they did not win the first Paris Dakar :biggrin:

I think an R1150GS can't be a legend because it's an iteration of an old theme. Basically a bored out 1100GS. Which in turn was a re - engined R80GS :evil6: (?) And again the old airhead was a Dakar winner :)

Can a CBR900 be a legend after CBR's were around for years?

Can a Hayabusa be a legend just because it's proof that you can sell a kotz ugly bike as long as it outperforms its competitors?

...

Let me continue MY legends ist:

KTM Duke 625: The first factory build Supermoto. Yes I know the honors officially belong to the Gilera Northwest but let's rather keep this one shrouded in the veils of history :laughing5: A bike which rattles apart and has electrical failures as its most memorable feature does not make a good legend :evil6:

Triumph Speed Triple: First factory build streetfighter. :biggrin:

Harley Davidson Evo - series: The conversion of a run down company assembling unreliable and poorly finished bikes to what the brand is today. The Phoenix from the AMF ashes. The legendary model line for me was the Softail for it's hard tail optics. :cool:
Proof of legend status: The Honda VT600C which kind of copied the hard tail optics chassis design.

Yamaha V-Max: The first muscle bike / power cruiser. The Yamaha actually is also only the runner up as it was preceded by the little known Honda VF1100C by three years (I owned a 1983 model from 1988 until last December).

I don't know enough about two strokes to make a valid legend status claim but to me the legend title seems to go to the RD500 and RG500. The dinosaurs were the biggest just before they became extinct. Sometimes the last in line becomes the legend  :-\
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Offline dirt rat

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #82 on: September 30, 2016, 10:23:41 am »
If part of the criteria is which of todays bikes will still be used in 20 years time I will vote for the Huyabusa- 1100 and 1150 Bmw"s in their various line ups as these motors are all proven to be capable of exceeding 500000 km. Also the Honda Goldwing. Some will argue that the 1150 gs has already achieved legend status.
 

Offline lecap

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #83 on: September 30, 2016, 10:31:10 am »
If part of the criteria is which of todays bikes will still be used in 20 years time I will vote for the Huyabusa- 1100 and 1150 Bmw"s in their various line ups as these motors are all proven to be capable of exceeding 500000 km. Also the Honda Goldwing. Some will argue that the 1150 gs has already achieved legend status.

People still ride Honda CX500's. They aren't legends. They are overweight wobbly turds :evil6:
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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #84 on: September 30, 2016, 12:11:37 pm »
Why actually would a Yamaha RZ500 be a legend bike? Or an RG500 Suzuki? Both were fast, but not faster than what was on the road at the time, albeit twice their size.
The XT500, though surpassed by the XT550/600, was a truly reliable continent crosser and Yamaha built these bikes to high specifications, with roller bearing cams, oil in frame dual oil pump system, etc.
XT's in various guises like the 500, Tenere, are definitely legend. You see it by the remarks on here.

The problem is that 40 years on it could be difficult for riders of 690/701's and such bikes to think of a 26hp single with twinshocks as a legend.

Why is a Vincent 1000/v2 a legend? Fastest bike for long after launch, extremely expensive then, as now. I do not actually know, it is to me just
another slow old vtwin with dangerous handling and zero brakes.
 

Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #85 on: September 30, 2016, 12:16:14 pm »
Suzuki's original 750GSX-R ruled the roost straight from the crate, so much that it actually completely overshadowed the almost better allround
Yamaha FZ750.
The Suzuki won races at first appearance, and when it became eligible for classic racing 30 years later, it killed that too.

No doubt......1985 Suzuki GSX-R750=LEGEND.
 

Offline Rough Rider

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #86 on: September 30, 2016, 01:37:39 pm »
The OP asks on what bikes we ride TODAY will there be legend status put in future.

XT500, while still being ridden today, has been out of production for over 30 years. Same with KX500, etc. Does it count for this thread?
It actually does not matter because it has been seen as legend for a while already, as long back as 1979/80 when it won the first two Dakars.

