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Author Topic: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )  (Read 582 times)

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Offline blitzer

2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« on: June 27, 2020, 07:23:05 pm »
After the recommendation here by good intended individuals to not go for the VFR 400, i got a CBR 125 and today was my first ride on it.

Upon my first pull away I stalled it, it happened a couple of times, releasing the clutch to soon, and while riding, i by accident shifted up and grinding the gears a bit. (man i was upset that i did that)

Anyway as  drove up and down driving the neighborhood crazy i became more at ease with shifting gears. However cannot fully seem to get used to it, (i fully believe its simply a matter of practice)

But reading some more i found that the CBR 125 does not have a "race" gearbox as Honda wanted to save costs so they put in a different gearbox.

But now i need some more clarification before i confuse myself more. As tomorrow will be spent practicing gear shifts (no peace of mind in the neighborhood tomorrow :D)

The advice on how to shift with this bike was the following:

Yep, you got the descriptions right and like Bladeracer says, having a light pressure on the shifter while you ease the clutch out ever so slightly will do the trick. The clutch only needs to be released just a tiny bit, no where near the distance you would use to get the bike to roll forward when in first.
It's one of those things that will start to feel natural in no time and you'll do it without even thinking about it.


Now i do not want to burn the clutch or crunch the gears so i'm asking for a bit of clarification.
This is how i understand the above: (is this correct ?)

Fully pull the clutch (obviously) for each gear change yes.
Fully release the clutch lever for first gear (that i found out from the get go, it will not engage fully if you do not release the clutch lever fully.)

However from 2nd gear onwards, you should not fully release the clutch lever (so always keep it with some squeeze while riding ?) and simultaneously just before squeezing the clutch lever fully have some pressure on the shiftier for each gear upwards.

Am i understanding this correct ?

Also one has to physically "shift" through neutral after first gear (what i mean is you really feel the lock into neutral that you need to lock out of as you gear towards second gear) From what i have read, it is typical CBR 125 ?
« Last Edit: June 27, 2020, 07:26:08 pm by blitzer »
 

Offline VaalBaas

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2020, 06:34:03 pm »
My son says his is pretty normal compared to the 525 and TW he is also using. It is a 2016 though
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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2020, 07:00:34 pm »
My boy had one, easiest shift ever, change oil,easy job.
It's the end of the road as we know it and I feel fine.
 

Offline BuRP

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2020, 09:46:40 am »
However from 2nd gear onwards, you should not fully release the clutch lever (so always keep it with some squeeze while riding ?) ...

NEVER do that with ANY bike, you'll fry the clutch in no time!
No idea what oilchange intervals are prescribed but renew the oil (more?) regularly, and a full synth will clean the clutch better than a plain mineral oil.... and my hunch is the clutch is just not working too well in yours.
Look, it's a Honda and trashed worldwide by teenagers trying to impress schoolgirls in an attempt to get laid, and they do not really break easily... new oil?
 :thumleft:
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Offline blitzer

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2020, 11:04:59 am »
However from 2nd gear onwards, you should not fully release the clutch lever (so always keep it with some squeeze while riding ?) ...

NEVER do that with ANY bike, you'll fry the clutch in no time!

I appreciate your advice on the oil, however
As wilddog is a respectable bike site, so does this website seem to be:

https://www.fireblades.org/threads/shifting-problem-is-it-me-or-my-bike.99392/

Look at the posts by bladeracer and godsmacked in the above link and not just them others too wrt the cbr 125 specifically.

Bladeracer has over 30 000 posts on that site, so to say he does not know what hes talking i would say is very unlikely:

Almost everyone there says the clutch on the cbr 125 should not be released fully after first gear on a cbr 125, specifically this bike.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2020, 12:57:24 pm by blitzer »
 

Offline Kortbroek

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2020, 11:12:06 am »
Almost everyone there says the clutch on the cbr 125 should not be released fully after first gear on a cbr 125, specifically this bike.

To be fair to Oom Burp, that make no sense at all. So effectively they say you should slip the clutch all the time?  :eek7:

I cannot see how this would influence gear shifts as aside from de coupling the engine and gearbox from each other, the clutch should have ZERO effect on the shifting. Maybe your clutch is not releasing enough, hence the rough shifts?
- you reckon that thing will pop a wheelie? We're about to find out, SLAP that pig!
 

Offline IceCreamMan

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2020, 11:29:43 am »
oil change is a good idea also adjust and lube the chain, makes a hellova difference on gear changes.

edit: and post pics of the machine
« Last Edit: June 29, 2020, 11:30:40 am by IceCreamMan »
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Offline blitzer

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2020, 01:06:11 pm »
Almost everyone there says the clutch on the cbr 125 should not be released fully after first gear on a cbr 125, specifically this bike.