Today's bikes? 1290 Superduke?  H2/R?  2015 Yamaha R1?  690? [701 just a disguised 690]  XT660Z?  AT1000? 

I can hear you.

Will any bike which uis outstandingly good today ever become a legend without it breaking new ground? I mean beyond having three kW more and more trick suspension and brakes and a new paint scheme?

Some of the bikes on my list I actually don't want to ride today any more because there are better successors to the iconic firsts. I would neither trade my KLR nor one of my DR's for an XT500 :peepwall:

The idea behind my list was to try and make you guys think which more recent bikes were absolute firsts and not just a further development of an old concept.

Are there any ???

Ther XT500 is a legend. It was quickly surpassed by the XT550 and the XT600 and so on which don't have the same status because they weren't the first big DS and they did not win the first Paris Dakar :biggrin:

I think an R1150GS can't be a legend because it's an iteration of an old theme. Basically a bored out 1100GS. Which in turn was a re - engined R80GS :evil6: (?) And again the old airhead was a Dakar winner :)

Can a CBR900 be a legend after CBR's were around for years?

Can a Hayabusa be a legend just because it's proof that you can sell a kotz ugly bike as long as it outperforms its competitors?

...

Let me continue MY legends ist:

KTM Duke 625: The first factory build Supermoto. Yes I know the honors officially belong to the Gilera Northwest but let's rather keep this one shrouded in the veils of history :laughing5: A bike which rattles apart and has electrical failures as its most memorable feature does not make a good legend :evil6:

Triumph Speed Triple: First factory build streetfighter. :biggrin:

Harley Davidson Evo - series: The conversion of a run down company assembling unreliable and poorly finished bikes to what the brand is today. The Phoenix from the AMF ashes. The legendary model line for me was the Softail for it's hard tail optics. :cool:
Proof of legend status: The Honda VT600C which kind of copied the hard tail optics chassis design.

Yamaha V-Max: The first muscle bike / power cruiser. The Yamaha actually is also only the runner up as it was preceded by the little known Honda VF1100C by three years (I owned a 1983 model from 1988 until last December).

I don't know enough about two strokes to make a valid legend status claim but to me the legend title seems to go to the RD500 and RG500. The dinosaurs were the biggest just before they became extinct. Sometimes the last in line becomes the legend  :-\

You have to include one of the KTM LC8's probably the 950 which was also a Dakar winner.

The 660 Rally also proved itself and led to the development of the 690.

Another notable Dakar winner is the Cagiva Elephant.

Also the 916 was an iconic race winner for many many years in its different versions.   
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Offline m0lt3n

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #87 on: September 30, 2016, 02:15:40 pm »
Some very interesting thoughts in the thread


and a LOT of bikes I have never heard off.

(Agreed with the banshee for quads!
1150 is already a legend for the dogs, it would seem that the AT stands a good chance but maybe it is still to early to say.)
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Offline 1190

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #88 on: September 30, 2016, 02:17:23 pm »
Why actually would a Yamaha RZ500 be a legend bike? Or an RG500 Suzuki? Both were fast, but not faster than what was on the road at the time, albeit twice their size.
The XT500, though surpassed by the XT550/600, was a truly reliable continent crosser and Yamaha built these bikes to high specifications, with roller bearing cams, oil in frame dual oil pump system, etc.
XT's in various guises like the 500, Tenere, are definitely legend. You see it by the remarks on here.

The problem is that 40 years on it could be difficult for riders of 690/701's and such bikes to think of a 26hp single with twinshocks as a legend.

Why is a Vincent 1000/v2 a legend? Fastest bike for long after launch, extremely expensive then, as now. I do not actually know, it is to me just
another slow old vtwin with dangerous handling and zero brakes.
RZ 500R (aluminium frame ) was a Motor GP replica....how many bikes can you say were Motor GP replicas? V4 2 stroke?
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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #89 on: September 30, 2016, 02:49:39 pm »
Yes, the RZV500R came closest to being a 500GP replica, but if you look at it's engine layout they are substantially different with the RD using reed valves
and the YZR using rotary disc valves on the intake. Very loosely styled around the YZR500.

Just like saying the 2015/16 Yamaha R1 is a Motogp replica.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2016, 02:50:46 pm by 2StrokeDan »
 

Offline Dux

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #90 on: September 30, 2016, 03:24:44 pm »
Honda VFR750R - RC30 , easily one of the best bikes I have ever had the pleasure of riding
Ducati 916 - 996 , sex on wheels and that sound
Any of the RD350 range , all great in their day and just as much fun to ride now
CBR900RR Fireblade , tankslap city but what a weapon once you got used to it ,
Triumph Thruxton , best grin factor bike ever , love them
Triumph 1050 Speed Triple , BEEEEG wheelies
Honda NSR500 , lethal , overkill , want one and can't have one
Honda CR500 , dirt version of NSR500 , treat with respect or it will kill you
Honda XR range , from the 200 up to the 650's , they are all lekker
Kawasaki KDX200 , damn I miss mine , must be the most bang for the buck bike out there
KTM 950/990 range , anyone that hasn't ridden one wouldn't know

And there are a shitload more but these are just the ones I have ridden , except for the NSR500 , or that I can think of at the moment
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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #91 on: September 30, 2016, 03:31:13 pm »
Something like Yamaha's RZ350 YPVS was always destined to be a legend bike, right from the start. It was a small 350cc two-stroke twin that could easily beat most bikes twice it's size.

Now think of a bike today that could beat most bikes twice it's size.......

And in 4 wheel format the Banshee is gonna be right up there IMO.

The Yamaha YFZ350 is a good example of something turned legend in it's own production run period. Just the vast prolifiration of aftermarket parts for it
shows it's tremendous larger-than-life status.
And this is what brings legend status.
 

Offline Bappas

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #92 on: September 30, 2016, 03:32:57 pm »
To me the true legends are the "first" not the ones which improved on existing concepts or which simply sold well.

Honda CB750 Four - This is probably the most debatable since straight fours were absolutely nothing new in bikes. See Nimbus (late 1920's and 1930's) or FN (1909). But it kind of was the mother of all modern road bikes.

Suzuki Katana: Modern sports motorcycle ergonomics, Japanese product designed in the target market.

Honda CBR600F: The first modern sports bike which found the balance between performance, brakes and chassis.

Suzuki GSX-R 750 (first series) First "Superbike"

XT500. First big CC Dual Sport Single.

BMW R80 G/S First Adventure Bike.

You cvan probably find a few more.
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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #93 on: September 30, 2016, 03:35:41 pm »
To me the true legends are the "first" not the ones which improved on existing concepts or which simply sold well.

Honda CB750 Four - This is probably the most debatable since straight fours were absolutely nothing new in bikes. See Nimbus (late 1920's and 1930's) or FN (1909). But it kind of was the mother of all modern road bikes.

Suzuki Katana: Modern sports motorcycle ergonomics, Japanese product designed in the target market.

Honda CBR600F: The first modern sports bike which found the balance between performance, brakes and chassis.

Suzuki GSX-R 750 (first series) First "Superbike"

XT500. First big CC Dual Sport Single.

BMW R80 G/S First Adventure Bike.

You cvan probably find a few more.
The only post with a bit of sense not a My Bike Post

Bappas, the point is to nominate a bike you believe will achieve cult/legend status, not review other posts. :peepwall: :imaposer:
 

Offline 1190

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #94 on: September 30, 2016, 03:37:08 pm »
Yes, the RZV500R came closest to being a 500GP replica, but if you look at it's engine layout they are substantially different with the RD using reed valves
and the YZR using rotary disc valves on the intake. Very loosely styled around the YZR500.