To be fair to Oom Burp, that make no sense at all. So effectively they say you should slip the clutch all the time?  :eek7:

I cannot see how this would influence gear shifts as aside from de coupling the engine and gearbox from each other, the clutch should have ZERO effect on the shifting. Maybe your clutch is not releasing enough, hence the rough shifts?

My experience so far having tried the method they described is that: usually you can feel the clutch slip yes ? Its the effect you have when "riding" the clutch in head to head traffic uphill (just as an example which you should not do but some people do it)

When i released the clutch lever not fully 2nd gear and up as they described, i cannot feel the "slip" effect at all, the gears seems fully engaged and power 100%, so perhaps what they describe is only a means of putting your shift lever to a position just to before clutch disengagement, as the clutch does not disengage from the "get go" 2nd gear and up when pulling the clutch lever

I did try it and it did help heaps i was able to shift quickly at one stage to my amazement and very smooth, but its something i need to get used to as i cannot yet consistently master it.

So i just need to know if what i am saying makes sense, as i don't want to burn the clutch, it definitely does not feel like i am "riding" the clutch at all as like mentioned the gearbox feels fully engaged with the engine.
 

Offline Kortbroek

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2020, 01:27:35 pm »
Almost everyone there says the clutch on the cbr 125 should not be released fully after first gear on a cbr 125, specifically this bike.

To be fair to Oom Burp, that make no sense at all. So effectively they say you should slip the clutch all the time?  :eek7:

I cannot see how this would influence gear shifts as aside from de coupling the engine and gearbox from each other, the clutch should have ZERO effect on the shifting. Maybe your clutch is not releasing enough, hence the rough shifts?

My experience so far having tried the method they described is that: usually you can feel the clutch slip yes ? Its the effect you have when "riding" the clutch in head to head traffic uphill (just as an example which you should not do but some people do it)

When i released the clutch lever not fully 2nd gear and up as they described, i cannot feel the "slip" effect at all, the gears seems fully engaged and power 100%, so perhaps what they describe is only a means of putting your shift lever to a position just to before clutch disengagement, as the clutch does not disengage from the "get go" 2nd gear and up when pulling the clutch lever

I did try it and it did help heaps i was able to shift quickly at one stage to my amazement and very smooth, but its something i need to get used to as i cannot yet consistently master it.

So i just need to know if what i am saying makes sense, as i don't want to burn the clutch, it definitely does not feel like i am "riding" the clutch at all as like mentioned the gearbox feels fully engaged with the engine.

I suspect we're mixing up terminology here. When you say you don't "fully release" the clutch, do you mean you don't pull the clutch lever all the way in? Or do you mean you don't let go of the lever completely? The former could make sense in the scenario you describe.
- you reckon that thing will pop a wheelie? We're about to find out, SLAP that pig!
 

Offline BuRP

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2020, 01:57:08 pm »
Bladeracer has over 30 000 posts on that site, so to say he does not know what hes talking i would say is very unlikely:

Blitzer, I don't care if he's got a million posts and me posting my first here, but someone who says you should keep the clutch pretensioned - which is close to or actually slipping the clutch - gives wrong advice!
But, your prerogative who you want to believe, we all have preferences, just don't take it out on someone who takes the trouble to give you asked-for advice.

Like I fingered and Kortbroek says, put new oil in so as to make sure that your clutch-pack is not sticking and becomes fully disengaged when activated - so that there's no/minimal pressure on the dogs/gears so that the box will shift, it's actually very simple.
And, if that really does not work open up the clutch, measure the plate's thicknesses and replace according to the workshop manual.
Mind you, when in there also check for notching of the basket's fingers, but this becomes more and more a remote possibility .... put new synthetic (this stuff cleans your engine and clutch better) oil in!
« Last Edit: June 29, 2020, 02:01:11 pm by BuRP »
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Offline 2StrokeDan

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2020, 02:46:08 pm »
I think that gearbox feel so fucked because the previous owner also listened to Bladeracer.

 

Offline IceCreamMan

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2020, 02:48:48 pm »
Bladeracer has over 30 000 posts on that site, so to say he does not know what hes talking i would say is very unlikely:

Blitzer, I don't care if he's got a million posts and me posting my first here, but someone who says you should keep the clutch pretensioned - which is close to or actually slipping the clutch - gives wrong advice!
But, your prerogative who you want to believe, we all have preferences, just don't take it out on someone who takes the trouble to give you asked-for advice.

Like I fingered and Kortbroek says, put new oil in so as to make sure that your clutch-pack is not sticking and becomes fully disengaged when activated - so that there's no/minimal pressure on the dogs/gears so that the box will shift, it's actually very simple.
And, if that really does not work open up the clutch, measure the plate's thicknesses and replace according to the workshop manual.
Mind you, when in there also check for notching of the basket's fingers, but this becomes more and more a remote possibility .... put new synthetic (this stuff cleans your engine and clutch better) oil in!

ja, erm ....

what the high posting bladerunner may have meant is cover the clutch lever not pretension it.... that would be kak advice
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Offline Welsh

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2020, 05:24:18 pm »
I think its just terminology, he means don't full release the clutch, NOT don't fully release the lever, which means don't pull the lever all the way to the bars, just release slightly from second onward, as we do.  ::)
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Offline TheBear

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2020, 05:53:53 pm »
I think its just terminology, he means don't full release the clutch, NOT don't fully release the lever, which means don't pull the lever all the way to the bars, just release slightly from second onward, as we do::)

Indeed, I believe you are 100% correct Welsh.  Remember the clutch in / clutch out problem we have with language.   