Just like saying the 2015/16 Yamaha R1 is a Motogp replica.
I hear you...but with the tree huggers trying to stop the production of 2 strokes, those machines will never be raced again in motor GP again.....those were the years when we had true motor GP legend riders, not aided by traction control and various other rider aids...but i digress....I think a lot of the "legend status" of bikes are based on nostalgia...the IT200 also had legend status when I started racing enduro.....maybe there should be various categories I.E. adventure,superbike etc
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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #95 on: September 30, 2016, 03:48:34 pm »
Yes, the RZV500R came closest to being a 500GP replica, but if you look at it's engine layout they are substantially different with the RD using reed valves
and the YZR using rotary disc valves on the intake. Very loosely styled around the YZR500.

Just like saying the 2015/16 Yamaha R1 is a Motogp replica.
I hear you...but with the tree huggers trying to stop the production of 2 strokes, those machines will never be raced again in motor GP again.....those were the years when we had true motor GP legend riders, not aided by traction control and various other rider aids...but i digress....I think a lot of the "legend status" of bikes are based on nostalgia...the IT200 also had legend status when I started racing enduro.....maybe there should be various categories I.E. adventure,superbike etc

Nostalgia plays a big part, but a model has to prove itself somehow too, and things like sales only like the BMW GS range should not count too much,
or else a CitiGolf will be legend too.
 

Offline 1190

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #96 on: September 30, 2016, 03:52:16 pm »
Yes, the RZV500R came closest to being a 500GP replica, but if you look at it's engine layout they are substantially different with the RD using reed valves
and the YZR using rotary disc valves on the intake. Very loosely styled around the YZR500.

Just like saying the 2015/16 Yamaha R1 is a Motogp replica.
I hear you...but with the tree huggers trying to stop the production of 2 strokes, those machines will never be raced again in motor GP again.....those were the years when we had true motor GP legend riders, not aided by traction control and various other rider aids...but i digress....I think a lot of the "legend status" of bikes are based on nostalgia...the IT200 also had legend status when I started racing enduro.....maybe there should be various categories I.E. adventure,superbike etc

Nostalgia plays a big part, but a model has to prove itself somehow too, and things like sales only like the BMW GS range should not count too much,
or else a CitiGolf will be legend too.
:imaposer: :imaposer:
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Offline Grant650x

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #97 on: September 30, 2016, 04:09:12 pm »
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Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #98 on: September 30, 2016, 04:26:42 pm »
 CitiGolf will be legend too.

I think they are :deal: :thumleft:
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Offline Dux

Re: What is a modern day legend bike?
« Reply #99 on: September 30, 2016, 05:13:03 pm »
Yes, the RZV500R came closest to being a 500GP replica, but if you look at it's engine layout they are substantially different with the RD using reed valves
and the YZR using rotary disc valves on the intake. Very loosely styled around the YZR500.

Just like saying the 2015/16 Yamaha R1 is a Motogp replica.
I hear you...but with the tree huggers trying to stop the production of 2 strokes, those machines will never be raced again in motor GP again.....those were the years when we had true motor GP legend riders, not aided by traction control and various other rider aids...but i digress....I think a lot of the "legend status" of bikes are based on nostalgia...the IT200 also had legend status when I started racing enduro.....maybe there should be various categories I.E. adventure,superbike etc

Nostalgia plays a big part, but a model has to prove itself somehow too, and things like sales only like the BMW GS range should not count too much,
or else a CitiGolf will be legend too.

In my opinion a legend bike is something that you ride which leaves a lasting impression , I have ridden bikes that people have rated highly and I thought they were pieces of crap , and then others that weren't rated very highly but I loved , so it differs from person to person .
So it is down to personal experience , in my case it is bikes I have ridden except for the NSR500 , although I did a session on a TZ250 and it blew my mind , but for some or other reason when I think of bikes the TZ doesn't spring to mind as good as it was .
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