The other way around will kill the clutch quick-quick.
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Offline Sam

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2020, 09:55:01 am »
Unfortunately the OP strikes me as someone who is going to learn the hard way......
 

Offline blitzer

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #15 on: June 30, 2020, 10:00:11 am »
Thanks i appreciate the advice, i'm just still not getting it, not that you are describing it incorrectly, its me, i'm the stupid.

Perhaps this is what you guys mean: So what you guys are saying is i should release the lever entirely after each shift, but not pull it compress it fully to the handlebar grip when changing gears ?

Maybe i'm wrong but its as if i can feel when the clutch is being "ridden" and when it is disengaged and when it is fully engaged.
 

Offline Welsh

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #16 on: June 30, 2020, 10:03:44 am »

Perhaps this is what you guys mean: So what you guys are saying is i should release the lever entirely after each shift, but not pull it compress it fully to the handlebar grip when changing gears ?


Yes  :sip:
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Offline TheBear

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Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2020, 10:10:12 am »
Unfortunately the OP strikes me as someone who is going to learn the hard way......

By asking questions, listening to advice, asking more question if not sure?  I don't think so.

Thanks i appreciate the advice, i'm just still not getting it, not that you are describing it incorrectly, its me, i'm the stupid.

Perhaps this is what you guys mean: So what you guys are saying is i should release the lever entirely after each shift, but not pull it compress it fully to the handlebar grip when changing gears ?

Maybe i'm wrong but its as if i can feel when the clutch is being "ridden" and when it is disengaged and when it is fully engaged.

No, you are not stupid.  In South Africa we confuse ourselves by saying the clutch is engaged when the lever is pulled in.  It is, in fact disengaged with the lever pulled in and engaged with the lever all the way out.  So, to end the confusion, lets forget about the clutch and what it is doing and rather just speak about the clutch lever and its position.

See the bold part above.  That is correct.  You release the lever completely after each change.  You only pull it in a small bit during the gear change.  You will quickly feel how far is required. 

The other way around will not only destroy your clutch, but also your hand.  Imagine a hour ride with you holding the lever in a bit all the time.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2020, 10:13:02 am by TheBear »
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Offline blitzer

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2020, 10:53:27 am »

Perhaps this is what you guys mean: So what you guys are saying is i should release the lever entirely after each shift, but not pull it compress it fully to the handlebar grip when changing gears ?


Yes  :sip:
Got it thanks
 

Offline blitzer

Re: 2010 Honda 125 cbr shifting (something to get used to ? )
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2020, 11:00:10 am »
Unfortunately the OP strikes me as someone who is going to learn the hard way......

By asking questions, listening to advice, asking more question if not sure?  I don't think so.

Thanks i appreciate the advice, i'm just still not getting it, not that you are describing it incorrectly, its me, i'm the stupid.

Perhaps this is what you guys mean: So what you guys are saying is i should release the lever entirely after each shift, but not pull it compress it fully to the handlebar grip when changing gears ?

Maybe i'm wrong but its as if i can feel when the clutch is being "ridden" and when it is disengaged and when it is fully engaged.

No, you are not stupid.  In South Africa we confuse ourselves by saying the clutch is engaged when the lever is pulled in.  It is, in fact disengaged with the lever pulled in and engaged with the lever all the way out.  So, to end the confusion, lets forget about the clutch and what it is doing and rather just speak about the clutch lever and its position.

See the bold part above.  That is correct.  You release the lever completely after each change.  You only pull it in a small bit during the gear change.  You will quickly feel how far is required. 

The other way around will not only destroy your clutch, but also your hand.  Imagine a hour ride with you holding the lever in a bit all the time.

Thank you Sir. Yes indeed the other day my hand did get a bit sore, but for the amount i compressed the clutch lever it really did not feel like the clutch was slipping at all, the motor felt fully engaged to each gear shift while i was doing it like that and i was able to shift very quickly and smoothly without the engine wasting energy while shifting as i feel the amount that i compressed the clutch in did not at all cause any slipping.

The way it is recommended to not fully compress the clutch lever however makes me a bit nervous, as i am worried about grinding the gears, it happened once.

Anyway i guess i will have to scratch that and start from scratch, releasing the lever fully every time like being advised and not pull it in fully and just try and figure out how much to compress so i don't crunch the gears. Muscle memory workouts the next couple of weeks :D